In or out of EU ? Poll

[carryfast]

muckles:

Carryfast:
The problem being that the pro immigration agenda has tried,and in many cases succeeded through propaganda,in making jus Soli ( place of birth ) the most relied on criteria.To the point where most of the indigenous population here probably don’t even know that jus Sanguinis is the relevant criterea in many cases.

So you are saying the law says just being born in the UK makes you a British citizen?

As it stands exactly.On that note there is absolutely nothing to stop a pregnant woman from any third world country arriving in a British private maternity hospital wing or maybe even possibly NHS and the child then being given automatic UK citizenship when it’s delivered.

dailymail.co.uk/health/artic … urist.html

[dolph]

Mr Cameron travelled to the Lesovo border crossing and the nearby Elhovo control centre with Bulgarian counterpart Boyko Borissov - after holding talks in Sofia last night to bolster support for his EU reform proposals.
After chatting with border patrol officials, he urged others to learn from the Bulgarian approach.
“Britain has always maintained - and will always maintain - our own borders,” he said.
"We are not in the border-free Schengen Zone.
"But it is important that Europe has strong external borders and here in Bulgaria you can see a prime minister and a government that is absolutely committed to that.

Read more: dailymail.co.uk/wires/pa/art … z3tZnMUUuS

[carryfast]

Dolph:
Mr Cameron travelled to the Lesovo border crossing and the nearby Elhovo control centre with Bulgarian counterpart Boyko Borissov - after holding talks in Sofia last night to bolster support for his EU reform proposals.
After chatting with border patrol officials, he urged others to learn from the Bulgarian approach.
“Britain has always maintained - and will always maintain - our own borders,” he said.
"We are not in the border-free Schengen Zone.
"But it is important that Europe has strong external borders and here in Bulgaria you can see a prime minister and a government that is absolutely committed to that.

Read more: dailymail.co.uk/wires/pa/art … z3tZnMUUuS

Meanwhile at home the Jihadists are already here with no fear of deportation and even those that aren’t can stay if they can get in from Calais,because of his and Merkel’s immigration policies and those before him.With a police force facing assualt weapons with zb tasers.With the Jihadist threat of Saudi and Iran met by dropping a few bombs or missiles in Syria or Iraq while supporting the Saudi,Turkish and Iranian Islamic regimes where Jihad has its roots and is getting its support.

As for the EU as I said the best way to fix that is for us to leave it not try to ‘reform’ it.Then do everything possible to convince those remaining in it,of the benefits of kicking out people like Merkel and Junker and breaking it up and then rebuilding it as the Confederation,of seperate,sovereign,nation states,that it should have been from the start.

[boredwivdrivin]

Dolph:
“Britain has always maintained - and will always maintain - our own borders,” he said.

who does the posh fatty think hes kidding .

thatcher stopped counting people leaving the country ( to save money ! ) and border controls has been cut back with every government since .

they have absolutely no idea how many people have overstayed their student/visitor visas . if these people keep their noses clean they will never be found .

also on small ports in west country the customs sheds have signs on them asking you to ring customs/immigration if you have anything to declare as posts are unmanned !!

and to top that off they have given free movement to every gangster country in europe .

any turk or russian can buy a eu passport from the state official gangsters in bulgari / romania for a few hundred euros baksheesh .

does dave think we are all idiots

[winseer]

boredwivdrivin:

Dolph:
“Britain has always maintained - and will always maintain - our own borders,” he said.

who does the posh fatty think hes kidding .

thatcher stopped counting people leaving the country ( to save money ! ) and border controls has been cut back with every government since .

they have absolutely no idea how many people have overstayed their student/visitor visas . if these people keep their noses clean they will never be found .

also on small ports in west country the customs sheds have signs on them asking you to ring customs/immigration if you have anything to declare as posts are unmanned !!

and to top that off they have given free movement to every gangster country in europe .

any turk or russian can buy a eu passport from the state official gangsters in bulgari / romania for a few hundred euros baksheesh .

does dave think we are all idiots

Dave knows we’re all idiots. The vast majority of voters going over to UKIP - were from Labour. Imagine his delight when he contained the sea of blue in the south of England, thanks to Pensioners in big houses voting Tory 'cos they were worried about Milliband’s Mansion tax…

