Oh, I cant believe I missed this. My favourite pastime. Arguing with people of faith…
Seeing as you all have covered the usual bases, easy and gentle arguments, I’d like to ask sploom how he, or his creator, explains the Tse tse fly? Created, like all creatures on his creation, by himself.
Go on.
You can blame man’s atrocities on his “free will”… but explain the Tse Tse Fly…
Go on…
the nodding donkey:
Oh, I cant believe I missed this. My favourite pastime. Arguing with people of faith…Seeing as you all have covered the usual bases, easy and gentle arguments, I’d like to ask sploom how he, or his creator, explains the Tse tse fly? Created, like all creatures on his creation, by himself.
Go on.
You can blame man’s atrocities on his “free will”… but explain the Tse Tse Fly…
Go on…
I also like you am weirdly fascinated by all this stuff,.and these types of ‘full time Christians’ types.
I ain’t talking about just normal everyday people who are usually fine and balanced,.and just believe in God, like my past relatives I mentioned, who would say something like ‘‘Well that’s what I believe anyway’’ then change the subject .and good on em, usually ok people, many of which I am sure will be on here maybe reading this,.I really have no problem with these people,.what they believe is their own business and they usually keep it to themselves .
I’s the dangerous ones who always try and steer a conversation towards their fanatical belief,.and attempt to convert you I am wary of.
They love all this stuff these guys,.trying to explain and justify their faith to unbelievers, they see themselves as re.enacting the 3 temptations of Christ in the wilderness where he had to explain the existence of God to the devil . (See I did listen at Sunday School 
)
Problem is their answer is usually concluded by the obligatory Gospel/chapter/verse, from the Bible, .they can not answer you in something that makes sense or in a sentence that they have constructed themselves, and it is then usually followed by what they see as ‘proof’, ie God made this that and the other.
I’ve met guys like that since I was a kid and right through adulthood, (but only if I could not succeed in avoiding them before they saw me. )
I just googled the tse tse fly,yrs its a nasty peice of work.And God created it.
But things like this werent in Gods original plan,they were made after man first sinned and the earth was cursed because of it.There is no mention of predatory animals eating other animals until after the fall.That is when these unpleasant things came about.
Go on.
You can blame man’s atrocities on his "free es.
I ain’t talking about just normal everyday people who are usually fine and balanced,.and just believe in God, like my past relatives I mentioned, who would say something like ‘‘Well that’s what I believe anyway’’ then change the subject .and good on em, usually ok people, many of which I am sure will be on here maybe reading this,.I really have no problem with these people,.what they believe is their own business and they usually keep it to themselves .
I would doubt these types of people are real Christians because if they really believed in the message of the gospel,if they really believed we were all in danger of the fires of hell,they would be shouting it from the rooftops.They wouldnt be keeping it quiet from you.
I recognise these sorts of people.They believe in the Bible because they think God will bless them with wealth and health and good relationships and so on and He might do all these things but the real reason Jesus came down to earth was to save sinners from eternal ,just,punishement
Sploom:
I just googled the tse tse fly,yrs its a nasty peice of work.And God created it.
But things like this werent in Gods original plan,they were made after man first sinned and the earth was cursed because of it.There is no mention of predatory animals eating other animals until after the fall.That is when these unpleasant things came about.
Ah, there we are. It’s all our fault.
Your “all loving father” created polio, and punished innocent children for ever more, because his own creation didnt behave as he wanted. Punishing people for crimes they did not commit, that they had no control over, during an existence that they didnt ask for, sounds like the work of a nasty and vindictive psychopath.
And there we have it again…‘.’‘Here endeth the first lesson in the word of the Lord amen’'. …delivered in the usual style of a parrot word for word. 
Ok so because they don’t border on the ‘Fire and Brimstone’ variety of total insanity, they ain’t '‘real Christians’…ok got it. :
So basically you are sitting as judge and jury ,.and writing off and condemning the vast majority of normal people who are in the ‘‘Christian community’’. 
What a ■■■■ insult to those people !
Not to mention past members of my own family who’s way of life was to follow what they believed was their God’s will, but at the same time not be completely obssesed, but kept a balance.
You need help sir.seriously, you are just like the rest of your type, give them enough rope etc, and the total irrationality and arrogance comes to the surface.
To come down to my level for a moment ,.let’s use a football analogy.
It’s a bit like saying…
Because the vast majority of fans of a football club don’t spend ALL their wages on following their team all around the country, spending ridiculous amounts of money on merchandise, making donations to the club to the point of their families suffering financially because of it (the same way these mad religious fanatic’s family generally suffer emotionally and mentally btw) they ain’t REAL fans, even though they have followed a team all their lives and love a club, but are not totally obsessive about it.
People like you just crease me up.
