gazzer:
Not a £350mil REFUND franglais, just an amount we will no longer have to pay.
I’m tiring of the fight now, losing the will to live, I don’t give a sh*t, just get on with it and live with the consequences.
If we’re in, good for us all in Europe. If we’re out, we’ll deal with it. Simples.
That’s partly what they’ve been doing, wearing everyone down so we just give up.
What did you all expect?
Breeze into a room, tell the EU how it’s gonna be, and go down the pub in time for lunch?
I really expected a more realistic attitude from you two gentlemen at least. I can see some might have been listening to the siren song of how easy and painless it was gonna be, but if you believed the EU were a bunch of time wasting bureaucrats why did you expect ‘leave’ would be smooth and quick?
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Personally I expected a concrete plan long before June 2018 when we had Chequers. Then everyone would have had more time to assess. That doesn’t mean to say that the EU have covered themselves in glory; essentially they have put obstacles in the way all through the process and I agree with you that they have no obligation not to. In an ideal world if I was Theresa I would have played hard ball about a year into negotiations and gone if there wasn’t some meeting in the middle.
gazzer:
Not a £350mil REFUND franglais, just an amount we will no longer have to pay.
I’m tiring of the fight now, losing the will to live, I don’t give a sh*t, just get on with it and live with the consequences.
If we’re in, good for us all in Europe. If we’re out, we’ll deal with it. Simples.
That’s partly what they’ve been doing, wearing everyone down so we just give up.
What did you all expect?
Breeze into a room, tell the EU how it’s gonna be, and go down the pub in time for lunch?
I really expected a more realistic attitude from you two gentlemen at least. I can see some might have been listening to the siren song of how easy and painless it was gonna be, but if you believed the EU were a bunch of time wasting bureaucrats why did you expect ‘leave’ would be smooth and quick?
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Personally I expected a concrete plan long before June 2018 when we had Chequers. Then everyone would have had more time to assess. That doesn’t mean to say that the EU have covered themselves in glory; essentially they have put obstacles in the way all through the process and I agree with you that they have no obligation not to. In an ideal world if I was Theresa I would have played hard ball about a year into negotiations and gone if there wasn’t some meeting in the middle.
Which is what I’ve just done with my contract [emoji38]
Ah, but we as a country aren’t in the happy position to retire are we?
And playing hardball? It’s the EU that owns the ball in this game, and we are the ones that signed up to their rules and are now changing our minds.
Could we just walk away? Well, if we wanted to be known as untrustworthy deal breakers we could. Wouldn’t do us well in the future. And I note that although you are quitting you are helping with a smooth transition for your company. We shouldn’t throw a huff and become quitters!
albion:
Personally I expected a concrete plan long before June 2018 when we had Chequers. Then everyone would have had more time to assess. That doesn’t mean to say that the EU have covered themselves in glory; essentially they have put obstacles in the way all through the process and I agree with you that they have no obligation not to. In an ideal world if I was Theresa I would have played hard ball about a year into negotiations and gone if there wasn’t some meeting in the middle.
Spardo:
Surprised at you, so you think that British citzens paying British taxes should not have a say in the way those taxes are administered? Simply because of where they happen to live?
And here’s me thinking you were a democrat.
It’s obvious that you’ve got a contradictory selective idea of ‘democracy’.In which you want to use National citizenship and National voting rights to vote for a system in which that same national vote can be cancelled out by a foreign majority in the form of QMV and unelected politburo directive.
While by your logic we contribute to EU taxes in the form of VAT so we should all be able to vote in the elections of every EU state and you obviously want to end the constituency based electoral system in favour of PR to the advantage of UKIP.So while you can vote for your preferred Federalist rabble here I can obviously vote for Le Pen and the FN over there even though I live in the UK.Sounds fair to me.
Franglais:
And playing hardball? It’s the EU that owns the ball in this game, and we are the ones that signed up to their rules and are now changing our minds.
Could we just walk away? Well, if we wanted to be known as untrustworthy deal breakers we could.
It seems obvious that you’re a rabid EU Federalist who doesn’t do secession.So tell us exactly which rule and ‘deal’ is it that says that any state can’t just unilaterally walk away from the EU according to its own wishes and requirements including ditching article 50 as part of that ?.While as we all know the European Communities Act was only signed up to on the basis of it being a ‘Common Market’ nothing more.Ironically that market all being in the favour of EU exporters to the UK.On that note the EU owns nothing ( so far ) but we all know that the EU owning our country,including the removal of the right to secede,was always the end game as stated with FCO 30/1048 which of course Heath hid from the UK public in 1973 and 1975 and which your dictatorial bs has confirmed.
