Coolrider:
No I watched an interview with the leader of the BMA today and when asked if emergency care would be covered they said no as it will be a full withdrawal of their labour!
You couldn’t make this hypocritical zb up.The government is running a second rate system if not continuously slashing health cover in real terms by closing wards and withdrawing services and closing A and E departments and ripping off staff and you blame the doctors for drawing a line and saying no more.
If they temporarily have to put patients at risk to improve that situation.At least that’s better than allowing the government to permanently keep on putting patients at risk.On a continuous basis of cost cutting to save big business paying the incomes and therefore tax revenues needed to pay for decent health provision.
Every organisation is suffering cuts, armed forces, police, fire service, ambulance service, councils, education and so on. So the answer is what? All of these to go on strike?
With reference to your quote about it will be worth putting patients at risk temporarily to improve the situation then that’s fine by me. But they can do it with your family and not mine.
Incidentally the salary of a junior doctor is a lot more than all the professions I’ve mentioned above!
A doctor is also at university 3 plus years longer to get to be a junior one. A gp can be there 4 plus years longer. Also the police don’t work the long hours, teachers get 14 weeks off plus weekends. (My girlfriend is one) the army I believe should be on a better wage for putting there life’s on the line so we can sleep at night. ( that’s not the truckers that sleep in lay-bys) And the firemen should be allowed to retire at 55/60. I believe the government should clamp down on the bankers with a W n put this country back in order!!!
the maoster:
Since the 80’s the Government no matter which party has ridden roughshod over the working classes and treated them with contempt. Terms and conditions that had been fought for over many decades were suddenly taken away and replaced with zero hours contracts and job INsecurity.
This strike is because the posh Eton boys have decided to impose a new contract on the doctors, no consultation, no sitting around a table, just simply telling them that they’ll from now on work more for less.
I don’t believe in striking for striking so sake but do believe passionately that standing united shoulder to shoulder will hammer home the message that enough is enough and I for one wish the doctors all the very best in this matter.
our maggies fault. she did well to send us to the Falklands and that was it! Smashed the unions and strikes! FAIR PLAY TO THEM I SAY! Plus 4
the maoster:
Since the 80’s the Government no matter which party has ridden roughshod over the working classes and treated them with contempt. Terms and conditions that had been fought for over many decades were suddenly taken away and replaced with zero hours contracts and job INsecurity.
This strike is because the posh Eton boys have decided to impose a new contract on the doctors, no consultation, no sitting around a table, just simply telling them that they’ll from now on work more for less.
I don’t believe in striking for striking so sake but do believe passionately that standing united shoulder to shoulder will hammer home the message that enough is enough and I for one wish the doctors all the very best in this matter.
+3.
as always Maoster you’ve whacked that nail right on the bonce, call a doctor, quick…oh wait
Carryfast:
You couldn’t make this hypocritical zb up.The government is running a second rate system if not continuously slashing health cover in real terms by closing wards and withdrawing services and closing A and E departments and ripping off staff and you blame the doctors for drawing a line and saying no more.
If they temporarily have to put patients at risk to improve that situation.At least that’s better than allowing the government to permanently keep on putting patients at risk.On a continuous basis of cost cutting to save big business paying the incomes and therefore tax revenues needed to pay for decent health provision.
Every organisation is suffering cuts, armed forces, police, fire service, ambulance service, councils, education and so on. So the answer is what? All of these to go on strike?
With reference to your quote about it will be worth putting patients at risk temporarily to improve the situation then that’s fine by me. But they can do it with your family and not mine.
Incidentally the salary of a junior doctor is a lot more than all the professions I’ve mentioned above!
Firstly the answer to cuts in public services and defence is obviously doing something about the race to the bottom economics that are causing it all.IE big business giving UK jobs to cheap labour countries,avoiding taxes and paying what people we’ve got left working peanuts including importing cheap immigrant labour.Resulting in obviously peanuts being available for the tax revenues needed to pay for it all.Together with the lose lose situation of artificially increased demand for the services in question.
On that note the doctors deciding to do something about cut backs in the their own field,just like the Fire Brigades unions,can only help on the basis of the lesser of two evils rather than leaving things to go on as they are.In which case why are you blaming the doctors for that situation and not the government.
