The limper dimwits Had their chance to show their worth but failed that task 2010-2015 , they lost all creditability and aren’t doing themselves any favours with pledges like we will reverse brexit they aren’t vote worthy
Dolph:
Evil8Beezle:
Dolph:
Seems no one mentioned today memorial.
Battle of the Somme centenary!Our ancestors fought so there will be no more war, you remember - the war to stop all wars. Didn’t happen until Europe became united, EEA, EU, whatever you want to call it its a fact, that not NATO, but European countries work together brought peace.
Will the British departure from EU bring uncertainty, economic stagnation, xenophobia, trade war etc. is to be seen.Sorry Dolph but that argument is bollox and you are hypothesizing.
How do you know that the EU federation doesn’t end up leading to a war?
You don’t, and can only guess…You are taking something that should be respected, and trying to use it for your own propaganda purposes!
And what is your proof that EU lead to war? This is the longest time in Europe with peace, I wish my kids enjoy it as well. Every time when we have nationalistic or imperialistic government takes control of European country [zb] happens, over and over again. Look at the last 4-5 centuries - The British, The French, The Spanish, The Italians, The Dutch, The Russian/Soviet etc.
Brexiters glorify the Empire days, some are calling for kicking out people, hate crime is on a rise, the economic uncertainty is rising as we speak. Just watched the news - 73% of British farming is exported to EU countries, 75% of UK car manufacturing is exported to EU countries, do you think outside of EU you will have the very same rights/privileges, I doubt that. People are genuinely worried. The moment article 50 is activated the British economy will go down, that’s my personal opinion. There will be no trade agreement, British business will bankrupt, if a major bank goes busted or mortgage bubble burst that will be the beginning of huge recession.
the tories have already been planning to drop echr and that was whilst remaining in the EU, yet some think she will make a good PM UK must leave European convention on human rights, says Theresa May | Brexit | The Guardian
But what evidence have you got that staying in the EU will also not lead to war?
Yes in the past when countries have been highly isolated, controlled by dictators or fed by wild propaganda, wars in Europe have occurred. A lot has changed in recent years, and I’d like to think that the stupidity that has lead to European wars in the past, can’t really occur anymore.
OK you are an EU supporter, but I’d rather live in a sovereign country and risk a European war thanks!
Evil8Beezle:
Carryfast:
Evil8Beezle:
tommy t:
The people voted to leave the EU and that is what should happen ,without excusesYes, we will be leaving the EU from the position of being a fully paid up member who agrees to the 4 rules, that’s hopefully what we will get! But where did it say anything about us never ever dealing or trading with the EU again?
Do you really think that the definition of ‘leave’ means ‘remaining’ a ‘fully paid up member’ subject to any bs EU Federal ‘rules’.If the EU wants a trade war over imposing its rules on a non EU member state then bring it on.
Leave means leave get used to it.
So you can’t answer my question and trying your normal trick of avoidance and twisting things.
- WHERE DID THE VOTE SAY WE WOULD BECOME A 3rd COUNTRY AND NOT TRY TO MAKE DEALS WITH THE EU■■?
I’m waiting CF, or are you doing your normal internet version of: I can’t hear you!
Dolph:
Evil8Beezle:
Dolph:
Seems no one mentioned today memorial.
Battle of the Somme centenary!Our ancestors fought so there will be no more war, you remember - the war to stop all wars. Didn’t happen until Europe became united, EEA, EU, whatever you want to call it its a fact, that not NATO, but European countries work together brought peace.
Will the British departure from EU bring uncertainty, economic stagnation, xenophobia, trade war etc. is to be seen.Sorry Dolph but that argument is bollox and you are hypothesizing.
How do you know that the EU federation doesn’t end up leading to a war?
You don’t, and can only guess…You are taking something that should be respected, and trying to use it for your own propaganda purposes!
And what is your proof that EU lead to war? This is the longest time in Europe with peace, I wish my kids enjoy it as well. Every time when we have nationalistic or imperialistic government takes control of European country [zb] happens, over and over again.
No it’s every time the Federation in whatever form acts to stamp out the legitimate right of self determination of the nation that we get more war in Europe.In the case of WW1 the Austro Hungarian empire v Serbia.But what can you expect from someone from a country that was with Germany in WW1 and supported Hitler in WW2.As I said you can’t educate fanatical indoctrinated Federalist Pork.Let me guess you would have been on the side of the JNA not the Slovenian militia in 1991.In which case I’d have been happy and honoured to have been facing you. 
Carryfast:
A Confederation wouldn’t be able to impose any rules or decisions on any member state without that state’s consent.The EU is a Federation dedicated to the ever increasing transfer of state sovereignty to Federal government control.
A federation is what the EU is turning into, it could be argued that the EU started as Confederation or was promoted as such but over time veto powers of member countries have been reduced and will continue to be.
The most recent being the Lisbon treaty which reduced veto powers even further.
So have we got out just in time or are we a dollar short of a clean getaway, will other countries follow suit realising the not so well hidden agenda of the EU is to create a federal superstate, time will tell.
With that in mind how can we trust the EU to negotiate a fair exit, why would we want to even consider Article 50.