The 2016 referendum was very clear and outcome was acknowledged by both sides to be absolutely binding “no ifs no buts” although the Remain camp smugly assumed that they would win hands down ! so of course they could be seen to be “magnanimous” and agree that the outcome of this once and for all vote would be final and accepted as such by both sides ! However, what a shock the Remainers got when they woke up next morning and “clocked” the result !
So why can’t we just walk away with just a small token “goodwill” payment being made as after all we did vote on a simple question “in or out” !!
Cheers Bewick.
Because Federalists don’t do secession as numerous wars over the issue have shown and the so called referendum was only meant to be a Trojan Horse to seal us into the EU in perpetuity with the win win that a Leave vote would just be ignored in the form of Remain + being called Brexit.Not surprising with the Head of State and the forces obviously being on the side of selling us out to the EU.If that wasn’t the case Heath would have found himself being marched off to jail escorted by the military.
Bewick, if only it was so simple !!! Come to think of it, how many times (on here) have we heard that all that was needed was to repeal the 1972 European Communities act and that would have been it - job done, but I’ve never heard any reference to it on TV or radio when Brexit was being discussed. Another thing I’ve never heard explained is just what is meant by a “no-deal”. Does anyone know any FACTS about such an outcome, not just speculation, guesswork and conjecture? Mind you, none of us REALLY know what the situation is as of right now - one thing I’ve learned about politicians is that it’s not what they say that matters, it’s what they don’t say that you have to beware of.
fodenway:
Bewick, if only it was so simple !!! Come to think of it, how many times (on here) have we heard that all that was needed was to repeal the 1972 European Communities act and that would have been it - job done, but I’ve never heard any reference to it on TV or radio when Brexit was being discussed. Another thing I’ve never heard explained is just what is meant by a “no-deal”. Does anyone know any FACTS about such an outcome, not just speculation, guesswork and conjecture? Mind you, none of us REALLY know what the situation is as of right now - one thing I’ve learned about politicians is that it’s not what they say that matters, it’s what they don’t say that you have to beware of.
Repealing the Act is purely a private affair, in our own Parliament. All that does is start the process, I presume, which lead to invoking article 51. What happens between that and actually leaving is the subject of the treaty that we signed with the EU, or whatever it was called then. That is, discussing all the arrangements and payments made and terminated, which is supposed to be what has been happening all this time.
But one of the things we signed up to is a ‘divorce’ payment. Yes, we could leave with no agreement as to future trade arrangements and simply say ‘sod it, we’re going, and you can whistle for the money’. But that would be breaking a treaty and, as Franglais said in different words, who will want to deal with a welsher? In other words, all these wonderful free trade agreements we can apparently strike with the rest of the world, will be extremely hard to get.
fodenway:
Bewick, if only it was so simple !!! Come to think of it, how many times (on here) have we heard that all that was needed was to repeal the 1972 European Communities act and that would have been it - job done, but I’ve never heard any reference to it on TV or radio when Brexit was being discussed. Another thing I’ve never heard explained is just what is meant by a “no-deal”. Does anyone know any FACTS about such an outcome, not just speculation, guesswork and conjecture? Mind you, none of us REALLY know what the situation is as of right now - one thing I’ve learned about politicians is that it’s not what they say that matters, it’s what they don’t say that you have to beware of.
Repealing the Act is purely a private affair, in our own Parliament. All that does is start the process, I presume, which lead to invoking article 51. What happens between that and actually leaving is the subject of the treaty that we signed with the EU, or whatever it was called then. That is, discussing all the arrangements and payments made and terminated, which is supposed to be what has been happening all this time.
But one of the things we signed up to is a ‘divorce’ payment. Yes, we could leave with no agreement as to future trade arrangements and simply say ‘sod it, we’re going, and you can whistle for the money’. But that would be breaking a treaty and, as Franglais said in different words, who will want to deal with a welsher? In other words, all these wonderful free trade agreements we can apparently strike with the rest of the world, will be extremely hard to get.
Spardo i know we are on different sides on here but one thing is for sure it wont matter a hoot if we were welshers, if the deal makes profit then they will deal with anyone its the way it works in buisness, its no good being proud and bust better to convieniently forget the past and just count the money you have made, Buzzer
Buzzer:
Spardo i know we are on different sides on here but one thing is for sure it wont matter a hoot if we were welshers, if the deal makes profit then they will deal with anyone its the way it works in buisness, its no good being proud and bust better to convieniently forget the past and just count the money you have made, Buzzer
Maybe so, but I bet you wouldn’t be so understanding and friendly with a haulier who subbed you a load and then refused to pay you, or if you backloaded another and found he had diverted the load, forged a receipt and then got his payment from you.
