I just don`t get it

UK PROFESSIONAL DRIVERS FORUMS THE UK PROFESSIONAL DRIVERS FORUM (INTERACTIVE)
1

Nope, no matter how many times I read up on it, no matter how many questions I ask, no matter how many times I think I`ve grasped it, I still cannot get my head around the whole driving rules dogpoo.

Who the hell thought this complicated drivel up to start with? and who thought it would be a good idea to implement it and use it, and why the frick isn`t it taught in depth at CPCs for new drivers, as well as the other not so helpful stuff they preach sorry I mean teach?

Why the hell is it so complicated?? Why??

2

I don’t think it’s that complicated personally. Could be simpler granted but the basics are easy to learn

3

Muckles did a crib sheet that I thought was good covering all the basics, maybe he’s feeling in a good mood and will post the link again! :wink:

You’ll get there mate! :smiley:

4

I thought that you were on about ■■■.The rules are more complex than they need to be.

5

It’s not that hard.

The basics…
Fixed week is 00:00 Monday to 23:59 Sunday.
No more than 56 hours in a single week, and no more than 90 hours in a fortnight. This is a rolling fortnight, which means the current week counts towards last weeks driving, and next weeks. Maximum 9 hours a day driving, except no more than two extended 10 hour drives in a fixed week.

Duty time. A normal weekly rest is 45 hours long. A reduce rest is between 24 hours and 44:59 long. Anything less than 24 hours is a daily rest. The week can run any time between 2 weekly rest periods. This is not a fixed week. During that time you can do no more than 3 reduced rest periods (except split breaks). A reduced rest is less than 11 hours daily rest. All rest must be shown by 24 hours from putting your card in.

Start at 0600, finish at 1900 = 11 hours rest.
Start at 0600, finish at 1930 = 10.5 hours (reduced).
Start at 0600, finish at 1700 but start day 2 at 0300 = 10 hours reduced rest.
Start at 0600, finish at 2100 but start day 2 at 0800 = 9 hours reduced rest by 0600, the extra 3 hours are irrelevant.

A split break is where an uninterrupted break of 3 hours (technically should be rest) is added to a reduced 9 hour daily rest to make a 12 hour rest and does not count as a reduced rest.

Driving is not to exceed 4.5 hours. Breaks can be split into either a 15 min then 30 min break, or two 30 min breaks, or a straight 45min break. The last part of the break must be at least 30 mins.

A break is for driving time and means a break from driving.
Rest is an overnight or weekend rest where the driver is free to dispose of his/her time.

See, simple :stuck_out_tongue:

6

switchlogic:
I don’t think it’s that complicated personally. Could be simpler granted but the basics are easy to learn

This. Stick to the basic parts if you can, then do things like splitting daily rest, reduced rest periods etc.
Do a job like tippers/skips/mixers. The hours these jobs entail, you’ll only need to know the basics (unless you have a sleeper cab).

7

You’ll find, the more you use them and abuse them the easier most of them become to remember. I used to have cold sweats about how many reduced daily rests and extended driving hours I could have per week, but now I use it to my advantage, mostly to get me home. After a few weeks it becomes second nature to calculate it, honest.

Just try not to use your 10 hour drives vs the usual 9 hours per 24 at the start of the week as they’re useful to get you back. Same with the 15 hour working days vs the usual 13 hours. And POA can be for the most part ignored. Oh and don’t over think it, when you need to use those little extras you’ll be able to work it out, but they are useful.

Having just read what OVLOV JAY wrote - I agree it’s seriously overly complicated. :slight_smile:

8

Poa can be very usefull if say you’ve pulled up at a site and can’t get on a bay for an hour or 2 and your Sat waiting… basically it can extend your 6 hour wtd to whatever time you’ve spent on poa provided your not doing any work then of course it must be on duty time. It’s a pain in the arse cus ur taco classes it as a break but for us in the UK and Sweden it’s not a break so you just need a mental note of what driving you have done…

Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk

9

alamcculloch:
I thought that you were on about ■■■.The rules are more complex than they need to be.

Far from it, they’re remarkably similar. 45 minute rest after 4 and half minutes. Maximum 9 minutes in any 24 hour period, can be extended twice a week to 10 minutes if there’s any foreplay.

10

switchlogic:
I don’t think it’s that complicated personally. Could be simpler granted but the basics are easy to learn

Good for you, glad you understand it, not a particularly helpful comment there to be fair :neutral_face:

Evil8Beezle:
Muckles did a crib sheet that I thought was good covering all the basics, maybe he’s feeling in a good mood and will post the link again! :wink:

You’ll get there mate! :smiley:

Cheers Bud, I hope so, there just seems to be so many grey areas :unamused: :laughing:

alamcculloch:
I thought that you were on about ■■■.The rules are more complex than they need to be.

