Franglais:
.
'Re big families, if some societies relying on subsistence farming, and have no formal social support it is only your family you can rely on. If you don’t want to starve when ill or old you need kids.
Obviously more to it than that, but it is a factor.
Oh wait.
Who pays for our ‘formal social support’.
Why are we importing loads of third world immigration on the so called grounds of ‘we aren’t producing enough children to sustain our own ‘ageing’ population’.
In which case who is then supporting all those ageing third world populations left behind by such economic migration and which is why,according to you,there are supposedly so many children being produced there.
Which leaves the even more inconvenient questions of
How do third world populations supposedly,without enough food for their own children,suddenly
conveniently find enough food for the adults,in them obviously having the energy to keep breeding like rabbits when they aren’t fighting tribal wars.
Or for that matter why are our own women told to use contraception as the default choice when they are young and only have children when they are too bleedin old for it.At best ending up with their children having to look after,if not bury,their mum,by the time those children are in their 40s.Or at worst disillusioned women suddenly finding out that IVF can do nothing for them and then regretting listening to all the bs Kalergi propaganda when they were younger.Oh wait generations seperated by 20 years or less obviously increases the potential pensions bill of children retiring while their own parents are also still alive and claiming their’s.
What a sick rotten to the core society we’ve become.All based on the import of the cheapest labour possible combined with minimising the tax and social care costs of the employer elite classes.Allied to the Social Engineering agenda of the Champagne Socialists in the form of their Kalergi type Plans.
To which your answer is we are rich they are poor let’s chuck loads more money at them if not invite them all in to live here. 
Buzzer:
Dennis nail on the head right there as food is a secondary consideration in a lot of households and if they can get a food hand out for nought they will while dragging on a ■■■ and swilling a pint or three. Personally I could not smoke when they cost over a tenner a packet even though I did for 40 odd years but not in the last ten. The only plus on food banks is the supermarkets give it free and this saves it going to landfill which would probably cost them more big hearted that they are, cheers Buzzer.
PS. as for the Conservative leadership contest I think any of the candidates who have fiddled expenses should be eliminated, that would shorten the numbers for sure.
A bit like the striking miners who were on big wages bleating about not being able to feed their families sat in clubs with a pint and a cig in their hands
ramone:
PS. as for the Conservative leadership contest I think any of the candidates who have fiddled expenses should be eliminated, that would shorten the numbers for sure.
A bit like the striking miners who were on big wages bleating about not being able to feed their families sat in clubs with a pint and a cig in their hands
[/quote]
Wow Ramone, this must be one for the record books, I totally agree with you, having personally suffered at the hands of those twice in my career and never cease to be amazed at how few drivers nowadays remember the violence we were subjected to. 
Spardo:
ramone:
PS. as for the Conservative leadership contest I think any of the candidates who have fiddled expenses should be eliminated, that would shorten the numbers for sure.
A bit like the striking miners who were on big wages bleating about not being able to feed their families sat in clubs with a pint and a cig in their hands
Wow Ramone, this must be one for the record books, I totally agree with you, having personally suffered at the hands of those twice in my career and never cease to be amazed at how few drivers nowadays remember the violence we were subjected to.
[/quote]
Scargill killed the coal industry not Thatcher
Spardo:
ramone:
A bit like the striking miners who were on big wages bleating about not being able to feed their families sat in clubs with a pint and a cig in their hands
Wow Ramone, this must be one for the record books, I totally agree with you, having personally suffered at the hands of those twice in my career and never cease to be amazed at how few drivers nowadays remember the violence we were subjected to.
Don’t remember many drivers applying for mining jobs for the ‘big wages’.Remind us how much that was in 1972 compared to other industries.
As for remainers with a liking for crossing picket lines.While at the same time moaning about a Tory Brexit and that the EU is supposedly good for workers’ ‘rights’.Which probably explains why most of the Tory Party is for Remain from Thatcher to May.
Carryfast:
Don’t remember many drivers applying for mining jobs for the ‘big wages’.Remind us how much that was in 1972 compared to other industries.
