Spardo:
Don’t see how you can include Cable, Blackford and Sturgeon in that. They have been steadfast remainers from day one and have never wavered from that position. You may not agree with them, but you should at least give them credit for standing by their beliefs throughout.
One of the “Leavers” arguments has been about accountability and being able to vote out politicians hasn’t it?
Come the next election I wonder how many will find candidates they will be happy to vote for?
I’m not particularly “having a go” at anyone here, but pointing out the party system we have may not give many electors a candidate or party they like.
Indeed, and something I have been saying for a long time, the system is crippled. But the Leavers’ complaints are always that their MPs do not represent the views of their constituents, or the manifesto promises made at the General Election.
My point above is that that cannot be said of the 3 mentioned because they were elected on an unequivical Remain platform.
The domestic issue of the dodgy UK electoral and party systems isn’t the same thing as the issue of EU Federalists wanting to throw the country’s mandate open to their foreign Federal EU one.Which is effectively just the LibDem type agenda as usual using a form of corrupt Gerrymandering,as a perceived force multiplier,by inviting in and tying us to a perceived allied vote.In just the same way that we can bet that EU Federalists would be ■■■■■■ off if we instead tied the country to being a 51st state of America under US presidential rule because we prefer Trump’s ideas to our pathetic corrupt bunch of tossers.
As for anyone ‘elected’ on an EU Federalist platform.That was ‘supposed’ to have been settled and overruled by the referendum regardless.You know the same referendum and it’s decision that all the EU Federalist scumbags were happy to go along with and said they would abide by.Until the vote didn’t go their way at which point true to form it conveniently suddenly became a worthless opinion poll,unlike 1975.All too predictably with a Head of State who is also like the quisling parliament obviously working for the interests of German Federalism not Brit sovereignty.We Brit patriots obviously won’t fix all that by saying let’s go along with it as opposed to let’s rebel against it with the argument having long since gone past any democratic solution.Even if handing over the country to a foreign power was ever a matter to be settled by any type of bs vote anyway.
Repeated 108 times previously by TM " We will be leaving the EU on the 29th of March" talk about speaking with “forked tongue” she will go down in history up until now and qualify as the worst PM we have ever had the misfortune to have inflicted upon us. But there could be worse to come if Corbyn manages to scrape in ! But surely not, the majority of the British Electorate are made of more sensible stuff than to elect a ■■■■ like Corbyn ! Cheers Bewick.
The referendum isn’t the whole problem, if there’s an extension Blair will put himself forward for eu president and backed by Rumpoy, Merkel, Junker, Bernier and Shultz
So sorry to see my homeland be humiliated in this way, whether they leave or not the country has lost all credibility on the world stage from what I have learned/ heard.
I live in Canada now but could have voted but didn’t as I thought it would have been unfair to do so. I would have voted leave BTW, I’m not a racist, I’m an immigrant myself, have a BSc honors degree and a further Master’s degree, so don’t fit the demographics that remainers continue state as an uneducated bigot. (And as we all know education is not an equal or indicator of common sense or inteligence)
But from the intial referendum result I thought this will never be allowed to happen, there are too many influential individuals with wealth that will not simply not allow it. My beef is that MP’s are allowed to hold coporate board room positions and have vested business intrests. Also, as Dominic Grieve pointed out, it is a representative democracy, in that an MP can, and is clearly the case, vote on matters that go against their majority constituents views and not be held to account until the next election. I believe they should have individual local manifestos that should in large part take a precedent on key matters such as this to prevent them from doing so.
My thoughts are that if I lived there still and if they hold European elections, then i would make sure to vote in them for a leave party. The power they would wield if they got enough seats could be the only possible way for Europe to relinquish, as they could not steamroller through anything they wanted then.
Bewick:
Repeated 108 times previously by TM " We will be leaving the EU on the 29th of March" talk about speaking with “forked tongue” she will go down in history up until now and qualify as the worst PM we have ever had the misfortune to have inflicted upon us. But there could be worse to come if Corbyn manages to scrape in ! But surely not, the majority of the British Electorate are made of more sensible stuff than to elect a [zb] like Corbyn ! Cheers Bewick.
Let’s get this right you support the Party which took us into it led by such pro EU Federalist notables as Heath,Thatcher,Major and Cameron and now May.While they chucked out the only real patriot they ever had in the form of Powell.Then as usual your lot want to turn all that into a silly Con v Lab argument when you know that on this issue the remainers on all sides are allied in handing over the country to the Krauts.While to be fair while Thatcher was busy supporting Heath in 1975 at least Labour had such notables as Benn,Shore and Heffer opposing them like Hoey is opposing May and her quisling Con rabble now.