Well my biggest problem with this whole religious righteous is as I have mentioned before. The ideology is for the rich to give to the poor and needy but does not apply itself to themselves. The threats that come with it are also very intimidating especially to the very young. Another example of this is to live not believing in God is death itself and you will be judged in the afterlife for your sins. All pretty frightening stuff to even the most level headed of people. It is all built on fear and threats are in abundance, so you can see how some people can get fanatical about religion. Everyone has to die and to think of your own death is bad enough without having to be judged. It is also very contradictory a little bit like driving hours. You have the option of going to heaven or hell depending upon how you have lived your life, yet Jesus/ God forgives everyone in which case who is it that goes to Hell? It was certainly conjured up by those in power to control the masses but has lived on through fear over the years. The bible was written over a period of 1500 years? How ridiculous is that in itself. I am sure JK Rowling could and has written better books in a fraction of this time. It doesn’t add up when you look closer into it all. Take away the fear aspect and the bible and all religion would not have lasted for this time. The only religion that has any credability about it is Buddhism.
Yorkshire Tramper:
Well my biggest problem with this whole religious righteous is as I have mentioned before. The ideology is for the rich to give to the poor and needy but does not apply itself to themselves. The threats that come with it are also very intimidating especially to the very young. Another example of this is to live not believing in God is death itself and you will be judged in the afterlife for your sins. All pretty frightening stuff to even the most level headed of people. It is all built on fear and threats are in abundance, so you can see how some people can get fanatical about religion. Everyone has to die and to think of your own death is bad enough without having to be judged. It is also very contradictory a little bit like driving hours. You have the option of going to heaven or hell depending upon how you have lived your life, yet Jesus/ God forgives everyone in which case who is it that goes to Hell? It was certainly conjured up by those in power to control the masses but has lived on through fear over the years. The bible was written over a period of 1500 years? How ridiculous is that in itself. I am sure JK Rowling could and has written better books in a fraction of this time. It doesn’t add up when you look closer into it all. Take away the fear aspect and the bible and all religion would not have lasted for this time. The only religion that has any credability about it is Buddhism.
All religion boils down to,.and was initially kicked off only for one thing…The fear of death,.the unknown, people were more gullible in those days and believed it all
So they tell you if you lead the life of a saint, no need to fear,.because you don’t really die, you go to.a magical place in the sky (a bit like Blackpool but without the rides ) but first you have to pass a test asked by a guy with wings as to how good or bad you have led your life, if it’s pass mark…,.Blackpol here we come .
But…
Here’s the good bit to keep you down your entire life and spoil all enjoyment till you die.
If you have led your life like 99% of others, it’s a place called Hell (a bit like Scunthorpe but worse ) ran by a bloke with cow’s hooves, a tail.and horns, carrying an old type toasting fork, who will torment you and eventually burn you…I mean,.c’mon ffs. seriously??
People in 2022 still believe all this,.and worse continue to perpetuate it?
It’s the little kids I feel.sorry for, imagine filling their poor little impressionable heads with all this ■■■■ is just totally wrong on all levels.
It’s one thing trying to guide them to a parents values on what they believe to be right (I’m referring to those who ain’t ‘‘real Christians’’ here btw just to be clear ) Sunday school,.evening prayers etc, but to think it’s wrong to tell a little kid about Santa, but perfectly acceptable to keep telling him or her this crap that they will burn in hell if they nick their brothers sweets and such nonsense, brainwash them with more threats and fears all their childhood, stop them from doing perfectly natural things up to their adulthood, to when they grow up to think something natural like ■■■ before marriage is sinful, in my book it is bordering on a form of child abuse. 
And totally unhealthy if you drive a HGV.
Ah religion; a classic example of one woman’s infidelity and her subsequent story to hide the fact getting way out of hand.
the maoster:
Ah religion; a classic example of one woman’s infidelity and her subsequent story to hide the fact getting way out of hand.
the maoster:
Ah religion; a classic example of one woman’s infidelity and her subsequent story to hide the fact getting way out of hand.
I’ve often thought about that too.
A bit like if you get caught with your pants down with another woman by the girlfriend or wife in the middle of doing the business …and the immortal line comes out…
‘‘Wait I can explain’’.
Seems that Joe the joiner swalowed it hook line and sinker poor sod.
Sploom:
I just googled the tse tse fly,yrs its a nasty peice of work.And God created it.
But things like this werent in Gods original plan,they were made after man first sinned and the earth was cursed because of it.There is no mention of predatory animals eating other animals until after the fall.That is when these unpleasant things came about.
Arg! Must… resist… debating…with…the…superstitious…
Nope, can’t do it
See, there’s your wilful delusion, the self-referral to the collection of Fairy Stories I mentioned yesterday, rather than the realization that your stories do not constitute an actual documented history of anything related to the real world. This is the kind of irrational nonsense I can’t cope with, mixing up the Fairy Stories (which I acknowledge it is your right to choose to believe) with the Natural World.
You say your “proof of God’s existence is all around you”, but the fact that you have (apparently) never heard of the Tsetse fly is a reasonable indication that your knowledge of the real world is pretty limited, we covered that in school in the 1970’s. There are far more “unpleasant” organisms in the world than these, parasitology is a vast subject covering many different types of creature - protozoa (single celled organisms), parasitic helminths (worms) and some arthropods (insects, mites etc).