Are we on the brink of a more aggressive stance being taken by the EU.
Where we just one treaty away from total submission.
These questions and more will be answered in Brexit, the soap that keeps on giving.
Carryfast:
Dolph:
Evil8Beezle:
Dolph:
Seems no one mentioned today memorial.
Battle of the Somme centenary!Our ancestors fought so there will be no more war, you remember - the war to stop all wars. Didn’t happen until Europe became united, EEA, EU, whatever you want to call it its a fact, that not NATO, but European countries work together brought peace.
Will the British departure from EU bring uncertainty, economic stagnation, xenophobia, trade war etc. is to be seen.Sorry Dolph but that argument is bollox and you are hypothesizing.
How do you know that the EU federation doesn’t end up leading to a war?
You don’t, and can only guess…You are taking something that should be respected, and trying to use it for your own propaganda purposes!
And what is your proof that EU lead to war? This is the longest time in Europe with peace, I wish my kids enjoy it as well. Every time when we have nationalistic or imperialistic government takes control of European country [zb] happens, over and over again.
No it’s every time the Federation in whatever form acts to stamp out the legitimate right of self determination of the nation that we get more war in Europe.In the case of WW1 the Austro Hungarian empire v Serbia.But what can you expect from someone from a country that was with Germany in WW1 and supported Hitler in WW2.As I said you can’t educate fanatical indoctrinated Federalist Pork.Let me guess you would have been on the side of the JNA not the Slovenian militia in 1991.In which case I’d have been happy and honoured to have been facing you.
Again you are assuming wrongly, I would never agree on military forceful action in order to keep a country into a union. You seems to forget that Serb and Slovenians and Croats don’t like each other for centuries to come…
Carryfast:
Dolph:
Evil8Beezle:
Dolph:
Seems no one mentioned today memorial.
Battle of the Somme centenary!Our ancestors fought so there will be no more war, you remember - the war to stop all wars. Didn’t happen until Europe became united, EEA, EU, whatever you want to call it its a fact, that not NATO, but European countries work together brought peace.
Will the British departure from EU bring uncertainty, economic stagnation, xenophobia, trade war etc. is to be seen.Sorry Dolph but that argument is bollox and you are hypothesizing.
How do you know that the EU federation doesn’t end up leading to a war?
You don’t, and can only guess…You are taking something that should be respected, and trying to use it for your own propaganda purposes!
And what is your proof that EU lead to war? This is the longest time in Europe with peace, I wish my kids enjoy it as well. Every time when we have nationalistic or imperialistic government takes control of European country [zb] happens, over and over again.
No it’s every time the Federation in whatever form acts to stamp out the legitimate right of self determination of the nation that we get more war in Europe.In the case of WW1 the Austro Hungarian empire v Serbia.But what can you expect from someone from a country that was with Germany in WW1 and supported Hitler in WW2.As I said you can’t educate fanatical indoctrinated Federalist Pork**.Let me guess you would have been on the side of the JNA not the Slovenian militia in 1991.In which case I’d have been happy and honoured to have been facing you**.
Are you frothing as you type this fantasy ?
I better put some popcorn on…this threads gonna go on and on and on… and the political debate go around in circles… 
Swampey2418:
I better put some popcorn on…this threads gonna go on and on and on… and the political debate go around in circles…
Got any beer? This troll baiting is thirsty work… 
Dolph:
And what is your proof that EU lead to war? This is the longest time in Europe with peace, I wish my kids enjoy it as well. Every time when we have nationalistic or imperialistic government takes control of European country [zb] happens, over and over again. Look at the last 4-5 centuries - The British, The French, The Spanish, The Italians, The Dutch, The Russian/Soviet etc.
Brexiters glorify the Empire days, some are calling for kicking out people, hate crime is on a rise, the economic uncertainty is rising as we speak. Just watched the news - 73% of British farming is exported to EU countries, 75% of UK car manufacturing is exported to EU countries, do you think outside of EU you will have the very same rights/privileges, I doubt that. People are genuinely worried. The moment article 50 is activated the British economy will go down, that’s my personal opinion. There will be no trade agreement, British business will bankrupt, if a major bank goes busted or mortgage bubble burst that will be the beginning of huge recession.
The EU expansion east has been a scource of tension with Russia. In the recent past the EUs overtures to Ukraine has resulted in the annexation of Crimea, civil war within Ukrainian borders, civil airlines shot down and can you really think that Putin was sorry to see the hundreds of thousands refugees from Syria following his intervention in an area of traditional Russian influence? Hasn’t the sight of refugees risking everything to flee that danger not been part of the catalyst to the referendum result?
There might not have been a hot war within the EU boundaries but there have been, it seeems to me, plenty of proxy conflicts with the near neighbours.
Evil8Beezle:
- WHERE DID THE VOTE SAY WE WOULD BECOME A 3rd COUNTRY AND NOT TRY TO MAKE DEALS WITH THE EU■■?
I’m waiting CF, or are you doing your normal internet version of: I can’t hear you!