As for the Police they maybe should have thought about all the implications when they helped Thatcher to defeat the unions thereby starting the race to the bottom economics which are causing it all.
As for the army they join up to defend the country.What’s the point when the country’s interests are being handed over to the Chinese cheap labour and their big business allies selling us out to take advantage of it.While China uses the money to build up its military power the obvious question then being for use against who.While at best that squaddie’s family are as dependent on the resulting economically crippled NHS as everyone else’s.
Meanwhile all the government has to offer is more of the same hypocritical bs of causing the problems in the NHS and then blaming the workforce for it.
A very good explanation of the problem but youve still not answered the question of what’s the solution.
Yes you are right the fire brigade did try to change it by striking. Did it work and make any difference?
So did the teachers. Again did it work?
Do you honestly think that doctors striking will make a difference?
If you read my first post I did say that I support any workers standing up for their rights and conditions but nothing justifies putting people’s life’s at risk, ever!
Some of you on here have commented on Robroys post where the stobart driver has frightened the life out of his daughter by driving up her arse. You’ve , quite rightly by the way condemned the driver for his dangerous driving and showed your outrage.
However your quite happy for thousands of junior doctors to put the lives at risk of people by simply walking away for a week every month and totally withdraw!
We are all in agreement that public services are being stripped back to a level that’s becoming dangerous. I’ve got mates in the army, police force and a paramedic so I hear how bad things are from their first hand accounts but striking won’t achieve anything.
Some of you have also stated the NHS cuts and more pressure on staff has been happening for years. Yet the junior doctors who are taking this action still decided to sign up for the job knowing what was happening! Why?
My main point is this I’m a father, I have a wife, parents etc. their safety to me is my priority and should they need it, hope they don’t, but should they need hospital care I would hate for them to be admitted when all the junior doctors are on strike!
I’m dam sure 99% of truck net members would feel exactly the same on my last point even if you don’t agree with anything else I’ve said!!
Coolrider:
A very good explanation of the problem but youve still not answered the question of what’s the solution.
Yes you are right the fire brigade did try to change it by striking. Did it work and make any difference?
So did the teachers. Again did it work?
Do you honestly think that doctors striking will make a difference?
If you read my first post I did say that I support any workers standing up for their rights and conditions but nothing justifies putting people’s life’s at risk, ever!
Some of you on here have commented on Robroys post where the stobart driver has frightened the life out of his daughter by driving up her arse. You’ve , quite rightly by the way condemned the driver for his dangerous driving and showed your outrage.
However your quite happy for thousands of junior doctors to put the lives at risk of people by simply walking away for a week every month and totally withdraw!
We are all in agreement that public services are being stripped back to a level that’s becoming dangerous. I’ve got mates in the army, police force and a paramedic so I hear how bad things are from their first hand accounts but striking won’t achieve anything.
Some of you have also stated the NHS cuts and more pressure on staff has been happening for years. Yet the junior doctors who are taking this action still decided to sign up for the job knowing what was happening! Why?
My main point is this I’m a father, I have a wife, parents etc. their safety to me is my priority and should they need it, hope they don’t, but should they need hospital care I would hate for them to be admitted when all the junior doctors are on strike!
I’m dam sure 99% of truck net members would feel exactly the same on my last point even if you don’t agree with anything else I’ve said!!
As I said why are you selectively only bothered about strike action potentially putting lives at relatively smaller risk in the hope of possibly changing the government’s direction.As opposed to the larger risk of the doctors doing nothing thereby if/when the times comes you’ll be faced with either a potentially fatal wait for a qualified doctor.Or an accident caused by an over worked tired doctor.Or a closed A and E department or ward.Or other cut back in services.
All because the government doesn’t want to pay for a decent health service. Resulting in not enough doctors to meet the workload and tired under paid disillusioned doctors walking away to work in other countries like Canada or New Zealand etc.I’d have thought you’d view strike action as the preferable alternative in that case.
The basic problem which seems to have escaped that lunatic Hunt (and I’d really like to punch the smarmy grinning ******** lights out), is that if you are going to extend the NHS operations to seven days a week then you need more doctors, nurses etc. But we haven’t even got enough for five days ffs.
Having been involved by having family working in the medical services I do understand their frustration in getting what they want but let’s be honest it’s not like they Don’t know what their getting into.
Also how many that have been trained go on to stay in this country and more importantly stay in the health / medical service as a fair few turn direction and do something totally different
The practice of forcing government employees to take unwanted contracts should be banned.its not fair and is bully boy tactics
Ex council employee !These managers are nothing more than self serving a holes
Good luck to the doctors …
we live in a democratic society that says, if you do not like what is being imposed on you, you have the right to withdraw your labour, if people do not like the idea of doctors standing up for what they (and they all seem to agree)believe to be their worth then the objectors should retrain as doctors, drivers in particular cannot even agree whether we ■■■■ inside or over the pan so who are we to judge
Albert1:
The practice of forcing government employees to take unwanted contracts should be banned.its not fair and is bully boy tactics
Ex council employee !These managers are nothing more than self serving a holes
Good luck to the doctors …
and this is why they DO NOT GET THE IRONY OF IT ALL! thick managers, who couldn’t MANAGE to run a bath on THEIR own. fair play to the doctors! Not falling for governmint SPIN.
There’s no problem in Wales, Scotland or Northern Ireland. Why is that? Of course, their health service isn’t being dictated to by Jeremy Hunt.
What Theresa May was thinking of re-appointing him is a mystery. The biggest insult of all is he’s got the cheek to wear a NHS badge in his lapel
Coolrider:
A very good explanation of the problem but youve still not answered the question of what’s the solution.
Yes you are right the fire brigade did try to change it by striking. Did it work and make any difference?
So did the teachers. Again did it work?
Do you honestly think that doctors striking will make a difference?
If you read my first post I did say that I support any workers standing up for their rights and conditions but nothing justifies putting people’s life’s at risk, ever!
Some of you on here have commented on Robroys post where the stobart driver has frightened the life out of his daughter by driving up her arse. You’ve , quite rightly by the way condemned the driver for his dangerous driving and showed your outrage.
However your quite happy for thousands of junior doctors to put the lives at risk of people by simply walking away for a week every month and totally withdraw!
We are all in agreement that public services are being stripped back to a level that’s becoming dangerous. I’ve got mates in the army, police force and a paramedic so I hear how bad things are from their first hand accounts but striking won’t achieve anything.
Some of you have also stated the NHS cuts and more pressure on staff has been happening for years. Yet the junior doctors who are taking this action still decided to sign up for the job knowing what was happening! Why?
My main point is this I’m a father, I have a wife, parents etc. their safety to me is my priority and should they need it, hope they don’t, but should they need hospital care I would hate for them to be admitted when all the junior doctors are on strike!
I’m dam sure 99% of truck net members would feel exactly the same on my last point even if you don’t agree with anything else I’ve said!!
Evil8Beezle:
As I understand it, emergency care has never been affected during the strikes!
You don’t understand it very well then Evil ( nothing new there some might say) they have announced during the week long strikes they they will not cover emergency care!
Or you’re just gullible enough to lap up the media coverage promoted by the government…
Or you haven’t taken into consideration that there’s a team of doctors that are permanently employed as emergency cover and they will still be there.
"My main point is this I’m a father, I have a wife, parents etc. their safety to me is my priority and should they need it, hope they don’t, but should they need hospital care I would hate for them to be admitted when all the junior doctors are on strike!
I’m dam sure 99% of truck net members would feel exactly the same on my last point even if you don’t agree with anything else I’ve said!!"
totally agree but then I also dont want family members treated by an overworked/tired member of staff… and unless something is done soon the situation will get worse… Report on news last week that Lincoln NHS have considered closing A+E depts in major hospital due to lack of doctors/staff…
I will add this too, a few weeks ago my son had an op, things didnt go quite as planned and the aftercare pain management was very poor to say the least, I had to restrain him and sit on his chest to stop him ripping the bandages off whilst it took the hospital a hour to find someone qualified to administer a morphine drip to a child. This was during the day, in mid week at a main hospital… so got knows what would have happened out of hours, or if/when the doctors are forced to cover 24/7. meaning an already stretched service to be stretched even further…
makes me laugh some of the comments re they know what they were getting themselves into ect, yes but the same can be said of us drivers, driving game as always been poor pay/conditions ect yet we all have chosen to become drivers… the only difference is that majority of us dont have a massive debt to pay off…
the maoster:
Since the 80’s the Government no matter which party has ridden roughshod over the working classes and treated them with contempt. Terms and conditions that had been fought for over many decades were suddenly taken away and replaced with zero hours contracts and job INsecurity.
