[/quote]
It costs around £1.20 per hour to run a gas boiler at less than 5p per kwh.
All bets are off if they try to replace gas with electric at 20p per kwh.
Both are stated as going well North of those prices in April.
Probably along the lines of their fixed rate 6p per kwh for gas and 26p per kwh electric.
Also with plans to equalise gas with electric to ‘incentivise’ the switch.
The increase in gas standing charge from 17p per day to around 25p per day is obviously part of that and noticeably adds up over a 30 day period.
My reading under the Octopus new variable rate after my fixed rate deal ended was 1447 kwh of gas from 13th November to 7th December and was £65 and around £6 of that was standing charge.
Electric was 129 kwh for £33 and £5.49 of that was standing charge.So that’s over a tenner for less than a month in standing charges alone.
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I’ve never really sat down & worked out the cost of running the central heating so around £1.20/hour is good to know, We only fire it up around teatime until 10:00pm & we don’t run any electric heaters. It just seemed quite a steep rise in costs over & above the recent energy price rises when we’re still using the same amount energy.
lancpudn:
It costs around £1.20 per hour to run a gas boiler at less than 5p per kwh.
All bets are off if they try to replace gas with electric at 20p per kwh.
Both are stated as going well North of those prices in April.
Probably along the lines of their fixed rate 6p per kwh for gas and 26p per kwh electric.
Also with plans to equalise gas with electric to ‘incentivise’ the switch.
The increase in gas standing charge from 17p per day to around 25p per day is obviously part of that and noticeably adds up over a 30 day period.
My reading under the Octopus new variable rate after my fixed rate deal ended was 1447 kwh of gas from 13th November to 7th December and was £65 and around £6 of that was standing charge.
Electric was 129 kwh for £33 and £5.49 of that was standing charge.So that’s over a tenner for less than a month in standing charges alone.
[/quote]
I’ve never really sat down & worked out the cost of running the central heating so around £1.20/hour is good to know, We only fire it up around teatime until 10:00pm & we don’t run any electric heaters. It just seemed quite a steep rise in costs over & above the recent energy price rises when we’re still using the same amount energy.
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It’s around £1.20 per hour assuming a 25kw boiler some boilers are rated higher than that depending on amount of rads etc.‘But’ that’s also assuming less than 5p per kwh.
6p per kwh is £1.50 per hour.
While as I said good luck with all electric at 26p per kwh that’s obviously 6.50 per hour.
Combine all that with the winter of '82 when we still had ice on the inside of double glazed windows with the heating on full 24/7.
I just received a 100 euro bonus from the French government,paid directly to my energy supplier.
This is the second time.
Apparently I have a low income which is bizarre but that’s the way the tax system works here.
Will you be getting the same in the Unicorn Kingdom ?
OwenMoney:
I just received a 100 euro bonus from the French government,paid directly to my energy supplier.
This is the second time.
Apparently I have a low income which is bizarre but that’s the way the tax system works here.
Will you be getting the same in the Unicorn Kingdom ?
I read the other month that the EU were setting up a social climate fund and France were giving out energy vouchers & tax refunds. I doubt the UK will get anything since Brexit. euractiv.com/section/energy … gy-prices/
Juddian:
Not for the first nor last times wish my late brother was still around.He used to maintain the generators in central london for one of the big bank’s head office (generated their own power, more reliable), i bet a gen set designed and installed by him running on red chugging away quietly at the bottom of the garden is now more than likely a cheaper way to power your home than the mains.
I think that’s a bet you would lose. A large diesel genset is at best around 30% efficient when running at optimum loading. A litre of diesel contains 10kWh of energy (so 3kWh of electricity output). Red diesel is currently about 70p/litre - so a fuel cost of 23p per kWh. That’s for a large industrial unit, running at optimum loading - a small domestic sized unit running at variable loads throughout the day won’t get anywhere near that. Then there’s the cost of maintenance, as well as the purchase/installation costs…
Sent from my VOG-L09 using Tapatalk
lancpudn:
OwenMoney:
I just received a 100 euro bonus from the French government,paid directly to my energy supplier.