And if not you, would you sub again from someone who welshed on paying you? I’m pretty sure that you would not, and neither would (and have) I.
The arrogance of the EU knows no boundaries, we have the Spanish spouting about Gibraltar and the French spouting about fishing in our waters , why on earth do we want to deal with these ■■■ wipes .
Good old Corbyn as put his Penarth in too this afternoon. We dont want the deal May is pushing or should I say I don't but how can you negotiate with a bunch of arrogant Europeans who wont budge an inch but somehow Corbyn thinks he has all the answers . I think the only negotiations he would be interested in his remain something he was totally against in his younger days. May needs to step down on the 11th December after she fails and we need a committed Brexiteer to pave the way , after all thats what the majority of the UK voted for
ramone:
The arrogance of the EU knows no boundaries, we have the Spanish spouting about Gibraltar and the French spouting about fishing in our waters , why on earth do we want to deal with these ■■■ wipes .
Good old Corbyn as put his Penarth in too this afternoon. We dont want the deal May is pushing or should I say I don't but how can you negotiate with a bunch of arrogant Europeans who wont budge an inch but somehow Corbyn thinks he has all the answers . I think the only negotiations he would be interested in his remain something he was totally against in his younger days. May needs to step down on the 11th December after she fails and we need a committed Brexiteer to pave the way , after all thats what the majority of the UK voted for
Interesting “ramoan” when I was watching the one oclock news they were interviewing random public on the streets of Leeds and most said leave was the vote just get on with it, ordinary people just don’t under stand why we cannot do this and just handle what comes our way, but oh no we have yet more scare mongering and the world is going to end in March 2019 if there is no deal, if May gets her way we will be tied to the EU for years to come with no say and all pay, that will be great wont it.
Now I have voted Conservative for many years and have bothered to get of my ■■■ to do so but must say I am very disappointed in Mrs May and the way she has conducted this farce, if she stays they wont get my vote next time, I don’t want Corbin leading this country either but as things stand reckon he is in with a chance for sure as many Cons will be feeling exactly the same as me, betrayed cheers Buzzer.
Buzzer:
Spardo i know we are on different sides on here but one thing is for sure it wont matter a hoot if we were welshers, if the deal makes profit then they will deal with anyone its the way it works in buisness, its no good being proud and bust better to convieniently forget the past and just count the money you have made, Buzzer
Maybe so, but I bet you wouldn’t be so understanding and friendly with a haulier who subbed you a load and then refused to pay you, or if you backloaded another and found he had diverted the load, forged a receipt and then got his payment from you.
And if not you, would you sub again from someone who welshed on paying you? I’m pretty sure that you would not, and neither would (and have) I.
Wrong comparison Spardo ! Wether you like it or not the UK has only ever been looked upon as a source of continuing substantial contributions and we were the “Mugs” for putting up with it for so long but unfortunately our Political Classes were only too happy to oblige and oh! lest we forget some of our failed Politicians, i.e. The family Kinnock for instance have done extremely well off the “Gravy Train” not to mention the likes of that Reptile Mandleson ! And in the interests of fair play the Conservatives have their share of aerosols as well who are blinded by the stinking edifice that is the EU ! Cameron, Hesletine , Ken Clark et al ! At least J. Corbyn has consistently opposed our membership of the EEC/ EU for 40 odd years which is the reason why he is having great difficulty in changing the habit of a life time and opposing what Mother Teresa has presented us with. Corbyn will oppose Teresa’s deal on ideologic grounds but he isn’t fooling anyone ! Cheers Bewick.
Buzzer:
Spardo i know we are on different sides on here but one thing is for sure it wont matter a hoot if we were welshers, if the deal makes profit then they will deal with anyone its the way it works in buisness, its no good being proud and bust better to convieniently forget the past and just count the money you have made, Buzzer
Maybe so, but I bet you wouldn’t be so understanding and friendly with a haulier who subbed you a load and then refused to pay you, or if you backloaded another and found he had diverted the load, forged a receipt and then got his payment from you.
And if not you, would you sub again from someone who welshed on paying you? I’m pretty sure that you would not, and neither would (and have) I.
Ah Spardo you just hit the nail smack on the head with that statement because if you analyse your reply to my quote, that is exactly what the EU does to Great Britain, Buzzer
ramone:
The arrogance of the EU knows no boundaries, we have the Spanish spouting about Gibraltar and the French spouting about fishing in our waters , why on earth do we want to deal with these ■■■ wipes .
