Well, page 304 and we are still no closer to the truth, “Look into my eyes, look into my eyes”!
Frankydobo:
Well, page 304 and we are still no closer to the truth, “Look into my eyes, look into my eyes”!
Why does someone not telephone the museum, to check the authenticity of the documents posted by Valkyrie?
[zb]
anorak:Frankydobo:
Well, page 304 and we are still no closer to the truth, “Look into my eyes, look into my eyes”!Why does someone not telephone the museum, to check the authenticity of the documents posted by Valkyrie?
I don’t know if that’s possible, I think the guy at the museum has probably hung himself by now and has requested that all Guy’s records are cremated with him.
Trev_H:
[zb]
anorak:
Why does someone not telephone the museum, to check the authenticity of the documents posted by Valkyrie?I don’t know if that’s possible, I think the guy at the museum has probably hung himself by now and has requested that all Guy’s records are cremated with him.
That would be an inconsiderate under hand cop out at this crucial stage in answering all the questions. 
Carryfast:
Trev_H:
[zb]
anorak:
Why does someone not telephone the museum, to check the authenticity of the documents posted by Valkyrie?I don’t know if that’s possible, I think the guy at the museum has probably hung himself by now and has requested that all Guy’s records are cremated with him.
That would be an inconsiderate under hand cop out at this crucial stage in answering all the questions.
He’s probably heard that he’s on Bewicks hit list !
If you own a GUY big J with a 240 in you get to look at the AUTHENTICITY documents in the BCVM vaults 
Friday,25th September,2015
TruckNetUK.Old Time Lorries.
Guy Big J4T Gardner 8LXB 240-250 Tractive Units.
VALKYRIE:
Monday,21st September,2015,Autumn Equinox - it is now Autumn…golden-brown leaves…Golden Brown,a great song-record by The StranglersTruckNetUK.Old Time Lorries.
Guy Big J4T Gardner 8LXB 240-250 Tractive Units.
The Conclusion - well,I can always live in hope!
As promised in my very recent posts,here is the information that provides conclusive proof that Guy Motors,of Fallings Park,Wolverhampton,
a division of the BRITISH LEYLAND Truck & Bus Division,did indeed genuinely build and produced Guy Big J4T 4x2 Gardner 8LXB 240-250 Eight-
Cylinder In Line Straight Eight Diesel-Engined Tractive Units from 1973 to 1975.
29 Guy Big J4T 4x2 Tractive Units were built with a Gardner 8LXB diesel engine installed in each one of these lorries.
Guy announced in the Commercial Motor in 1973 that the Gardner 8LXB 240-250 Diesel Engine was to be made available in Guy Big J tractive units.
And 29 Gardner 8LXB - engined Guy Big J tractive units were built,and all had the optional 9Ft 6in wheelbase and all were fitted with the
Fuller RTO 9509 Gearbox.Unfortunately,no known photographs of any angle and view exist of any genuine Guy factory-produced Guy Big J4T Gardner 8LXB-engined tractive
units. There is a 1973?,or 1974?,Commercial Vehicle Motor Show photograph of a white Guy Big J4T 4x2 Tractive Unit which could have a Gardner
8LXB engine in it,and I think this particular Guy lorry went to Smiths of Madiston - the operator with the largest fleet of Gardner 8LXB-engined
Guy Big J tractive units.
Photographs are not that important if you have written evidence,and we’ve now got written evidence that proves that Guy Motors actually
built 29 Guy Big J4T Gardner 8LXB -engined tractive units!!! EUREKA!!!
the archives of THE BRITISH COMMERCIAL VEHICLE MUSEUM!I just asked the right questions,and BCVM Archivist,Gordan Whittaker,did the fascinating research - well done Gordon and thank you very much!
The historic details below were taken from Guy Motors production records that are now in the safe keeping of the Archive Division of The British Commercial Vehicle Museum.
