Juddian:
I haven’t fully investigated it, but i believe LPG conversions on Diesels are completely different to petrol conversions, certainly in car and van world.
The vehicle still runs on Diesel so keeping it compression ignition, but less than normal and the extra made up with LPG.
Course i could be waffling out me arse as usual.
Totally ■■■■■■ pointless directing this to any other blinkered member on here so I reply to you … The Foden I drove (of which there were a few at our depot) fired up and ran on diesel until operating temps were reached then they switched to LPG if I remember correctly. I am not a scientist like our ‘font of all knowledge’ so can only go by what I was told by the bods in the workshop but have no reason to disbelieve them, and I know we had to fill up at ■■■■■■■■■■■ not that it makes one iota of difference to whether they were successful or not cos like I said I aint no scientist unlike some. Maybe the Co-op was involved in an experiment to determine their worth but I don’t know that either.
Juddian you’ve just become the middle man between Captain Pugwash and Captain hogwash
‘‘I haven’t fully investigated it, but i believe’’
Do you blame me as the above seems to me like the voice of reason whereas the ‘font’ states I have said it so therefore it must be …
Don’t take a lot of working out surely ?
raymundo:
Juddian:
I haven’t fully investigated it, but i believe LPG conversions on Diesels are completely different to petrol conversions, certainly in car and van world.
The vehicle still runs on Diesel so keeping it compression ignition, but less than normal and the extra made up with LPG.
Course i could be waffling out me arse as usual.
Totally [zb] pointless directing this to any other blinkered member on here so I reply to you … The Foden I drove (of which there were a few at our depot) fired up and ran on diesel until operating temps were reached then they switched to LPG if I remember correctly. I am not a scientist like our ‘font of all knowledge’ so can only go by what I was told by the bods in the workshop but have no reason to disbelieve them, and I know we had to fill up at ■■■■■■■■■■■ not that it makes one iota of difference to whether they were successful or not cos like I said I aint no scientist unlike some. Maybe the Co-op was involved in an experiment to determine their worth but I don’t know that either.
Mustardmit, i’d like to know more about how it worked, whether the vehicle still used some Diesel to provide the ignition then LPG to provide the burn and when in the cycle was the LPG added with the Diesel after or before, mustaph bin bloody complicated setting up and the only real saving being fuel tax, unless companies trialling these things get other tax breaks.
It’s never taken off so can’t be cost effective.
I have an interest because we own a couple of LPG cars, petrol engined so ordinary conversions, i had heard that Diesels could be converted but even the converters say its hardly worth doing due to it not being possible to run solely on gas.
Seeing how fragile and temperamental modern Diesels can be with all the emission ■■■■■■■■ helping enormously 
, and a bloody living nightmare when they go wrong, it’s not something i’d be considering doing to my own Diesel.
Juddian:
raymundo:
Juddian:
I haven’t fully investigated it, but i believe LPG conversions on Diesels are completely different to petrol conversions, certainly in car and van world.
The vehicle still runs on Diesel so keeping it compression ignition, but less than normal and the extra made up with LPG.
Course i could be waffling out me arse as usual.
Totally [zb] pointless directing this to any other blinkered member on here so I reply to you … The Foden I drove (of which there were a few at our depot) fired up and ran on diesel until operating temps were reached then they switched to LPG if I remember correctly. I am not a scientist like our ‘font of all knowledge’ so can only go by what I was told by the bods in the workshop but have no reason to disbelieve them, and I know we had to fill up at ■■■■■■■■■■■ not that it makes one iota of difference to whether they were successful or not cos like I said I aint no scientist unlike some. Maybe the Co-op was involved in an experiment to determine their worth but I don’t know that either.
Mustardmit, i’d like to know more about how it worked, whether the vehicle still used some Diesel to provide the ignition then LPG to provide the burn and when in the cycle was the LPG added with the Diesel after or before, mustaph bin bloody complicated setting up and the only real saving being fuel tax, unless companies trialling these things get other tax breaks.
It’s never taken off so can’t be cost effective.
I have an interest because we own a couple of LPG cars, petrol engined so ordinary conversions, i had heard that Diesels could be converted but even the converters say its hardly worth doing due to it not being possible to run solely on gas.
Seeing how fragile and temperamental modern Diesels can be with all the emission ■■■■■■■■ helping enormously , and a bloody living nightmare when they go wrong, it’s not something i’d be considering doing to my own Diesel.
kittylitter and ribena seems to work well enough over here without complicating things…and if we didnt have carryfasts waffling posts,you could read through al of trucknet in 5 mins…they pass the time untill your eyes start to cross so you just skip to the next one…seems fair enough to me…we al post pish from time to time…and at least he is consistent?? 
raymundo:
Juddian:
I haven’t fully investigated it, but i believe LPG conversions on Diesels are completely different to petrol conversions, certainly in car and van world.