As for remainers with a liking for crossing picket lines.While at the same time moaning about a Tory Brexit and that the EU is supposedly good for workers’ ‘rights’.Which probably explains why most of the Tory Party is for Remain from Thatcher to May.
Why on earth would lorry drivers apply for miners’ jobs, the whole point of driving is being in relative freedom in the big wide world, not down a black hole breathing coal dust all day?
Speaking personally, I have never crossed a picket line at someone’s place of work in my life, but I have been subjected to mob rule and threat to life at someone else’s place of work. Workers who were merely asking for the right to work until a democratic vote to strike was made.
Buzzer:
PS. as for the Conservative leadership contest I think any of the candidates who have fiddled expenses should be eliminated, that would shorten the numbers for sure.
After ten(?) offences relating to breaking Parliament’s rules on finances and expenses would Boris be out of the race then then?
After taking monies meant for EU constituency and using them for party political (UKIP at the time) purposes good job Farage ain’t a Tory too.
Franglais:
Buzzer:
PS. as for the Conservative leadership contest I think any of the candidates who have fiddled expenses should be eliminated, that would shorten the numbers for sure.
After ten(?) offences relating to breaking Parliament’s rules on finances and expenses would Boris be out of the race then then?
After taking monies meant for EU constituency and using them for party political (UKIP at the time) purposes good job Farage ain’t a Tory too.
So Boris alone comes to Court. How does he get a fair trial by Jury? at the Old Bailey? in Remoan London? or where else? How are the Jurors going to be selected? Why just Boris? lots of lies were told by remoan politicians.
So allegedly he told lies in the 2016 Referendum campaign to get us out of the EU. What about the lies told which got us into the predecessor Common Market and its other alias tiltes and which kept us there? I don’t notice much publicity about how those campaigns were funded. All I see is junkers jumo pontificating about how he wants to intervene in any second referendum campaign and how much he regrets not doing so in 2016.
Carryfast:
Franglais:
.
'Re big families, if some societies relying on subsistence farming, and have no formal social support it is only your family you can rely on. If you don’t want to starve when ill or old you need kids.
Obviously more to it than that, but it is a factor.
Oh wait.
Who pays for our ‘formal social support’.
Why are we importing loads of third world immigration on the so called grounds of ‘we aren’t producing enough children to sustain our own ‘ageing’ population’.
In which case who is then supporting all those ageing third world populations left behind by such economic migration and which is why,according to you,there are supposedly so many children being produced there.
Which leaves the even more inconvenient questions of
How do third world populations supposedly,without enough food for their own children,suddenly
conveniently find enough food for the adults,in them obviously having the energy to keep breeding like rabbits when they aren’t fighting tribal wars.
Or for that matter why are our own women told to use contraception as the default choice when they are young and only have children when they are too bleedin old for it.At best ending up with their children having to look after,if not bury,their mum,by the time those children are in their 40s.Or at worst disillusioned women suddenly finding out that IVF can do nothing for them and then regretting listening to all the bs Kalergi propaganda when they were younger.Oh wait generations seperated by 20 years or less obviously increases the potential pensions bill of children retiring while their own parents are also still alive and claiming their’s.
What a sick rotten to the core society we’ve become.All based on the import of the cheapest labour possible combined with minimising the tax and social care costs of the employer elite classes.Allied to the Social Engineering agenda of the Champagne Socialists in the form of their Kalergi type Plans.
To which your answer is we are rich they are poor let’s chuck loads more money at them if not invite them all in to live here.
Totally agree. Particularly as I fit the description mentioned having buried my elderly mother at 41, by coincidence the age at which she gave birth to me. WW2 however being the reason behind that since she refused to marry her sweetheart and have a child until he came home safely and they had then saved enough for a home.
It’s funny how much of CF’s above doesn’t fit in with the popularly broadcast perception that our wastrel,feckless young are breeding like flies to get council houses. It would seem that as a nation we are being brainwashed into thinking we would prefer to support aliens who wish to continue their tribal and religious wars in our midst than to do anything to solve the problems of our own young ‘poor’.
cav551:
Totally agree. Particularly as I fit the description mentioned having buried my elderly mother at 41, by coincidence the age at which she gave birth to me. WW2 however being the reason behind that since she refused to marry her sweetheart and have a child until he came home safely and they had then saved enough for a home.
