Juddian:
I will say it again lads, stand fast, it ain’t the 30th yet, the ball is still in the air, every bugger is confused as the story shifts, this is the only way Brexit could have been delivered because the enemy are as confused and frustrated as anyone.
That post is open to a lot of different interpretation Juddian.
Just who are “the enemy” one wonders? Surely not those fellow Brits who have a slightly differing political view I hope?
“The only way Brexit could happen”?
So you don’t think it could happen after a calm, reasoned, factual debate?
Buzzer:
John Bercow is no different than the Prime minister who advocates granting the wish of the 17.4 million who voted to leave with no strings or deals and goes in a completely different direction so what democracy are you talking about, from where I am looking that is long gone down the drain, Buzzer
Exactly where has the PM or Bercow or even HM ever ‘advocated’ ‘granting the wish’ of no deal Brexit ( Leave means Leave ).Which side are you on ?.
According to my Oxford Concise dictionary ADVOCATE means one who speaks in favour of a ( proposal etc ) which is exactly what TM is doing buy saying she will grant the wishes of those who voted to leave but in fact she has a completely different agenda in real terms, naff the backstop its all the other bad things in her deal which would keep us tied in to the EU with absolutely no say what so ever. You only have to read any of my other posts to leave you in no doubt that I voted to leave the abortion that is the EU so I don’t understand where you are coming from with your comment, Buzzer.
That seems to explain how the Con ‘leave’ side has got itself so confused that it doesn’t even understand what it wants itself.
Let’s get this right you wanted to trust the Party which enthusiastically took us into the EU and the Head of State who signed Royal Assent to it to now take us out of it.When the wording of the Referendum Act ( non binding document ) and section 13 of the Withdrawal Act ( parliament has the final say on how/when/if we leave the EU ) and the Head of State’s and Parliament’s all too predictable actions since June 2016,including crowning absolutely clearly enthusiastic EU Federalists May and Hammond,let alone Bercow,to lead the process,tells you all you need to know in that regard.
As opposed to the Head of State preferably having made a statement that signing the assent to the European Communities Act was a mistake based on the treasonous actions of Heath.Nor as a clear matter of sovereignty can it possibly be settled by referendum because no one has the right to vote the nation out of existence.All that done in 1975 let alone 2016.Without that you’re looking at a fait accompli and it’s going to take a mutiny within the armed forces against the equally clearly pro EU Federalist Head of State to get us out of this mess.When the forces are more likely to uphold the rule of the EU over the country.Make no mistake that’s where the reasons for it all are based and it’s naive in the extreme to think that any government would possibly go against the Head of State and the forces in that regard.Which just leaves the choice of smashing the EU from within.Which of course the foregone conclusion of BRINO would stop us taking any effective part in and UKIP having naively walked into Cameron’s trap which removes its only power base within the EU parliament.
IE better an alliance with AfD and FN within Europe than wanting to hand over the agenda to the quisling UK parliament who’ll hand it straight back to Juncker,Macron and Merkel in the form of BRINO.
Juddian:
I will say it again lads, stand fast, it ain’t the 30th yet, the ball is still in the air, every bugger is confused as the story shifts, this is the only way Brexit could have been delivered because the enemy are as confused and frustrated as anyone.
That post is open to a lot of different interpretation Juddian.
Just who are “the enemy” one wonders? Surely not those fellow Brits who have a slightly differing political view I hope?
“The only way Brexit could happen”?
So you don’t think it could happen after a calm, reasoned, factual debate?
;-?
The only calm reasoned debate we need is an answer to the question since when was it considered as ok for a sovereign nation to be voted,let alone criminally taken,out of existence and into an illegal invalid unrecognised de Jure wannabee Federal superstate/EU 4th Reich.Run by continental megalomaniacs like Juncker,Merkel and Macron helped by people like Blair here.
IE a clear matter of which country we owe our allegiance to isn’t a matter of ‘politics’ or political choices within that country.Shame on the so called Head of State for allowing matters to reach this point.
Juddian:
I will say it again lads, stand fast, it ain’t the 30th yet, the ball is still in the air, every bugger is confused as the story shifts, this is the only way Brexit could have been delivered because the enemy are as confused and frustrated as anyone.
