Abnormal?
famous last words…
It doesn`t look that long !
Is there overhang out the back, because the trailer doesn`t appear to be extended by 5m?
Load security?
Appears to be 5 straps and 2 chains? I`d want more chains.
Should be carried wide side down really, not narrow side down, although without seeing it, hard to say with fabbed steel.
I would be thinking of wrapping a chain around narrow part of trailer to stop twisting of load.
About the same length as a well loaded car transporter overall and no more rear overhang from what can be seen than what said car carrier would have.
Yes it could do with a few more chains and or straps, but unless its going over some dodgy ground…
What’s an attendant and what are the requirements for one? Is it just anyone following behind with the beacons on?
stu675:
What’s an attendant and what are the requirements for one? Is it just anyone following behind with the beacons on?
"Attendants
An attendant is required where:
the overall width of the vehicle together with the width of any lateral projection of the load exceeds 3.5m
a single rigid vehicle together with any forward or rearward projection of the load exceeds 18.75m in length
a vehicle combination exceeds 25.9m in length
the length of any forward projection of the load exceeds 2m
the length of any rearward projection of the load exceeds 3.05m.
The attendant’s duty is to:
accompany the vehicle or vehicle-combination
attend to the vehicle or all vehicles in the combination
attend to any load carried on the vehicles
warn the driver or any other person of any danger likely to be caused by the presence of the vehicle or vehicles on the road.
An attendant must have had appropriate training or experience in these tasks and must receive warning of the risks and dangers arising from performing the tasks. Although there is no age limit, attendants should be over 18.
Attendants do not necessarily need to travel in the vehicle they are attending but may accompany it as a passenger (not the driver) in another vehicle (ie an ■■■■■■ vehicle) providing that:
the attendant can see the attended vehicle at all times during the journey
a direct radio voice link is in operation.
Where attendants are required and three or more vehicles are involved, travelling in convoy, only the first and last vehicles of that convoy need be accompanied by an attendant."
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stu675:
What’s an attendant and what are the requirements for one? Is it just anyone following behind with the beacons on?
I remember when they were called Driver’s Mate.
Thanks! So is that ■■■■■■ vehicle superfluous wanna be a copper syndrome [emoji6] or is there another regulation that requires them?
■■■■■■ vehicle drivers are invaluable for certain loads, they undergo very specific training, it’s quite a decent niche to get into if you’re near a company who deal with these special loads eg Collards in Goole. A mate of mine looked into this when he wanted a change of scenery. It’s basically a week long course costing around a grand, but with pretty much a ready made market to recoup the outlay. It’s definitely not just white-van-man with a bunch of amber beacons
Here’s some more reading if this has sparked your interest in AIL’s
gov.uk/esdal-and-abnormal-loads/print
This isn’t the first AIL I’ve seen recently getting stopped and found not to have the correct paperwork, pretty stupid considering police notice is required before you get on the road, so they’re already switched on about any big load that might be passing their way and it’ll be a relatively short list to check.
audi2001:
Motorway police bring 'abnormal load' on M6 to a stop | Express & Star
It’s quite difficult to be certain from that photo, but :-
that trombone is probably a 13.7 metre closed up, extended by about 3 metres, making it 16.7 metres.
There doesn’t seem to be much overhang.
It’s been a long time since I did oversize loads for British Steel, then Corus.
And the rules were updated after I was made redundant, so I haven’t really kept up with them. But as far as I remember, the measurement rules weren’t changed, it was the attendant and the marking rules which were updated.
Old rule. An attendant was required for loads over 3.5 metres wide, and/or an overhang of more than 3(.5?) metres. If 3 or more loads were in convoy, only the first and last loads needed an attendant.
(If it was a big convoy, more than 2 attendants would probably be desirable, but that might have been left to the discretion of the company)
Updated rule, the attendant could ■■■■■■ from another suitable vehicle.
Old rule. Markings, a red and white triangle of a minimum size was required, if the load was wider than 2.9 metres, positioned to show the width of projection from front and rear.
A red and white triangle, of a minimum size, was required to mark a rear overhang of more than 1 metre. At night a warning light was required for the widest part and/or longest overhang. They should meet normal marker light regulations. An amber flashing beacon doesn’t meet normal marker light regulations.
P.S. If the load was steel plate, for example, and the steel plate was 2.9 metres wide. Any load securing equipment would make the load more than 2.9m, so marking was required.
Updated rule. An amber flashing beacon(s) became acceptable as a marker light(s).
Old Rule. A 60 foot, fixed length trailer, can be used, provided that an indivisible load of more than 50 feet is carried on at least one leg of a journey. Without the trailer being classified as an oversize load.
I’ve no idea if this rule was changed in any way when the rules were updated.
At BSD Bellshill, a 3m wide load was a normal load. Being able to see the sides of my trailer was unusual. Basically every load was abnormal. But we didn’t apply for a permit for every load. We applied for an annual permit, for specific routes, from each police authority area we carried through. So in Scotland, Fife, Lothians and Borders and Strathclyde Police areas. And in England, Northumbria and ■■■■■■■■ Then, on a weekly basis, we informed each authority what loads we had carried through their area of responsibility. The dimensions, the route and the destination. ie, what, when, where, why.
So, going by what I remember. And looking at that photo, that is not an abnormal load.
