Info required about National CPC

[leo_saphira]

A family friend of mine who works in the trucking world like I do told me on the side today to start considering going in for a National and International CPC (I seem to think he knows where I am heading in the future)

So just a brief question regarding the these 2 cpc’s - what are they about? (as from my point of view I’ve heard something about them but not looked into it fully hence my question here - by all means, I am still a newbie as per such and a young driver in this game after 5 years under my belt at 28 )

Training? can anyone recommand training firms or offline learning that I can do some home study and take an exam else where?

Generally any help would be great

Mick

[hitch]

their about transport management
national is for uk
international is gloriefied work pottering about France or Ireland lol

So if you have a yen for being an owner driver you will require onew or both of these

[helen_stevens]

OK. I will start at the beginning. (Not assuming you’re daft or anything, but just assuming no prior knowledge.)

Life was so much simpler before they confused things by bringing in the driver CPC. This is nothing to do with the operator’s CPC, and why they couldn’t have called it something else I have no idea. Anyway. First important thing to note is that the two are very different qualifications and are not linked in any way. You don’t need either to get the other. But if you’re an owner driver, you will unfortunately need both!

All of what I’m talking about in this bit below refers to the operators CPC. Here goes:

Basically, you need to hold an Operators Certificate of Professional Competence (CPC) - which is what you’re talking about - in order to prove that you have the knowledge necessary to hold an operators licence. Every operator (which is basically anybody who runs a truck, including owner drivers) must have an operators licence. With the exception of ‘own account’ operators who only move their own goods, who have a restricted licence and cannot drive for hire and reward, every operators licence must have a designated “transport manager”. This transport manager must be proved competent to know what they are doing, must know the rules and regulations related to running trucks, and he proves his competence by passing the operators CPC exams. The CPC also includes information about employing people, tax, running a business etc, so is more in depth than what an employed driver needs to know.

If you aren’t intending to run internationally, you might want to get your skates on if you want a CPC. Because they are merging the national and international elements of the CPC into one qualification. Which means that from next year anybody who wants an O licence will need to pass the international elements to get the CPC. Whether or not you intend to run internationally. The exams are quarterly, and you can sit them all in one go (there are currently three national and one international as I remember). I think the last sitting in which you can do just national is September. But don’t hold me to that.

I have to go… May add more later if I get a chance. Good luck if you decide to go for it.

[bluenose]

Module 1 Syllabus:

Structure of Law, Business and Company Law
Social Legislation, Financial Management Techniques
Commercial Conduct of Business, General Insurance
Vehicle Maintenance

Module 2 Syllabus:

General Traffic Regulations, Vehicle Taxation
Marketing, Commercial Conduct of Business
Methods of Operating, Operator Licensing
Weights & Dimensions of Vehicle, Vehicle Selection
Safety of Loads, Mechanical Condition
Drivers Hours and Records, Vocational Driving Licences
Speed Limits, Traffic Accident Procedure
Vehicle & Goods Insurance

Module 4 Syllabus:

Consists of a case study taken from the syllabus in Modules 1 and 2.

Module 6 Syllabus - International:

Import/Export Procedure, Community Transit System
Customs Documentation, Road Permits & Tariffs
Drivers Hours of Work & The Tachograph, Vehicle & Goods Insurance
Vehicle Costing, Route Planning
Technical Standards of Operating, Road Traffic Regulations

The International Freight Syllabus consists of Module 6 which includes a case study.

As Helen has said the exam is being joined into one qualification, but not until next year so there are two dates which you can do it in its present format, 9th September & 2nd December. You can do home study & take the exam at a designated site, but I personally wouldn’t advise this, take time off do the course & exam at the same time, that way you can focus on the course only, as there’s alot to take in and remember, the qualification itself is equivalent to an A level so its not a walk in the park to obtain. Module 4 is the hardest, a written exam. Modules 1 & 2 are multi choose. You haven’t said what area you live in, someone may know a good training school if you ask. Good luck anyway

On the driver CPC, when/if you complete 35 hours you get a DQC (Driver Qualification Card) don’t know why they didn’t just call it that, to stop any confusion.

[helen_stevens]

Good lord bluenose. That long list of exam subjects is bound to scare him off!

I did home study and passed all first time. Sat the three national exams in one go, and the international at the next sitting. Not that I’m bragging or anything. It depends on your background. If you left school at 16 and haven’t studied since, you’re likely to need a bit of help to get you into study ‘mode’ and help you to get your head around it. If you’re a Chartered Accountant with a degree (like me) it’ll be a walk in the park. Though you will still have to read and take in the study pack. It’ll help if you’re good with numbers, because there’s a bit of number crunching to do, costing jobs etc. But I think most people with average intelligence could pass it if they decided to try and put a reasonable amount of effort in. The pass marks aren’t that high.

I’d recommend the EOS study pack, that’s also what RHA training use. If you go for home study, buy direct from EOS, it’s cheaper. If you go for training courses, I have heard the RHA ones are quite good, and they do them at various venues over the country. If you are going on a study course, don’t buy a pack, as it will be included in the price.