It’s funny how much of CF’s above doesn’t fit in with the popularly broadcast perception that our wastrel,feckless young are breeding like flies to get council houses. It would seem that as a nation we are being brainwashed into thinking we would prefer to support aliens who wish to continue their tribal and religious wars in our midst than to do anything to solve the problems of our own young ‘poor’.
My own Father was also a late arrival of parents in their 40’s and lost his mum when he was 46 and was only 16 in the case of his Father.In addition to lots of inter family squabbles on his side,over sharing the looking after of his infirm Mother for a long period before she died well into her 80’s.IE having to share the looking after of an elderly parent pushing 80,in addition to all the responsibilities of raising a young family at the same point in life in the 30’s,is mission impossible also resulting in unjustified rows among families.However it would probably be fair to say that,as in his parents’ case’,( seemingly thought they were no longer medically able to reproduce at the time ),those examples were the exception which proved the rule of women usually married by their early 20’s and finished raising their families in their 40’s.
On that note there’s no way that the establishment can explain that contradiction,in calling on our own to delay having a family as long as possible if at all.While at the same time inviting in loads of third world immigration based on the excuse that our own aren’t reproducing enough.The obvious only logical explanation being a deliberate policy of creating a pool of the cheapest labour possible.In addition to the all too credible aims contained within the Kalergi plan.With the win win of minimising/nullifying any overlap in the pension ages between generations.It stinks.
Carryfast:
Franglais:
.
'Re big families, if some societies relying on subsistence farming, and have no formal social support it is only your family you can rely on. If you don’t want to starve when ill or old you need kids.
Obviously more to it than that, but it is a factor.
Oh wait.
Who pays for our ‘formal social support’.
Why are we importing loads of third world immigration on the so called grounds of ‘we aren’t producing enough children to sustain our own ‘ageing’ population’.
In which case who is then supporting all those ageing third world populations left behind by such economic migration and which is why,according to you,there are supposedly so many children being produced there.
Which leaves the even more inconvenient questions of
How do third world populations supposedly,without enough food for their own children,suddenly
conveniently find enough food for the adults,in them obviously having the energy to keep breeding like rabbits when they aren’t fighting tribal wars.
Or for that matter why are our own women told to use contraception as the default choice when they are young and only have children when they are too bleedin old for it.At best ending up with their children having to look after,if not bury,their mum,by the time those children are in their 40s.Or at worst disillusioned women suddenly finding out that IVF can do nothing for them and then regretting listening to all the bs Kalergi propaganda when they were younger.Oh wait generations seperated by 20 years or less obviously increases the potential pensions bill of children retiring while their own parents are also still alive and claiming their’s.
What a sick rotten to the core society we’ve become.All based on the import of the cheapest labour possible combined with minimising the tax and social care costs of the employer elite classes.Allied to the Social Engineering agenda of the Champagne Socialists in the form of their Kalergi type Plans.
To which your answer is we are rich they are poor let’s chuck loads more money at them if not invite them all in to live here.
If you calm down for a few seconds and re-read my post, you may realise that I was offering one possible aspect of what was happening.
Nowhere did I suggest this was in anyway a good thing.
I said it was a complex problem. Nowhere did I offer any solution.
cav551:
Franglais:
Buzzer:
PS. as for the Conservative leadership contest I think any of the candidates who have fiddled expenses should be eliminated, that would shorten the numbers for sure.
After ten(?) offences relating to breaking Parliament’s rules on finances and expenses would Boris be out of the race then then?
After taking monies meant for EU constituency and using them for party political (UKIP at the time) purposes good job Farage ain’t a Tory too.
So Boris alone comes to Court. How does he get a fair trial by Jury? at the Old Bailey? in Remoan London? or where else? How are the Jurors going to be selected? Why just Boris? lots of lies were told by remoan politicians.
