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UK PROFESSIONAL DRIVERS FORUMS THE UK PROFESSIONAL DRIVERS FORUM (INTERACTIVE)
81

Carryfast:
I think that reply says everything about the whole bs situation.On one hand you’re saying that the British don’t want to work so we give the jobs to foreign immigrant labour instead.Then you conveniently change the argument to one of discrimination when someone says if it’s all about the Brits not wanting the job then let’s leave the job advertised and if a Brit wants it then the Brit gets it and the foreign worker has to go home.

This is two different things, and I explained my reasons why I think this is ridiculous in a first place. Do it as its done in Poland: first you have to advertise for Polish (or EU Citizens) workers, and only if you can prove that you was unable to find someone to fill your post, you can invite a foreigner. But then, after you gave him a job, he has to be secure.

It makes no difference that the British worker might be an untrained worker nor wether the employer has invested time in training the foreign worker in the job.The fact is the foreign worker shouldn’t have been here in the first place when there’s British workers,wether trained or not, who need a job

Yeah, great idea: don’t invite Polish engineers to build your railways, employ some neds who quit school at 16 instead, BECAUSE THEY ARE BRITISH :smiley:

The issue of the Asian community is just another stereotypical red herring.Ther are sections of the Asian community that work in many different sectors of the economy.However what they do have in common with all the other types of immigrant workforce is that they add demand for housing and social security and health provision and add supply and capacity to the labour market which lowers tax revenues and income levels and removed/s job opportunities for the indigenous workforce.British cab drivers would have had a lot more opportunities and would be earning more for example if there were no Asian cab drivers for example :smiling_imp:

No. Because if there would be no all this PHC driven by asians, not many people would be able to afford a cab.

:lol: just as there would have been more job opportunities and higher wage levels in public transport like the bus service jobs over the years if there’d been no immigrant workers brought in from the other parts of the so called ‘Commonwealth’ like Jamaica.However the situation would have been balanced more if British workers could have gone to other parts of the commonwealth in that case to drive cabs and buses in Canada and Australia which they couldn’t.

That’s interesting what you are saying. My plumber was in my place today and we had a nice chat. He spent 15 years of his life in Australia doing guess what? Yeah, you’re right. Plumbing! :wink:

So as I’ve said it’s all a big con put up by the British employers and the government to over supply the British labour market to keep wage levels down.

I am fascinated by this theory. Are there any flying saucers involved as well? :wink:

As I’ve said if foreign workers are so good and British workers are so bad then how is it that Britain seems to have been turned by those same useless British workers into a country where foreign workers want to live while those so called ‘better’ foreign workers only seem to have managed to turn their own countries into places that they wanted to leave and not return to :question: . :unamused:

Well. Have you ever heard about Yalta agreements? That might give you answer to that question when it comes to Eastern Europe. And last time I checked my history book, Edvard BeneÅ¡ or WÅ‚adysÅ‚aw Raczkiewicz had not much to say there, it was all done by UK, USA and USSR. So again you proved your ignorance blaming Eastern Europeans for that they had to spent 50 years under Soviet occupation when you were enjoying benefits of Marshall Plan and later European Commonwealth…

82

orys:

Carryfast:
I think that reply says everything about the whole bs situation.On one hand you’re saying that the British don’t want to work so we give the jobs to foreign immigrant labour instead.Then you conveniently change the argument to one of discrimination when someone says if it’s all about the Brits not wanting the job then let’s leave the job advertised and if a Brit wants it then the Brit gets it and the foreign worker has to go home.

This is two different things, and I explained my reasons why I think this is ridiculous in a first place. Do it as its done in Poland: first you have to advertise for Polish (or EU Citizens) workers, and only if you can prove that you was unable to find someone to fill your post, you can invite a foreigner. But then, after you gave him a job, he has to be secure.

It makes no difference that the British worker might be an untrained worker nor wether the employer has invested time in training the foreign worker in the job.The fact is the foreign worker shouldn’t have been here in the first place when there’s British workers,wether trained or not, who need a job

Yeah, great idea: don’t invite Polish engineers to build your railways, employ some neds who quit school at 16 instead, BECAUSE THEY ARE BRITISH :smiley:

The issue of the Asian community is just another stereotypical red herring.Ther are sections of the Asian community that work in many different sectors of the economy.However what they do have in common with all the other types of immigrant workforce is that they add demand for housing and social security and health provision and add supply and capacity to the labour market which lowers tax revenues and income levels and removed/s job opportunities for the indigenous workforce.British cab drivers would have had a lot more opportunities and would be earning more for example if there were no Asian cab drivers for example :smiling_imp:

No. Because if there would be no all this PHC driven by asians, not many people would be able to afford a cab.

