Brexit stuff in one place [MERGED]

[monkey241]

Franglais:

Monkey241:
The gain / loss of a single deal is far easier to more accurately estimate (that after all is what these are).

A larger more complex deal is far harder to accurately predict… and actually less relevant since leaving the EU is far more than just about leaving a trade bloc
5 years later and the fact you still haven’t grasped that shows just why folk like you never provided an adequately persuasive narrative to Remain

5 years later… and I’ve seen nothing yet that even hints to me that I pursued the wrong course of action.

The more complicated a deal, the harder it is to assess? I agree.
That does not mean that an assessment of Brexit wasnt carried by the UK Gov does it? No one (I think) has suggested that they are so stupid as to sign a deal without doing an Impact Assessment, have they? But one hasnt (correct me if wrong) ever been published.
As you say it is FIVE years since the UK committed to Brexit and still…
.
So was Brexit entered into with no assessment?
Cant see that. So, do the Gov simply reckon we are prepared for Brexit at any cost? Youve used the expression fanatical…how do you reckon pursuing an aim, irrespective of cost, and keeping that cost secret from ones own people stacks up? . Have I "grasped the narrative"...... ? I have heard the nonsense spouted but no, I dont grasp, embrace, or whatever any “narrative” coming from the present administration.
…
…
But any assessment kept away from us is fading into irrelevance…
The Q 3 Trade figures aren`t pretty for the UK.
Covid has hit everyone of course, but who is recovering quicker? EU or UK?
No need for difficult projections, to see what has happened.
.

Pursuing an aim irrespective of cost is fanatical? Two tiers to that.

1. Was it fanatical to take on ■■■■ Germany or a price worth paying?

OR

2. Cost requires a definition. It can encompass far more than cold hard cash. The principles involved to me are worth pursuing.
   In reality I’ve seen nothing so far that convinces me that either cost is too great.

The Northern saying about knowing the cost of everything and the value of nowt comes to mind and should be engraved on each Remainers’ grave stone.

You misunderstood the narrative comment. Quelle surprise. Less time typing volumes and more time thinking about the opposition stance.

Q3 figures?

Who IS recovering quicker? And if it is the EU, is it EU wide?

I read an interesting article today. At the time of shortages folk like you demanded it was only in the UK.

Not so…odd that

But let’s get something straight. We’ve been out less than 2 years… and you want immediate equivalent or greater results compared to a project 40 years in its evolution?

You get more absurd and bitter on each thread you frequent.

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[franglais]

Monkey241:

OwenMoney:
Well Monkey, as a UK citizen in Europe I am right royally peed off at the loss of free movement that myself and my children have lost due to Stupid Pointless Brexit.
Still waiting to see my Unicorn or the sunlight uplands.

I’m sorry that I’ve interfered with your self entitlement via the democratic process.

Consider your being pee’d off as a small unicorn for me.

As for your kids, bit too emotive and manipulative to include them in your argument. I tell you what - you sort your kids out and I’ll do the same for mine [emoji6]

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Monkey241:
You get more absurd and bitter on each thread you frequent.

Freedom of movement too emotive?
But you have said and I wholeheartedly agree, it isnt just about money. It isnt just up to the “self-entitled” to dictate the subject matter, is it?

Some of it about democracy and open Government, and you dont seem to be denying that we arent getting too much of that lately.

Monkey241:
You misunderstood the narrative comment. Quelle surprise. Less time typing volumes and more time thinking about the opposition stance.

Did I, in that case please explain what you meant?

Monkey241:
Pursuing an aim irrespective of cost is fanatical? Two tiers to that.

1. Was it fanatical to take on ■■■■ Germany or a price worth paying?

Were the Allies fanatics?
Did they use poison gases, concentration camps etc?
No. They were steadfast and determined, but not fanatics.
So, what are you saying?
If it has any relevance please explain, if not and you just fancy bringing WW2 into the conversation…I wont stop you. After all the past decades of economic and social co-operation have been the most peaceful time between the countries of western Europe, and you cant put a price on that, can you?