This is the second time.
Apparently I have a low income which is bizarre but that’s the way the tax system works here.
Will you be getting the same in the Unicorn Kingdom ?I read the other month that the EU were setting up a social climate fund and France were giving out energy vouchers & tax refunds. I doubt the UK will get anything since Brexit. euractiv.com/section/energy … gy-prices/
chequeenergie.gouv.fr/ If you want to look it up.
OwenMoney:
I just received a 100 euro bonus from the French government,paid directly to my energy supplier.
This is the second time.
Apparently I have a low income which is bizarre but that’s the way the tax system works here.
Will you be getting the same in the Unicorn Kingdom ?
Around a hundred quid isn’t going to cut it at 26p per kwh in the nuke fuelled all electric utopia that France wants us tied to.An electric boiler will burn through that in less than a week, if one of their nuke power stations doesn’t explode first.
Roymondo:
Juddian:
Not for the first nor last times wish my late brother was still around.He used to maintain the generators in central london for one of the big bank’s head office (generated their own power, more reliable), i bet a gen set designed and installed by him running on red chugging away quietly at the bottom of the garden is now more than likely a cheaper way to power your home than the mains.
I think that’s a bet you would lose. A large diesel genset is at best around 30% efficient when running at optimum loading. A litre of diesel contains 10kWh of energy (so 3kWh of electricity output). Red diesel is currently about 70p/litre - so a fuel cost of 23p per kWh. That’s for a large industrial unit, running at optimum loading - a small domestic sized unit running at variable loads throughout the day won’t get anywhere near that. Then there’s the cost of maintenance, as well as the purchase/installation costs…
Electric generation is less efficient than a diesel engine which is actually closer to 50% efficient.Which is why commercial shipping doesn’t use steam turbines.
Even a petrol engine is better than a power station’s efficiency plus the losses in transmission across the grid.
Which is why they are now quoting 26p per kwh for electric + the standing charge.Also bearing in mind red diesel is still subject to 20% VAT as opposed to 5% for domestic electricity.
So power the ICE genset with domestic natural gas at 5p per kwh and 5% VAT then what figures do you get ?.At least until Al Gore and his theiving cronies predictably stop that loophole by cutting off, or equalising, the price of gas.
learnmetrics.com/how-much-does- … tural-gas/
As for diesel v electric it’s clearly cheaper to generate electric with diesel engines than use mains electricity.
I’m wondering how it can possibly be legal for energy outfits to deliberately overcharge people, fake actual customer meter readings, (which is what “Override with their own estimate” amounts to…) and go on a “cash grab” of (often) four figure positive credit balances, which seems to affect diddery old folk with pots of money more than anyone else…
There’s posts on their own message boards of pensioners with demands to up their monthly direct debits to ever-higher figures per month, whilst their actual usage remains way below that, even at the elevated prices…
I insist on pay-as-I-go now. They are screaming at me to re-establish a direct debit, and then promptly demand a MINIMUM of nearly £300 per MONTH… Nope! Not doing that!
My current month’s bill came in at £129 which is bad enough. There was £63 on my account in credit, I’ve cancelled my DD already, so I’ve just sent them a payment of £66 to bring it even. I’ll pay my next bill as and when they calculate it using the readings I’ll be giving them, NO bloody estimates required!
Carryfast:
Roymondo:
Juddian:
Not for the first nor last times wish my late brother was still around.He used to maintain the generators in central london for one of the big bank’s head office (generated their own power, more reliable), i bet a gen set designed and installed by him running on red chugging away quietly at the bottom of the garden is now more than likely a cheaper way to power your home than the mains.
I think that’s a bet you would lose. A large diesel genset is at best around 30% efficient when running at optimum loading. A litre of diesel contains 10kWh of energy (so 3kWh of electricity output). Red diesel is currently about 70p/litre - so a fuel cost of 23p per kWh. That’s for a large industrial unit, running at optimum loading - a small domestic sized unit running at variable loads throughout the day won’t get anywhere near that. Then there’s the cost of maintenance, as well as the purchase/installation costs…
Electric generation is less efficient than a diesel engine which is actually closer to 50% efficient.Which is why commercial shipping doesn’t use steam turbines.