This strike is because the posh Eton boys have decided to impose a new contract on the doctors, no consultation, no sitting around a table, just simply telling them that they’ll from now on work more for less.
I don’t believe in striking for striking so sake but do believe passionately that standing united shoulder to shoulder will hammer home the message that enough is enough and I for one wish the doctors all the very best in this matter.
Well Im yet another agreeing with you here. Sign of the times that it has to come to this, but sooner or later a stand has to made. Now hands up: who wants to support or vote for a party promising more tax cuts? And who believes the politicians who say they can deliver better services at less cost thro "efficiency savings"? We may all WANT to believe in it, but, FFS it aint so!
Franglais:
Well Im yet another agreeing with you here. Sign of the times that it has to come to this, but sooner or later a stand has to made. Now hands up: who wants to support or vote for a party promising more tax cuts? And who believes the politicians who say they can deliver better services at less cost thro "efficiency savings"? We may all WANT to believe in it, but, FFS it aint so!
The problem being that it’s more a case of the lose lose situation of big business minimising wage levels.Therefore removal of the ‘ability’ of the general population to ‘pay’ enough tax ( or insurance premiums in the case of the US system ).While also minimising the tax exposure of the resulting higher corporate profits.In addition to the local over loading of services,in this case the NHS,as part of that labour cost minimisation scam in the form of immigration.
Franglais:
Well Im yet another agreeing with you here. Sign of the times that it has to come to this, but sooner or later a stand has to made. Now hands up: who wants to support or vote for a party promising more tax cuts? And who believes the politicians who say they can deliver better services at less cost thro "efficiency savings"? We may all WANT to believe in it, but, FFS it aint so!
The problem being that it’s more a case of the lose lose situation of big business minimising wage levels.Therefore removal of the ‘ability’ of the general population to ‘pay’ enough tax ( or insurance premiums in the case of the US system ).While also minimising the tax exposure of the resulting higher corporate profits.In addition to the local over loading of services,in this case the NHS,as part of that labour cost minimisation scam in the form of immigration.
Franglais:
Well Im yet another agreeing with you here. Sign of the times that it has to come to this, but sooner or later a stand has to made. Now hands up: who wants to support or vote for a party promising more tax cuts? And who believes the politicians who say they can deliver better services at less cost thro "efficiency savings"? We may all WANT to believe in it, but, FFS it aint so!
The problem being that it’s more a case of the lose lose situation of big business minimising wage levels.Therefore removal of the ‘ability’ of the general population to ‘pay’ enough tax ( or insurance premiums in the case of the US system ).While also minimising the tax exposure of the resulting higher corporate profits.In addition to the local over loading of services,in this case the NHS,as part of that labour cost minimisation scam in the form of immigration.
“.In addition to the local over loading of services,in this case the NHS,as part of that labour cost minimisation scam in the form of immigration.” quote.
How would you differentiate between “over-loading of services” and, say, “under-investment in services” ?
Seems to me the current obsession with lower taxes is guilty of cutting the true standard of living of ALL of us. The few extra quid in your bank, wont pay for a new hospital bed when your loved ones are on a waiting list. Whatever happened to Camerons “Happiness Index” or whatever it was called?
As you rightly say (I think youre saying) if a company makes excessive profit from underpaying employees then they should be taxed more aggressively to make up in corporate taxes, that lost income tax. More tax equals properly paid Doctors, Nurses, Teachers etc. More tax equals a better QUALITY if life surely? And less time spent dusting of all the eBay stuff Ive just bid on. (Other purveyors of tat are available).
she did well to send us to the Falklands and that was it! Smashed the unions and strikes! FAIR PLAY TO THEM I SAY! Plus 4
thick managers, who couldn’t MANAGE to run a bath on THEIR own. 
fair play to the doctors! Not falling for governmint SPIN. 