The vehicle still runs on Diesel so keeping it compression ignition, but less than normal and the extra made up with LPG.
Course i could be waffling out me arse as usual.
Totally [zb] pointless directing this to any other blinkered member on here so I reply to you … The Foden I drove (of which there were a few at our depot) fired up and ran on diesel until operating temps were reached then they switched to LPG if I remember correctly. I am not a scientist like our ‘font of all knowledge’ so can only go by what I was told by the bods in the workshop but have no reason to disbelieve them, and I know we had to fill up at ■■■■■■■■■■■ not that it makes one iota of difference to whether they were successful or not cos like I said I aint no scientist unlike some. Maybe the Co-op was involved in an experiment to determine their worth but I don’t know that either.
It couldn’t possibly have been running on dedicated LPG without spark ignition and a lower than CI compression ratio.Only diesel and LPG using diesel as a pilot because you can’t ignite LPG with compression ignition without blowing holes in the pistons and you can’t ignite diesel without compression ignition type compression ratios.The flaw in the diesel pilot idea being that you still obviously have to subject the LPG to diesel compression ignition type cylinder pressures to ignite the diesel first.In addition to defeating the object of using cleaner alternative fuels.Nor does it take a scientist to realise that.
Carryfast:
raymundo:
Juddian:
I haven’t fully investigated it, but i believe LPG conversions on Diesels are completely different to petrol conversions, certainly in car and van world.
The vehicle still runs on Diesel so keeping it compression ignition, but less than normal and the extra made up with LPG.
Course i could be waffling out me arse as usual.
Totally [zb] pointless directing this to any other blinkered member on here so I reply to you … The Foden I drove (of which there were a few at our depot) fired up and ran on diesel until operating temps were reached then they switched to LPG if I remember correctly. I am not a scientist like our ‘font of all knowledge’ so can only go by what I was told by the bods in the workshop but have no reason to disbelieve them, and I know we had to fill up at ■■■■■■■■■■■ not that it makes one iota of difference to whether they were successful or not cos like I said I aint no scientist unlike some. Maybe the Co-op was involved in an experiment to determine their worth but I don’t know that either.
It couldn’t possibly have been running on dedicated LPG without either spark ignition.Only diesel and LPG using diesel as a pilot because you can’t ignite LPG with compression ignition without blowing holes in the pistons and you can’t ignite diesel without compression ignition type compression ratios.The flaw in the diesel pilot idea being that you still obviously have to subject the LPG to diesel compression ignition type cylinder pressures to ignite the diesel first.In addition to defeating the object of using cleaner alternative fuels.Nor does it take a scientist to realise that.
Right on the tick, Capn Hogwash fresh from sailing the seas in the jagwaaar
Juddian:
raymundo:
Juddian:
I haven’t fully investigated it, but i believe LPG conversions on Diesels are completely different to petrol conversions, certainly in car and van world.
The vehicle still runs on Diesel so keeping it compression ignition, but less than normal and the extra made up with LPG.
Course i could be waffling out me arse as usual.
Totally [zb] pointless directing this to any other blinkered member on here so I reply to you … The Foden I drove (of which there were a few at our depot) fired up and ran on diesel until operating temps were reached then they switched to LPG if I remember correctly. I am not a scientist like our ‘font of all knowledge’ so can only go by what I was told by the bods in the workshop but have no reason to disbelieve them, and I know we had to fill up at ■■■■■■■■■■■ not that it makes one iota of difference to whether they were successful or not cos like I said I aint no scientist unlike some. Maybe the Co-op was involved in an experiment to determine their worth but I don’t know that either.
Mustardmit, i’d like to know more about how it worked, whether the vehicle still used some Diesel to provide the ignition then LPG to provide the burn and when in the cycle was the LPG added with the Diesel after or before, mustaph bin bloody complicated setting up and the only real saving being fuel tax, unless companies trialling these things get other tax breaks.
It’s never taken off so can’t be cost effective.
I have an interest because we own a couple of LPG cars, petrol engined so ordinary conversions, i had heard that Diesels could be converted but even the converters say its hardly worth doing due to it not being possible to run solely on gas.
Seeing how fragile and temperamental modern Diesels can be with all the emission ■■■■■■■■ helping enormously , and a bloody living nightmare when they go wrong, it’s not something i’d be considering doing to my own Diesel.
There you go.Truck engine converted to dedicated LPG and what it takes to do it and for raymundo’s etc information no I didn’t need that to tell me.
papers.sae.org/2012-01-1983/
While in the case of cars might as well go for converted petrol because the correct compression ratio and spark ignition system is already there. 
Well thats bloody marvellous in Aussieland.
Now forgive me cos i’m a simple old soul, wouldn’t it have been easier to stick a bloody great petrol engine under the bonnet and just literally plug the LPG in, already the right compression ratio, already set up for spark ignition, job done in a fraction of the time and cost.