Good old Corbyn as put his Penarth in too this afternoon. We dont want the deal May is pushing or should I say I don't but how can you negotiate with a bunch of arrogant Europeans who wont budge an inch but somehow Corbyn thinks he has all the answers . I think the only negotiations he would be interested in his remain something he was totally against in his younger days. May needs to step down on the 11th December after she fails and we need a committed Brexiteer to pave the way , after all thats what the majority of the UK voted for
Interesting “ramoan” when I was watching the one oclock news they were interviewing random public on the streets of Leeds and most said leave was the vote just get on with it, ordinary people just don’t under stand why we cannot do this and just handle what comes our way, but oh no we have yet more scare mongering and the world is going to end in March 2019 if there is no deal, if May gets her way we will be tied to the EU for years to come with no say and all pay, that will be great wont it.
Now I have voted Conservative for many years and have bothered to get of my ■■■ to do so but must say I am very disappointed in Mrs May and the way she has conducted this farce, if she stays they wont get my vote next time, I don’t want Corbin leading this country either but as things stand reckon he is in with a chance for sure as many Cons will be feeling exactly the same as me, betrayed cheers Buzzer.
I agree with Buzzer ! my feelings exactly but I can’t bring myself to vote for our sitting MP Farron what a ■■■■ he is ! I’ll have to find out if our prospective Con candidate is a “Leaver” ! If he isn’t and is a Remainer I’ll just have to vote Labour which in this constituency will mean one extra vote to the two or three hundred they usually get ! at least I will have voted even if it is a waste ! Cheers Dennis.
Spardo:
Repealing the Act is purely a private affair, in our own Parliament. All that does is start the process, I presume, which lead to invoking article 51. What happens between that and actually leaving is the subject of the treaty that we signed with the EU, or whatever it was called then. That is, discussing all the arrangements and payments made and terminated, which is supposed to be what has been happening all this time.
But one of the things we signed up to is a ‘divorce’ payment. Yes, we could leave with no agreement as to future trade arrangements and simply say ‘sod it, we’re going, and you can whistle for the money’. But that would be breaking a treaty and, as Franglais said in different words, who will want to deal with a welsher? In other words, all these wonderful free trade agreements we can apparently strike with the rest of the world, will be extremely hard to get.
Exactly which ‘rule’ says that any state can’t leave summarily with immediate effect according to its own requirements without any need to go through with article 50 and which rule says that we have to make a so called divorce payment ?.
As for Repeal of the Act and invoking article 50 after doing that even the remainers wildest dreams haven’t dream’t up that bs so far.We’ve actually already invoked article 50 we haven’t repealed the European Communities Act yet.We probably never will for the reasons I’ve given.IE repeal would be an admission by the establishment that it never should have been passed.
Bewick:
I agree with Buzzer ! my feelings exactly but I can’t bring myself to vote for our sitting MP Farron what a [zb] he is ! I’ll have to find out if our prospective Con candidate is a “Leaver” ! If he isn’t and is a Remainer I’ll just have to vote Labour which in this constituency will mean one extra vote to the two or three hundred they usually get ! at least I will have voted even if it is a waste ! Cheers Dennis.
Conservative leave vote voting for Labour that’ll fix it.The constituency electoral system is a joke when the best way would be vote for whichever Party of choice regardless of residential address.Bearing in mind that students living away from home and multiple home owners can register to vote in more than one constituency.
Buzzer:
Ah Spardo you just hit the nail smack on the head with that statement because if you analyse your reply to my quote, that is exactly what the EU does to Great Britain, Buzzer
Oh dear, I thought there for a moment that we were having a sensible discussion, but now you’ve gone and spoiled it.
The EU has stuck to the treaties, but you are saying that Britain shouldn’t and should renege on promises freely given.
I think you may have been taking lessons from CF in word twisting.
Buzzer:
Ah Spardo you just hit the nail smack on the head with that statement because if you analyse your reply to my quote, that is exactly what the EU does to Great Britain, Buzzer
Oh dear, I thought there for a moment that we were having a sensible discussion, but now you’ve gone and spoiled it.
The EU has stuck to the treaties, but you are saying that Britain shouldn’t and should renege on promises freely given.
I think you may have been taking lessons from CF in word twisting.
It’s you who’s doing all the twisting in this case trying to impose a non existent no secession without compensation clause on us.Although we can bet that’s exactly what remainer traitor May wants to
Which part of,we’ve left the stinking EU and with it any further obligation to be ripped off by these Federalist leeches for Brit cash while imposing austerity at home to pay for it,don’t you understand.So again tell us exactly what ‘treaty’ says that any member state can’t unilaterally secede from the Union on its own terms with immediate effect with certainly no need to keep on paying into the EU budget from that point.