Monkey241:
I read an interesting article today. At the time of shortages folk like you demanded it was only in the UK.
Not so…odd that

“Folk like me”…Oh my…Folk different to you?..Oh my…
.
I don`t think I can be arsed to carry on with this tonight.

[monkey241]

Franglais:

Monkey241:

OwenMoney:
Well Monkey, as a UK citizen in Europe I am right royally peed off at the loss of free movement that myself and my children have lost due to Stupid Pointless Brexit.
Still waiting to see my Unicorn or the sunlight uplands.

I’m sorry that I’ve interfered with your self entitlement via the democratic process.

Consider your being pee’d off as a small unicorn for me.

As for your kids, bit too emotive and manipulative to include them in your argument. I tell you what - you sort your kids out and I’ll do the same for mine [emoji6]

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Monkey241:
You get more absurd and bitter on each thread you frequent.

Freedom of movement too emotive?
But you have said and I wholeheartedly agree, it isnt just about money. It isnt just up to the “self-entitled” to dictate the subject matter, is it?

Some of it about democracy and open Government, and you dont seem to be denying that we arent getting too much of that lately.

Monkey241:
You misunderstood the narrative comment. Quelle surprise. Less time typing volumes and more time thinking about the opposition stance.

Did I, in that case please explain what you meant?

Monkey241:
Pursuing an aim irrespective of cost is fanatical? Two tiers to that.

1. Was it fanatical to take on ■■■■ Germany or a price worth paying?

Were the Allies fanatics?
Did they use poison gases, concentration camps etc?
No. They were steadfast and determined, but not fanatics.
So, what are you saying?
If it has any relevance please explain, if not and you just fancy bringing WW2 into the conversation…I wont stop you. After all the past decades of economic and social co-operation have been the most peaceful time between the countries of western Europe, and you cant put a price on that, can you?

Monkey241:
I read an interesting article today. At the time of shortages folk like you demanded it was only in the UK.
Not so…odd that

“Folk like me”…Oh my…Folk different to you?..Oh my…
.
I don`t think I can be arsed to carry on with this tonight.

You can’t be arsed? Then why ask questions?

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[monkey241]

As for the rest…
Disingenuous at best.

I prefer dishonest particularly with your misinterpretation of my emotive comment.

Won’t somebody please think of the children!!!

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[franglais]

Monkey241:
You can’t be arsed? Then why ask questions?

Franglais:
I don`t think I can be arsed to carry on with this tonight.

Good Morning!

I could start off about selective quotes, misinterpretation, and dishonesty, but I wont. I could pick-up where I got rather tired last night, with "Folk like you", but I wont.
We could start with any misinterpretations I may have made?

Franglais:
.

Monkey241:
You misunderstood the narrative comment. Quelle surprise. Less time typing volumes and more time thinking about the opposition stance.

Did I, in that case please explain what you meant?

Please explain what you mean?
Or not??

How about Brexit?
How about you you please explain about this:

Monkey241:
But let’s get something straight. We’ve been out less than 2 years… and you want immediate equivalent or greater results compared to a project 40 years in its evolution?

You`re talking about economics right? And apparently suggesting that as things go further into the future they will change more?
Well, I certainly agree that is true.
So if after two years* we have had no financial benefits (Please correct me where wrong) do you believe we may have more later?
Is this based on some…Impact Assessment?..or other? If there are real credible expectations where are they?
It could be a view that any price is worth paying?

*Which is of course a nonsensical figure. We started with Brexit effects following the 2016 referendum, we only (partially) left the Customs Union one year, we have another bunch of paperwork and regulations regarding the EU due to start January, with more later.

[monkey241]

Quite happy to answer questions on ‘folk like you’ but I had hoped you’d learned the importance of context by now

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[monkey241]

No financial benefits…two years in…
Am i suggesting things will get better…?

I’m really not witness to any negative effects economically so far…

Will things change? Yes since they’re still working on several aspects of the agreement I’m sure they will.

I’m sure you’ll point to reduced growth etc…but then this be suggesting that a prediction is factual; that that growth would definitely have happened

That would be an error… its also dishonest to present reduced growth as a negative.