:lol: just as there would have been more job opportunities and higher wage levels in public transport like the bus service jobs over the years if there’d been no immigrant workers brought in from the other parts of the so called ‘Commonwealth’ like Jamaica.However the situation would have been balanced more if British workers could have gone to other parts of the commonwealth in that case to drive cabs and buses in Canada and Australia which they couldn’t.

That’s interesting what you are saying. My plumber was in my place today and we had a nice chat. He spent 15 years of his life in Australia doing guess what? Yeah, you’re right. Plumbing! :wink:

So as I’ve said it’s all a big con put up by the British employers and the government to over supply the British labour market to keep wage levels down.

I am fascinated by this theory. Are there any flying saucers involved as well? :wink:

As I’ve said if foreign workers are so good and British workers are so bad then how is it that Britain seems to have been turned by those same useless British workers into a country where foreign workers want to live while those so called ‘better’ foreign workers only seem to have managed to turn their own countries into places that they wanted to leave and not return to :question: . :unamused:

Well. Have you ever heard about Yalta agreements? That might give you answer to that question when it comes to Eastern Europe. And last time I checked my history book, Edvard BeneÅ¡ or WÅ‚adysÅ‚aw Raczkiewicz had not much to say there, it was all done by UK, USA and USSR. So again you proved your ignorance blaming Eastern Europeans for that they had to spent 50 years under Soviet occupation when you were enjoying benefits of Marshall Plan and later European Commonwealth…

So what you’re saying is forget about our own kids when they leave school let’s leave them with a life of poverty and teach them zb all by leaving them on the dole and employ so called ‘better’ more ‘qualified’ Polish workers instead and just turn Britain into a Polish colony in which the future of our own people will be something like that of the native Americans.All based on the fact that the Polish think that they are better more superior workers who’ve been denied their destiny to be the best since WW2,all because Churchill should have dictated terms to zb Stalin and the Red Army at the end of WW2 with the threat of a declaration of war if he refused. :open_mouth: :unamused: :laughing:

The only problem that might stand in the way of your master plan might be if the immigrant Asian muslim community manage to form a majority first. :open_mouth: :smiling_imp:

Either way we would have been better off to have stayed neutral with the Swiss during WW2 and let the Poles and the Germans decide amongst themselves who were the best workers.Although I think the Me 109 and the Stuka proved that anyway before we’d even bothered to send a Spitfire up in the air to fire a shot against them. :imp: :unamused: :laughing: :wink:

83

Carryfast:
So what you’re saying is forget about our own kids when they leave school let’s leave them with a life of poverty and teach them zb all by leaving them on the dole and employ so called ‘better’ more ‘qualified’ Polish workers instead and just turn Britain into a Polish colony in which the future of our own people will be something like that of the native Americans.All based on the fact that the Polish think that they are better more superior workers who’ve been denied their destiny to be the best since WW2 all because of Churchill and zb Stalin.

No, I am not saying anything like that. It’s your rubbish, as usual.

What I am saying is teach your kids “Kids, the world of today is a world of competition, we are no longer isolated island, because it’s XXI century, the world is a global village and its too deeply interconected to go back what was before. Therefore I am sorry, but your generation is the first generation since the war in Europe and North America and Far East (in most of its countries at least) that cannot expect to have better life than their parents. Therefore if you want to have good life, learn a lot, to be the best in your field, respect the work you have and dont’ take anything for granted only because you have been born in this country”.

I will be telling that to my kids as well, because it’s also true in Poland.

Don’t worry, we won’t colonize Britain: since Poland, despite brain drain, is developing quicker, the gap between our two countries closes rapidly. Who knows, maybe soon you will go to Poland for work.

Laughing, don’t you? Check where Spain was 30 years ago and where fellow forum members now go for better work.

The only problem that might stand in the way of your master plan might be if the immigrant Asian muslim community manage to form a majority first. :open_mouth: :smiling_imp:

And flying saucers. Don’t forgot flying saucers. That will make your conspiracy theory even more, eeeh, saucy.

Either way we would have been better off to have stayed neutral with the Swiss during WW2 and let the Poles and the Germans decide amongst themselves who were the best workers.Although I think the Me 109 and the Stuka proved that anyway before we’d even bothered to send a Spitfire up in the air to fire a shot against them. :imp: :unamused: :laughing: :wink:

You proved your ignorance once already by discussing the war, I will spare you further compromitation and just ignore the historical bits in this discussion :slight_smile:

84

orys:

Carryfast:
So what you’re saying is forget about our own kids when they leave school let’s leave them with a life of poverty and teach them zb all by leaving them on the dole and employ so called ‘better’ more ‘qualified’ Polish workers instead and just turn Britain into a Polish colony in which the future of our own people will be something like that of the native Americans.All based on the fact that the Polish think that they are better more superior workers who’ve been denied their destiny to be the best since WW2 all because of Churchill and zb Stalin.