Like I said I don’t pretend to know how the gas lorry worked only that I drove it. What went on under the floor of the cab was down to the trained mechanics who I think knew what they were on about unlike a certain person who gets less things right than Bking !!
But I have done a fair bit of time on old wooden built Thames sailing barges in my ‘yoof’ but don’t pretend to know all about that either, not that any one gives a toss either way, but daresay he would try to prove me wrong on any of that as well !
I for one don’t have to admire what I have typed before and read my double post again so deleted …
Just a question. What was that duel-fuel thing seen on ERF’s years ago?..
simon1958:
Just a question. What was that duel-fuel thing seen on ERF’s years ago?..
You’re dreaming !!! It never happened cos the ‘font’ says so …
I remember some tractors were dual fuel (petrol/parafin).They had to start and stop on petrol.There are tales of car owners using this system in the days of the side valve engines, the owners couldnt pay 2 bob for a gallon of petrol when paraffin was only a tanner a gallon back then.I think that the Mayors will stop grand standing when the citizens find out how much more they have to pay for goods and services.
Juddian:
Well thats bloody marvellous in Aussieland.
Now forgive me cos i’m a simple old soul, wouldn’t it have been easier to stick a bloody great petrol engine under the bonnet and just literally plug the LPG in, already the right compression ratio, already set up for spark ignition, job done in a fraction of the time and cost.
Realistically unless you’re going for an old Hall Scott or Rolls Meteorite there isn’t much choice and the former will obviously burn loads of LPG or petrol in additon to their pathetic old tech specific power output potential and no longer being in production anyway.
As opposed to the much larger choice of availability in the right engine capacities and advances provided by more up to date diesels.Bearing in mind that even the old 14 litre and K series ■■■■■■■ are now both available in spark ignition form just not certified for road use. In view of which it’s anyone’s guess why operators and manufacturers seem to prefer the idea of going to all the aggro of cleaning up diesel exhausts.Instead of going for the much easier situation of cleaner alternative fuels.
raymundo:
simon1958:
Just a question. What was that duel-fuel thing seen on ERF’s years ago?..
You’re dreaming !!! It never happened cos the ‘font’ says so …
No what I ‘actually’ said was that you couldn’t switch between diesel ‘or’ LPG.Only diesel or diesel ‘and’ LPG. In which case the Aussies clearly did dedicated LPG first and only relatively recently.
I had an old hand start Kelvin diesel engine that you had to start on petrol then once the revs were up throw a lever to switch over to diesel but a bugger to get going unless it were warm … and if you never let the revs build up it would or could kick back and run backwards ! Fact
raymundo:
I had an old hand start Kelvin diesel engine that you had to start on petrol then once the revs were up throw a lever to switch over to diesel but a bugger to get going unless it were warm … and if you never let the revs build up it would or could kick back and run backwards ! Fact
Let me guess you also think that the petrol fuelling system all worked through the same diesel injection system without a spark plug at the same diesel compression ratio.As opposed to a switchable seperate curburation,ignition and combustion chamber system that allowed the petrol fuelling side to be shut down and increased the compression when running on diesel and vice versa.
Meanwhile science fiction is getting a bit closer to ‘fact’ in that regard but not ‘yet’. 
machinedesign.com/news/compressi … as-engines
alamcculloch:
I remember some tractors were dual fuel (petrol/parafin).They had to start and stop on petrol.There are tales of car owners using this system in the days of the side valve engines, the owners couldnt pay 2 bob for a gallon of petrol when paraffin was only a tanner a gallon back then.I think that the Mayors will stop grand standing when the citizens find out how much more they have to pay for goods and services.
And Fergusson TE 20’s on TVO. ( Tractor Vaporising Oil )… Then diesel was discovered… Bingo 
Carryfast:
Juddian:
I haven’t fully investigated it, but i believe LPG conversions on Diesels are completely different to petrol conversions, certainly in car and van world.
The vehicle still runs on Diesel so keeping it compression ignition, but less than normal and the extra made up with LPG.
Course i could be waffling out me arse as usual.
No you’re spot on.
‘But’ the really clever bit is the realisation that using diesel defeats the object of going for alternative fuel anyway and trying to use the incorrect cylinder pressure environment and timing of compression ignited diesel to ignite LPG doesn’t work properly.In which case there are people out there who have been working on that problem by converting diesels properly along the lines I described and running it on LPG on a dedicated basis.On that note I’d guess the old N14 would be a perfect candidate for such a move.
Our lot trialed a system where it used both fuels and I’m told that you needed the Derv to give it any power. The LPG was OK for cruising and holding a speed, but was hopeless when things got a bit lumpy…
Anyway, the accountants will have looked at all this and if LPG was a real alternative it would have got somewhere by now…
Which it hasn’t!