I have just received info from a reliable Dutch source that the NGC displayed at the 1976 RAI show in Amsterdam became 16-37-FB and went to Groen of Nieuw Lekkerland (a unit we do know about) and that the B-series went to Prooi of Barendrecht. This contradicts information received much earlier (via a REVS article) from another reliable Dutch source that the NGC displayed was 41-54-NB that was owned by Barend Sjouw of Portugaal (Rotterdam). I am seeking clarification behind the scenes and I’m hoping for a definitive answer. While I’m at it I am enquiring about the possibility of a Prooi NGC.
Another possibility occurs to me: that there were two NGCs at the RAI but only one visible in the photograph. Robert
robert1952:
I thought we established months ago that in the Middle East they still do it whatever you say - I saw it with my own eyes when I lived there.Didn’t we also mention chopping the unwanted bits of the back to avoid fouling ? Here’s a pic I took in Cairo. Robert
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Admittedly I think I missed that bit.
But building a rigid,with the right length chassis and typical drive axle position to suit,then instead fitting a fifth wheel in the correct position to make into a long tractor unit instead,then taking a gas axe to the resulting overhang to hopefully allow it to couple up to a semi trailer seems like an awkward way to do it.
As opposed to just starting with shorter chassis rails then placing the drive axle in the correct place when it’s built.
Although having said that the photo obviously doesn’t show whether it’s built along the lines of the former or the latter in that case.Although it’s also possible that it’s a 4x2 having been built or modified on 6x4 chassis rails with a big gap where the centre drive axle would have been.
How about this f88 still working in Abberville,France. Photo was taken this week and its not having an easy
life by the looks of it dragging that draw bar trailer around. The 88 must be about 45 years old !
A french driver thinks that the orange rigid number 12 on the register,reg 4644FX94 could have
belonged to Fleche Marseillaise of St Etienne. This is quite possible when you consider it was photographed
in Chalon-sur-Saone,which is about 110 miles from St Etienne. It is possible that maybe once the original
company had sold it a local farmer bought it as it looks fairly rural ■■
tiptop495:
hey Anorak, as Robert said, its a Fap and behind a Fiat, think two Yougoslavians, and pic maybe made over there too.
At the back end it looks a Hungaro Raba to be.
Eric,
Well done Robert and Eric. The FAP is a definite, the Hungaro Raba probable, but the other one? It does look like a Fiat.
robert1952:
I thought we established months ago that in the Middle East they still do it whatever you say - I saw it with my own eyes when I lived there.Didn’t we also mention chopping the unwanted bits of the back to avoid fouling ? Here’s a pic I took in Cairo. Robert
Admittedly I think I missed that bit.
But building a rigid,with the right length chassis and typical drive axle position to suit,then instead fitting a fifth wheel in the correct position to make into a long tractor unit instead,then taking a gas axe to the resulting overhang to hopefully allow it to couple up to a semi trailer seems like an awkward way to do it.
As opposed to just starting with shorter chassis rails then placing the drive axle in the correct place when it’s built.
Although having said that the photo obviously doesn’t show whether it’s built along the lines of the former or the latter in that case.Although it’s also possible that it’s a 4x2 having been built or modified on 6x4 chassis rails with a big gap where the centre drive axle would have been.
I can understand why it seems crazy to you. Some of these rigids-turned-tractors are the most ungainly, unsafe, bizarre lorries around CF; but they are out there working where regulations hang on a bribe etc. Ce’st la vie! I took the picture below in Libya. Robert
DEANB:
Since we are putting different pics on today !
How about this f88 still working in Abberville,France. Photo was taken this week and its not having an easy
life by the looks of it dragging that draw bar trailer around. The 88 must be about 45 years old !
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Used to be a good routier there! F88 looks quite early, but late enough to have bottom-mounted wipers I notice. Robert
tiptop495:
hey Anorak, as Robert said, its a Fap and behind a Fiat, think two Yougoslavians, and pic maybe made over there too.
At the back end it looks a Hungaro Raba to be.
Eric,
Well done Robert and Eric. The FAP is a definite, the Hungaro Raba probable, but the other one? It does look like a Fiat.
The wheel arches are about right for a 682-shape Fiat, but the panels don’t look rounded enough. They look quite severe and flat, and angled towards the front like the earlier shaped cab (below). That would make it quite a old Fiat even then. But this was Yugo 40 years ago so perhaps we shouldn’t be surprised! robert
With regard to the Groen versus Sjouw NGC at the '76 RAI, it occurs to me that both sported blue Continental-style plastic sun-visors! No help there, then! Robert
DEANB:
A french driver thinks that the orange rigid number 12 on the register,reg 4644FX94 could have
belonged to Fleche Marseillaise of St Etienne. This is quite possible when you consider it was photographed
in Chalon-sur-Saone,which is about 110 miles from St Etienne. It is possible that maybe once the original
company had sold it a local farmer bought it as it looks fairly rural ■■
We should certainly ‘pencil’ Fleche Marseillaise in and mark it as possible
! Robert
tiptop495:
hey Anorak, as Robert said, its a Fap and behind a Fiat, think two Yougoslavians, and pic maybe made over there too.