I’d wager you have no concept of how many different species we share this planet with. Current best estimates are 8.7 million (new species are discovered all the time, and many species are lost without being properly studied). Nearly all (around 97%) of these species are invertebrates, only about 3% are things most people might recognize as “animals” (creature with a backbone).
Beetles are an especially good topic, there are currently at least 400,000 species described; by comparison there are only about 8,000 mammal species documented. This statistic spawned the (most likely apocryphal but oft-repeated) story about a scientist, (the geneticist JBS Haldane), who, when asked by some pompous cleric, what Haldane’s study of the Natural World had taught him about “The Creator”, Haldane replied "He has an inordinate fondness for beetles”.
Stephen Fry has been much less amused by your “Creator”
theguardian.com/culture/201 … c-irish-tv
robroy:
the maoster:
Ah religion; a classic example of one woman’s infidelity and her subsequent story to hide the fact getting way out of hand.I’ve often thought about that too.
A bit like if you get caught with your pants down with another woman by the girlfriend or wife in the middle of doing the business …and the immortal line comes out…‘‘Wait I can explain’’.
Seems that Joe the joiner swalowed it hook line and sinker poor sod.
At the risk of deliberately being overly controversial 
, if we applied modern-day legal criteria, Joe the Joiner would have been banged up for being a ■■■■■■ predator with a laughable “excuse” for child abuse; even devotees of Christianity will (sheepishly) admit Mary has been determined to have been about 14 years old when she was supposedly impregnated by “The Holy Ghost”. Given the Christian Church’s attitude to child abuse since then (cover-ups sanctioned at the highest levels), it seems not very much has changed.
A question I have often pondered on is “Do you think vicars actually believe in God and these stories themselves?” or are they just going along with it for a cushy number for themselves? if they genuinely believed in all of this mumbo jumbo would they really cover up the vicars that have been involved in child abuse, there are registered cases of these vicars being simply moved on to other churches to protect them. I honestly do not believe that they go along with it all.
Yorkshire Tramper:
A question I have often pondered on is “Do you think vicars actually believe in God and these stories themselves?” or are they just going along with it for a cushy number for themselves? if they genuinely believed in all of this mumbo jumbo would they really cover up the vicars that have been involved in child abuse, there are registered cases of these vicars being simply moved on to other churches to protect them. I honestly do not believe that they go along with it all.
To be pedantic here they ain’t vicars they are RC priests.
Vicars are allowed to marry and have ■■■…priests are not.
That and the fact that ■■■■■■■■■■■■ is a big no no in the branch of their faith,.determines a sad life for them .
So I really can not see then joining the church just for a ‘cushy number’'.
As for the hypocrisy of the church,.that is real world stuff, religion v the dark side of human nature, the latter always wins.
But they ain’t bothered. as they have it covered…because God always forgives apparentlly,.so it’s a win win for em.
robroy:
To be pedantic here they ain’t vicars they are RC priests.
Vicars are allowed to marry and have ■■■…priests are not.
That and the fact that ■■■■■■■■■■■■ is a big no no in the branch of their faith,.determines a sad life for them .
So I really can not see then joining the church just for a ‘cushy number’'.As for the hypocrisy of the church,.that is real world stuff, religion v the dark side of human nature, the latter always wins.
But they ain’t bothered. as they have it covered…because God always forgives apparentlly,.so it’s a win win for em.
Well who knows what goes on behind RC vicarage closed doors. RC priests are allowed to drink and smoke. They also seem to be at the centre of a lot of ■■■ abuse cases so yes I do believe they are probably in it for a cushy number. To keep the topic on driving, I am not allowed to vape in my cab but it hasnt stopped me from driving. 
All I can add to this theological discussion is, Joe the joiner (nice one Rob) must have been a ■■■■ chippy. Geezer had no saucepans but was still skint! Maybe he had a habit?
Sploom…
Come out with your hands up, you are surrounded.
You’ve been brave enough to fight the good fight against the army of sinners that we are apparently. But to keep quoting from the book of fairytales to prove your fantasist logic is pointless. To keep defending a god, religion and way of life that is so profoundly unjust, makes you look a little foolish to say the least.
yourhavingalarf:
Sploom…Come out with your hands up, you are surrounded.
You’ve been brave enough to fight the good fight against the army of sinners that we are apparently. But to keep quoting from the book of fairytales to prove your fantasist logic is pointless. To keep defending a god, religion and way of life that is so profoundly unjust, makes you look a little foolish to say the least.
Your name will alzo go on ze list…
My tuppence worth, Its part of the human condition to hope for a hereafter. People worshiped the Moon and all sorts of totems long before Jesus Christ and other deities. Did a loving God (all powerful) really sit on his hands while the Jews were being gassed and could he not have blown Titanic a wee bit away from the iceberg. Religion has one purpose, to exercise control over the masses. Go on Youtube and look up Super churches, an eye opener.