Don’t choose a study course solely on price. Research online what people have said about different study providers and choose a good one. It’s not cheaper if you have to sit it twice because the trainer was rubbish.
Best of luck.

[wheel_nut]

You may only have one chance at this as the operator qualifications are altering in 2012 to be a combined exam, so if you haven’t got an international yet, you will be doing the whole combined thing again by the sound of it.

fta.co.uk/media_and_campaign … s_fta.html

It may actually make my certificates worth the paper they are printed on

[leo_saphira]

Bugger I better get cracking on with this national then. Am based in Lincoln general location (well nearer to Scunthorpe to be honest)

Anyhow… came out of school with very good GCSE’s grades so can study hard if need be (just recently passed NVQ Level 2 in HGV - have asked about Level 3 but not heard anymore about it since)

So thinking, I make the move this time…

In relation to location - what sort of costs would I be expected to pay to gain the National CPC?

Mick

[wheel_nut]

leo.saphira:
Bugger I better get cracking on with this national then. Am based in Lincoln general location (well nearer to Scunthorpe to be honest)

Anyhow… came out of school with very good GCSE’s grades so can study hard if need be (just recently passed NVQ Level 2 in HGV - have asked about Level 3 but not heard anymore about it since)

So thinking, I make the move this time…

In relation to location - what sort of costs would I be expected to pay to gain the National CPC?

Mick

it depends how you need to learn, if you can learn alone from a book, you only need to pay OCR for the examination although I don’t think you can book it direct. I went through my local RTITB place

[repton]

Wheel Nut:
it depends how you need to learn, if you can learn alone from a book, you only need to pay OCR for the examination although I don’t think you can book it direct. I went through my local RTITB place

You’re right, you can’t book direct. Your best bet is to find a local training school that does the exams and ask them if you can book just the exam. That is what I did and they charged me the OCR exam fees plus I think £40 for the use of their facilities.

Paul

[helen_stevens]

RHA training also let you sit their exams without having done their course, that’s who I did mine with, after doing home study. I think you need to decide if you want to do home study or not first. Might help you to compare the cost of just buying the notes with the cost of sitting the course.

Home study:
For example with EOS: buy a single set of notes for £47 plus an exam preparation pack for £26.
eostraining.com/categories.p … t-National
(Don’t waste money on the study pack, I did that and the only extras you get to the two things above is a few ring binders. Pretty enough, but not worth the extra £32! I sent them back and bought the items individually instead!) Then you would need to sit the exam. £84.50 with RHA Training for just sitting in their exam (inc the exam fees). So if you feel you can handle home study, you could get the job done for £47 + £26 + £84.50 = £157.50. What a bargain. Plus one day off work to sit the exams.

Training course:
Alternatively you could go on a course. eg RHA training course is £735 (£685 in Perth for some reason) plus VAT. Plus the exam fee above. Also potentially plus a fair bit of travelling or a hotel depending on where you live. Plus probably a week off work.
rhaonline.co.uk/courses/list.php?id=11

It’s up to you. But if you’re reasonably clever, and able to get motivated to study at home, you could save yourself a good few quid.

[dieseldave]

Just to clarify a little…

Whether you book a classroom course, or do home-study is a matter of personal choice because there is no requirement to attend an ‘approved’ course as there is with some other qualifications. The only actual requirement is that a candidate sits the exams at an OCR approved exam venue, like Paul, Helen and Malc did.

As already mentioned, the price of the exams is fixed by OCR, but the approved exam venue can make a separate extra charge to cover admin. IMHO, this is reasonable because an extra (external) candidate does generate a requirement on the exam venue to do an identity check, administer the registration of the candidate, provide exam room space and inform the candidate of the outcome of the exams.

The CPC exams are set and marked by OCR, so it doesn’t matter at which approved exam center you do them, cos the exams are all the same per each exam rotation. The exams arrive at the exam center securely, but the invigilator may only open the sealed pack of question papers in front of the candidates 10 mins before the start of an exam. All exams must be run exactly at the times and dates stated by OCR and this currently only happens four times per year, although a CPC classroom teaching course can be run at any time.

[helen_stevens]

dieseldave:
All exams must be run exactly at the times and dates stated by OCR and this currently only happens four times per year, although a CPC classroom teaching course can be run at any time.

I agree. But would add the courses tend to run a week or two before the exams, so that you don’t forget it all before you sit them. You don’t want a big gap.

I think we have pretty much nailed this one now!

So what do you think you will do?

[helen_stevens]

I wonder…

Since you are fairly young, and don’t really know where life may lead you in ten or twenty years time, are you sure you might not want to do the international CPC anyway? Reason I suggest this is because if you just sit national now, and five or ten years down the line you decide you fancy a bit of work in France or wherever, I suspect you might then have to sit the whole thing all over again in order to get the International CPC, since the two will have merged Or is this not the case?