At the back end it looks a Hungaro Raba to be.
Eric,
Well done Robert and Eric. The FAP is a definite, the Hungaro Raba probable, but the other one? It does look like a Fiat.
The wheel arches are about right for a 682-shape Fiat, but the panels don’t look rounded enough. They look quite severe and flat, and angled towards the front like the earlier shaped cab (below). That would make it quite a old Fiat even then. But this was Yugo 40 years ago so perhaps we shouldn’t be surprised! robert
Hey Robert, I go for this model, of course it could be an OM or UNIC to, but go for that it are two yougoslavians.
And don’t think that OM has sold that cab in YU ■■? only the older types I think.
Re: the two conflicting accounts of the NGC at the '76 RAI. My latest thoughts are that both accounts are probably true; and that in addition to the NGC displayed in the hall, there may have been a second NGC outside the building prepared for test drives. I know this used to happen in London. Both entered service in ERF’s demo livery and blue plastic sun-visors. Robert
tiptop495:
Hey Robert, I go for this model, of course it could be an OM or UNIC to, but go for that it are two yougoslavians.
And don’t think that OM has sold that cab in YU ■■? only the older types I think.
Eric,
That’s what I thought too, but am not sure. It looks like a double drive tractor, and that is a tilt behind it. A double drive tractor with a yellow cab and a red bumper, pulling a tilt in Hungary or Yugoslavia? Could it be an NG, or even the later, NG-cabbed FAP?
I found this: youtube.com/watch?v=ghWMW25sXOU
It is a superb film. Time to start a new thread, to prevent the NGC becoming overwhelmed by East Europeans.
You may remember a while back when i posted the pics of the Cauvas 4x2 unit before its conversion that my
contact had mentioned that P.Brame also operated a 4x2 unit. (Number 77 on the register)
I now have finally tracked it down,parked in P.Brame’s yard. Unfortunately i cannot read the number plate,
however further investigations are on going.
I would imagine that the picture was taken in Winter as i note the front grill cover. I wonder if that
was a factory option or something they had made up as i have not seen one before ?
tiptop495:
Hey Robert, I go for this model, of course it could be an OM or UNIC to, but go for that it are two yougoslavians.
And don’t think that OM has sold that cab in YU ■■? only the older types I think.
Eric,
That’s what I thought too, but am not sure. It looks like a double drive tractor, and that is a tilt behind it. A double drive tractor with a yellow cab and a red bumper, pulling a tilt in Hungary or Yugoslavia? Could it be an NG, or even the later, NG-cabbed FAP?
I found this: youtube.com/watch?v=ghWMW25sXOU
It is a superb film. Time to start a new thread, to prevent the NGC becoming overwhelmed by East Europeans.
Great footage - and so typical of the kind of film-loop that used to run on exhibitors’ stands at motor shows.
Thoughtful of you to start a new thread! I will contribute to it forthwith! Robert
DEANB:
You may remember a while back when i posted the pics of the Cauvas 4x2 unit before its conversion that my
contact had mentioned that P.Brame also operated a 4x2 unit. (Number 77 on the register)
I now have finally tracked it down,parked in P.Brame’s yard. Unfortunately i cannot read the number plate,
however further investigations are on going.
I would imagine that the picture was taken in Winter as i note the front grill cover. I wonder if that
was a factory option or something they had made up as i have not seen one before ?
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A fantastic find, Dean; not least because it gives credence to one of our ‘rumoured’ NGCs! Another French one in the bag, then. Almost choked on my pop-corn! Look forward to a reg no if it materialises. The only other example of NGC radiator shuttering that I can think of is Cees Willemstein’s unit. On the other hand it might have been heading for an exhibition and the front hoarding was about to be given a poster! Robert
History proceeds with rapidity on this thread ^^^^!! It’s taken centuries for Sky news to discover today that Jesus wasn’t born on the 25th December (Pope Gregory could have told us that centuries ago when he hijacked the winter solstice!); yet it has only taken DEANB a few pages to run the Brame P unit to earth .
On the subject of the RAI, Best Trucks Import, in conjunction with ERF, must have produced a brochure, a leaflet, or at least a single-page hand-out for the '76 RAI show. That might give more of a clue as to whether or not a 2nd NGC was present. Robert
Just been talking to the chap that took this photo it was taken in herblay near Paris in 1974.
He used to see it regularly carry bags of cement,but does not know the company name.
DEANB:
Just been talking to the chap that took this photo it was taken in herblay near Paris in 1974.
He used to see it regularly carry bags of cement,but does not know the company name.
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Good! We getting details filled in here. And I know you realise that we already have a reg number for this unit, as we have another pic (back on the thread). Robert
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