manalishi:
Best of 2 Evils …so ‘vote’ for a lesser evil ?
What do you…
Suggest we do when the next 4 yearly annual ■■■■ kissing fest begins?
I’d love an alternative but there just isn’t one with the present system.
In Election 2024 - I predict that any party that fields over 500 candidates nationwide as a “4th name on the ballot papers” - will do VERY well indeed!
Quite, we’ve had alternatives for a number of years but those alternatives, often with policies that the real Labour Party would and did trumpet in the years before it was taken over (ie no to the EU), could not agree with each other, and the main parties together with their long bought and paid for media machine crushed them.
Until the alternatives combine burying their differences for the sake of the country as whole, a bit of my enemy’s enemy if my friend, and don’t allow Farage anywhere near, then sadly long after we’re dead and gone the Uniparty will continue to be elected just changing its colours every now and again.
Its not going to happen Winseer, the public are happy with the way things are so long as the bread and circuses continue, one could suggest voting for the same thing time and again and expecting a different result isn’t the best way forward but it would be a waste of time.
I’ve given up mate and have resigned to just watching in sadness as this once Jerusalem votes itself into hell.
I still have a good deal of faith left, it’s true… An unusual political event (NOT HM’s Demise btw) might trigger off a chain of events that bring a new block to the fore, just as Brexit did six years ago, and further back if you include the 2015 election result where UKIP gained more voters from Labour than from the Tories…
I suspect that Boris is about to Sack Sunak, my Mrs thinks he’ll get rid of Javid again as well, thus kicking into touch the threat of “tax rises” and “compulsory jabs” in one thump…
The respect for Boris among Tory Grass Roots will then ensure that the worst that could happen to the Tories at the next election - would be a reduction in all their five-figure majorities in the South, whilst making further headway into the Red Wall, meaning the Tory majority actually increases, rather than falls…
If I’m right - it would also prove that the Media are behind all this ■■■■■■■■ about Tory Tax Rises which sit about as well as Labour starting to slag off the Greens and Terrorists (not that there’s much difference these days…)
We’ll have to wait and see what this much-hyped cabinet re-shuffle brings - won’t we?
I suspect that it won’t be a non-event, because if it IS - Boris ultimately loses out of it, and he simply ain’t that daft!
JeffA:
One things certain - the tories hatred for the working poor knows no end - even pinching back the £20 pittance they put on universal credit. Boris was saying “you need to get into work” - he didnt even know universal credit is paid to people in work. And these are the people you are depending on to keep wages high? Say goodnight to the folks Gracie.
Once again, Let’s wait until the Tories actually DO that - rather than forget the fact the Tory Chancellor upped UC in the first instance, gave out furlough even to Labour voters in the second instance - and then the Media (I suspect) hype it up that “Tories Giveth” (Deleted) and Tories Taketh Away" taken out of context, as per usual…
Meanwhile, Keir Starmer - is in danger of goind down in history as being "That guy who never became PM who got kicked out of a pub more times than either Corbyn brother…
JeffA:
One things certain - the tories hatred for the working poor knows no end - even pinching back the £20 pittance they put on universal credit. Boris was saying “you need to get into work” - he didnt even know universal credit is paid to people in work. And these are the people you are depending on to keep wages high? Say goodnight to the folks Gracie.
You’re doing a lot of arguing with yourself mate, NOBODY has said on here the Tories and/or Boris sre perfect…on the contrary in fact, so why do you keep labouring (no pun intending) your hatred towards then as if we are defending them…We ain’t!!.
There will be no such thing as cheap EU labour. They all left, when legally entitled to stay for good reasons that won’t have changed. Any ‘cheap’ labour will come from third world countries.
On the Tory/Labour argument, I see it going like the political situation in Ireland. The two main parties, ff & fg have formed a coalition to keep out the nationist Sinn Fien. Who, incidentally would have won the election if they had fielded more candidates. Which in itself is probably why the governing elite didn’t go back to the polls when there was no clear winner.
So, a government of national unity will prevail lol!
LazyDriver:
There will be no such thing as cheap EU labour. They all left, when legally entitled to stay for good reasons that won’t have changed. Any ‘cheap’ labour will come from third world countries.
Well?
And with driver and other labour shortages throughout the EU and other western economies…
With visas available for our new trade partners citizens, even without job offers…
Which part of my post do you feel is untrue? It’s not exactly a secret that Labour would re-join the eu in a heartbeat if it ever got into power, which obviously it won’t do in our lifetimes.
Some of us have got more than 5-10 years left to live Harry.
IF Keir Starmer got elected PM because say, the Tories raised taxes and got hammered at the polls for it…
… The public would likely ask Keir Starmer TWO questions:
(a) Would you take us back into the EU if you were PM at some point?
(b) Would you reverse the hated Tory tax rises that we voted you in to reverse again - immediately?