How can the ball be in the air when section 13 of the withdrawal act states that there is no time deadline and parliament not the referendum has the final say as to how/when/if we leave the EU.No deal having clearly been taken off the table under section 13 leaving the choice of BRINO or Remain.Just as HM wants it to protect her from the implications of the contradiction in signing Royal Assent to any withdrawal from the EU on grounds of sovereignty v her signing Royal Assent to the European Communities Act.Make no mistake without HM being prepared to meet that contradiction head on by admitting dereliction of duty in 1973 and asking for God’s forgiveness regards same according to her oath,this fight was already lost in 1973.
The enemy are those MP’s and others in positions of what was once called public service, who are trying their best to deny the will of the people, to betray the instructions given to them in a referendum.
There could never have been a calm reasoned factual agreement with the EU politburo, or it’s political standard bearers here, because they are to all intent and purposes fanatics, you cannot reason with a fanatic because they can see nothing other than their way, all you can do is say cheerio.
If my understanding is correct our leaving date is the 29th March no if’s no but’s because its LAW and cast stone. So roll on the 29th and let the UK shake off the stench and interference of the EU and then it will be onwards and upwards regardless of what the Traitor Remainers claim might happen so my response to them is “■■■■ it up” and watch, you lost and 17:4 million of us won ! Cheers Bewick.
Bewick:
If my understanding is correct our leaving date is the 29th March no if’s no but’s because its LAW and cast stone. So roll on the 29th and let the UK shake off the stench and interference of the EU and then it will be onwards and upwards regardless of what the Traitor Remainers claim might happen so my response to them is “■■■■ it up” and watch, you lost and 17:4 million of us won ! Cheers Bewick.
Your understanding is wrong Bewick.In that firstly the Referendum Act was drawn up making the referendum a non binding document on the government ( obviously in the event that the ‘wrong’ result happened which it did ).
While the Withdrawal Act contains section 13 which gives parliament the right to modify or totally revoke/ignore article 50 and any deadlines set by it and to make the process mean whatever they want it to mean varying anywhere from BRINO to maintaining the Remain status quo and take full return of sovereignty,in the form of no deal Brexit,off the table.Which is where we are now.
Bearing in mind that HM has effectively removed any chance we had by signing away the country’s sovereignty by providing Royal Assent to the European Communities Act,Single European Act,Maastricht,Lisbon and now the dodgy Referendum Act and EU Withdrawal Act and therefore handing over the powers contained in the Royal Perogative,which she should be exercising regarding matters of state especially sovereignty,to our dodgy MP’s and parliament to do as they please with.
As for a so called referendum why would any head of state worthy of the name want to put their name and signature to any document which allows the public and/or MP’s to vote the nation out of existence and into the rule a foreign power.Let alone signing up to the European Communities Act just on the word of Heath.Let alone a foreign power as illegal and invalid as the un recognised self appointed de Jure EU superstate run by megalomaniacs like Juncker and the Commissioner politburo.
Oh wait.The Queen,Prince Philip and Ted Heath arrived for a ‘gala performance’ to ‘celebrate the new dawn’.As for a Common Market that ain’t what Powell or Benn or Shore or Heffer said at the time.Which leaves the question did HM know about FCO 30/1048 when Royal Assent to the European Communities Act was signed or not ?.
An old school friend who lives in London and sends out regular emails says he happened to run into Michael Portillo in Hatchards book shop in London. MP’s opinion is that they will kick it around for a further 2 years, when they can say that a vote 5 years ago is no longer relevant. He may well be right. Meanwhile the EU will squeeze the pips. They must, with Italy bankrupt and most economies stagnating, otherwise there won’t be an EU to stay part of.
John West:
An old school friend who lives in London and sends out regular emails says he happened to run into Michael Portillo in Hatchards book shop in London. MP’s opinion is that they will kick it around for a further 2 years, when they can say that a vote 5 years ago is no longer relevant. He may well be right. Meanwhile the EU will squeeze the pips. They must, with Italy bankrupt and most economies stagnating, otherwise there won’t be an EU to stay part of.
