Franglais:
Im surprised that someone who seems to be one of younger members seems to be an acolyte of Adam Smith. A great man of course, and his ideas have been valuable, but surely J K Galbraith, Dan Ariely, Ha-Joon Chang, and others have more to say about economics to-day. We (in the UK) do not live in a "free market". We do not live in a command economy either. We live in a mixture of the two. We are not Smiths “free agents” making “rational decisions”. We are human beings making emotionally influenced choices, only sometimes good ones.
No argument with that… except you didn’t mention how devastatingly good looking I am … along with young.
That aside, I’ve not studied any of those economists… needless to say we do live in a ‘market driven’ economy - which I agree - is not the same as a ‘free market’.
Maybe you appeared to be too ‘‘well educated’’ for him, and blew his theory.
So rather than answer your point in an intellectual and constructive manner, thus keeping the debate open, he conveniently backed into a conversational cul de sac…much easier that way.
Hope that sounded ‘educated’ enough btw…
I admit I have not read the thread right through, but if the jist is drivers need to be better educated, I would say that academic education has not a lot to do with it.
I know guys that have done badly at school but have excellent practical careeers.
I also know those that have done well at school but are as thick as pig ■■■■.
Same with negotiating which our friend mentioned…, just because I was dodgy at algebra and biology at school does not prevent me from putting up an intelligent and constructive negotiation with results.
Franglais:
Im surprised that someone who seems to be one of younger members seems to be an acolyte of Adam Smith. A great man of course, and his ideas have been valuable, but surely J K Galbraith, Dan Ariely, Ha-Joon Chang, and others have more to say about economics to-day. We (in the UK) do not live in a "free market". We do not live in a command economy either. We live in a mixture of the two. We are not Smiths “free agents” making “rational decisions”. We are human beings making emotionally influenced choices, only sometimes good ones.
No argument with that… except you didn’t mention how devastatingly good looking I am … along with young.
That aside, I’ve not studied any of those economists… needless to say we do live in a ‘market driven’ economy - which I agree - is not the same as a ‘free market’.
They are IMHO all accessible reads. Take it from one who is also devastatingly good looking, intelligent, and am also very modest.
Franglais:
Im surprised that someone who seems to be one of younger members seems to be an acolyte of Adam Smith. A great man of course, and his ideas have been valuable, but surely J K Galbraith, Dan Ariely, Ha-Joon Chang, and others have more to say about economics to-day. We (in the UK) do not live in a "free market". We do not live in a command economy either. We live in a mixture of the two. We are not Smiths “free agents” making “rational decisions”. We are human beings making emotionally influenced choices, only sometimes good ones.
No argument with that… except you didn’t mention how devastatingly good looking I am … along with young.
That aside, I’ve not studied any of those economists… needless to say we do live in a ‘market driven’ economy - which I agree - is not the same as a ‘free market’.
They are IMHO all accessible reads. Take it from one who is also devastatingly good looking, intelligent, and am also very modest.
I doubt you are anywhere near as good looking as me and I am at least the most modest person on earth. If time permits… I’ll take a look.
Maybe you appeared to be too ‘‘well educated’’ for him, and blew his theory.
So rather than answer your point in an intellectual and constructive manner, thus keeping the debate open, he conveniently backed into a conversational cul de sac…much easier that way.
Hope that sounded ‘educated’ enough btw…
I admit I have not read the thread right through, but if the jist is drivers need to be better educated, I would say that academic education has not a lot to do with it.
I know guys that have done badly at school but have excellent practical careeers.
I also know those that have done well at school but are as thick as pig [zb].
Same with negotiating which our friend mentioned…, just because I was dodgy at algebra and biology at school does not prevent me from putting up an intelligent and constructive negotiation with results.
Youre absolutely right that some who have no interest at schooling can make terrific and highly competent drivers. Same as some with high intellectual pretensions have no common sense and fail miserably. A good professional driver is rarely, if ever, stupid, but their learning capabilities cant be readily found by I.Q. type tests, or even less so by school exams. You test for a good driver by giving them a driving test, not a multi choice paper, or inviting them to write an essay. Driver CPC debate time again.
Maybe you appeared to be too ‘‘well educated’’ for him, and blew his theory.
So rather than answer your point in an intellectual and constructive manner, thus keeping the debate open, he conveniently backed into a conversational cul de sac…much easier that way.
Hope that sounded ‘educated’ enough btw…
I admit I have not read the thread right through, but if the jist is drivers need to be better educated, I would say that academic education has not a lot to do with it.