So allegedly he told lies in the 2016 Referendum campaign to get us out of the EU. What about the lies told which got us into the predecessor Common Market and its other alias tiltes and which kept us there? I don’t notice much publicity about how those campaigns were funded. All I see is junkers jumo pontificating about how he wants to intervene in any second referendum campaign and how much he regrets not doing so in 2016.
I’m all in favour of more inspection of what ALL politicians say. Their party or leanings shouldn’t matter.
The Law Courts are probably not the ideal tool, but it’s difficult to see what else is out there?
The Blair 45min statement would be good to have tried maybe?
.
If a liar gets into Government through lying what should we do? Shrug out shoulders are say “Well, they’re all as bad as each other”?
What a depressing surrender to the lowest standards that would be.
.
I don’t think that much will come of this, and worry that some will see this as a green light to actually increase lying to the electorate. Dishonest actions that go unpunished generate more and worse of the same.
.
Too many of our politicos hold us in contempt. They won’t get better by us doing nowt.
Franglais:
Carryfast:
Oh wait.
Who pays for our ‘formal social support’.
Why are we importing loads of third world immigration on the so called grounds of ‘we aren’t producing enough children to sustain our own ‘ageing’ population’.
In which case who is then supporting all those ageing third world populations left behind by such economic migration and which is why,according to you,there are supposedly so many children being produced there.
Which leaves the even more inconvenient questions of
How do third world populations supposedly,without enough food for their own children,suddenly
conveniently find enough food for the adults,in them obviously having the energy to keep breeding like rabbits when they aren’t fighting tribal wars.
Or for that matter why are our own women told to use contraception as the default choice when they are young and only have children when they are too bleedin old for it.At best ending up with their children having to look after,if not bury,their mum,by the time those children are in their 40s.Or at worst disillusioned women suddenly finding out that IVF can do nothing for them and then regretting listening to all the bs Kalergi propaganda when they were younger.Oh wait generations seperated by 20 years or less obviously increases the potential pensions bill of children retiring while their own parents are also still alive and claiming their’s.
What a sick rotten to the core society we’ve become.All based on the import of the cheapest labour possible combined with minimising the tax and social care costs of the employer elite classes.Allied to the Social Engineering agenda of the Champagne Socialists in the form of their Kalergi type Plans.
To which your answer is we are rich they are poor let’s chuck loads more money at them if not invite them all in to live here.
If you calm down for a few seconds and re-read my post, you may realise that I was offering one possible aspect of what was happening.
Nowhere did I suggest this was in anyway a good thing.
I said it was a complex problem. Nowhere did I offer any solution.
Fine then you’d obviously be happy with the idea of Friends with Fences and Charity begins at Home and they will have to stand on their own feet.Which obviously means not squandering their natural resources on corruption and fighting inter tribal wars and not overpopulating the place to unsustainable levels and not exporting food while their own starve.
Carryfast:
Spardo:
ramone:
A bit like the striking miners who were on big wages bleating about not being able to feed their families sat in clubs with a pint and a cig in their hands
Wow Ramone, this must be one for the record books, I totally agree with you, having personally suffered at the hands of those twice in my career and never cease to be amazed at how few drivers nowadays remember the violence we were subjected to.
Don’t remember many drivers applying for mining jobs for the ‘big wages’.Remind us how much that was in 1972 compared to other industries.
As for remainers with a liking for crossing picket lines.While at the same time moaning about a Tory Brexit and that the EU is supposedly good for workers’ ‘rights’.Which probably explains why most of the Tory Party is for Remain from Thatcher to May.
I remember when i was young my dad commenting on how the miners earned more for 35 hours than he did for 60 he also said he couldnt remember the miners backing the drivers when they came out on strike.
ramone:
Carryfast:
Spardo:
ramone:
A bit like the striking miners who were on big wages bleating about not being able to feed their families sat in clubs with a pint and a cig in their hands
Wow Ramone, this must be one for the record books, I totally agree with you, having personally suffered at the hands of those twice in my career and never cease to be amazed at how few drivers nowadays remember the violence we were subjected to.
Don’t remember many drivers applying for mining jobs for the ‘big wages’.Remind us how much that was in 1972 compared to other industries.