John
John that is probably our only hope of getting out now that we have been betrayed by our politicians, its not just Italy but Greece, Spain, Portugal and Ireland who are dodgy so it just needs one of these to falter and the whole pack of cards will fall down. Just hoping the EU will tell TM no extension but I doubt that either as they need our financial input to keep it all going, without it they will struggle as the other main contributors to the coffers will have to pay more in to take up the slack and I don’t think they have a taste for that at all, here’s hoping they reject her extension plea, Buzzer
Buzzer:
John that is probably our only hope of getting out now that we have been betrayed by our politicians, its not just Italy but Greece, Spain, Portugal and Ireland who are dodgy so it just needs one of these to falter and the whole pack of cards will fall down. Just hoping the EU will tell TM no extension but I doubt that either as they need our financial input to keep it all going, without it they will struggle as the other main contributors to the coffers will have to pay more in to take up the slack and I don’t think they have a taste for that at all, here’s hoping they reject her extension plea, Buzzer
The EU needs our cash to keep the whole Federal scam afloat and the EU has already said that parliament can unilaterally revoke article 50 and obviously doesn’t need an extension anyway to impose the foregone conclusion of BRINO or Remain by the 29th.Bearing in mind all that how and why would the EU want to help Brexit in any way ?.The fact is this long ago became an issue for the head of state and the forces to fix not our dodgy wavering parliament or referendum.Instead of which HM and her forces have clearly come down on the side of EU ( read German ) Federalism at the expense of the country’s sovereignty and with it right to exist as of 1973 and it would/will probably take a war of secession to free it.Which obviously ain’t going to happen without a large faction of the armed forces being prepared to mutiny against a government and Head of State gone rogue.
I have sadly come to the conclusion that May, Corbyn & Cable and oh! Blackford & Sturgeon must rank as the worst bunch of Politicians to ever infect our Great country. Surely when the opportunity does finally arrive we have got to rid ourselves of these self inflated pigmy politicians so bring it on I say and crucify the ■■■■■■■■ at the ballot box ! Bewick.
Bewick:
I have sadly come to the conclusion that May, Corbyn & Cable and oh! Blackford & Sturgeon must rank as the worst bunch of Politicians to ever infect our Great country. Surely when the opportunity does finally arrive we have got to rid ourselves of these self inflated pigmy politicians so bring it on I say and crucify the [zb] at the ballot box ! Bewick.
Don’t see how you can include Cable, Blackford and Sturgeon in that. They have been steadfast remainers from day one and have never wavered from that position. You may not agree with them, but you should at least give them credit for standing by their beliefs throughout.
Bewick:
I have sadly come to the conclusion that May, Corbyn & Cable and oh! Blackford & Sturgeon must rank as the worst bunch of Politicians to ever infect our Great country. Surely when the opportunity does finally arrive we have got to rid ourselves of these self inflated pigmy politicians so bring it on I say and crucify the [zb] at the ballot box ! Bewick.
Don’t see how you can include Cable, Blackford and Sturgeon in that. They have been steadfast remainers from day one and have never wavered from that position. You may not agree with them, but you should at least give them credit for standing by their beliefs throughout.
One of the “Leavers” arguments has been about accountability and being able to vote out politicians hasn’t it?
Come the next election I wonder how many will find candidates they will be happy to vote for?
I’m not particularly “having a go” at anyone here, but pointing out the party system we have may not give many electors a candidate or party they like.
Bewick:
I have sadly come to the conclusion that May, Corbyn & Cable and oh! Blackford & Sturgeon must rank as the worst bunch of Politicians to ever infect our Great country. Surely when the opportunity does finally arrive we have got to rid ourselves of these self inflated pigmy politicians so bring it on I say and crucify the [zb] at the ballot box ! Bewick.
Don’t see how you can include Cable, Blackford and Sturgeon in that. They have been steadfast remainers from day one and have never wavered from that position. You may not agree with them, but you should at least give them credit for standing by their beliefs throughout.
One of the “Leavers” arguments has been about accountability and being able to vote out politicians hasn’t it?
Come the next election I wonder how many will find candidates they will be happy to vote for?
I’m not particularly “having a go” at anyone here, but pointing out the party system we have may not give many electors a candidate or party they like.
Indeed, and something I have been saying for a long time, the system is crippled. But the Leavers’ complaints are always that their MPs do not represent the views of their constituents, or the manifesto promises made at the General Election.
My point above is that that cannot be said of the 3 mentioned because they were elected on an unequivical Remain platform.
Lets hope that TM’s speech last night has rattled enough MP’s to vote her deal down for a third time, if it fails the EU say they will not grant an extension so that’s a case of the EU tail wagging the UK dog for sure which seems to be the case all the time, onward to the 29th to see if we are betrayed, Buzzer