It doesn’t project over the side. It doesn’t have a long overhang. And the trailer isn’t over 60 foot long. The load is indivisible, so on this leg of the journey a 60 foot trailer can be used. Clearly, on a 45 foot trailer, it would have a huge overhang, would need markers, lights, a permit and possibly even an attendant. From what we can see from this photo, load wise, it is perfectly legal. On load security grounds, I can’t tell either. Not all load straps are created equal. I’ve seen 2 tonne straps, 5 tonne straps and 7 tonne straps. Looking at them side by side, you can see the difference. Looking at them individually, you have to look at the labels. Looking at them in a photo, you can’t possibly say what size straps they are. And there could be two load chains there, difficult to tell again, from that photo.
So if plod is in the wrong can the operator claim compensation for the delay?
I forgot to say, the 60 foot trailer rule is UK only. Same as 44t is UK only. So IF that’s a foreign registered vehicle, it can’t pull a 60 foot trailer.
The EU rules, which we still have to abide by, for a foreign journey are, 40T, 16.5m long, 4.0m high. Same rules apply to EU vehicles in GB.
cav551:
So if plod is in the wrong can the operator claim compensation for the delay?
I don’t know. But if they’re in the wrong and you can show illegal detention has cost you. I’m fairly sure you could get compensation.
Or sue for both wrongful detention and compensation. It wouldn’t just be suing for the direct costs to you either. There could be ‘damage to your reputation’, etc as well.
Don’t see mention of weight in the article but only 5 axles could it be overweight?
Wiretwister:
Don’t see mention of weight in the article but only 5 axles could it be overweight?
It’s unlikely.
A general rule of thumb for judging the weight of steel plate is:- a steel plate of 5m x 2.5m x 10mm = 1 tonne. It’s a very useful guide and a nice coincidence.
That rule of thumb makes a 6m x 3m x 20mm = 3 tonne, which is right.
Constructed steel beams, like that on is, usually have a fairly light web in comparison to the thickness of the rest. So for that load to be over 25 tonnes doesn’t seem likely.
Besides, weight wasn’t mentioned in the news article. The police would have said, if weight was a factor. But it’s all about the abnormal load regs, so those would be the reason it was parked up.
My knowledge of abnormal load rules is old. I stopped doing that work in 1999. So I could be wrong about them, rules can be changed quite a lot in over 20 years.
But I’ve explained the rules, as I understand them. And I’ve explained why I think the police are wrong, if it’s a British registered truck.
I’m certain that if I’m wrong, someone else will tell us all why.
Wait for it, wait for it. I can hear CF’s fingers rattling the keyboard for google.
M6 police seize ‘highly dangerous’ lorry with huge unsecured load
The 20 metre lorry was carrying an unsecured load weighing 22.5 tons along the M6
Police were astonished after they stopped a lorry carrying an unsecured load weighing 22.5 tons on the M6. Officers pulled over the 20 metre flatbed truck between junctions 8 and 9 of the motorway.
They discovered the 22.5 ton load was not strapped down safely, leaving it at risk of coming loose on the M6. There was no additional attendant on board and a movement order had not been issued, cops said.
Simon:
Wiretwister:
Don’t see mention of weight in the article but only 5 axles could it be overweight?It’s unlikely.
A general rule of thumb for judging the weight of steel plate is:- a steel plate of 5m x 2.5m x 10mm = 1 tonne. It’s a very useful guide and a nice coincidence.
That rule of thumb makes a 6m x 3m x 20mm = 3 tonne, which is right.
Constructed steel beams, like that on is, usually have a fairly light web in comparison to the thickness of the rest. So for that load to be over 25 tonnes doesn’t seem likely.
Besides, weight wasn’t mentioned in the news article. The police would have said, if weight was a factor. But it’s all about the abnormal load regs, so those would be the reason it was parked up.My knowledge of abnormal load rules is old. I stopped doing that work in 1999. So I could be wrong about them, rules can be changed quite a lot in over 20 years.
But I’ve explained the rules, as I understand them. And I’ve explained why I think the police are wrong, if it’s a British registered truck.
I’m certain that if I’m wrong, someone else will tell us all why.
Even if it an EU reg truck, it seems peculiar.
Indivisible loads still exist on international trips. They are subject to the rules of each country they travel through. Night moves in Germany, differing ■■■■■■ requirements, either always on, or always off, m-ways.
It could be an EU truck on a UK run. Cabotage is still (mostly) legal here. So subject to UK rules as a UK truck would be. Is there much trade of steel fabrications being exported?
Being a 2 plus 3 set up, weights could be an issue, but the mention of an attendant seems to go against that.
Lots of issues, but none seem to explain what is or isn`t going on here.
How much of the report is a Police statement? And how much is a reporter reading some transport regs and making 2+2=5?
And now as I was typing
Santa:
M6 police seize ‘highly dangerous’ lorry with huge unsecured loadThe 20 metre lorry was carrying an unsecured load weighing 22.5 tons along the M6
Police were astonished after they stopped a lorry carrying an unsecured load weighing 22.5 tons on the M6. Officers pulled over the 20 metre flatbed truck between junctions 8 and 9 of the motorway.
They discovered the 22.5 ton load was not strapped down safely, leaving it at risk of coming loose on the M6. There was no additional attendant on board and a movement order had not been issued, cops said.
birminghammail.co.uk/news/m … s-25215767
20 metre lorry? No problem is there? Guess that is bad reporting?
20 metre load? Yes, a problem.
peterm:
Wait for it, wait for it. I can hear CF’s fingers rattling the keyboard for google.
\
\He obviously couldn’t find the answer otherwise he would have been on by now
“a movement order had not been issued, cops said.”
Obviously a highly professional journalist.
peterm:
“a movement order had not been issued, cops said.”Obviously a highly professional journalist.
As it says at the foot of the article:
"By Nathan Rowe
Reporter
Trainee reporter at the Express & Star."
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I’m no journalist but I’d still have known to put ‘police’ rather than cops.