No, I am not saying anything like that. It’s your rubbish, as usual.

What I am saying is teach your kids “Kids, the world of today is a world of competition, we are no longer isolated island, because it’s XXI century, the world is a global village and its too deeply interconected to go back what was before. Therefore I am sorry, but your generation is the first generation since the war in Europe and North America and Far East (in most of its countries at least) that cannot expect to have better life than their parents. Therefore if you want to have good life, learn a lot, to be the best in your field, respect the work you have and dont’ take anything for granted only because you have been born in this country”.

Orys the only thing they need to be told is that this country was the best in it’s field from the industrial revolution on.However the employers chucked all that advantage away by going for short term self interest and profit for their own benefit at the expense of the country’s workforce who’d put the place where it was.Nothing changes.

The fact is the British had/still have more right than any German to expect a fair day’s pay for a fair day’s work without having to be bothered with competition from any one else in the so called zb global free market economy.The ‘global village’ is only as interconnected as we are prepared to allow it to be.

85

Carryfast:
Orys the only thing they need to be told is that this country was the best

Yeah, I will also give my kid a history lessons.

The fact is the British had/still have more right than any German to expect a fair day’s pay for a fair day’s work

Why is that British have more right than Germans?

without having to be bothered with competition from any one else in the so called zb global free market economy.The ‘global village’ is only as interconnected as we are prepared to allow it to be.

Yeah. That’s True. Kim Dzong Un for example does not allow it at all - they even dead GPS signal :wink:

86

The fact is the British had/still have more right than any German to expect a fair day’s pay for a fair day’s work without having to be bothered with competition from any one else.

Hows that work then. Just because there great grandad let a rather camp nutcase with a stupid haircut and silly moustache in to power doesn’t mean your average German today deserves to be punished.

87

kr79:
Hows that work then. Just because there great grandad let a rather camp nutcase with a stupid haircut and silly moustache in to power doesn’t mean your average German today deserves to be punished.

But please note: for him it only works one way: because Germans were bad guys, they don’t deserve as much as Britons. But Poles were even more victims of war than Britons, so following that path they should even more deserve it… but that does not work that way for carryfast. It’s just Britons, they deserve it all, because they are Britons, period :wink:

88

In reality you only get out of life what you put in Not more or less because of your passport.

89

kr79:
In reality you only get out of life what you put in Not more or less because of your passport.

Exactly.

90

kr79:
The fact is the British had/still have more right than any German to expect a fair day’s pay for a fair day’s work without having to be bothered with competition from any one else.

Hows that work then. Just because there great grandad let a rather camp nutcase with a stupid haircut and silly moustache in to power doesn’t mean your average German today deserves to be punished.

Blimey the young generation really do deserve to be shafted by ze Germans just as they are being now if they aren’t bright enough to work out that the Germans were given a free lunch after WW2 at the expense of the British economy and British workers and the money has never been paid back.

Since then the Germans have been all about other countries being held to account for their debts but those hypocrites are the biggest debtors in Europe and had the life of Reilly since the end of WW2 based on the bs idea that German workers are better than British ones (nothing new there except,unlike the Poles etc,it was all about justifying being paid higher wages than their British counterparts in the Germans case) and all done on the free money given to them to re build their country after they’d wrecked the place through their own stupidity.

Ironically it seems like it might be the French and the Greeks who might be the ones who’ll have the bottle to tell the zb’s to zb off while the British just continue to do as the Germans tell them. :unamused:

91

orys:

kr79:
In reality you only get out of life what you put in Not more or less because of your passport.

Exactly.

In which case it would have been the British who were paid German rates of pay through the 1960’s/70’s and the Germans would still be where Greece is now. :imp:

92

Carryfast:
Blimey the young generation really do deserve to be shafted by ze Germans just as they are being now if they aren’t bright enough to work out that the Germans were given a free lunch after WW2 at the expense of the British economy and British workers and the money has never been paid back.

Here, here! (says someone from the nation who suffered under the communist regime for a half of the century so Britain and others can enjoy peacful and relatively luxury life). :smiling_imp: :smiling_imp:

93

orys:

Carryfast:
Blimey the young generation really do deserve to be shafted by ze Germans just as they are being now if they aren’t bright enough to work out that the Germans were given a free lunch after WW2 at the expense of the British economy and British workers and the money has never been paid back.