Even a petrol engine is better than a power station’s efficiency plus the losses in transmission across the grid.
Don’t agree with your figures. According to a mate who used to be an engineer at a CEGB power station, the true efficiencies are as follows:
The very best may be 99.5% but most are more like 98% efficient. Since the electricity has to pass through at least 5 transformers before it reaches the consumer, their combined efficiency is around 92%. In the UK, about 8.5% of all generated electricity is wasted in the grid and distribution system.
Buckstones:
Carryfast:
Roymondo:
I think that’s a bet you would lose. A large diesel genset is at best around 30% efficient when running at optimum loading. A litre of diesel contains 10kWh of energy (so 3kWh of electricity output). Red diesel is currently about 70p/litre - so a fuel cost of 23p per kWh. That’s for a large industrial unit, running at optimum loading - a small domestic sized unit running at variable loads throughout the day won’t get anywhere near that. Then there’s the cost of maintenance, as well as the purchase/installation costs…Electric generation is less efficient than a diesel engine which is actually closer to 50% efficient.Which is why commercial shipping doesn’t use steam turbines.
Even a petrol engine is better than a power station’s efficiency plus the losses in transmission across the grid.Don’t agree with your figures. According to a mate who used to be an engineer at a CEGB power station, the true efficiencies are as follows:
The very best may be 99.5% but most are more like 98% efficient. Since the electricity has to pass through at least 5 transformers before it reaches the consumer, their combined efficiency is around 92%. In the UK, about 8.5% of all generated electricity is wasted in the grid and distribution system.
Why are fuel costs less to run diesel electric trains than all electric trains ?.
Why does commercial shipping use diesel ICE direct propulsion rather than steam turbines.
Why is domestic electricity around 5x the price of gas per kwh ?.
Carryfast:
Buckstones:
Carryfast:
Roymondo:
Electric generation is less efficient than a diesel engine which is actually closer to 50% efficient.Which is why commercial shipping doesn’t use steam turbines.
Even a petrol engine is better than a power station’s efficiency plus the losses in transmission across the grid.Don’t agree with your figures. According to a mate who used to be an engineer at a CEGB power station, the true efficiencies are as follows:
The very best may be 99.5% but most are more like 98% efficient. Since the electricity has to pass through at least 5 transformers before it reaches the consumer, their combined efficiency is around 92%. In the UK, about 8.5% of all generated electricity is wasted in the grid and distribution system.Why are fuel costs less to run diesel electric trains than all electric trains ?.
Why does commercial shipping use diesel ICE direct propulsion rather than steam turbines.
Why is domestic electricity around 5x the price of gas per kwh ?.
The cost of running trains is not solely due to fuel cost.
Electric train infrastructure is expensive to the extent that recent proposed electrifications have been deemed not cost effective.
The cost of electricity charged to rail operating companies is also governed by market forces, as is the untaxed diesel used on rail.
Commercial shipping uses diesel engines because 1) steam turbine efficiency is proportional to size 2) A diesel engine can be stopped and started simple and immediately, most of the really large ones are two-strokes which can run in either direction so don’t need a reverse gearbox.
Ref your link to ■■■■■■■■ I worked for years at a ■■■■■■■ subsidiary, visited their HQ , development and test centre in Columbus Indiana and was involved in some of the efficiency projects referred to.
Agreed that present engines are much improved, but supply to the National Grid needs power generation on a huge scale, failure to invest in adequate capacity has been a trademark of Governments for many years.
Tidal barrages and nuclear power are the only ‘non CO2 emitting’ sources of reliable base load power when the wind doesn’t blow and the sun doesn’t shine.
Buckstones:
The cost of running trains is not solely due to fuel cost.