Hmmmm what, the rules for ■■■ or the rules for driving ? :laughing:

OVLOV JAY:
It’s not that hard.

The basics…
Fixed week is 00:00 Monday to 23:59 Sunday.
No more than 56 hours in a single week, and no more than 90 hours in a fortnight. This is a rolling fortnight, which means the current week counts towards last weeks driving, and next weeks. Maximum 9 hours a day driving, except no more than two extended 10 hour drives in a fixed week.

Duty time. A normal weekly rest is 45 hours long. A reduce rest is between 24 hours and 44:59 long. Anything less than 24 hours is a daily rest. The week can run any time between 2 weekly rest periods. This is not a fixed week. During that time you can do no more than 3 reduced rest periods (except split breaks). A reduced rest is less than 11 hours daily rest. All rest must be shown by 24 hours from putting your card in.

Start at 0600, finish at 1900 = 11 hours rest.
Start at 0600, finish at 1930 = 10.5 hours (reduced).
Start at 0600, finish at 1700 but start day 2 at 0300 = 10 hours reduced rest.
Start at 0600, finish at 2100 but start day 2 at 0800 = 9 hours reduced rest by 0600, the extra 3 hours are irrelevant.

A split break is where an uninterrupted break of 3 hours (technically should be rest) is added to a reduced 9 hour daily rest to make a 12 hour rest and does not count as a reduced rest.

Driving is not to exceed 4.5 hours. Breaks can be split into either a 15 min then 30 min break, or two 30 min breaks, or a straight 45min break. The last part of the break must be at least 30 mins.

A break is for driving time and means a break from driving.
Rest is an overnight or weekend rest where the driver is free to dispose of his/her time.

See, simple :stuck_out_tongue:

:open_mouth: :open_mouth: :open_mouth: :open_mouth: :open_mouth: … Nope, still dont get it ... I have questions, let me work out how the ■■■■ I can explain as to what I dont understand and I`ll be back :laughing: :laughing: :laughing: :laughing: :laughing:

trevHCS:
You’ll find, the more you use them and abuse them the easier most of them become to remember. I used to have cold sweats about how many reduced daily rests and extended driving hours I could have per week, but now I use it to my advantage, mostly to get me home. After a few weeks it becomes second nature to calculate it, honest.

Just try not to use your 10 hour drives vs the usual 9 hours per 24 at the start of the week as they’re useful to get you back. Same with the 15 hour working days vs the usual 13 hours. And POA can be for the most part ignored. Oh and don’t over think it, when you need to use those little extras you’ll be able to work it out, but they are useful.

Having just read what OVLOV JAY wrote - I agree it’s seriously overly complicated. :slight_smile:

See, Im doing local running about, not distance or nights out hence the fact its just not sinking in, and it just doesn`t work for local work :laughing: :laughing: :laughing:

Berty:
Poa can be very usefull if say you’ve pulled up at a site and can’t get on a bay for an hour or 2 and your Sat waiting… basically it can extend your 6 hour wtd to whatever time you’ve spent on poa provided your not doing any work then of course it must be on duty time. It’s a pain in the arse cus ur taco classes it as a break but for us in the UK and Sweden it’s not a break so you just need a mental note of what driving you have done…

POA does my tree in. I`ve been on POA for 4hrs today due to the factory breaking down, so how does that affect me? What does it actually mean?

11

Trouble:

switchlogic:
I don’t think it’s that complicated personally. Could be simpler granted but the basics are easy to learn

Good for you, glad you understand it, not a particularly helpful comment there to be fair :neutral_face:

Evil8Beezle:
Muckles did a crib sheet that I thought was good covering all the basics, maybe he’s feeling in a good mood and will post the link again! :wink:

You’ll get there mate! :smiley:

Cheers Bud, I hope so, there just seems to be so many grey areas :unamused: [emoji38]

alamcculloch:
I thought that you were on about ■■■.The rules are more complex than they need to be.

Hmmmm what, the rules for ■■■ or the rules for driving ? [emoji38]

OVLOV JAY:
It’s not that hard.

The basics…
Fixed week is 00:00 Monday to 23:59 Sunday.
No more than 56 hours in a single week, and no more than 90 hours in a fortnight. This is a rolling fortnight, which means the current week counts towards last weeks driving, and next weeks. Maximum 9 hours a day driving, except no more than two extended 10 hour drives in a fixed week.

Duty time. A normal weekly rest is 45 hours long. A reduce rest is between 24 hours and 44:59 long. Anything less than 24 hours is a daily rest. The week can run any time between 2 weekly rest periods. This is not a fixed week. During that time you can do no more than 3 reduced rest periods (except split breaks). A reduced rest is less than 11 hours daily rest. All rest must be shown by 24 hours from putting your card in.

Start at 0600, finish at 1900 = 11 hours rest.
Start at 0600, finish at 1930 = 10.5 hours (reduced).
Start at 0600, finish at 1700 but start day 2 at 0300 = 10 hours reduced rest.
Start at 0600, finish at 2100 but start day 2 at 0800 = 9 hours reduced rest by 0600, the extra 3 hours are irrelevant.

A split break is where an uninterrupted break of 3 hours (technically should be rest) is added to a reduced 9 hour daily rest to make a 12 hour rest and does not count as a reduced rest.

Driving is not to exceed 4.5 hours. Breaks can be split into either a 15 min then 30 min break, or two 30 min breaks, or a straight 45min break. The last part of the break must be at least 30 mins.

A break is for driving time and means a break from driving.
Rest is an overnight or weekend rest where the driver is free to dispose of his/her time.

See, simple :stuck_out_tongue:

:open_mouth: :open_mouth: :open_mouth: :open_mouth: :open_mouth: … Nope, still dont get it ... I have questions, let me work out how the [zb] I can explain as to what I dont understand and I`ll be back [emoji38] [emoji38] [emoji38] [emoji38] [emoji38]

trevHCS:
You’ll find, the more you use them and abuse them the easier most of them become to remember. I used to have cold sweats about how many reduced daily rests and extended driving hours I could have per week, but now I use it to my advantage, mostly to get me home. After a few weeks it becomes second nature to calculate it, honest.

Just try not to use your 10 hour drives vs the usual 9 hours per 24 at the start of the week as they’re useful to get you back. Same with the 15 hour working days vs the usual 13 hours. And POA can be for the most part ignored. Oh and don’t over think it, when you need to use those little extras you’ll be able to work it out, but they are useful.

Having just read what OVLOV JAY wrote - I agree it’s seriously overly complicated. :slight_smile:

See, Im doing local running about, not distance or nights out hence the fact its just not sinking in, and it just doesn`t work for local work [emoji38] [emoji38] [emoji38]

Berty:
Poa can be very usefull if say you’ve pulled up at a site and can’t get on a bay for an hour or 2 and your Sat waiting… basically it can extend your 6 hour wtd to whatever time you’ve spent on poa provided your not doing any work then of course it must be on duty time. It’s a pain in the arse cus ur taco classes it as a break but for us in the UK and Sweden it’s not a break so you just need a mental note of what driving you have done…

POA does my tree in. I`ve been on POA for 4hrs today due to the factory breaking down, so how does that affect me? What does it actually mean?

Basically it stops it the clock on your six hour… so whatever time you’ve had it on poa add it onto your six hour then that’s when you would need to have half hour break…

Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk

12

Right, so I had another job, van driving, 2 days a week (sometimes 3) rest of the week I work my class 2 job in round it. Though the van driving isnt tachod I still have to count it (count it as what exactly I don`t know, but it has to be counted :laughing: )

So this was what I had planned (well I hadn`t planned to be sick, that was dodgy Scampi, I was supposed to in the Van on the Monday :laughing:):

Mon (Sick)
Tues - Van
Weds - Rest
Thurs - Class 2
Friday - Class 2
Sat - Class 2
Sun - Class 2
Mon - Van
Tues - Van
Weds - Class 2
Thurs - Class 2
Fri - Class 2
Sat - Rest
Sun - Rest

Now I thought that was with in the rules, fixed week is 00:00 Monday to 23:59 Sunday, so I had a reduced weekly rest the 1st week on the Wednesday, and then Saturday and Sunday off the following week for a full weekly rest. But apparently thats not allowed as I would have worked too many days on the bounce? So the Fixed week 00:00 Monday to 23:59 Sunday is bollox then really isnt it.