[dolph]

Carryfast:

Dolph:
Mr Cameron travelled to the Lesovo border crossing and the nearby Elhovo control centre with Bulgarian counterpart Boyko Borissov - after holding talks in Sofia last night to bolster support for his EU reform proposals.
After chatting with border patrol officials, he urged others to learn from the Bulgarian approach.
“Britain has always maintained - and will always maintain - our own borders,” he said.
"We are not in the border-free Schengen Zone.
"But it is important that Europe has strong external borders and here in Bulgaria you can see a prime minister and a government that is absolutely committed to that.

Read more: dailymail.co.uk/wires/pa/art … z3tZnMUUuS

Meanwhile at home the Jihadists are already here with no fear of deportation and even those that aren’t can stay if they can get in from Calais,because of his and Merkel’s immigration policies and those before him.With a police force facing assualt weapons with zb tasers.With the Jihadist threat of Saudi and Iran met by dropping a few bombs or missiles in Syria or Iraq while supporting the Saudi,Turkish and Iranian Islamic regimes where Jihad has its roots and is getting its support.

As for the EU as I said the best way to fix that is for us to leave it not try to ‘reform’ it.Then do everything possible to convince those remaining in it,of the benefits of kicking out people like Merkel and Junker and breaking it up and then rebuilding it as the Confederation,of seperate,sovereign,nation states,that it should have been from the start.

CF, again your feelings are getting over. Its not Merkel fault if UK doesn’t deport illegals, its your fault. The Calais is mostly French and Italian problem, they simply refuse to deal with it because the illegals want to go to UK. Why the French are doing it, you have to ask them.
CF again, its not EU job to give British police guns instead of tasers, again UK old style policies - cops not heaving guns, policies like not heaving ID cars, outdated benefit system etc. Why British police does not have guns in 21 century where terrorist can get hands on AK47’s and kill civilians is beyond me.

[dolph]

boredwivdrivin:

Dolph:
“Britain has always maintained - and will always maintain - our own borders,” he said.

who does the posh fatty think hes kidding .

thatcher stopped counting people leaving the country ( to save money ! ) and border controls has been cut back with every government since .

they have absolutely no idea how many people have overstayed their student/visitor visas . if these people keep their noses clean they will never be found .

also on small ports in west country the customs sheds have signs on them asking you to ring customs/immigration if you have anything to declare as posts are unmanned !!

and to top that off they have given free movement to every gangster country in europe .

any turk or russian can buy a eu passport from the state official gangsters in bulgari / romania for a few hundred euros baksheesh .

does dave think we are all idiots

Smart a$$, why don’t you come and get passport for 100 quid!

[dolph]

Carryfast, one more thing. You keep bashing how bad is Federalism, how people have to be against it by all means because is BAD.
In the same time you live in a Federal state so to speak, a union of 4 countries with same currency, no borders and I dare to say you live a very good life. I have lived in Federal state and was great. Why shouldn’t Europe be the same what UK is, or US is?
That’s hypocrisy at it best, you are against EU Federal “super” state, but in the same time you want your country(UK)back, which is also a Federal state…

[carryfast]

Dolph:

Carryfast:
Meanwhile at home the Jihadists are already here with no fear of deportation and even those that aren’t can stay if they can get in from Calais,because of his and Merkel’s immigration policies and those before him.With a police force facing assualt weapons with zb tasers.With the Jihadist threat of Saudi and Iran met by dropping a few bombs or missiles in Syria or Iraq while supporting the Saudi,Turkish and Iranian Islamic regimes where Jihad has its roots and is getting its support.

As for the EU as I said the best way to fix that is for us to leave it not try to ‘reform’ it.Then do everything possible to convince those remaining in it,of the benefits of kicking out people like Merkel and Junker and breaking it up and then rebuilding it as the Confederation,of seperate,sovereign,nation states,that it should have been from the start.