Here, here! (says someone from the nation who suffered under the communist regime for a half of the century so Britain and others can enjoy peacful and relatively luxury life). :smiling_imp: :smiling_imp:

No.It was actually a nation that had to be left to Russian control because that was a better alternative for the whole of Europe,including eastern europe,to what ‘would’ have happened if we hadn’t and had decided to make an argument and a fight of it with the Russians.Although ironically what was left of the German armed forces would have been up for it. :open_mouth: :unamused: :laughing:

However it’s no surprise than in all those years since the wall came down,that many east europeans would rather come here to work,which helps the employers and tory government’s ideas of rigging the domestic labour market,than stay at home and make their own countries into a place where they’d want to live and work by their own efforts,instead of those countries getting richer on EU handouts. :smiling_imp:

94

Carryfast:
However it’s no surprise than in all those years since the wall came down,that many east europeans would rather come here to work,which helps the employers and tory government’s ideas of rigging the domestic labour market,than stay at home and make their own countries into a place where they’d want to live and work by their own efforts,instead of those countries getting richer on EU handouts. :smiling_imp:

I am courious why is it so big surprise to you while so many Britons do exactly the same emigrating to States, Canada, Australia or Souther European countries. And I guess it would require much less work to put Britain into place they would like to live, as it’s already much richer… Obviously they are indeed laziest than Eastern Europeans - the latter give up when they see that much more is to be done :wink:

The answer for that if we ignore your crazy teories is just as simple as: people wont’ sacrifice the present wellbeing of themselves and their families for the sake of the future prosperity of the nation.

95

Carryfast I think you will find its labour who shafted us most with open door immigration policy’s.
Even before this current economic crisis this country had a fair size economic underclass who were happy to live on state benifits perhaps the government should have stoped there benifits rather than imported people to do jobs they could have.

96

kr79:
Carryfast I think you will find its labour who shafted us most with open door immigration policy’s.
Even before this current economic crisis this country had a fair size economic underclass who were happy to live on state benifits perhaps the government should have stoped there benifits rather than imported people to do jobs they could have.

The issue of oversupplying the uk labour market to keep wage levels low goes back years and has absolutely zb all to do with any so called ‘underclass’ of who are ‘happy’ to live on state benefits.The same issue applied just after WW2 when the government had a similar policy of bringing in as much immigrant labour as possible instead of allowing the domestic labour market to go into an undersupply situation which would have helped wage levels and therefore economic growth rise much faster and therefore would have helped to avoid a lot of the industrial unrest and unemployment and demand for housing and social security of the post war years.I think your ideas are just based on the re written tory version of history which says that all the wartime generation,who’d just won your freedom in WW2,had amongst their number,a large so called ‘underclass’ of lazy zb’s who were happy to live on so called ‘state benefits’,so they had to bring in immigrant workers by the ship load to do the work instead and none of the immigrant communities have ever had any underclass of long term benefit claimants. :imp:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Af … eration.22

For the umpteenth time we’ve never actually had a proper labour party in this country that looks after the interests of the country’s working class.It’s just another zb tory party with a different name.

By the way just to prove nothing changes with the double standards applied to German workers in these times of ‘Austerity’ in which we’re all supposed to be in this ‘together’.We’ve got eurocrats,as usual,calling for wage rises for the Germans while everyone else goes without.If the immigrants here have got any sense they’ll all zb off to Germany where they’ll be welcomed with open arms to share in Germany’s success. :imp: :imp:

bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b0 … 8_05_2012/ 32.02-32.40

97

Could it be the fact after world war 2 we had lost a lot of men who would of filled those jobs that commonwealth labour filled. :bulb:

98

kr79:
Could it be the fact after world war 2 we had lost a lot of men who would of filled those jobs that commonwealth labour filled. :bulb:

No what we actually had was loads of returning conscripts looking for well paid work in order to make up for the time that they’d spent on zb army pay fighting with the zb Germans.By the way the Germans had actually lost more men than we had but no suprise that the German government didn’t flood it’s labour market and put more demands on it’s wrecked housing stock by looking for immigrant labour to fill it’s job vacancies and we didn’t offer to help them out by sending them loads of our spare immigrants from zb Jamaica to work on their buses and railways who I’m sure would have been met with open arms by the locals when they got there. :smiling_imp: :imp: :unamused:

99

No they recruited loads of Turk guest workers who were paid well and were looked after but not given full citizenship.

100

kr79:
No they recruited loads of Turk guest workers who were paid well and were looked after but not given full citizenship.

The fact is there is and always has been a fundamental difference between the motives of the German government in using ‘Gaste Arbeiters’ and the British government’s policy of mass immigration of foreign labour.The latter’s policy is all about making sure that the British labour market is in a permanent state of over supply to rig the market in favour of employers and low wage levels relative to those of ze Germans. :imp: