ive just started delivering sofas for harveys through an agencey.im having trouble with driver/working hours.i know the rules but putting it on paper is a different story.ive only been there two days and im struggling.my tacho’s bust and im entering my day manualy(nightmare).boss said it will be sorted.we start at 6 and dont know when we will be back.7 fininsh one night,9 the next.im over on my hours already for the two days.im confused and worried im gonna get in trouble.ive been told this ■■■■ is really serious.ive even been told you shouldnt drive past your hours even to get home.but what choice do u have!? my question is will the company watch my hours and any mistakes on my tachograph and bring it to my attention? oh and…if i did get done by vosa would they take into account im a new driver and dont know what the [zb] im doing? thanks for reading this and any replies.
ten4rubberduckie:
i know the rules but putting it on paper is a different story.ive only been there two days and im struggling.my tacho’s bust and im entering my day manualy(nightmare).boss said it will be sorted
Is the broken tacho a digi or analogue ?
How are you doing the manual enties - back of analogue chart or manual input into digi ?
ten4rubberduckie:
we start at 6 and dont know when we will be back.7 fininsh one night,9 the next
11 then 9 hours daily rest uses up one of your 3 reduced ones.
ten4rubberduckie:
ive even been told you shouldnt drive past your hours even to get home.but what choice do u have!?
STOP and do a night out - if no suitable sleeping in cab then the boss must pay for digs - simple 
ten4rubberduckie:
if i did get done by vosa would they take into account im a new driver and dont know what the [zb] im doing?
NO - you are supposed to know the law and stick to it.
ten4rubberduckie:
im over on my hours already for the two days
In what way ?
I like examples of what you are doing in order to help you such as…
Sat & Sun off
Mon 0600 - 1900
tue 0600 - 2100
Wed 0600 - 2000
etc etc
It seems that you are out of your depth here and you would be well advised to pay for professional Tachograph instruction.£50 spent know is a wise investment,better that than have a history of VOSA prosecutions.All Harvey’s are interested in is getting suites out before Xmas eve.You might get a week in January collecting the rubbish that you delivered to keep the customers happy.Someone with more experience would not have stood for Harvey’s attitude and it is up to you to recognise these situations and make sure that you are not compromised.Ignorance,you will find,is no excuse.
Deathstar:
Ignorance,you will find,is no excuse.
Or fined 
i dont understand why you would take a job where you do not understand the laws to me driving hours are not that complicated 4 and a half hours driving then a brak of 45 mins however this break can be broken down into 2 but after 4 and a half hours a break must be for 30 mins for example
2 and a half hours driving 15 min break 2 hours driving half an hour
Daily driving limits are 9 hours which on two days a week maybe extended to 10 hours
Daily rest must be 11 hours but can be reduced to 9 hours three times a week
Weekly rest must be 45 hours ie the weekend or can be reduced down to 24 hours however this must be repayed so basically to make it easier take 2 days are week off in block preffered ie weekend
over a two week period you are allowed to drive no more than 90 hours a week so if you do 56 one week then your only allowed to do 34 the following week
Remember these are driving regulatations and do not apply to loading or unloading which should be recorded as other work.
I really would read up on this because as far as the law is concerned your driving hours are your responsabilty and you will be the one suffering if you break the law, your employer has the resonsabitly to give you work that you are able to carry out legally i think they will also be fined but its your licence that will suffer and as you are driving for a living you know what im saying
if you search google for ec driving hour regulations and if you cant get your head round that i would suggest you pay for training like rog suggests 50 quid is a lot less than the fine vosa would give you.
Im not slaging you just cant understand why you would take a job when not knowing the correct legislation could cost you soooooo much
Big Brummie Macca:
if you search google for ec driving hour regulations and if you cant get your head round that i would suggest you pay for training like rog suggests 50 quid is a lot less than the fine vosa would give you.
I did not suggest that paying for training but would recommend it if all else fails
Deathstar:
you would be well advised to pay for professional Tachograph instruction.£50 spent know is a wise investment,better that than have a history of VOSA prosecutions
The first suggestion is a good one - a good read of the regs
Here are 2 links for you…
EU DRIVER REGS
VOSA DRIVER REGS
If you do have any queries on the regs then coffeeholic or tachograph or geebee45 are the site GURUs and are probably the best members to help you and they answer most of these queries in the Forum for questions on drivers hours
ten4rubberduckie:
ive just started delivering sofas for harveys through an agencey.im having trouble with driver/working hours.i know the rules but putting it on paper is a different story.ive only been there two days and im struggling.my tacho’s bust and im entering my day manualy(nightmare).boss said it will be sorted.
I’m guessing the tachograph was broken when you got there and have to question why you would take a vehicle out with no working tachograph 
The regulations require that a faulty tachograph should be fixed as soon as possible, if the tachograph becomes faulty whilst on the road and you can’t get back to base within a week then the tachograph should be fixed on route.
The drivers hours are not the only thing you need to worry about mate, it looks to me as if the company are taking advantage of your obvious lack of experience and knowledge and putting themselves and you in a very precarious position in doing so.
If the tachograph is broken then defect the vehicle, you shouldn’t be driving the thing with no tachograph
As far as the hours are concerned, what do you mean you’re over the hours for the two days, do you mean your over the daily driving hours hours or are you not having the proper breaks, if you start at 06:00 and the latest you’ve worked in the two days is 21:00 then you certainly haven’t failed to have the required daily rest.
If you can’t get back to base in your hours then you should stop and have a night out.
Ignore what ROG has said about the company must pay for digs, there’s no such law or regulation but they should pay night out money which is probably what ROG meant, they are however required to plan the journey in such a way as not to encourage the driver to break the law.
If you do continue to drive the vehicle ask you boss what night out money they pay when you can’t get back to base, if the answer is that they don’t pay night out money then simply make sure you get back within your hours and comply with the break requirements even if it means not doing all the deliveries.
As ROG asked is the tachograph analogue or digital ?
Good luck
tachograph:
Ignore what ROG has said about the company must pay for digs, there’s no such law or regulation but they should pay night out money which is probably what ROG meant, they are however required to plan the journey in such a way as not to encourage the driver to break the law.
So who is RESPONSIBLE for the cost of the digs if the driver CANNOT for whatever reason make it LEGALLY back to base ?
ROG:
tachograph:
Ignore what ROG has said about the company must pay for digs, there’s no such law or regulation but they should pay night out money which is probably what ROG meant, they are however required to plan the journey in such a way as not to encourage the driver to break the law.So who is RESPONSIBLE for the cost of the digs if the driver CANNOT for whatever reason make it LEGALLY back to base ?
There’s no legal requirement that I know of that requires a company to pay night out money of pay for digs, it’s up-to the driver to sort these things out before starting the job.
As we all know all companies where drivers are expected to stay out at night do pay night out money or pay for digs or both otherwise no-one would drive for them, but as far as I’m aware there is no legal requirement for them to do so.
Hi mate, I find alot of Small companys try and add pressure on drivers and more so in this present climate… My worry is that these companys dont give a hoot about there drivers and if you get stopped or are involved in a prang ( touch wood your not } and VOSA look at your working hours If you brake them its always the driver who gets it in the neck.
Dont ever feel pressured into breaking the Law a company can afford a fine, can you??
That includeds taking Motors not fit for the road
Cheers
Daz
I know what you are up against in the real world.Your boss just wants his stock shifted no more no less. If you cant do the job you will be told that the agencies are full of drivers who can.As you will be out the door after Christmas I think you should quit and keep your licence clean.This is very important for a newbie without much experience.
down load this pdf
VOSA EC Drivers Hours guide
from here
http://www.dft.gov.uk/vosa/publications/leafletsandposters/drivershoursandtachographleaflets.htm
print it out, read it till u understand it dont worry about aetr or domestic ruels just yet concentrate on eu regs and carry it with you so that if u have a problem with any thing to do with ours and your boss says hes right and ur wrong u can put him straight if he still wont listen get out of there quick
farmer:
down load this pdfVOSA DRIVER REGS
from herehttp://www.dft.gov.uk/vosa/publications/leafletsandposters/drivershoursandtachographleaflets.htm
print it out, read it till u understand it dont worry about aetr or domestic ruels just yet concentrate on eu regs and carry it with you so that if u have a problem with any thing to do with ours and your boss says hes right and ur wrong u can put him straight if he still wont listen get out of there quick
ROG:
The first suggestion is a good one - a good read of the regs
Here are 2 links for you…
EU DRIVER REGS
VOSA DRIVER REGS
The EU regs link is the law for EU regs
The VOSA link is a GUIDE to that EU law and also includes the domestic UK regs
yeah i know rog but the link i posted is direct to vosas web site and also contains domestic and aetr rule but seein as how ten4rubberduckie is only doings work that comes under eu regs at the moment its all he has to worry about
and he can always bone up on aetr and domestic regs later if need be
farmer:
yeah i know rog but the link i posted is direct to vosas web site and also contains domestic and aetr rule but seein as how ten4rubberduckie is only doings work that comes under eu regs at the moment its all he has to worry about
In which case the EU regs link would be his best bet as the VOSA one is only a GUIDE to the regs
ps forgot to say that vosa publication GV262-2 is also vosas INTERPRITATION [sp] of the EU rules and regs
and as a result is what vosa want you to stick to
i however is not saying their interpritation is right but hey ho it the one they want us to stick too
pps i was typing this as you replied rog
sorry rog is was the post before me that mentioned training and as far as i am aware if you are required to take a night out the company must provide suitable sleeping arrangements im not to sure about them having to pay you for having a night out but am pretty sure that if no bed in the cab they must provide digs or give you the money back if you have had to pay for your own, myself personally i would ask about what happens if you cant get back within legal hours and if the answer is not suffice bring the load back and explain why you have and you will not risk having to pay heavy fines for them
Given that you are delivering furniture you will have a second man with you,does he share the driving with you ? There are rules regarding double manning that you should be aware of.I am not familiar with them myself but they do exist.
It doesn’t seem the driver is over on his hours from the information he gave, start at 6 finish at 1900, start at 6 finish at 2100, seems like a normal day in haulage. I doubt the driver is over on his driving hours either. how many 3 piece suites or beds can you get on a truck?
You may be wise to keep an eye on your breaks, and maybe you will be tight on WTD.
Start at 6, have a cup of tea at snap time, have a fish and chip at lunch, you wont be far away, then make sure you grab a coffee before yo go home, simple…
oh and get the tacho fixed
Once the vehicle returns to base the tacho must be rectified, somebody has already posted that if your away there is a time limit to repair i maybe wrong but i refused to take a tractor unit out from base with a faulty tacho and had no come backs took it to scania they backed me up it shouldn’t leave if its defective so dont be frightened to tell them