Now figure out a way he could state in no uncertain terms - his intent that would actually be credible by the some 5m extra voters that Labour would need to muster - to win the 2024 election…
A good number of those extra votes required - would have to be from those who voted Leave, and those who disliked the Tory Tax Rises…
My prediction for the 2024 election at present is that Labour would have a couple of seats more than the Tories - BUT both of them falling so far below a majority that either a Rainbow Coalition happens or worse - a fresh election a few months later, because the rabble in parliament simply cannot form a government that doesn’t involve the Tories…
A few more seats and they could have a full dining set
JeffA:
One things certain - the tories hatred for the working poor knows no end - even pinching back the £20 pittance they put on universal credit. Boris was saying “you need to get into work” - he didnt even know universal credit is paid to people in work. And these are the people you are depending on to keep wages high? Say goodnight to the folks Gracie.
Once again, Let’s wait until the Tories actually DO that - rather than forget the fact the Tory Chancellor upped UC in the first instance, gave out furlough even to Labour voters in the second instance - and then the Media (I suspect) hype it up that “Tories Giveth” (Deleted) and Tories Taketh Away" taken out of context, as per usual…
Meanwhile, Keir Starmer - is in danger of goind down in history as being "That guy who never became PM who got kicked out of a pub more times than either Corbyn brother… https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fxj5K9WLzKg
Why wouldnt they do it? Theyve said they will (one tory millionaire “Im sure they do like getting 20 quid but its not affordable”). Do you think Marcus Rashford can shame them into doing the decent thing again?
LazyDriver:
There will be no such thing as cheap EU labour. They all left, when legally entitled to stay for good reasons that won’t have changed. Any ‘cheap’ labour will come from third world countries.
Well?
And with driver and other labour shortages throughout the EU and other western economies…
With visas available for our new trade partners citizens, even without job offers…
No labour shortage here in Australia, even if half of it is in lockdown for 1200:cases a day in nsw …
Facts remain, drivers are getting deserved pay rise, yet, some best the drum of labour thinking they are the creme da la creme … I used to vote labour in the UK, I would never vote Tories , however, I would now if I had too.
whisperingsmith:
Whilst never having been a Labour voter I don’t see the problem with their call:
“The long-term problems in the HGV sector will not be solved by making drivers work longer hours but by training workers and improving their terms and conditions. What we are seeing across our economy should be a wake-up call to Government that insecurity and low pay cannot build the high performing economy we need. It’s time for the Prime Minister to take this situation seriously and appoint a minister to work across Government and come up with a clear plan with businesses and unions to improve wages and conditions in key sectors.”
And in the short term to ameliorate issues (that have or haven’t been) caused by Brexit :-
“We continue to call for temporary visas to be considered for roles with severe shortages such as HGV drivers, as well as adding these roles to the Shortage Occupation List as soon as possible. These will be the most effective routes to relieving the rising pressure in this area in the short term.”
Please educate me as to what is wrong with that call ■■
Do you know what an oxymoron is? If not you’ve a good example above with Labour calling for higher wages and better conditions whilst wanting to allow Eastern European truck drivers back which will lower wages and keep conditions poor.
Build5:
That cheap foreign labour is like crack cocaine to these people - they know it’s bad for everyone long term, but one more hit on the pipe won’t hurt!
Absolutely bang on,
and labour are supposed to be the party of the working man ,don`t make me laugh.
one half are sneering metropolitan liberal tory lites, the other half a lunatic marxist mob stuck the seventies who seemingly despise their own country and sing to red flag and listen to billy bragg songs[remember him who now preaches from his million pound pile in burton bradstock…let the revolution begin comrades.
Did you read this in the daily heil?
Conservatives say - “sort your industry out and attract UK workers, we’ve been warning you for years”
Labour says - “OMG! The Tories have it wrong we need a special minister”
What exactly do we need a special minister for?
What exactly does Labour intend doing that the Tories haven’t already said?.. import more cheap labour perhaps?
osark:
Britain now has two main parties. One is a left leaning the other is outright marxist (including the cultural revolution)
Indeed, the tories are now new labour, and that Blair bod is still there giving advice and lauded by a supplicant media, he’s like an embarrassing stain that won’t wash away, the Johnson regime is now showing to even the most blinkered what a Junta looks like.
Proof if any were needed that conservatism is dead, is that the tories have ■■■■■■ more money away and borrowed more than even Gordon Brown could have managed, for no worthwhile results, and are now busily raiding the take home pay of those who work for a living by raising taxes they falsely promised not to do…including for the first time ever making working pensioners pay National Insurance Tax.
They’ve made some braying noises about stopping the south coast invasion, but we know like every others promise they have made about immigration (legal or otherwise) for the past decade or more, they have no intentions of fulfilling, but the meaningless (no intention of doing anything) strong words will go down well with those poor deluded souls who despite everything still believe.