So I ended up doing:

Mon (Sick)
Tues - Van
Weds - Rest
Thurs - Class 2
Friday - Class 2
Sat - Class 2
Sun - Class 2
Mon - Van
Tues - Van
Weds - Rest
Thurs - Rest
Fri - Class 2
Sat - Class 2
Sun - Class 2

Apparently that`s ok ?!! (Of course it is, it ■■■■■■ all over my plans for the week end :unamused: :unamused: :laughing: )

Then theres the "break" bull-poop ... 15 mins then 30 mins, never the other way round (coz that makes so much difference doesnt it :unamused: ) or a 45 min …

So I pull up to be told “dont need you yet driver" ... nay worries, Tacho on to break, pour a coffee, they shout me after 23 mins, but that can only be counted as 15 mins. Get loaded and off I pop (30 mins driving), get tipped (22 mins other work), get back 30 mins driving, get back to be told "dont need you yet driver, get a brew” … they shout me after 22 mins, I have to move to get loaded. Reality is at this point Ive been happily sat drinking tea and reading my paper for 45 mins over the last couple of hours, but yet Ive still only had 15 mins according to their “rules”. So then I have to drive/tip/repeat thing, only at some point with in 6 hours (WTD rule?) I have to make the team wait to load me (anywhere from 7 on wards), as I NEED to have an extra 7 minutes to “comply” with either the 45 min rule or the 30 min 6 hr WTD rule … really, and youre trying to tell me this ■■■■ aint complicated ■■ :confused:

I havent even began to try and wrap my head around the on/off stuff as we work 12 hr shifts as a rule I think Ive complied there through default (or sheer luck) :laughing: :laughing:

13

Berty:

Trouble:
POA does my tree in. I`ve been on POA for 4hrs today due to the factory breaking down, so how does that affect me? What does it actually mean?

Basically it stops it the clock on your six hour… so whatever time you’ve had it on poa add it onto your six hour then that’s when you would need to have half hour break…

So thats the WTD rule? The 6 hr rule? Thats a half hour break?

The driving is 4.5 hrs driving time, but say if I have a 45 min break after 1.5 hours of driving time (what ever point of the day I`m at) that then resets the driving time again?

Cheers for this Berty, muchly appreciated

14

This is a wind up right?

15

Coolrider:
This is a wind up right?

Nope … Sorry to disappoint :laughing:

16

alamcculloch:
I thought that you were on about ■■■.The rules are more complex than they need to be.

Think the basics are, if it moves hump it, if it dont move hump it till it moves.

Tacho regs can be confusing at first, grasp the basics and the rest will come. The best way to learn em is to live em and the more you think about them the harder it gets.

Learn daily driving limits with breaks then daily rest period limits first, treat every day like a 24 hour block and everything will click into place.

17

Muckaway:

switchlogic:
I don’t think it’s that complicated personally. Could be simpler granted but the basics are easy to learn

This. Stick to the basic parts if you can, then do things like splitting daily rest, reduced rest periods etc.
Do a job like tippers/skips/mixers. The hours these jobs entail, you’ll only need to know the basics (unless you have a sleeper cab).

Thanks. This is what Im trying to do, I think it wasnt helped by the fact I was doing two jobs, so had to count the Van job too, even though it`s not on a tacho it still counts.

18

Trouble:

Berty:
POA does my tree in. I`ve been on POA for 4hrs today due to the factory breaking down, so how does that affect me? What does it actually mean?

Basically it stops it the clock on your six hour… so whatever time you’ve had it on poa add it onto your six hour then that’s when you would need to have half hour break…

So thats the WTD rule? The 6 hr rule? Thats a half hour break?

The driving is 4.5 hrs driving time, but say if I have a 45 min break after 1.5 hours of driving time (what ever point of the day I`m at) that then resets the driving time again?

Cheers for this Berty, muchly appreciated
[/quote]
Yes but it depends on how long you have been on duty (hammers) in your example 1.5 hours driving so as long as you haven’t had 4.5 duty time then yes that would be fine. Only on duty time and driving time count towards your six hour poa doesn’t…

Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk

19

Dipper_Dave:
Tacho regs can be confusing at first, grasp the basics and the rest will come. The best way to learn em is to live em and the more you think about them the harder it gets.

Learn daily driving limits with breaks then daily rest period limits first, treat every day like a 24 hour block and everything will click into place.

Cheers Dipper, good advice. Im wondering if more "down the road" stuff would help me get to grips with it sooner, though I dont fancy being away from home, bit too dependent on life`s luxuries, I don my cap to those of you who tramp.

20

Berty:
Yes but it depends on how long you have been on duty (hammers) in your example 1.5 hours driving so as long as you haven’t had 4.5 duty time then yes that would be fine. Only on duty time and driving time count towards your six hour poa doesn’t…

Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk

Got it, that`s another part of the equation pegged, cheers for your patience :sunglasses: