A mate of mine has asked me if it is legal to run 2 trucks down the road together with 1 man jumping between them to cover breaks etc so as they dont have to stop for a ‘45’? The trucks in question are only travelling a 8 hr journey but delivery times are so tight that a ‘45’ is near on impossible!Is this legal?
I SAYno as the 3rd driver cannot put 2 tachos in simutanioulsy regarding double manning rules in each truck
bloody hell tony 
what a bloody load of palava that is… what about the driver
if any boss suggested that to me i would advise him to think again. if the delivery times are that tight he should have advise the customer… what about road works or accidents how does the driver get round with his foot still glued to the floor. sounds like a sandy kidd trick.
topmixer11:
I SAYno as the 3rd driver cannot put 2 tachos in simutanioulsy regarding double manning rules in each truck
but you can legally change trucks half way through a shift as long as you write it on back of card! i aint no expert and it doesnt sound 100% to me either.
some of you bradford lads may know about this but my mate dereck worked for grattan’s and the night trunk to southend ?. had a jump driver every night bradford to wooley edge. cant see them doing anything illeagal mind ?. he is away at the moment but i will ask him when he comes back or coffeholic will be along in a mo im sure.
TONY530I:
A mate of mine has asked me if it is legal to run 2 trucks down the road together with 1 man jumping between them to cover breaks etc so as they dont have to stop for a ‘45’? The trucks in question are only travelling a 8 hr journey but delivery times are so tight that a ‘45’ is near on impossible!Is this legal?
Yes that would be perfectly legal as far as I can see.
If anything went wrong and a driver was to run out of time you would not be able to take advantage of the double manning concessions in the circumstances you describe.
Obviously the charts/cards would have to be changed over on each driver change and the third driver would need to make manual entries on the chart (if using analogue tachograph) for the change of vehicle and the chart/card for any time lost during the changeover but apart from that breaks can legally be taken in a moving vehicle so I can’t see a problem.
edit:
Are the vehicles using analogue or digital tachographs ?
The reason I ask is that booking a break whilst in the passenger seat could be a problem with a digital tachograph and could mean booking it with a manual entry.
r slicker:
some of you bradford lads may know about this but my mate dereck worked for grattan’s and the night trunk to southend ?. had a jump driver every night bradford to wooley edge. cant see them doing anything illeagal mind ?. he is away at the moment but i will ask him when he comes back or coffeholic will be along in a mo im sure.
I did this for Grattans with the trunk to Scotland … used to take the truck to Gargrave on A65 (with driver sat in the passenger seat) … van used to follow to bring me back. Then do manual entry on the card.
I suppose in “theory” there is nothing wrong in swapping trucks to cover whilst drivers have there breaks, but DEFFO agree, that if the schedule is that tight, then it is “wrong” as there is no margin for hold-ups … you’ve got to allow time to pull in to do the change over … i used to double-man to Spain on viviers truck, and you can’t just pull in and swap … although did once swap at a set of traffic lights, as we were running well late for Madrid market ! LOL.
Would like to hear what VOSA would think to the idea ?
Yes it’s legal as long as you only work to single manning limits and not multi.
I have done “jumping” as part of a normal driving shift.
Most vehicles I’ve driven in one shift is about four, after all the sections of the chart has been used up, you just fill in another chart.
My only main concern with the original post is that if the trucks are running in convoy, you’d have to be pretty slick with the breaks and changeovers to keep them both moving
TONY530I:
A mate of mine has asked me if it is legal to run 2 trucks down the road together with 1 man jumping between them to cover breaks etc so as they dont have to stop for a ‘45’? The trucks in question are only travelling a 8 hr journey but delivery times are so tight that a ‘45’ is near on impossible!Is this legal?
hi mate i would say it would be very difficult to do it, as the two trucks are departing at the same time so in fact the both drivers would be required to have the break at the same time you best bet would be to straggle the breaks
say you leave yard at 8 am and the trip takes 8 hours driving
the first break 3 hours drive then ask the driver that as yet not driven drive for 1 hour then that driver gets in the other truck and drivers for 1 hour and then swaps back with the normal driver the odd driver would have to go in the other truck within 3.5 hours driver can take an other break if required so you stagger you driving and breaks
it would have to be the odd driver that moves trucks not the to main ones
delboytwo:
it would have to be the odd driver that moves trucks not the to main ones
Doesn’t matter which driver moves trucks, doesn’t have to be the odd driver. To make the best use of the time all three drivers will spend a period driving each truck.
Coffeeholic:
delboytwo:
it would have to be the odd driver that moves trucks not the to main onesDoesn’t matter which driver moves trucks, doesn’t have to be the odd driver. To make the best use of the time all three drivers will spend a period driving each truck.
yes i know that but the odd driver would not require any breaks if there just swap for breaks if you get what i mean
‘multi-manning’ means the situation where, during each period of driving between any two consecutive daily rest periods, or between a daily rest period and a weekly rest period, there are at least two drivers in the vehicle to do the driving.
this bit deleted as incorrect 
In the situation mentioned by the OP, one driver is going between two vehicles…
Or have I seen a problem that is not there ■■?