As we head full steam into the the long planned Great Reset, the tories are fulfilling their part of the globalist plan.
What is so infuriating is that come the next elections, people will continue to vote for the same dead parties and still after all that has and is happening expect a different result, failing to notice that their once beautiful free country is vanishing before their very eyes and their freedoms and way of life are being stolen at an increasing rate.
osark:
Britain now has two main parties. One is a left leaning the other is outright marxist (including the cultural revolution)
Absolutely, I think some people on this board still think we’re in the 70s the way they’re talking.
The Conservatives are liberals, they are constantly moving to the left.
Labour now rely on the immigrant vote, how anyone thinks they are on their side is beyond me.
There are no ‘Conservative’ or ‘right wing’ parties. In other words, you have no choice. Democracy…
I’m not sure this analysis is correct.
The Tories have been dominated by right-wing liberals since Thatcher, whilst Labour has had the same problem since Blair. If anything, the Tories are veering away from that now whilst Labour has doubled down - I don’t think the Tories have supported this much state intervention since the 1960s.
If that makes the Tories “left”, then it’s the sort of left-wing economics (at least, a faint whiff of it) that the vast majority of the country actually want.
And far from relying on the immigrant vote, a third of “migrants” (who must be somehow naturalised citizens, or only descended from migrants) voted Brexit, and probably aren’t too fond of Starmer. Actual immigrants can’t actually vote in general elections.
Meanwhile, the rhetoric of the Tory party has rarely been tougher on immigration, and they’re certainly doing more than Labour under Starmer would do to suppress it (which is also unusual, because under the control of right-wing liberals, migration normally soars under Tory governments).
The Tories have been dominated by right-wing liberals since Thatcher, whilst Labour has had the same problem since Blair. If anything, the Tories are veering away from that now whilst Labour has doubled down - I don’t think the Tories have supported this much state intervention since the 1960s.
If that makes the Tories “left”, then it’s the sort of left-wing economics (at least, a faint whiff of it) that the vast majority of the country actually want.
And far from relying on the immigrant vote, a third of “migrants” (who must be somehow naturalised citizens, or only descended from migrants) voted Brexit, and probably aren’t too fond of Starmer. Actual immigrants can’t actually vote in general elections.
Meanwhile, the rhetoric of the Tory party has rarely been tougher on immigration, and they’re certainly doing more than Labour under Starmer would do to suppress it (which is also unusual, because under the control of right-wing liberals, migration normally soars under Tory governments).
Spot on. The recent replacement of the “Red Wall” by a blue one in the north of England is proof that many people are actually socially conservative (note the small ‘c’) even if they don’t naturally vote for the Conservative party. Corbyn and his London-centric Marxist rabble were the primary reason for that happening; comparisons were drawn with Michael Foot’s tenure but I suspect that whilst the media found it easy to mock him, the voting public did at least respect Foot’s integrity as a person and his ability as a parliamentarian and he did not fare half as badly as Corbyn.
Spot on. The recent replacement of the “Red Wall” by a blue one in the north of England is proof that many people are actually socially conservative (note the small ‘c’) even if they don’t naturally vote for the Conservative party. Corbyn and his London-centric Marxist rabble were the primary reason for that happening; comparisons were drawn with Michael Foot’s tenure but I suspect that whilst the media found it easy to mock him, the voting public did at least respect Foot’s integrity as a person and his ability as a parliamentarian and he did not fare half as badly as Corbyn.
As before, I’m not sure whether I quite agree with this analysis.
The vast majority of “conservatives” actually support most of Corbyn’s manifesto. You find me the “conservative” who wants more private rail, more private buses, fewer houses built for their kids, or worse quality broadband for rural communities.
Their objections against Corbyn presumably consist of things that weren’t actually in the manifesto, and would probably consist of things that owe more to liberalism or even Christianity, than to Marxism.
For example, Corbyn’s pacifism has little in common with Marxists who argue for the necessity of a violent revolution against capitalism, and who would fully expect a socialist state to have to use the threat of nuclear weapons to hold back the threat of attack from remaining capitalist nations.
I’m never quite sure exactly what a “social conservative” is - I think frankly it describes the opposite of the rootless cosmopolitanism and radical individualism of right-wing liberals.
In other words, such “social conservatives” are people who value and enjoy living as part of communities that are sustainable and settled over the long-term and consist of multiple generations living together in a locality (including children and elderly), as opposed to the ceaseless novelty of living amongst an ever-changing parade of largely middle-aged strangers and carpetbaggers, which is what city-dwelling liberals probably have in mind as an ideal state of affairs.
I suspect most such “social conservatives” are not in fact illiberal in their attitudes to others in their community, they simply hold that their community and locality ought to have a fairly high amount of continuity and stability.
…so ‘vote’ for a lesser evil ?