The British Commercial Vehicle Museum Invoice to me,VALKYRIE
:-
Gordon Whittaker’s note to me:-
Guy Big J4T GARDNER 8LXB 240-250 Eight-Cylinder In Line Straight Eight Diesel-Engined 4x2 Tractive Units Production Details,Chassis Numbers,Engine Numbers,Dates,Operators,etc,from the Guy Motors archives in The British Commercial Vehicle Museum,Leyland,Lancashire:-
The blue-painted Wall of Liverpool restored and preserved Guy Big J4T 4x2 Gardner 8LXB 240-250 Diesel-Engined 4x2 Tractive Unit,PWK 914M,
registered on Tuesday,25th June,1974 is not a genuine Guy factory-built Gardner 8LXB-engined Big J. It has an 11Ft 4in(?) wheelbase,a Spicer
gearbox and was originally engined with either a ■■■■■■■■■■ Rolls-Royce,or Gardner 6LXB 180,or AEC diesel engine.It was originally a tractive
unit,but it was converted in to a heavy recovery vehicle - HRV later on. It was re-engined with a magnificent Gardner 8LXB 240-250 Diesel Engine,
it’s present engine.The question is do any genuine Guy Motors factory built Guy Big J4T Gardner 8LXB 240-250 Engined 4x2 Tractive Units still exist?
Twenty-nine - 29 were built,they were rare when they were new…so they’ve got a low chance of survival - BUT I bet most if not all of those
29 Gardner 8LXB engines have survived!!!
their original motor vehicle applications have been scrapped,either powering other motor vehicles,or boats.or generator sets,or whatever.
But fate may turn up one or two genuine Guy factory built Gardner 8LXB-engined Guy Big J4T tractive units yetAnd now for another mystery…well it is to me!
With respect,Bewick,how the hell do you pronounce your name?..I’ve often wondered
Is it BE - WICK, or “Buick” as in the famous marque of American motorcar? Please solve this mystery.Thanks.Guy Big J4T Gardner 8LXB 240-250 Tractive Units.
THIS CASE IS NOW CLOSED
We can always live in hope…
I love mysteries,so somebody please open up another motor vehicle mystery,please
VALKYRIE
Friday,25th September,2015
TruckNetUK.Old Time Lorries.
Guy Big J4T Gardner 8LXB 240-250 Tractive Units.
First of all,I will just have to qualify what I am now going to say with this:2015 has been one of the weirdest,traumatic,surreal,roller coaster,
ecstatic year’s of my life so far:I won a rare late 1930s Hobbies-Mamod SE4 “Rolls-Royce” Historic Model Steam Engine on EBay UK,then I was Hit
By The Thunderbolt and fell in love with an ■■■■■■ Model,my darling Emily Bloom,then later on I was accused of being a xxxxxxx by a silly paranoid
over sensitive middle-aged woman (nothing to do with Emily by the way).I also contacted both my late mother and late father via genuine psychic mediums,and I’ve also had some genuine,weird and eerie psychic experiences…AND NOW…I’m apparently accused of being a “Conman” and fabricating bogus documents in regard to the rare Guy Big J Gardner 8LXB - Engined 4x2 Tractive Units! - all of which by the way could bring the good name of The British Commercial Vehicle Museum in to disrepute!!! 
…and we’ve still got October,November and December to go yet! So what else might happen to me? Ah! My future wife and I get might together this year instead of next year,2016! … Genuine psychic predictions:It’s all coming true! Objective facts
QUOTE:Guy Big J4T Gardner 8LXB 240-250 Tractive Units.
The Conclusion - well,I can always live in hope!
VALKYRIE.
UNQUOTE…There is no wonder I can say that! With respect,there are certain people on this forum who are being overly cynical,they remind
me of the misguided and wrong The Americans Never Landed Men On The Moon,It was All Done In A Television Studio Brigade!
It could be said that they are bringing the good name of The British Commercial Vehicle Museum in to disrepute,undermining it’s archives and it’s staff - Just try doing that to the NATIONAL MOTOR MUSEUM - it would sue you!!!
Furthermore,I am very serious when it comes to my hobbies and interests,and pride my self as a serious researcher in to fascinating subjects that
happen to be my hobbies:-Historic and Modern Motor Vehicles of All Kinds,Music of all Kinds,Aeroplanes,Radio,Railway Locomotives,Engines of All
Kinds,Pschic-Supernatural-UFO-Flying Saucers,etc,etc.