CF, again your feelings are getting over. Its not Merkel fault if UK doesn’t deport illegals, its your fault. The Calais is mostly French and Italian problem, they simply refuse to deal with it because the illegals want to go to UK. Why the French are doing it, you have to ask them.
CF again, its not EU job to give British police guns instead of tasers, again UK old style policies - cops not heaving guns, policies like not heaving ID cars, outdated benefit system etc. Why British police does not have guns in 21 century where terrorist can get hands on AK47’s and kill civilians is beyond me.

Firstly I’d doubt if the type of deportation and repatriation regime which it would take would fit EU ‘human rights’ legislation.While we certainly can blame Merkel and Junker for inviting in loads of more immigration from Asia and Africa and many of those will add to the numbers trying to get in here at Calais.In addition to those subject to Merkel’s etc plans for EU redistribution and/or free movement after being given EU citizen status.

As for our ‘benefit’ system as I said we can’t change/dismantle that without a massive structural change in the wage regime which would allow people to look after themselves and we won’t get that change with an open door cheap labour immigration policy that adds to the labour supply.Regardless of whether it’s EU economic migration or non EU.Nor can we do anything about existing claimants.However what we need to do is put the word ‘national’ back into the NHS and ‘National Insurance/Social Security’ system to stop access to it by non UK ‘nationals’ including ‘EU citizens’.Again we can’t do that unless we dump our EU membership and all the Federalist government dictatorial free movement immigration bs which is part of it.

On that note what is your objection and why,if any,to the idea of the EU being ‘reformed’ along Confederal,as opposed to Federal,lines in which each seperate state maintains full national sovereignty which obviously includes immigration and trade policies ?.

[carryfast]

Dolph:
Carryfast, one more thing. You keep bashing how bad is Federalism, how people have to be against it by all means because is BAD.
In the same time you live in a Federal state so to speak, a union of 4 countries with same currency, no borders and I dare to say you live a very good life. I have lived in Federal state and was great. Why shouldn’t Europe be the same what UK is, or US is?
That’s hypocrisy at it best, you are against EU Federal “super” state, but in the same time you want your country(UK)back, which is also a Federal state…

There’s no inconsistency in that regard at least in my case having made it clear that I’m a nationalist who would have fought with Collins against the UK federation in the case of the Irish struggle for independence,for example.Or for that matter would have been proud to fight on the Confederate side in the US civil war ‘if’ I’d have been around at the time.

On that note,as I’ve said,the contradiction between pro UK Federation anti Federalist EU really damages UKIP’s credibility in that nationalism isn’t something which can be selectively applied.In which case I,for one,am just as against the idea of the ‘UK’ as the ‘EU’ or the US federations.In that they are all undemocratic therefore dictatorial institutions,which contradict the idea and right of self determination.

[boredwivdrivin]

Dolph:
smart a$$, why don’t you come and get passport for 100 quid!

i was totally wrong saying that . apologies .

its a couple of thousand !!

““Islamic State Fighters Reportedly Travelling in EU on Bulgarian Passports -”” See more at: novinite.com/articles/169602 … UZEz9.dpuf

::"“Border police in Germany has already detained jihadists wanted by Interpol who were travelling on real Bulgarian passports. The explanation is that the Bulgarian mafia was “working closely with criminal gangs from Russia, Serbia and Italy””

And …

““European press reports also have revealed that Muslim extremists are infiltrating Europe through Bulgaria, with the assistance of organized crime groups that can provide terrorists with forged identity documents.””

:: freebeacon.com/national-security … unimpeded/

then there is the trade in syrian passports , organised in bulgari , which allows the holder to claim asylum in EU

““In Bulgaria 10,000 fake Syrian passports have been seized, which is likely to be only a fraction of those in circulation elsewhere.””

:: telegraph.co.uk/news/worldne … rants.html

of course its not just bulgari that is mafia country , greece and romania are little better .

being in a ‘union’ with these baksheesh countries is crazy

particularly as gives russians a platform to operate in EU .

for any further whinging just type burgaria +mafia into google and read about the various groups . CIA casebooks and wikileaks tell you all about the mafias history in government too .

[boredwivdrivin]

Carryfast:
As for the EU as I said the best way to fix that is for us to leave it not try to ‘reform’ it.Then do everything possible to convince those remaining in it,of the benefits of kicking out people like Merkel and Junker and breaking it up and then rebuilding it as the Confederation,of seperate,sovereign,nation states,that it should have been from the start.

how naive people think they can reform EU is beyond me . the politicians might stitch up a deal behind closed doors to try and win referendum , but then they will interpret a yes vote as a request by electorate to unleash the european ‘dream’
we will be in worse position after a yes vote than we are now .
our only negotiating position is leaving . once we are out we can always negotiate some mutually satisfactory deals , as we see fit .

winseer :: with regards to UKIP . what a steaming great pile of plonkers !

they say they want independence from Brussels , but wont consider giving england independence from UK .

we all know if the english had a vote on scotland , they would be long gone . which is exactly why we were not asked .

the same for NI . its not english taxpayers job to police christian terrorism in another island . let them sort it out themselves .

wales should logically be treated the same , altho i personally would vote to remain in an alliance with the joneses as i love the country .

UKIP need to sort this out if they ever want my vote

[carryfast]

boredwivdrivin:

Carryfast:
As for the EU as I said the best way to fix that is for us to leave it not try to ‘reform’ it.Then do everything possible to convince those remaining in it,of the benefits of kicking out people like Merkel and Junker and breaking it up and then rebuilding it as the Confederation,of seperate,sovereign,nation states,that it should have been from the start.

how naive people think they can reform EU is beyond me . the politicians might stitch up a deal behind closed doors to try and win referendum , but then they will interpret a yes vote as a request by electorate to unleash the european ‘dream’
we will be in worse position after a yes vote than we are now .
our only negotiating position is leaving . once we are out we can always negotiate some mutually satisfactory deals , as we see fit .

winseer :: with regards to UKIP . what a steaming great pile of plonkers !

they say they want independence from Brussels , but wont consider giving england independence from UK .

we all know if the english had a vote on scotland , they would be long gone . which is exactly why we were not asked .

the same for NI . its not english taxpayers job to police christian terrorism in another island . let them sort it out themselves .

wales should logically be treated the same , altho i personally would vote to remain in an alliance with the joneses as i love the country .

UKIP need to sort this out if they ever want my vote

Notwithstanding that glaring inconsistency in UKIP’s ideological position,regards pro Federalist UK anti Federalist EU,they are arguably as close as we’re going to get to a credible force that will at least get us out of the EU with a better leader than either Cameron or Corbyn at this time.

Having said that you’re right in the sense that UKIP’s pro UK position actually counts against getting us out.Bearing in mind the even worse situation of a pro EU Scottish ‘Nationalist’ Socialist Party with its built in unfair electoral advantage on a vote per MP basis so long as the UK stays together.

So yes UKIP really needs to get its act together by ditching its pro UK stance and go for breakup of the UK and an English parliament based on PR.

Having said that all the signs are that both here and in France there is a much larger immigrant and therefore obviously anti nationalist vote than we’re being led to believe.In which case ironically the whole issue is a scary lost cause in which the indigenous population has no real electoral control over the place at all and it’s now just a matter of time until it ends up in the similar situation of the former Yugoslavia.

[dolph]

boredwivdrivin:

Dolph:
smart a$$, why don’t you come and get passport for 100 quid!

i was totally wrong saying that . apologies .

its a couple of thousand !!

““Islamic State Fighters Reportedly Travelling in EU on Bulgarian Passports -”” See more at: novinite.com/articles/169602 … UZEz9.dpuf

::"“Border police in Germany has already detained jihadists wanted by Interpol who were travelling on real Bulgarian passports. The explanation is that the Bulgarian mafia was “working closely with criminal gangs from Russia, Serbia and Italy””

And …

““European press reports also have revealed that Muslim extremists are infiltrating Europe through Bulgaria, with the assistance of organized crime groups that can provide terrorists with forged identity documents.””

:: freebeacon.com/national-security … unimpeded/

then there is the trade in syrian passports , organised in bulgari , which allows the holder to claim asylum in EU

““In Bulgaria 10,000 fake Syrian passports have been seized, which is likely to be only a fraction of those in circulation elsewhere.””