[/quote]
Feel free to explain how you’re going to deliver an end to free movement,which certainly was part of the Leave campaign’s documented position because I’ve still got the leaflets here advertising exactly that to the electorate,as an EEA member state. 
the nodding donkey:
So, you prefer to go back to independent sovereign states across Europe. The last time we had those we had wars on regular intervals. Is that what you want? I guess your inner agitator gets quite excited by the prospect of whipping up the masses to take up arms against the Bolshevik.Hang on… didn’t a small man with a patalogical hatred of Bolshevism once whip up his people to take up arms to destroy the Bolsheviks? He had a similar tendency to rant on and on and on.
As I said only the most indoctrinted fanatical Federalist remainer could try to re write history of the defence of the nation state against the aggression of the Federation as the opposite.The wars in question being almost non existent if you remove Ottoman Empire expansion and aggression in the Balkans and Eastern Europe,Napoleonic Federalism,Austro Hungarian Empire aggression against Serbia,and Hitler’s and Stalin’s invasion of Poland,and last but not least the implosion and subsequent wars of secession in Tito’s Federalist Socialist zb pile.While not forgetting the small matter of the fight against the agression of the UK over Irish secession.
While the nutter that your describing actually entered into an ‘alliance’ with the Soviet Union ( Bolshevik Federation ).To further the aims of his own plans for his own Federation,in the form of the third Reich by invading Poland. They only then went to war with each other when they realised that the Eurasian continent was too small for both Federations.
A bit like the EU now threatening Russia’s borders on Russia’s western frontier and disputed territory in Ukraine.
Hey carryfast, is the united kingdom a nation or a federation?
Dolph:
Again you are assuming wrongly, I would never agree on military forceful action in order to keep a country into a union. You seems to forget that Serb and Slovenians and Croats don’t like each other for centuries to come…
I’m sure that’s exactly what those Federalist zb wits who re wrote the American constitution,said.
As for Serbs and Croats etc they all seemed to manage fine before the Austro Hungarian empire tried to stamp its authority in the region,supported by Bulgaria.Then Hitler’s similar attempt having failed in murder and mayhem and rightful defeat.With Tito having learn’t nothing in then trying to impose his Socialist zb pile.Yeah right loads of different people with their own distinct cultures all minding their own business within their own sovereign states.All then put together as one and ruled by centralised control.What could possibly go wrong.
chrisdalott:
Hey carryfast, is the united kingdom a nation or a federation?
It’s a Franco Norman Federation built on blood and suffering and force.Hence Ireland 1916-20 and Sturgeon now having hijacked Wallace’s justified position of secession for her own Federalist aims.
The ‘nations’ that make up the British Isles can be seen in the Euro football championships. 
Yet it has held together for several hundred years and delivered peace and prosperity for its people, to the point of them voting to remain in the union in the Scottish referendum
Carryfast:
Evil8Beezle:
- WHERE DID THE VOTE SAY WE WOULD BECOME A 3rd COUNTRY AND NOT TRY TO MAKE DEALS WITH THE EU■■?
I’m waiting CF, or are you doing your normal internet version of: I can’t hear you!
Feel free to explain how you’re going to deliver an end to free movement,which certainly was part of the Leave campaign’s documented position because I’ve still got the leaflets here advertising exactly that to the electorate,as an EEA member state.
[/quote]
Feel free to explain how that answer is actually answering the question.
How about answering it rather than your tiresome “I have no answer so ill just start with “feel free” and try and change the subject”
The-Snowman:
Carryfast:
Evil8Beezle:
- WHERE DID THE VOTE SAY WE WOULD BECOME A 3rd COUNTRY AND NOT TRY TO MAKE DEALS WITH THE EU■■?
I’m waiting CF, or are you doing your normal internet version of: I can’t hear you!
Feel free to explain how you’re going to deliver an end to free movement,which certainly was part of the Leave campaign’s documented position because I’ve still got the leaflets here advertising exactly that to the electorate,as an EEA member state.
Feel free to explain how that answer is actually answering the question.
How about answering it rather than your tiresome “I have no answer so ill just start with “feel free” and try and change the subject”
[/quote]
The answer is there you’ve just chosen to ignore it.
The leave manifesto was in large part based on an end to free movement.
EEA member state status won’t provide that.
Carryfast:
The-Snowman:
Carryfast:
Evil8Beezle:
- WHERE DID THE VOTE SAY WE WOULD BECOME A 3rd COUNTRY AND NOT TRY TO MAKE DEALS WITH THE EU■■?
I’m waiting CF, or are you doing your normal internet version of: I can’t hear you!
Feel free to explain how you’re going to deliver an end to free movement,which certainly was part of the Leave campaign’s documented position because I’ve still got the leaflets here advertising exactly that to the electorate,as an EEA member state.
Feel free to explain how that answer is actually answering the question.
How about answering it rather than your tiresome “I have no answer so ill just start with “feel free” and try and change the subject”
The answer is there you’ve just chosen to ignore it.
The leave manifesto was in large part based on an end to free movement.
EEA member state status won’t provide that.
[/quote]
So where did you point out it says “no deals with the EU”? I must have missed it
Saying they will put an end to free movement does not equate to we will not make any deals.
Except in your head maybe