I know guys that have done badly at school but have excellent practical careeers.
I also know those that have done well at school but are as thick as pig [zb].
Same with negotiating which our friend mentioned…, just because I was dodgy at algebra and biology at school does not prevent me from putting up an intelligent and constructive negotiation with results.
Careful mate, we can’t be seen to be picking on people, as if you read Captain Fearless’s signature it says:
“Fearless Jingle Jon, not even afraid of the TNUK imaginary Mafia.”
But how you could potentially be afraid of something that you believe not to exist, is clearly beyond my intelligence!
Jingle Jon:
To deny there is a driver shortage is a bit like trying to argue the world is flat… everyone knows it’s round and everyone in the haulage sector knows there is a genuine shortage of drivers.
So how come drivers’ wages seem to be immune to the normal rules of the Law of Supply and Demand?
Maybe you appeared to be too ‘‘well educated’’ for him, and blew his theory.
So rather than answer your point in an intellectual and constructive manner, thus keeping the debate open, he conveniently backed into a conversational cul de sac…much easier that way.
Hope that sounded ‘educated’ enough btw…
I admit I have not read the thread right through, but if the jist is drivers need to be better educated, I would say that academic education has not a lot to do with it.
I know guys that have done badly at school but have excellent practical careeers.
I also know those that have done well at school but are as thick as pig [zb].
Same with negotiating which our friend mentioned…, just because I was dodgy at algebra and biology at school does not prevent me from putting up an intelligent and constructive negotiation with results.
Careful mate, we can’t be seen to be picking on people, as if you read Captain Fearless’s signature it says:
“Fearless Jingle Jon, not even afraid of the TNUK imaginary Mafia.”
But how you could potentially be afraid of something that you believe not to exist, is clearly beyond my intelligence!
And mine.
Wes mebbys just isent ejukated enuff mate eh?
Just look at the companies that are screaming “driver shortage”. Its the big players, the ones responsible for the race to the bottom. The ones that have cut the job up so much there is virtually nothing left. These big firms are renowed for paying poorly, lacking in common ground between management and drivers with the former seeing the latter as a necessary evil and working said drivers all hours God gives. These companies have as others have said been drinking at the fountain of cheap labour and now its running dry. They are panicking because they might lose that labour as it upsticks and goes back to Europe when we leave the EU and they can’t attract new blood because there isn’t any.
The job has too many cons and not enough pro’s for the average joe and it can be trying for even the most lorry mad individual.
Definitely no shortage but where I work now they have a driving academy and taking people out the warehouse and onto the the roads sticking people through their class 2 and 1.
I’ve worked here before over 10 years ago and upon going back no end of people I worked with have progressed through the company.
JaxDemon:
Definitely no shortage but where I work now they have a driving academy and taking people out the warehouse and onto the the roads sticking people through their class 2 and 1.
I’ve worked here before over 10 years ago and upon going back no end of people I worked with have progressed through the company.
Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
Out of curiosity can I ask if those trained by that company stay on as drivers for a long time after training and doing the job? Are they free to leave at any time or only after a period of service, or pay back training costs?
I`ve no axe to grind, just wondering how well it works. Ta.
JaxDemon:
Definitely no shortage but where I work now they have a driving academy and taking people out the warehouse and onto the the roads sticking people through their class 2 and 1.
I’ve worked here before over 10 years ago and upon going back no end of people I worked with have progressed through the company.
Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
Out of curiosity can I ask if those trained by that company stay on as drivers for a long time after training and doing the job? Are they free to leave at any time or only after a period of service, or pay back training costs?
I`ve no axe to grind, just wondering how well it works. Ta.
I know a guy who does this and although a small company (3 artics + 1 rigid) and not the best pay… he does seem to retain the drivers he trains. Not sure if he has any clauses.
JaxDemon:
Definitely no shortage but where I work now they have a driving academy and taking people out the warehouse and onto the the roads sticking people through their class 2 and 1.
I’ve worked here before over 10 years ago and upon going back no end of people I worked with have progressed through the company.
Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
Out of curiosity can I ask if those trained by that company stay on as drivers for a long time after training and doing the job? Are they free to leave at any time or only after a period of service, or pay back training costs?
I`ve no axe to grind, just wondering how well it works. Ta.
It’s too early to tell if anyone will leave. I can’t see anyone leaving the company because of how good they are to the staff and drivers.
Put it this way I’ve learned more this week in my induction about Tacho laws and vehicle checks and coupling and uncoupling then I’ve ever learned elsewhere and has a new driver it’s great to see a company invest in their drivers and the new academy.