I can have a joke about my hobbies from time to time,BUT when it comes to seriously researching something like the Guy Big J Gardner 8LXB 240-250 Mystery,I am really serious,a perfectionist and eager to find out the truth as much as possible!
And if you’ve read my threads and posts on TruckNetUK,Old Time Lorries,such as the D-Day 70th Anniversary,The Great Gathering,Rolls-Royce
Diesel Engines,etc,you will know that I am really serious and like to make a good,interesting and comprehensive job of my posts and threads.
So the cynics cannot be taken seriously - objective facts.
QUOTE: Robert1952
Yes, being an old cynic this possibility did occur to me. Then I reflected that this forum spends an astonishing amount of energy on genuine research for the pleasure of other TNUK users. It would be a very rare bird indeed who would fly in the face of this goodwill and run a spoof research just for a cheap laugh. Anywhere else he might get that cheap laugh if found out, but on this forum he’d simply fall flat on his face and lose all his credibility for good. So I am choosing to accept it in good faith, though a little more evidence from primary, rather than secondary sources wouldn’t go amiss! Robert
UNQUOTE.
Thanks,Robert1952,you are a wise man and right.Another objective fact.
QUOTE:
Lance Biscomb » Thu Sep 24, 2015 11:11 pm
If you own a GUY Big J with a 240 in you get to look at the AUTHENTICITY documents in the BCVM vaults
UNQUOTE.
Lance Biscomb has obviously seen the same information about Guy Big J Gardner 8LXB lorries as Gordon Whittaker sent to me!
Chassis Numbers and Engine Numbers.
Just because these are not printed in columns next to each other doesn’t mean say that they do not correspond with each other.
I’ve seen chassis,engine and body numbers all over the place in some lists of other marques and models of motor vehicle.So it no big
deal.
Dates.
The dates make up the last column on the extreme right of the Guy Big J Gardner 8LXB chassis list.
Smith Of Maddiston,Smith For Service,Smiths Of Madiston,etc.
The above titles all describe and refer to the same road haulage company,and it must have been referred to by those titles by many people over
the years…spelling mistakes and all.
More proof of how genuine my Guy Big J4T Gardner 8LXB 240-250 4x2 Tractive Units research and posts are in the way of photographs:-
BCVM GUY BIG J AND AEC LETTER TO BCVM EDITED:-
BCVM GUY BIG J INFORMATION £12 POSTAL ORDER:-
BCVM GUY BIG J RECORDED DELIVERY TO BCVM:-
BCVM GUY BIG J LETTER-ENVELOPE-ROYAL MAIL LETTER TO ME:-
NOTE:I am not letting any Tom,■■■■ and Harry know by name and address on the Internet…that is why I and billions of other people have
Internet usernames …and it doesn’t mean to say that I live in The Steel And Silver City of Sheffield - but I’m proud to say that I was born
in Sheffield
I’ve decided to contact The British Commercial Vehicle Museum Archivist,Gordon Whittaker,by recorded delivery letter (both ways if need be)
and ask him to try and provide more proof of Guy Big J4T Gardner 8LXB 240-250 - Engined 4x2 Tractive Units in the way of photocopying original
documents,including build sheets-cards,etc.
As I say,I’m a perfectionist and like to get things just right - I don’t always - but I do try,because I’m a Rolls-Royce Man:I always strive for the best!
This Guy Big J Gardner 8LXB Tractive Units Episode reminds me of one of my theme songs,which has been very appropriate for me in 2015 considering all the weird and wonderful things that have been happening to me this year! :-
THAT’S LIFE,sung by one of my great heroes,Frank Sinatra,The Voice
VALKYRIE
Personally Valkyrie I never doubted your honesty, far too much of your time taken up to waste it on a hoax and you are the only one to actually get off of your backside and do proper research on the subject. There is one member of the Trucknet forum who doesn’t believe that diesels can run on excessive sump oil and that the Holocaust didn’t really happen either so a few doubters regarding written information about 29 Guy Big J’s can be expected I guess! Keep up the good work.