As for leaving the EU it’s bleedin obvious that was never going to happen from the point when we didn’t Leave in June 2016.Bearing in mind that we couldn’t make any trade deals with anyone while we remained an EU member.While the cash kept on going to prop up the corrupt EU accounts and to pay for our EU import bill.The daft blind Con supporters really are avin a larf in trying to shift the blame from their own bunch of self serving traitors when with May and Hammond and at best wavering Davis who needs Corbyn to give away the country.When you’ve got May,Hammond and at best Davis and Raab all conspiring with our so called Head of ( vassal ) State to give away the country in the form of section 13 of the so called ‘withdrawal act’.Just like Heath,Thatcher and Major did before with the Queen’s help and blessing.
Now awaits you blaming Benn etc for all that.IE Cons blaming Labour for this treasonous give away and hand over of the century is a case of the bleedin Con pot calling the Lab kettle black.
So tell us Bewick will you now vote UKIP or stay with your bunch of Con muppets.Just like you obviously did in the case of Heath and Thatcher.
rsg1234567:
an MP can, and is clearly the case, vote on matters that go against their majority constituents views and not be held to account until the next election. I believe they should have individual local manifestos that should in large part take a precedent on key matters such as this to prevent them from doing so.
My thoughts are that if I lived there still and if they hold European elections, then i would make sure to vote in them for a leave party. The power they would wield if they got enough seats could be the only possible way for Europe to relinquish, as they could not steamroller through anything they wanted then.
In this case the local mandate was supposed to be irrelevant because it was supposedly a national referendum.However the fact that it was drawn up to be a non binding document obviously defeated the object.On that note ironically our local MP was on the Brexit side in a 60 v 40 remain constituency.
As for European elections Brit MEP’s make up only 9.7% of the total seats.So not exactly able to ‘wield’ much ‘power’ in the Federal European ‘parliament’ let alone stop the Commissioner Politburo from steamrollering through anything they want.Which is the problem with the Federal government type system.As opposed to a Confederal type system providing the supreme National right of opt out and substitution.Although having said that there’s more chance of smashing the EU from within by making alliances,than trying to rely on the puppet quisling UK parliament to isolate us from despotic EU Federalism running amok across the Channel.Just as we couldn’t isolate ourselves from the 3rd Reich in 1939.
The difference in this case being the massive support for Junker’s/Macron’s/Merkel’s 4th Reich within the country.Make no mistake this is going to get much messier and much worse in the longer term before it gets better.Possibly Yugoslavia type messy and worse but,unlike Slovenia and Croatia then,without any patriotic Militia or government on the country’s side and with too many being fully paid up indoctrinated supporters of the Federal dictatorship.
Realistically without the Head of State and/or the forces being willing to stand against our treasonous parliament on this the country is lost to this agenda of German Federalism rampaging across Europe and possibly deservedly so.
Not sure if that was directed at me but, as I don’t do Facebook, I don’t know what it is about.
Buzzer:
Lets hope that TM’s speech last night has rattled enough MP’s to vote her deal down for a third time, if it fails the EU say they will not grant an extension so that’s a case of the EU tail wagging the UK dog for sure which seems to be the case all the time, onward to the 29th to see if we are betrayed, Buzzer
Well, although I admit I was listening on a crackly signal in Northern France so could have got it wrong, but I thought she has 2 weeks extra to get the ‘deal’ through, or if not, another month or 2 to think of something else (referendum or general election), or, if she was willing to take part in the EU elections, a much longer extension.
My hopes (faint ) are for failed deal, long extension for GE, then revoquation.
Oh, and I did hear something about an ‘Overseas Electors’ bill. Something which was promised more than 2 GEs ago. If you think you are betrayed, Buzzer, you’re not the only one.
Spardo:
Well, although I admit I was listening on a crackly signal in Northern France so could have got it wrong, but I thought she has 2 weeks extra to get the ‘deal’ through, or if not, another month or 2 to think of something else (referendum or general election), or, if she was willing to take part in the EU elections, a much longer extension.
My hopes (faint ) are for failed deal, long extension for GE, then revoquation.
Oh, and I did hear something about an ‘Overseas Electors’ bill. Something which was promised more than 2 GEs ago. If you think you are betrayed, Buzzer, you’re not the only one.
Spardo, have you seen the UK Gov Petition site? The “Revoke Article 50 and remain in the EU” is up around the 4 million signature mark now. Unlikely to have any practical effect, given the timelines, but, it is open to all UK citizens to sign, so maybe you would like to put a small mark there?
Spardo:
Well, although I admit I was listening on a crackly signal in Northern France so could have got it wrong, but I thought she has 2 weeks extra to get the ‘deal’ through, or if not, another month or 2 to think of something else (referendum or general election), or, if she was willing to take part in the EU elections, a much longer extension.
My hopes (faint ) are for failed deal, long extension for GE, then revoquation.
Oh, and I did hear something about an ‘Overseas Electors’ bill. Something which was promised more than 2 GEs ago. If you think you are betrayed, Buzzer, you’re not the only one.
Spardo, have you seen the UK Gov Petition site? The “Revoke Article 50 and remain in the EU” is up around the 4 million signature mark now. Unlikely to have any practical effect, given the timelines, but, it is open to all UK citizens to sign, so maybe you would like to put a small mark there?