When we looked into going international last year, my other half had a national CPC already, so we thought he could just sit the international paper and we’d be sorted. But we were wrong: because he sat the national so long ago, and they had since changed the syllabus so much, the rules said that if he wanted international, he couldn’t ‘upgrade’, he would have to resit the whole national and international under the current syllabus. Of course he didn’t fancy that (too much like hard work ) so I volunteered to sit them instead. So now he has national, and I have both national and international. And I’m the named transport manager for our company, which allows us to have the international operators licence.

Could somebody in the know on the training side, please clarify what the position is if somebody with a (recent) national qualification later wants an international cpc, after the two have merged? Can they sit just one paper? Or do they have to resit the whole lot?

TBH, if I were in your shoes, and not sure what I might want to do in the future, I’d sit the lot. (National and International). The international is only one more paper, whereas the national is three. The extra course (or study pack and practice papers if you go for home study) and exam fee aren’t that expensive. So I’d sit the three National papers in one go first (no point splitting these, the syllabus overlaps so much!), and then sit the international at the next sitting. Job done.

I wouldn’t sit the national and international exams all in one go if you can avoid it, it’s a bit much to learn, unless you’re a really keen student! And you’re more likely to fail at least one if you try to do too much in one go. Which would be a shame after you’ve put so much time, money and effort into it.

Let us know what you decide to do, it’s nice to have an update on these things.

[dieseldave]

Helen Stevens:

dieseldave:
All exams must be run exactly at the times and dates stated by OCR and this currently only happens four times per year, although a CPC classroom teaching course can be run at any time.

I agree. But would add the courses tend to run a week or two before the exams, so that you don’t forget it all before you sit them. You don’t want a big gap.

Hi Helen,

That’s very true, so we used to look at the next exam date then work backwards until we had a start date for the course.

Some providers also ran extra courses (depending on numbers) then bring the candidates in near to the exam date for a revision day, but there were a few alternative strategies for course delivery. The one you mentioned was the best method IMHO.

Helen Stevens:
I think we have pretty much nailed this one now!

Yep, but the OP can post more questions if needed.

[dieseldave]

Helen Stevens:
Could somebody in the know on the training side, please clarify what the position is if somebody with a (recent) national qualification later wants an international cpc, after the two have merged? Can they sit just one paper? Or do they have to resit the whole lot?

Hi Helen,

If an ex-CPC trainer might answer, I’ve come up with this from EOS:

EOS:
The DfT have stated that anyone who has not achieved a full National CPC by the end of the processing of the December 2011 series will lose the credit for any unit passes and will have to begin again in 2012 and sit the full combined National/International examinations. Anyone who achieves a full National CPC by the end of 2011 will, though, have the opportunity to gain an additional stand alone International unit. OCR has pledged to offer a number of existing style Unit 6 (Freight) and 7 (Passenger) International examinations during 2012 for such candidates.

EOS tend to be the industry standard for CPC study materials, and they’ve been doing it for many many years. I used EOS study notes and a classroom course when I did my own Nat and Int CPCs in 1997.

Here’s a Link to the quote on the EOS website.

[helen_stevens]

dieseldave:
Hi Helen,

If an ex-CPC trainer might answer, I’ve come up with this from EOS:

EOS:
The DfT have stated that anyone who has not achieved a full National CPC by the end of the processing of the December 2011 series will lose the credit for any unit passes and will have to begin again in 2012 and sit the full combined National/International examinations. Anyone who achieves a full National CPC by the end of 2011 will, though, have the opportunity to gain an additional stand alone International unit. OCR has pledged to offer a number of existing style Unit 6 (Freight) and 7 (Passenger) International examinations during 2012 for such candidates.

So it sounds like they only give you a year to upgrade your National to an International. And reading between the lines I’d say after that you’d have to resit the whole lot if you decided in a few years time you would like to go international. Still. That gives you a year to think about whether or not to sit the international in case you need it in the future. I’d say plug on with getting the national now if you want it, and then have a careful think about whether you might want the international afterwards.

[dave_the_renegade]

I would have a crack at doing the two before the new single exam comes in…I did my national in 1989 and international in 1999,both home study,passed both first time Obviously the case study module 4 has come in since then…

[helen_stevens]

Case study?! It’s not worthy of the name! Their idea of a ‘case study’ is a (very) short paragraph to read about a company, and then you have to write a sentence or two about what they should do.

As somebody who has sat a real case study exam (four hours on one scenario ), I think they are having a larf calling it that. Though I suppose you have to be a bit more inventive than for the multiple choice questions!

[trukkertone]

i still wonder why anyone wants to do this job… if there were as many incentives as there are knock downs it would be great.

[helen_stevens]

Trukkertone:
i still wonder why anyone wants to do this job… if there were as many incentives as there are knock downs it would be great.

What do you mean trukkertone? (I can think of plenty of knockdowns, but none obvious from what we were discussing?)