Pete.
archive.commercialmotor.com/page … er-1975/59
This report on the 1975 Scottish Show says that the two Guy exhibits had ■■■■■■■ and RR engines.
archive.commercialmotor.com/page … er-1971/38
“■■■■■■■ engines are installed…”
The 1973 Scottish Show issue is missing from the archive, mysteriously…
Three Big J4s were at the 1974 Earls Court Show, all featuring ■■■■■■■ and RR power.
I am in complete agreement with Pete. VALKYRIE is telling the truth.
Cheers Dave.
It really is an insult to those of us who have first hand knowledge of the Guy concerned being factual and not a myth,that there are still those ignorant enough to disbelieve ANY additional proof being provided,all those doubting Thomas’s should hang their heads in shame.
David
Can I propose a vote of thanks to Valkyrie who, once again, has provided us with “Best Evidence”.
I’m just grateful that none of my former employers saw fit to reward me by insisting that I drive such a decent lorry wrecked by the fitting of those totally outmoded Patricroft Boat Anchors.
5thwheel:
It really is an insult to those of us who have first hand knowledge of the Guy concerned being factual and not a myth,that there are still those ignorant enough to disbelieve ANY additional proof being provided,all those doubting Thomas’s should hang their heads in shame.David
To be fair VALKYRIE says the ‘engine numbers’ in question aren’t next to the corresponding chassis numbers on the info sheet.But if I’m reading it right they ain’t there at all. 
I wish to record here that I accept Valkyrie’s evidence. Robert
Retired Old ■■■■:
I’m just grateful that none of my former employers saw fit to reward me by insisting that I drive such a decent lorry wrecked by the fitting of those totally outmoded Patricroft Boat Anchors.
robert1952:
I wish to record here that I accept Valkyrie’s evidence. Robert
+1.There’s more chance of Bewick winning the lottery than it being wrong. 
Well after a 103 pages we may have got to a conclusion of did they or did they not fit the 240 8 lxb engine in a Big J!!
THE evidence posted here looks authentic, however as i am not blessed with Bewick’s experience from that era iGuess that we need to have our tin hats ready for his return, and who knows a continuation of this great debate or 
E.W.
Evening all,
Valkyrie, well done, and thank you for pursuing such an elusive trail so diligently!
The things that now intrigue me, (and somewhere at the start of this thread I stated the registration number of the 8LXB Guy that I saw, when coupled to the Highway tandem that I was valuing)…and seeing an 8 cylinder Gardner was nothing to get excited about back then, but I am now fascinated about the wheelbases stated as 9ft 6in. I remember the Atkinsons were 10ft 8in for the 8 cylinder, and I think that the ERFs were over 10 ft, and the Highways, (either superlightweights, or conventional, or spread tandems ), were running a 2ft 6in pin position,(as specified by Smiths engineer Hulme Robertson), so on a 9ft 6in WB, they hust have been “close coupled”…Although with the block in the centre of the trailer, then the swing rotation, would have moved away from the vulnerable parts.
Hulme was a" Gardner man", despite the proliferation of “Scottish ■■■■■■■■ in the Smith`s fleet. I well remember many an “interesting” afternoon with him in the Docks at Leith, as he returned/fitted/fettled pumps for the Gardner engine Fishing Fleet!
And of course, as Falling Parks favourite client Smiths DID run a Detroit powered Big J…anyone have a picture of that old girl■■?
But what of the two for Longton Storage from Stoke on Trent, (back in the day of the Harp/Dale Management ownership…did they run for Knight and Riley…there is a question for the Stoke lads to answer…(long before the Alan Harp/Brian Riley days…
Valkyrie…well done.
Cheerio for now.
Don’t really care who beleves and who doesn’t but I’m one of the few who can honestly say
I DROVE ONE
reagle ill do it:
Don’t really care who beleves and who doesn’t but I’m one of the few who can honestly say
I DROVE ONE
Well that makes 2 of us “reagle”,although mechanics have admitted working on them,no one else has admitted to have actually driven one,not yet at any rate!
David