Already done, Franglais, I was about the half millionth to sign.
I agree, as all my friends here who signed do, that it will have little effect, but at least we get a little bit of our voice heard in this infair and un-democratic world.
Oh well that’s it then let’s just revoke Article 50 immediately, without any input from Parliament, on the basis that a minority of people - many of whom won’t be on the UK electorate - have signed a petition, mainly because they are so thick that they wish to follow the lead of a 5th- rate, Z list, so-called ‘celebrity’ who they have probably never even heard of.
Spardo:
I agree, as all my friends here who signed do, that it will have little effect, but at least we get a little bit of our voice heard in this infair and un-democratic world.
I`m rather late with this link (from last Monday!. Ancient history in Brexit terms), but I found the tweets amusing. indy100.com/article/brexit- … ow-8831246
Re “Take Back Control” the leave mantra…
Have I Got News For You @haveigotnews
· Mar 19, 2019
Brexiteers confused as John Bercow exercises Parliamentary sovereignty Leave campaign said we didn’t have.
John E Godwin @JohnEGodwin1
It would appear that people who wanted to “take back control” from an organisation they didn’t understand the operation of, are upset that they don’t understand the operation of the organisation they wanted to give control back to.
[zb] hilarious.
65
5:32 AM - Mar 20, 2019
cav551:
Oh well that’s it then let’s just revoke Article 50 immediately, without any input from Parliament, on the basis that a minority of people - many of whom won’t be on the UK electorate - have signed a petition, mainly because they are so thick that they wish to follow the lead of a 5th- rate, Z list, so-called ‘celebrity’ who they have probably never even heard of.
We’ve seen what happens when we get ‘input from parliament’ and it won’t be supportive of the Leave vote.It’s clear that we are seeing the final scenes in this charade in which a foreign power is being invited in by a treasonous rabble within to take over the country.The ‘referendum’ just being a part of that which went wrong somehow so now parliament will just tear that up and rely on whatever support it can find to justify finishing off the process of tying us into the 4th Reich which Heath started.Who would have thought it with obviously even those like Juddian being in denial at the depths which this conspiracy reaches to including as far as the Head of ‘State’.
Franglais:
It would appear that people who wanted to “take back control” from an organisation they didn’t understand the operation of
[zb] hilarious.
65
5:32 AM - Mar 20, 2019
You mean the organisation which lying EU Federalists ( if the cap fits wear it ) try to pretend is a Confederation of Sovereign states.But which in reality is a dictatorial self appointed illegal 4th Reich.In which unelected Commissioners make the rules implemented by a Court with no legal juristiction here and all laughably justified by a supposed foreign gerrymandered mandate.Within an equally illegal parliament imposing its will,across the obviously effectively dissolved former European National borders.Which now exist only in name as part of that.
It won’t seem so ‘zb hilarious’ if/when this all goes the way of Yugoslavia.Bearing in mind a coastline which couldn’t possibly be covered against arms shipments to Brit ‘rebels’ from sympathetic allies.Bearing in mind the moral high ground of any such ‘rebellion’ being the liberation of a country from takeover by a foreign power and treason within.Oh wait the government is already running scared of such a scenario and anything but laughably meeting it with a show of 4th Reich force.Zb hilarious.
So 4 million people have signed a petition to have a second vote , they just need another 13.5 million signatures to equal the leave vote but they needn`t worry because the self preservation society will never let Britain leave the corrupt EU because they make so much money out of it . British politics are at the lowest point in recent history , democracy is dead , the worst ever MPs are running this country or ruining this country ,depends how you view it . If we end up staying put which all parties have been aiming for then the EU will probably turn the screw tighter , this once proud land is being ruined from within
Buzzer: The “Plan G” you advocate…If you are in prison you can’t get your Gov’t pension…is there anything stopping you getting your private pension should you have one? You know so you can buy those little luxuries like a nice curry on a saturday night, TelePizza on a friday, a nice film on your personal Netflix stream? Maybe invoke Italian Rights to a ■■■■■■ once a month for being a model prisoner?
ramone:
So 4 million people have signed a petition to have a second vote ,
Not true, the petition is to revoke article 50 and remain in the EU, not for another referendum.
Otherwise I would have not put my name to it as I don’t want another one. The one which caused all this mess was fraudulent and there is no point in doing it all again.
Because it was fraudulent both in its framing and conduct it should be annulled. Hence the revocation of article 50.
The correct way to leave the EU is by a free vote in Parliament, that is what MPs are elected to do. Therefore the correct way to revoque a fraudulent decision is by a free vote in Parliament.
And before someone says that most MPs were elected on a party manifesto I will say this. Prospective MPs almost always need to join one party or another in the UK system and stand on that party’s manifesto at election. It is always dishonest because they can’t possibly believe in every little aspect of it, but they have to lump it if they want to get in. Once in there they often defy the whips on a point of principle, so why should this, the most important decision of all except to go to war, be any different?