Electric train infrastructure is expensive to the extent that recent proposed electrifications have been deemed not cost effective.
The cost of electricity charged to rail operating companies is also governed by market forces, as is the untaxed diesel used on rail.Commercial shipping uses diesel engines because 1) steam turbine efficiency is proportional to size 2) A diesel engine can be stopped and started simple and immediately, most of the really large ones are two-strokes which can run in either direction so don’t need a reverse gearbox.
Ref your link to ■■■■■■■■ I worked for years at a ■■■■■■■ subsidiary, visited their HQ , development and test centre in Columbus Indiana and was involved in some of the efficiency projects referred to.
Agreed that present engines are much improved, but supply to the National Grid needs power generation on a huge scale, failure to invest in adequate capacity has been a trademark of Governments for many years.
Tidal barrages and nuclear power are the only ‘non CO2 emitting’ sources of reliable base load power when the wind doesn’t blow and the sun doesn’t shine.
The rail industry was clearly making the case that using diesel engines to provide electric traction is cheaper than mains electricity costs.The infrastructure is already there and electric locos were already being used but were ditched in favour of diesel solely because of the relative fuel costs.
The fact is power stations are less than 40% efficient plus transmission costs and losses.
Steam turbines of all types are less efficient than diesel engines.
Nuclear power contains the downsides of expense and safety to the point where if/when it goes wrong it could take out a large proportion of this country’s habitation and food supply.
Whereas trees like CO2 and turn it into Oxygen for us to breathe so that’s also the oxymoron of biomass out of the frame.In addition to the lie that CO2 supposedly cooked Venus.
So gas and coal gas fired electric generation for the lights and a gas boiler for heat and petrol engine for the car it is thanks.
Which just leaves development of the Internal Combustion engine to get turbo diesel type efficiency from spark ignition and cleaner fuel.
This obvious rush to a nuclear and biomass fuelled utopia will prove disastrous and unaffordable.
Are we in for more energy price hikes as France EDF has closed down two more nuclear plants due to problems bringing the total of nuclear power stations to four 
EDF exports electricity to the UK & the power prices surged to record highs on this news. rt.com/business/543544-euro … gn=firefox
lancpudn:
Are we in for more energy price hikes as France EDF has closed down two more nuclear plants due to problems bringing the total of nuclear power stations to four
EDF exports electricity to the UK & the power prices surged to record highs on this news. rt.com/business/543544-euro … gn=firefox
How long are the Channel power cables?
When we cast off from the EU, can we plug into Australia?
.
Ed how many of these will we need?
m.alibaba.com/product/607707791 … -250V.html
Only 17.6 million voters will pay more …
lancpudn:
Are we in for more energy price hikes as France EDF has closed down two more nuclear plants due to problems bringing the total of nuclear power stations to four
EDF exports electricity to the UK & the power prices surged to record highs on this news. rt.com/business/543544-euro … gn=firefox
I’m sure that France played a large part in outlawing our fossil fuelled power stations.Can’t think why they’d have possibly wanted to do that.
Also a big argument now between Germany and Poland v France in that regard.
‘Problems’ they actually mean a potential nuclear disaster if they try to drive their nuke power stations harder for the extra energy exports profits.So they are obviously having second thoughts about blowing up France to make a few bob out of us.
Franglais:
lancpudn:
Are we in for more energy price hikes as France EDF has closed down two more nuclear plants due to problems bringing the total of nuclear power stations to four
EDF exports electricity to the UK & the power prices surged to record highs on this news. rt.com/business/543544-euro … gn=firefoxHow long are the Channel power cables?
When we cast off from the EU, can we plug into Australia?
.
It says they’ve shut down their nuke power plants probably because they know that the French agriculture sector won’t be happy if/when the French Chernobyl happens.
Our problem is the EU’s ‘climate’ rules banning our coal and gas fired power stations and exporting our fossil fuel resources instead of keeping them for ourselves.
What has any of that got to do with cables.
The truth is the EU is part of the problem not the solution.
In addition to UK energy policy.