As for remainers with a liking for crossing picket lines.While at the same time moaning about a Tory Brexit and that the EU is supposedly good for workers’ ‘rights’.Which probably explains why most of the Tory Party is for Remain from Thatcher to May.
I remember when i was young my dad commenting on how the miners earned more for 35 hours than he did for 60 he also said he couldnt remember the miners backing the drivers when they came out on strike.
Big wages.Violent pickets.Yeah right.When the reality is that in most cases you’re talking about the generation which saved this country from defeat less than 30 years previously.
youtube.com/watch?v=3gFhxhDdxnY
As for 35 hours per week if only it was true that might at least have helped those who died gasping for breath with their lungs clogged with coal dust before their time.
Scargill killed the coal industry CF with unrealistic wage demands , the man was a self confessed socialist who split families up and made quite a lot of money in the process. He didnt suffer in the strikes quite the opposite and was investigated for fraud
Big wages.Violent pickets.Yeah right.When the reality is that in most cases you’re talking about the generation which saved this country from defeat less than 30 years previously.
Yes, the same generation as all the old lorry drivers who risked their lives too, but who were then treated like scum by their so-called ‘brothers’, the so-called ‘aristocracy’ of the working classes. The dockers were no better, same union too (T&G, spit) who always supported them in any dispute. Would happily keep you waiting all day and more to unload one box but then got abusive if you didn’t hurry up if they were on a different bonus scheme.
Spardo:
Big wages.Violent pickets.Yeah right.When the reality is that in most cases you’re talking about the generation which saved this country from defeat less than 30 years previously.
Yes, the same generation as all the old lorry drivers who risked their lives too, but who were then treated like scum by their so-called ‘brothers’, the so-called ‘aristocracy’ of the working classes. The dockers were no better, same union too (T&G, spit) who always supported them in any dispute. Would happily keep you waiting all day and more to unload one box but then got abusive if you didn’t hurry up if they were on a different bonus scheme.
Did you actually look at the video.It’s obvious that you’re on the same side as Remainer Thatcher.While also laughably trying to paint the EU as the saviour of the working classes.When we all saw the reality of what EU membership really means firstly in the form of Callaghan’s regime then Thatcher’s.Let me guess you’re now going to blame the winter of discontent on Council workers’ unions and leadership.On that note let’s just say that the reputation that truck drivers earn’t themselves,among the general union movement,of too often being scabs,wasn’t coincidence.To the point where their pathetic lack of solidarity has historically let themselves down let alone others.
ramone:
Scargill killed the coal industry CF with unrealistic wage demands ,
Just look at the video.That’s the rank and file rightly talking not Scargill.Combined with facts regarding the Miners’ ridiculously disadvantaged place in the wage stakes compared to other industries and in view of the job they had to do.
ramone:
Scargill killed the coal industry CF with unrealistic wage demands , the man was a self confessed socialist who split families up and made quite a lot of money in the process. He didnt suffer in the strikes quite the opposite and was investigated for fraud
Scargill didn’t kill the industry alone, it was two sided. He was very militant and had gathered support during unofficial strikes in the early 70’s regarding wages, then at the Lofthouse incident he became a hero getting his hands dirty with the rescue teams, but his time as Yorkshire NUM leader he did nothing about the pits Labour had closed ( approx 60 ).
The Tories were given the task by ECES to modernise the coal industry, this was European wide not just aimed at British pits. The cost of this modernisation would cost millions soTories decided that to save the industry they had to look at what would be the most profitable pits to save and modernise, which pits could be sold to private / foreign investors and which pits were running at a loss but whose seams could be salvaged by neighbouring mines. The idea was put before the NUM and it was rejected. After several negotiations failed Scargill brought the men out stating enough pits had closed already and the industry would take no more, tied together with low wages he had a lot of backing.
The pits could have been saved if either side backed down, but standing for a year, floods and build up of gases made many of them unworkable, so apart from the ones earmarked for closure by the Tories ( some of those were already set for closure by labour ) Scargill committed industrial suicide.
The steelworkers were told any industrial action in support would see the steelworks close, as the government would not have another knife held at their throat, they went on strike and Thatcher kept her word.