:: telegraph.co.uk/news/worldne … rants.html

of course its not just bulgari that is mafia country , greece and romania are little better .

being in a ‘union’ with these baksheesh countries is crazy

particularly as gives russians a platform to operate in EU .

for any further whinging just type burgaria +mafia into google and read about the various groups . CIA casebooks and wikileaks tell you all about the mafias history in government too .

Again talking non sense and hatred are spilling from your post.
Yes we have mafia, every country has it. Just because some mafia guy bribed a police chief to make a passport doesn’t mean the whole country is mafia. Also our mafia can not operate without the support of western EU mafia.
I could easily say Britain main export is criminals to Bulgaria, but is going to be stupid generalization and Im not gonna fall on your level.
Britain is mafia country no less the Bulgaria.
Please do tell how we are platform for Russians to operate in EU, again idiotic and stupid comments. We were one of the first to support sanctions against Russia, even though we are badly hurt, because out tourism and agriculture depends on Russian market. We stopped build south stream pipeline with Russia, we stopped building new nuclear power plant with Russia, all because demand from countries like Germany, France and Britain. In the same time we depend on Russian gas 100%.
Ill tell you what is crazy, its British attitude and policies throughout the years regarding EU.

[carryfast]

Dolph:
We were one of the first to support sanctions against Russia, even though we are badly hurt, because out tourism and agriculture depends on Russian market. We stopped build south stream pipeline with Russia, we stopped building new nuclear power plant with Russia, all because demand from countries like Germany, France and Britain. In the same time we depend on Russian gas 100%.
Ill tell you what is crazy, its British attitude and policies throughout the years regarding EU.

Ironically you would have been better off to tell the EU to get stuffed and support Putin.On the basis of the question what’s the difference between Russian calls for partition of Eastern Ukraine,to reflect the wishes of the local Russian loyalist majority,v the partition of Ireland to reflect the wishes of the British loyalist majority in Northern Ireland.

As for our internal arguments between Federalist v anti Federalist that’s obviously for us to sort out.Bearing in mind that historically the Federalist side of that argument is so entrenched in its bs mindset that it usually resorts to force if it doesn’t get its way.

[winseer]

Carryfast:

Dolph:
We were one of the first to support sanctions against Russia, even though we are badly hurt, because out tourism and agriculture depends on Russian market. We stopped build south stream pipeline with Russia, we stopped building new nuclear power plant with Russia, all because demand from countries like Germany, France and Britain. In the same time we depend on Russian gas 100%.
Ill tell you what is crazy, its British attitude and policies throughout the years regarding EU.

Ironically you would have been better off to tell the EU to get stuffed and support Putin.On the basis of the question what’s the difference between Russian calls for partition of Eastern Ukraine,to reflect the wishes of the local Russian loyalist majority,v the partition of Ireland to reflect the wishes of the British loyalist majority in Northern Ireland.

As for our internal arguments between Federalist v anti Federalist that’s obviously for us to sort out.Bearing in mind that historically the Federalist side of that argument is so entrenched in its bs mindset that it usually resorts to force if it doesn’t get its way.

Not even Farage wants to pump that one I think… I can see our politicians being bumped off by “CIA Assets” once they embark upon a policy towards making Russia “Most Favoured Ally” - and winding down the “Special Relationship” at the same time.

Daft thing is, I’m no commie or Labour voter or leftist - But I, personally would like to see more co-operation (of the UK) with the East and less with NATO, America and the west beyond the Commonwealth states, let’s say…

[dolph]

Winseer:

Carryfast:

Dolph:
We were one of the first to support sanctions against Russia, even though we are badly hurt, because out tourism and agriculture depends on Russian market. We stopped build south stream pipeline with Russia, we stopped building new nuclear power plant with Russia, all because demand from countries like Germany, France and Britain. In the same time we depend on Russian gas 100%.
Ill tell you what is crazy, its British attitude and policies throughout the years regarding EU.

Ironically you would have been better off to tell the EU to get stuffed and support Putin.On the basis of the question what’s the difference between Russian calls for partition of Eastern Ukraine,to reflect the wishes of the local Russian loyalist majority,v the partition of Ireland to reflect the wishes of the British loyalist majority in Northern Ireland.