I’m certain they’d have to pay back if they left beforehand. I’ve came in as a class 1 driver so they’ve not had to do much with me. But I really can’t see anyone leaving this company when your driving brand new Volvo’s, paid well with great company benefits and a pension that pays 7% if you want to pay that in.
JaxDemon:
Definitely no shortage but where I work now they have a driving academy and taking people out the warehouse and onto the the roads sticking people through their class 2 and 1.
I’ve worked here before over 10 years ago and upon going back no end of people I worked with have progressed through the company.
Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
Out of curiosity can I ask if those trained by that company stay on as drivers for a long time after training and doing the job? Are they free to leave at any time or only after a period of service, or pay back training costs?
I`ve no axe to grind, just wondering how well it works. Ta.
It’s too early to tell if anyone will leave. I can’t see anyone leaving the company because of how good they are to the staff and drivers.
Put it this way I’ve learned more this week in my induction about Tacho laws and vehicle checks and coupling and uncoupling then I’ve ever learned elsewhere and has a new driver it’s great to see a company invest in their drivers and the new academy.
I’m certain they’d have to pay back if they left beforehand. I’ve came in as a class 1 driver so they’ve not had to do much with me. But I really can’t see anyone leaving this company when your driving brand new Volvo’s, paid well with great company benefits and a pension that pays 7% if you want to pay that in.
Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
Sounds good. More should copy this model I`d wish.
JaxDemon:
Definitely no shortage but where I work now they have a driving academy and taking people out the warehouse and onto the the roads sticking people through their class 2 and 1.
I’ve worked here before over 10 years ago and upon going back no end of people I worked with have progressed through the company.
Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
Out of curiosity can I ask if those trained by that company stay on as drivers for a long time after training and doing the job? Are they free to leave at any time or only after a period of service, or pay back training costs?
I`ve no axe to grind, just wondering how well it works. Ta.
It’s too early to tell if anyone will leave. I can’t see anyone leaving the company because of how good they are to the staff and drivers.
Put it this way I’ve learned more this week in my induction about Tacho laws and vehicle checks and coupling and uncoupling then I’ve ever learned elsewhere and has a new driver it’s great to see a company invest in their drivers and the new academy.
I’m certain they’d have to pay back if they left beforehand. I’ve came in as a class 1 driver so they’ve not had to do much with me. But I really can’t see anyone leaving this company when your driving brand new Volvo’s, paid well with great company benefits and a pension that pays 7% if you want to pay that in.
Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
Sounds good. More should copy this model I`d wish.
Well of you live near a Samworth Brothers or any of their chains they own they are worth working for.
Jingle Jon:
To deny there is a driver shortage is a bit like trying to argue the world is flat… everyone knows it’s round and everyone in the haulage sector knows there is a genuine shortage of drivers.
So how come drivers’ wages seem to be immune to the normal rules of the Law of Supply and Demand?
And there lies the golden argument which plainly signifies to anybody…(go on I will say it) … who is educated, and clearly, and unarguably refutes this fantasy theory of the famous ‘driver shortage’ the biggest con since The Hitler Diaries, started by our wonderful Agencies.
Harry Monk:
So how come drivers’ wages seem to be immune to the normal rules of the Law of Supply and Demand?
Many things are immune to the Law of Supply and Demand.
Once people invest in training they will resist a career move as they wont want to admit (to themselves) that the money invested was a waste. People will resist any move "frying pan / fire" thinking. People dont always make rational choices about employment any more than they (we) do about purchases. Thats why (one of the reasons) advertising pays off. Many of us drivers say were a “bit mad” to want to do the job, and I reckon thats about right. We actually (in between moaning and ■■■■■■■■ sessions) enjoy the job! Im not saying money is irrelevant, but many of us have put up posts saying we`d rather stick with an interesting job than be better paid as a cog in a machine.
JaxDemon:
Definitely no shortage but where I work now they have a driving academy and taking people out the warehouse and onto the the roads sticking people through their class 2 and 1.
I’ve worked here before over 10 years ago and upon going back no end of people I worked with have progressed through the company.
Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
Out of curiosity can I ask if those trained by that company stay on as drivers for a long time after training and doing the job? Are they free to leave at any time or only after a period of service, or pay back training costs?
I`ve no axe to grind, just wondering how well it works. Ta.
It’s too early to tell if anyone will leave. I can’t see anyone leaving the company because of how good they are to the staff and drivers.