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[winseer]

Before “Covid Pandemic” can end, the population are presumably supposed to say:-

“Please cancel Brexit. We regret voting for it. We don’t want to die. We’re sorry to have inconvenienced you with our votes the wrong way these past few years. Governments must be of Center Left, Center Center, or Center RIght - and we blatently tried to go against that narrative. We’re deeply sorry for believing we’ll actually ever get what we voted for.”.

What if the entire Covid conspiracy is actually about us reversing Brexit, rather than anything else, or at least this “opportunity taken” by our centerist politicians to reverse Brexit when all other methods have already failed?

In a logical world, we’d be putting sanctions against China who gave us Covid, rather than Russia who only want to flog us their cheap gas…

In a logical world, we’d be pulling up the drawbridge as mandated by the Brexit vote, rather than letting people come and go to all the Covid hotspots around the world…

In a logical world, if a politician made a decision - they’d stand by it, rather than pretend the “Science made them do it” rather than making a bad call, and stepping up for a stiff jail sentence when it all goes wrong… Where’s the bravery? If Boris seriously believes in all this trash implemented that we never voted for - let him be removed by his own party before we vote out his ENTIRE party at the next election… By this point, Former Tory voters won’t care if “Labour gets in” and will hand odd seats to all kinds of people putting themselves up for election… A multi-faceted Parliement indeed! Labour cannot win a majority except at SNP expense, and they ain’t going anywhere, don’t forget…

In a logical world, we wouldn’t be getting Hard Green policies introduced by parties that didn’t have anything of the sort on their manifesto committments…The Greens have one MP. Why didn’t Boris cancel Brexit using the “Farge has Zero MPs” as the argument? He’d have been murdered at the polls of course, but surely all the millions of bribe money from the EU would more than make up for being Persona Non Grata in his own country…

In a logical world - we wouldn’t be ignoring the crimes of actual criminals, but locking up granny who didn’t pay her poll tax, worker who didn’t wear a mask, or millionaire who didn’t have the jab and close down their business as demanded.

[anon84679660]

Don’t say, you weren’t warned.
We’ve been saying this since ever before the infamous referendum.

You can kiss your pay rise goodbye

Ministers plan to relax immigration rules to make it easier for thousands of Indians to live and work in UK as government seeks closer ties with India to counter China influence

Ministers are plotting to ease immigration restrictions that could help thousands of Indian citizens both live and work in the UK more easily in 2022.

The move is said to be a key point that could dominate trade talks that are due to commence between the two countries in Delhi later this month.

International trade secretary Anne-Marie Trevelyan is primed to dangle the offer in front of Indian representatives as part of a Government plan to curb China’s growing influence in the region.

dailymail.co.uk/news/articl … rk-UK.html

[anon84679660]

…and the top comments under the above article so far:

There’s no end is there? At what point will these politicians understand that we don’t want this?

And where are they going to live how will they be housed? Where are all the schools going to be appearing from to accommodate their kids? Where are all the extra doctors surgeries going to appear from to support them? Because currently we cannot sufficiently support the people adequately that are already here!

You can’t shut one door and open another without a debate with the public.

This government would sell their souls to get trade deals after the massive loss of trade caused by Brexit

Referendum on rejoining Europe anyone?

You telling me you didn’t see this coming in June 2016?

[monkey241]

anon84679660:
Don’t say, you weren’t warned.
We’ve been saying this since ever before the infamous referendum.

You can kiss your pay rise goodbye

Ministers plan to relax immigration rules to make it easier for thousands of Indians to live and work in UK as government seeks closer ties with India to counter China influence

Ministers are plotting to ease immigration restrictions that could help thousands of Indian citizens both live and work in the UK more easily in 2022.

The move is said to be a key point that could dominate trade talks that are due to commence between the two countries in Delhi later this month.

International trade secretary Anne-Marie Trevelyan is primed to dangle the offer in front of Indian representatives as part of a Government plan to curb China’s growing influence in the region.

dailymail.co.uk/news/articl … rk-UK.html

I thought it was Brexiteers who were the racists?

