Had a cpc course today, 1 example shown which involves driving in a 24 hour day, and how it can be “illegal” was, start 6am 4.5 hrs drive, 45 min break then 4.5 hrs drive, finish 15:45 then take 11 off then start again at 02:45 and drive 3 and a quite hours till 6 am which would involve 12 and a quarter hours driving in a 24 hour period.
I pointed out to him that it was incorrect, he replied that a friend had got done for doing this, I said that was not possible as a 24 hour tacho day doesn’t always last 24 hours, it can be as short as 18 hours and the only way his friend got done for it is if he took a 9 hour break when he could only take 11 off or he took slightly less than 11 hours off, which is the only way you can be done for exceeding the maximum driving hours in a 24 hour period, unless they went over 9/10 hours driving before their daily rest, I have also had to explain how this 24 hour day works to other drivers who may have interpreted the rule wrong or have been told wrongly by another cpc trainer.
He wasn’t convinced by my explanation of the 24 hour period, or when I said you can do 6 x 15 hour shifts in a week.
Has any one else come across this one on a course?
Did you tell the trainer they were mixing up EU with UK domestic rules 
Be good to know where and who you did this course with
And you went to this course thinking you were going to learn something, that’s a mistake
You paid to sit there and don’t open your mouth, if you don’t realise that and you already know more than him then you were in the wrong class, they are pen pussers that’s all nothing more
ROG:
Did you tell the trainer they were mixing up EU with UK domestic rulesBe good to know where and who you did this course with
I didn’t as I don’t know anything about domestic rules, I won’t reveal that, as I have another 4 to do with the same place, but I will inform him that it relates to domestic only as the rest of the course was ok.
Don’t they have to present these courses to JAUPT to get them approved, if so they missed it which is more worrying.
Bigtruck3:
And you went to this course thinking you were going to learn something, that’s a mistake
You paid to sit there and don’t open your mouth, if you don’t realise that and you already know more than him then you were in the wrong class, they are pen pussers that’s all nothing more
You have a point but it probably happens in loads of courses all over the country.
Technically I paid to attend only, if I could of got comfy I would of had a kip as I have done in the past on at least 1 course, and yes I was snoring…
weeto:
Bigtruck3:
And you went to this course thinking you were going to learn something, that’s a mistake
You paid to sit there and don’t open your mouth, if you don’t realise that and you already know more than him then you were in the wrong class, they are pen pussers that’s all nothing moreYou have a point but it probably happens in loads of courses all over the country.
Technically I paid to attend only, if I could of got comfy I would of had a kip as I have done in the past on at least 1 course, and yes I was snoring…
Dead right Weeto, sitting there quietly is simply endorsing their incompetent b.s.
As you said there is absolutely no restriction as he alludes to on how many hours you can drive in 24 hrs.
I would quietly advise him of this again and if he doesn’t respect your helpful input then I would harass him plenty or snore my way through too.
However it amazes me on the courses I’ve been on how few of the others have any interest whatsoever in Tacho regs as they are mostly outside of it or it will never add up to a hill of beans in their average day.
You failed the CPC attitude test - you should sit there and be quite.
Fun fact and true story. I had to endure 3 days of this rubbish as an induction. So I was going to be paid and I was going to get my CPC hours added. I mouthed off so much and upset the trainers enough that I still got paid, but was sacked immediately (not bothered) and didn’t get my hours added.
My big massive argument was with a bully ex wo2 who I wasn’t having shouting at my telling me to shut my mouth. I did my bit in the army. And I know these types. So I ended up raising my voice back and putting him straight. He didn’t like not having his bit of power. Sad thing is he knows deep down no one really cares what he has to say anymore.
Someone will know who I’m referring to here… They like to point out the CPC was introduced becuase of a fire in a bridge somehwere in euroland (who cares?). What has that got to do with me learning about how the extra injector to reduce emisions?
What I witnessed from the others on the course was shocking. I’m not tip top on my drivers hours as I don’t really care about WTD. But most of the blokes really struggled with the concept of 15/30 breaks. Ridiculous system. Favourite quote from fat CPC bully was ‘the CPC means you are professionals, nurses are not professional as they don’t have a CPC’.
If getting paid by your employer, ask for written proof of the trainers example, if no proof, nod and carry on.
If paying for the course with your own money, demand proof and if it’s not forthcoming, demand a refund and report training company to JAUPT.
Or do what everyone else does just crack on and accept the DCPC is flawed.
Going by your first paragraph o/p, I would have been sat half asleep mind wandering to even know wtf he was on about by the time he finished his first sentence to start his second one. 
(And before anybody jumps in, starting with the words ''And that is why you etc etc ‘’, 
…I virtually never get any tacho infringements.)
JAUPT do not approve the CONTENT of a course
They would have to be experts in all the subjects if they did that
Instead of arguing 15 hours this 15 hours that you should ask why in 2020 is 15 hours is legal ■■? 
sammym:
‘the CPC means you are professionals, nurses are not professional as they don’t have a CPC’.
Nurses need a degree and all the debt that gets them in, have a stressful job with long hours and get fairly badly paid.