Put it this way I’ve learned more this week in my induction about Tacho laws and vehicle checks and coupling and uncoupling then I’ve ever learned elsewhere and has a new driver it’s great to see a company invest in their drivers and the new academy.
I’m certain they’d have to pay back if they left beforehand. I’ve came in as a class 1 driver so they’ve not had to do much with me. But I really can’t see anyone leaving this company when your driving brand new Volvo’s, paid well with great company benefits and a pension that pays 7% if you want to pay that in.
Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
People will leave for various reasons. What is important (when in-house training is funded) is the retainment level. Sounds like you’ve got back in with a good employer - people often stay… even in less well paid jobs - when they are treated with respect. Hopefully, that will work out for you.
The problem with in-house training is quite often drivers (specifically) often believe the grass is greener elsewhere etc. The risk of investing into training Class One drivers, isn’t one many are willing to take… there’s no guarantees for the company and companies like to plan their financials tightly.
Iv’e seen countless drivers believe they have landed their dream job, then soon as reality dawns… they’re on their way out.
The RHA, have been campaigning for some time now… for the Government to come up with some funding assistance. I’m doubtful it will be successful - especially at a time when this specific Government are cutting funding for basic services. What they could do, is loan the money to the potential new drivers in a similar way to the Student Loan System… the details would need to be bashed out. But if students are expected to pay back their loans… seems only fair that this could be the case for drivers who received funding.
If something like this got legs, most companies of appropriate size would be likely go for it and set up training courses.
JaxDemon:
Well of you live near a Samworth Brothers or any of their chains they own they are worth working for.
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Sounds like a good offer for someone, maybe not me tho.
It`d take them too long to un-train me from my current bad habits before starting on the correct way of doing things.
JaxDemon:
Definitely no shortage but where I work now they have a driving academy and taking people out the warehouse and onto the the roads sticking people through their class 2 and 1.
I’ve worked here before over 10 years ago and upon going back no end of people I worked with have progressed through the company.
Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
Out of curiosity can I ask if those trained by that company stay on as drivers for a long time after training and doing the job? Are they free to leave at any time or only after a period of service, or pay back training costs?
I`ve no axe to grind, just wondering how well it works. Ta.
It’s too early to tell if anyone will leave. I can’t see anyone leaving the company because of how good they are to the staff and drivers.
Put it this way I’ve learned more this week in my induction about Tacho laws and vehicle checks and coupling and uncoupling then I’ve ever learned elsewhere and has a new driver it’s great to see a company invest in their drivers and the new academy.
I’m certain they’d have to pay back if they left beforehand. I’ve came in as a class 1 driver so they’ve not had to do much with me. But I really can’t see anyone leaving this company when your driving brand new Volvo’s, paid well with great company benefits and a pension that pays 7% if you want to pay that in.
Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
People will leave for various reasons. What is important (when in-house training is funded) is the retainment level. Sounds like you’ve got back in with a good employer - people often stay… even in less well paid jobs - when they are treated with respect. Hopefully, that will work out for you.
The problem with in-house training is quite often drivers (specifically) often believe the grass is greener elsewhere etc. The risk of investing into training Class One drivers, isn’t one many are willing to take… there’s no guarantees for the company and companies like to plan their financials tightly.
Iv’e seen countless drivers believe they have landed their dream job, then soon as reality dawns… they’re on their way out.
The RHA, have been campaigning for some time now… for the Government to come up with some funding assistance. I’m doubtful it will be successful - especially at a time when this specific Government are cutting funding for basic services. What they could do, is loan the money to the potential new drivers in a similar way to the Student Loan System… the details would need to be bashed out. But if students are expected to pay back their loans… seems only fair that this could be the case for drivers who received funding.
If something like this got legs, most companies of appropriate size would be likely go for it and set up training courses.
Yeah I have been fortunate tbh. Was forklift driver when I worked here last. I’ll retire here hopefully.
These are building a new site near my house which will have a training academy on site with the ability to do the tests on site as well. They’ve got a few class 2 trucks and Volvo have leased them an FH500 truck with all the gadgets on it with 4 seats in it with Samworths branding on it. Got a good deal because they’ve bought loads of trucks off Volvo lol.
They are spending some serious money on the future and the training academy is a big part of it.
Overall it’s just good to see especially with the safe working practises they are teaching and enforcing for safety ect…
… along with young.
which plainly signifies to anybody…(go on I will say it) … who is educated, and clearly, and unarguably refutes this fantasy theory of the famous ‘driver shortage’ the biggest con since The Hitler Diaries, started by our wonderful Agencies.