Do brown faces bother you?

What this isn’t is freedom of movement. It is visa controlled immigration.

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[gordon_50]

If the country voted remain in 2016 then in a few years time it would be Albanians, Ukranians and who knows…Kazaks or even uzbeks coming en mass. So a bit like a choice between a kick in the goolies or a punch in the face.

[whisperingsmith]

At long last, we finally have full fat ■■■■■■■■ where imports from the EU into Britain will be subject to checks from our much loved HM Customs.

Has anyone experienced this wonderful ■■■■■■■■ accomplishment yet, and how much has the promised reduction in Red Tape achieved ■■

Or is it like in the Good Old Days when if you were pulled in and lucky, you could be delayed for anything up to 24 hrs or more.

[mazzer2]

anon84679660:
Don’t say, you weren’t warned.
We’ve been saying this since ever before the infamous referendum.

You can kiss your pay rise goodbye

Ministers plan to relax immigration rules to make it easier for thousands of Indians to live and work in UK as government seeks closer ties with India to counter China influence

Ministers are plotting to ease immigration restrictions that could help thousands of Indian citizens both live and work in the UK more easily in 2022.

The move is said to be a key point that could dominate trade talks that are due to commence between the two countries in Delhi later this month.

International trade secretary Anne-Marie Trevelyan is primed to dangle the offer in front of Indian representatives as part of a Government plan to curb China’s growing influence in the region.

dailymail.co.uk/news/articl … rk-UK.html

Well it won’t affect us as drivers because the Baltic states are already signing up Indians to fill their driver shortage so they’ll be none left for the UK but I doubt they’ll be doing much for improving conditions and pay for EU drivers plus Ireland wants a relaxation on allowing drivers from the Ukraine to fill the ‘Shortage’ here yep the EU working so hard to raise wages and standards

[monkey241]

Mazzer2:

anon84679660:
Don’t say, you weren’t warned.
We’ve been saying this since ever before the infamous referendum.

You can kiss your pay rise goodbye

Ministers plan to relax immigration rules to make it easier for thousands of Indians to live and work in UK as government seeks closer ties with India to counter China influence

Ministers are plotting to ease immigration restrictions that could help thousands of Indian citizens both live and work in the UK more easily in 2022.

The move is said to be a key point that could dominate trade talks that are due to commence between the two countries in Delhi later this month.

International trade secretary Anne-Marie Trevelyan is primed to dangle the offer in front of Indian representatives as part of a Government plan to curb China’s growing influence in the region.

dailymail.co.uk/news/articl … rk-UK.html

Well it won’t affect us as drivers because the Baltic states are already signing up Indians to fill their driver shortage so they’ll be none left for the UK but I doubt they’ll be doing much for improving conditions and pay for EU drivers plus Ireland wants a relaxation on allowing drivers from the Ukraine to fill the ‘Shortage’ here yep the EU working so hard to raise wages and standards

Seems it wasn’t Brexiteers who were the racists after all

Sent from my SM-G981B using Tapatalk

[franglais]

whisperingsmith:
At long last, we finally have full fat ■■■■■■■■ where imports from the EU into Britain will be subject to checks from our much loved HM Customs.

Has anyone experienced this wonderful ■■■■■■■■ accomplishment yet, and how much has the promised reduction in Red Tape achieved ■■

Or is it like in the Good Old Days when if you were pulled in and lucky, you could be delayed for anything up to 24 hrs or more.

Not quite yet…
The vet checks won`t be starting until the summer will they?
reuters.com/world/uk/uk-com … 021-12-31/

Wonderful news as we get to pay for more office workers to file electronic documents, and more civil servants to check and administer such. Well, if they are allowed to check goods rather than just wave them through to stop delays.
More jobs? It`s true!
So we get to pay more for goods and in taxes.
Are these well paid jobs I wonder? You know, the ones we can get immigrants to do? Or poorly paid ones that we can only offer to UK citizens?

Still we did get blue passports, and “crown stamps” on pub glasses, and maybe the freedom to sell champagne in pint bottles not 75cl…

Happy New Year!