The bit you should have pointed out to bully boy is that they have to do 35 hours ‘continued professional development’ over a time period to keep their validation with the nurse and midwifery council or whatever it’s called.
fuse:
Instead of arguing 15 hours this 15 hours that you should ask why in 2020 is 15 hours is legal ■■?
Yep,.and also why in many cases it is not only legal but expected,.and what correlation there is with it with health and safety exactly, when it is legal to do another after only 9 hours rest, and repeat the process the next shifts.
Jimmy McNulty:
sammym:
‘the CPC means you are professionals, nurses are not professional as they don’t have a CPC’.Nurses need a degree and all the debt that gets them in, have a stressful job with long hours and get fairly badly paid.
The bit you should have pointed out to bully boy is that they have to do 35 hours ‘continued professional development’ over a time period to keep their validation with the nurse and midwifery council or whatever it’s called.
Preaching to the converted here mate.
I was in the Army. I repect the job he once did. I know the pros and the cons. And I know his mentality. He was a knobber and I knew how to spark the fire around the petrol. My shame and bad for antagonising him.
My partner works in the medical field (not as a nurse) and she has to do real CPD (continual pro development). So I know that a Nurse does more than a junior Doc and also keeps the NHS running.
I told him straight he was talking silly. I wasn’t in the right place at the right time to tell the truth. So I lose out. For me I was delighted as it showed me how the firm worked. I’d already decided that I wouldn’t dream of working there. So it was a win win for me. But for a bloke who needs a job… Keeping you mouth shut is better than anything.
fuse:
Instead of arguing 15 hours this 15 hours that you should ask why in 2020 is 15 hours is legal ■■?
It ain’t the DCPC instructors that make the rules. They may not agree with it either but …Remember most of them are lorry drivers or ex lorry drivers.
Sadly from my experience of doing 70 hours of DCPC courses is that generally the instructors are poor, (Just because you can drive a truck doesn’t mean you have the skills to impart that information to a group of people) the course content is poor, (much seems to be regurgitated from the Transport Managers CPC, but not changed make it work from a Drivers view point), the whole thing is really a box ticking exercise. It could have been so much better, (but nobody wants that, Government, Industry or Drivers)
So for the next 35 hours, I’ll sit in the classroom, keep quiet, tick the box get the card.
Who said that they can drive a truck? They may or may not have a vocational licence, you don’t need one to be a DCPC presenter. I wont be doing any more as I will retire this time.
alamcculloch:
Who said that they can drive a truck? They may or may not have a vocational licence, you don’t need one to be a DCPC presenter. I wont be doing any more as I will retire this time.
I was referring to the many DCPC instructors I’ve met who are quick to tell you they have driven trucks, but are godam awful at being instructors.
muckles:
Sadly from my experience of doing 70 hours of DCPC courses is that generally the instructors are poor, (Just because you can drive a truck doesn’t mean you have the skills to impart that information to a group of people) the course content is poor, (much seems to be regurgitated from the Transport Managers CPC, but not changed make it work from a Drivers view point), the whole thing is really a box ticking exercise. It could have been so much better, (but nobody wants that, Government, Industry or Drivers)
So for the next 35 hours, I’ll sit in the classroom, keep quiet, tick the box get the card.
Yep, you are quite correct muckles. Most I would imagine are not trained to instruct or deliver a lesson in a classroom hence all the poor courses.
It’s exactly the same as a lorry driver trying to teach another lorry driver without any proper instuctional techniques. It very rarely works.
There are some excellent DCPC Instructors though and I was lucky enough to get one during my one and only DCPC course.
Still reckon an awful lot depends on the attitude of the drivers attending the course. (reading on here…appalling)
jakethesnake:
muckles:
Sadly from my experience of doing 70 hours of DCPC courses is that generally the instructors are poor, (Just because you can drive a truck doesn’t mean you have the skills to impart that information to a group of people) the course content is poor, (much seems to be regurgitated from the Transport Managers CPC, but not changed make it work from a Drivers view point), the whole thing is really a box ticking exercise. It could have been so much better, (but nobody wants that, Government, Industry or Drivers)
So for the next 35 hours, I’ll sit in the classroom, keep quiet, tick the box get the card.Yep, you are quite correct muckles. Most I would imagine are not trained to instruct or deliver a lesson in a classroom hence all the poor courses.
It’s exactly the same as a lorry driver trying to teach another lorry driver without any proper instuctional techniques. It very rarely works.
There are some excellent DCPC Instructors though and I was lucky enough to get one during my one and only DCPC course.
Still reckon an awful lot depends on the attitude of the drivers attending the course. (reading on here…appalling)
Having done many courses in my time, some haulage related, some not, I can say the instructor can make a difference between and engaged group and an uninterested group, this includes drivers, even if many don’t want to be there.
One of those times was doing my ADR many years ago, the first instructor no doubt had a really good knowledge of the subject, but his delivery of it was so dry and boring most lost interest, the instructor who came in for the last day was different, he knew how to engage his audience, made it much more of a 2 way process, without letting the one, been there done that driver, tell yet another story and bore the rest of us.