As for our internal arguments between Federalist v anti Federalist that’s obviously for us to sort out.Bearing in mind that historically the Federalist side of that argument is so entrenched in its bs mindset that it usually resorts to force if it doesn’t get its way.

Not even Farage wants to pump that one I think… I can see our politicians being bumped off by “CIA Assets” once they embark upon a policy towards making Russia “Most Favoured Ally” - and winding down the “Special Relationship” at the same time.

Daft thing is, I’m no commie or Labour voter or leftist - But I, personally would like to see more co-operation (of the UK) with the East and less with NATO, America and the west beyond the Commonwealth states, let’s say…

You are absolutely correct, you don’t have to be commie/socialist to want better relation/cooperation with Russia(read resources) and EE. Im glad there is British people who use their brain cells.

[carryfast]

Winseer:

Carryfast:

Dolph:
We were one of the first to support sanctions against Russia, even though we are badly hurt, because out tourism and agriculture depends on Russian market. We stopped build south stream pipeline with Russia, we stopped building new nuclear power plant with Russia, all because demand from countries like Germany, France and Britain. In the same time we depend on Russian gas 100%.
Ill tell you what is crazy, its British attitude and policies throughout the years regarding EU.

Ironically you would have been better off to tell the EU to get stuffed and support Putin.On the basis of the question what’s the difference between Russian calls for partition of Eastern Ukraine,to reflect the wishes of the local Russian loyalist majority,v the partition of Ireland to reflect the wishes of the British loyalist majority in Northern Ireland.

As for our internal arguments between Federalist v anti Federalist that’s obviously for us to sort out.Bearing in mind that historically the Federalist side of that argument is so entrenched in its bs mindset that it usually resorts to force if it doesn’t get its way.

Not even Farage wants to pump that one I think… I can see our politicians being bumped off by “CIA Assets” once they embark upon a policy towards making Russia “Most Favoured Ally” - and winding down the “Special Relationship” at the same time.

Daft thing is, I’m no commie or Labour voter or leftist - But I, personally would like to see more co-operation (of the UK) with the East and less with NATO, America and the west beyond the Commonwealth states, let’s say…

The issue of federalism v anti federalism or the need to compromise in the case of issues like Irish or Ukrainian Nationalism v British or Russian Loyalism has nothing to do with alliances like NATO.On that note Farage has already made his position clear in that regard.But yes as I’ve said it would be no surprise that the US government would view any opposition to the aims of US Federalism,in the form of it wanting to create a USE,as a threat.They obviously don’t view Farage or Le Pen as enough of a threat to need to take the option of a ‘forced’ removal.Probably because it’s easier to just keep on fixing any anti Federalist vote/move in Europe.

youtube.com/watch?v=PjC6UhAM16Y

As for our position in NATO I’d prefer to see a move to ally ourselves with the increasing anti Federalist movement and feeling in the US than bothering with the unstable lost cause of the ‘Commonwealth’ countries.IE a Confederal Europe pushing for a Confederal America rather than a Federal America pushing for a Federal Europe.

[carryfast]

Dolph:
You are absolutely correct, you don’t have to be commie/socialist to want better relation/cooperation with Russia(read resources) and EE. Im glad there is British people who use their brain cells.

‘Using our brain cells’ in this case obviously meaning following Farage’s and Le Pen’s foreign policy agenda rather than that of Merkel’s,Junker’s and Obama’s.

[dolph]

Carryfast:

Dolph:
You are absolutely correct, you don’t have to be commie/socialist to want better relation/cooperation with Russia(read resources) and EE. Im glad there is British people who use their brain cells.

‘Using our brain cells’ in this case obviously meaning following Farage’s and Le Pen’s foreign policy agenda rather than that of Merkel’s,Junker’s and Obama’s.

No, actually means following our(EU) interest and co-operate with Russia, sell them goods, product and produce, buy cheap oil and gas and screw US. Because UK is like a mirror image of US when comes to foreign policy, if you believe UK out of EU will not follow US demands you are dead wrong.