[mazzer2]

Monkey241:

Mazzer2:

anon84679660:
Don’t say, you weren’t warned.
We’ve been saying this since ever before the infamous referendum.

You can kiss your pay rise goodbye

Ministers plan to relax immigration rules to make it easier for thousands of Indians to live and work in UK as government seeks closer ties with India to counter China influence

Ministers are plotting to ease immigration restrictions that could help thousands of Indian citizens both live and work in the UK more easily in 2022.

The move is said to be a key point that could dominate trade talks that are due to commence between the two countries in Delhi later this month.

International trade secretary Anne-Marie Trevelyan is primed to dangle the offer in front of Indian representatives as part of a Government plan to curb China’s growing influence in the region.

dailymail.co.uk/news/articl … rk-UK.html

Well it won’t affect us as drivers because the Baltic states are already signing up Indians to fill their driver shortage so they’ll be none left for the UK but I doubt they’ll be doing much for improving conditions and pay for EU drivers plus Ireland wants a relaxation on allowing drivers from the Ukraine to fill the ‘Shortage’ here yep the EU working so hard to raise wages and standards

Seems it wasn’t Brexiteers who were the racists after all

Sent from my SM-G981B using Tapatalk

When does a remainer see a racist?

When he looks in the mirror

[monkey241]

Mazzer2:

Monkey241:

Mazzer2:

anon84679660:
Don’t say, you weren’t warned.
We’ve been saying this since ever before the infamous referendum.

You can kiss your pay rise goodbye

Ministers plan to relax immigration rules to make it easier for thousands of Indians to live and work in UK as government seeks closer ties with India to counter China influence

Ministers are plotting to ease immigration restrictions that could help thousands of Indian citizens both live and work in the UK more easily in 2022.

The move is said to be a key point that could dominate trade talks that are due to commence between the two countries in Delhi later this month.

International trade secretary Anne-Marie Trevelyan is primed to dangle the offer in front of Indian representatives as part of a Government plan to curb China’s growing influence in the region.

dailymail.co.uk/news/articl … rk-UK.html

Well it won’t affect us as drivers because the Baltic states are already signing up Indians to fill their driver shortage so they’ll be none left for the UK but I doubt they’ll be doing much for improving conditions and pay for EU drivers plus Ireland wants a relaxation on allowing drivers from the Ukraine to fill the ‘Shortage’ here yep the EU working so hard to raise wages and standards

Seems it wasn’t Brexiteers who were the racists after all

Sent from my SM-G981B using Tapatalk

When does a remainer see a racist?

When he looks in the mirror

Is that before or after they see the hypocrite? [emoji6][emoji1787]

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[the_maoster]

I do like how the EU masters insist on nannying their subjects and deciding that THEY know best. How about letting grown ups make their own decisions eh?.

[franglais]

the maoster:
I do like how the EU masters insist on nannying their subjects and deciding that THEY know best. How about letting grown ups make their own decisions eh?.

That screen shot shows a half truth.

“The updated EU regulations on chemicals, known as Reach, were agreed by all member states in 2020. The ban covers 4,000 chemicals including isopropanol alcohol, a common ingredient in tattoo inks, although officials say substitutes are already available.”
and
“Further restrictions will be introduced in a year’s time. The EU has given a grace period to two common colours, blue and green, to allow time for alternatives to be found.”
bbc.com/news/world-europe-59871779

And from The Metro
metro.co.uk/2022/01/02/why-are- … -15852760/
“The regulatory body said the chemicals – some of which are already banned in products applied on top of the skin – can cause ‘cancer or genetic mutations’.”
“Manufacturers are not required to reveal their ingredients or conduct trials, but it’s widely reported that professional inks may be made from iron oxides (rust), metal salts, or plastics.
Heavy metals used for colours include mercury, lead, nickel, zinc, aluminium, titanium, copper, iron, and barium.
Other elements used as pigments can include arsenic, lithium, selenium and sulphur.
Typical carriers are ethyl alcohol or distilled water.”

Yep, let`s allow adults to make informed choices.
That can only happen if they know what is inside an ink.