ROG:
For the UK only…‘multi-manning’ means the situation where, during each period of driving between any two consecutive daily rest periods, or between a daily rest period and a weekly rest period, there are at least two drivers in the vehicle to do the driving.
Multi-manning
Where a vehicle is continuously manned by two or more drivers, each driver must have a daily rest period of at least 8 consecutive hours within the 30-hour period that starts at the end of the last daily or weekly rest period. For this rule to apply, there must be more than one driver travelling with the vehicle at all times. If, for any reason, only one driver is left on board the vehicle, then the single driver rules will apply.In the situation mentioned by the OP, one driver is going between two vehicles…
Or have I seen a problem that is not there ■■?
Yes, you have done your usual thing of bringing up stuff that doesn’t apply as well as it being out of date by nearly 2 years. (Red and blue bits above) Who said they are running to multi-manning rules. It has been already pointed out that it is legal but they are limited to normal duty and driving limits for each driver. Each vehicle will not have two drivers present at all times apart from the first hour so they cannot use multi-manning rules.
ROG:
For the UK only…
And what’s this ■■■■■■■■? You really are an idiot sometimes. There are not separate rules for the UK, the tacho rules cover ALL member states. It was a bad day when Dave gave you that copy of the guide book. 
That guide is to make things a little easier to understand the various regulations which cover a driver’s day. It seem to have the opposite affect on you, causing confusion and the spouting of ■■■■■■■■, so I think the best thing you can do is throw it away and concentrate on the regulations them self.
hi coffee to be fair to Rog the bit you say is out of date is in the 2009 gv262 book but its for aetr regs on page 22 so i think he as pasted a part from the wrong regs
delboytwo:
hi coffee to be fair to Rog the bit you say is out of date is in the 2009 gv262 book but its for aetr regs on page 22 so i think he as pasted a part from the wrong regs
Spot on Del, I got the wrong page
From the correct page - number 17
Multi-manning
‘Multi-manning’ is the situation where, during each period of driving between any two consecutive daily rest periods, or between a daily rest period and a weekly rest period, there are at least two drivers in the vehicle to do the driving. For the first hour of multi-manning the presence of another driver or drivers is optional, but for the remainder of the period it is compulsory. This allows for a vehicle to depart from its operating centre and collect a second driver along the way, providing that this is done within one hour of the first driver starting work.
Vehicles manned by two or more drivers are governed by the same rules that apply to single-manned vehicles, apart from the daily rest requirements.
Where a vehicle is manned by two or more drivers, each driver must have a daily rest period of at least 9 consecutive hours within the 30-hour period that starts at the end of the last daily or weekly rest period.
Under multi-manning, the ‘second’ driver in a crew may not necessarily be the same driver for the duration of the first driver’s shift but could in principle be any number of drivers as long as the conditions are met. Whether these second drivers could claim the multi-manning concession in these circumstances would depend on their other duties.
On a multi-manning operation the first 45 minutes of a period of availability will be considered to be a break, so long as the co-driver does no work.
delboytwo:
hi coffee to be fair to Rog the bit you say is out of date is in the 2009 gv262 book but its for aetr regs on page 22 so i think he as pasted a part from the wrong regs
I know it’s in the latest gv262 but as you say not in the EU Driver’s Hours Regulations which means the bit he posted is indeed getting on for 2 years out of date as we are not talking about AETR regs here. He once again tried to introduce non relevant stuff but [zb]ed up more than usual because not only was it not relevant it was also from a completely different set of regulations. Further proof, if proof were needed, he should ditch the guide book and stick to the actual regulations, he would be a lot less confused and make less [zb] ups. 
ROG:
Multi-manning
‘Multi-manning’ is the situation where, during each period of driving between any two consecutive daily rest periods, or between a daily rest period and a weekly rest period, there are at least two drivers in the vehicle to do the driving. For the first hour of multi-manning the presence of another driver or drivers is optional, but for the remainder of the period it is compulsory. This allows for a vehicle to depart from its operating centre and collect a second driver along the way, providing that this is done within one hour of the first driver starting work.
Vehicles manned by two or more drivers are governed by the same rules that apply to single-manned vehicles, apart from the daily rest requirements.
Where a vehicle is manned by two or more drivers, each driver must have a daily rest period of at least 9 consecutive hours within the 30-hour period that starts at the end of the last daily or weekly rest period.Under multi-manning, the ‘second’ driver in a crew may not necessarily be the same driver for the duration of the first driver’s shift but could in principle be any number of drivers as long as the conditions are met. Whether these second drivers could claim the multi-manning concession in these circumstances would depend on their other duties.
On a multi-manning operation the first 45 minutes of a period of availability will be considered to be a break, so long as the co-driver does no work.
Which still has no bearing on the original question. Still at least you are no longer claiming, in this post at least, that the UK operate to different regulations. 
there are at least two drivers in the vehicle to do the driving
So does that mean that in the OP case the third driver who is going from truck to truck cannot take a break whilst the vehicle is in motion 
Coffeeholic:
is indeed out of date as we are not talking about AETR regs
are you saying that the aetr regs are out of date cos as far as i know you can still do 8 hours rest on double manning on aetr regs there is a rummer about them been brought in line with the EU regs but not as yet