Carryfast thanks for quoting my post again!!! Sitting at home using Google and posting the info as your own is lame . your reply to my post is worse than a politician and shows what experience doing uk or European you do not have I’m sorry but driving a bin waggon on the council lame arse auto is all you will ever know
Never quote me again . sorry to users but every time I post I have this clown jumping over me didn’t no there was an other group worse than screwdriver’s ,…
chazzer:
For anyone moaning about auto boxes try driving in stop start traffic
I am one of those moaning and I spend 75% of the week or more on urban multi-drop work. But then you’d have realised that if you’d bothered actually reading what I wrote instead of generalising.
And every auto-manual I’ve driven has been dire, period.
Juddian:
Drivers don’t learn their vehicles any more, for example who the hell learns to drive their autos in manual for instance, only a handful of us i bet.
And I’d bet 95% of the few who do bother learnt their trade on real manual boxes.
autoboxes contribute to the general decline in road safety . start up , engage auto , engage cruise control and thats it . with a manual box the drivers mind was active , planning ahead for gear changes and looking well in front ready to react to road conditions . with auto boxes and the rest of the systems that take responsibility away from the driver the end result is something approaching boredom , the brain has little to deal with apart from the phone and radio . the mind isn’t focused on the job in hand which can lead to sluggish reaction to a situation that developes unexpectedly . . dave
karl2878:
Carryfast thanks for quoting my post again!!! Sitting at home using Google and posting the info as your own is lame . your reply to my post is worse than a politician and shows what experience doing uk or European you do not have I’m sorry but driving a bin waggon on the council lame arse auto is all you will ever know
Never quote me again . sorry to users but every time I post I have this clown jumping over me didn’t no there was an other group worse than screwdriver’s ,…
What the zb are you on about.I never drove any auto ‘bin wagons’ on the council all the autos I drove were fire trucks when working for a fire truck factory and nothing which I’ve posted has anything to do with google.It’s all based on experience.So exactly which part did I get wrong and why in your obviously bs opinion.Being that you,seem to/would like to think, you know more about what I did or didn’t do in the job than I know myself. 
rigsby:
autoboxes contribute to the general decline in road safety . start up , engage auto , engage cruise control and thats it . with a manual box the drivers mind was active , planning ahead for gear changes and looking well in front ready to react to road conditions . with auto boxes and the rest of the systems that take responsibility away from the driver the end result is something approaching boredom , the brain has little to deal with apart from the phone and radio . the mind isn’t focused on the job in hand which can lead to sluggish reaction to a situation that developes unexpectedly . . dave
+1… Even tho I do love my i-shift 
Having started my trucking career in an A series ERF with a 180 Gardner and 6 speed box progressing through various synchro and crash boxes including a Transcontinental with 13 speed Fuller which was one of the best 13 speeds I ever drove plus a handful of twin splitters which I detested, to move on to auto boxes is the right way to go. Anyone who says they have more control with a manual box is wrong, if I feel I want to overtake a bit quicker on a hill I can put it in Performance mode and flip the down switch but more importantly when I want to stop I don’t have to flip between brake and acelerator to change down on a crash box. Reversing on to a loading dock is no problem either maybe even easier than using a clutch so I don’t understand this aggression against the auto box.
During my last year before retirement I had a MAN with an auto box and although not as satisfying as a manual (if you know what I mean) it was boreing but OK, apart from dropping and swapping trailers. Then at the end of 2008 it was replaced with the same again but the latest version with buttons on the steering wheel, Oh Dear, is it me or are they a pain in the whatsit? Would be driving on a dual carrageway in moderate traffic and lift the right foot and keep going having unintentionally engaged the cruise control via the aforementioned steering wheel buttons, and whatever happened to 'proper oil dipsticks?
Hi
Like Chazzer I followed pretty much the same route. DB 6 speeds, Fullers ,Twin splitter,or which I,m a big fan of, synchro boxes, one truck had an awful Spicer 10 speed in.
Then came a session on auto boxes, the bulk of which was Volvo,s I Shift, IMO a ■■■■ good gearbox, one you can work with or just sit back and let it do it,s job.
This was followed by a MAN with the Auto box. I had that MAN for two years and didn’t, experience any gearbox faults with it. To my mind it was a good comfortable truck, if it had had the IShift box in it it would have been my ideal truck. Not my favourite truck, that will always be a C series ERF 8 wheeler with a Fuller 9speed.
On retirement I did a few months holiday relief driving Scania,s and FH Volvos and DAF,s, most of them fitted with manual boxes. None of those. trucks made me wish that all the trucks I have driven before should have had a manual box fitted, I never thought Whoopee a manual box to play with.
I may have been indoctrinated by my years on auto boxes and possibly have been lucky in having had good ones, but I believe you should go out to get the best out of whatever truck you are driving, auto or manual, if that means reading the handbook so be it, we are ,or in my case ,was, supposed to be proffessionals
Cheers. Bassman
Well i learnt to read at school , you can read as many handbooks as you like but try and reverse up an incline loaded onto a loading bay when there is no control whatsoever apart from the on/off switch that doubles as an accelerator and then say you are in full control of the vehicle ,then put a full explanation on how to do it in the handbook and if it works i will hold my hands up .Also maybe they could explain why sometimes the poxy thing wants to change up very quickly and other times not at all , and while im going on why when reversing into tight spots and you have to almost jacknife does the thing stop then you put a little more pressure on the throttle nothing then a little more and the thing jerks violently backwards so you scramble for the brakes .Before someone else suggests we get a Daf trainer in to show us weve already been there i took him on 2 or 3 sites with difficult loading bay access , i reversed on the first (and easiest) one and as it started to jacknife it stopped , a little more gas and a big learch backwards i asked what i had done wrong and in front of an audience he smuggly announced i didnt know how to drive it , so i pulled back to the starting point and gave him the keys and asked him to show me to put it lightly he ■■■■ himself and refused.Then he backtracked and suggested that there could be a problem with the vehicle so i pointed out a choice of another 8 in the yard and said try any one of them he declined and returned to the local dealer .So at the end of the day we`ve been there read the book tried the trainer and my verdict is still the same Not fit for purpose
Spot on Ramone, exactly that, not fit for purpose.
Fine for the easy work, light to medium weights involving acres of nice flat open space to line yourself up and take a leisurely coast backwards onto easy bays, but make them do the sort of maneuvers you describe and they simply aint up to it…Volvo excepted as the box is streets ahead of the second rate alternatives and Volvo’s engine has enough low speed grunt to cope with most.
My eureka moment came in 2006, i’d had a new 3 pedal Scanny for about 3 weeks and had just dropped a couple of cars off the back at my first drop, i then approached the set of lights near the dealer which was on a steep hill and had to turn left onto the level main road.
Well all’s fine i pull away and i’m just starting to make the left turn so the trailer’s now under load from three axles starting to turn and it’s still down the hill…yes you know whats coming next doncha the poxy thing decided to change gear and took so long about it that the revs were too low in the next one and the bloody engine stalled.
Bollox to that, from that moment on i drove that and every Scanny since in manual mode in MH (which is a faster change than straight M) and to be fair Scanny’s box drives really rather well in manual giving instant response to inputs, as a bonus fuel figures improve greatly if the driver keeps the revs under control.
I do the same with ZF’s hades version, drive it in manual loaded but depends on the situation what i do when when empty…too long to go into here discussing that box’s idiosyncrasies for empty manual running.
To be fair Volvo’s box seems to cope with nearly everything you throw at it, helped by the good ultra low speed torque which many modern engines lack, very very seldom have i ever had to use manual input with one.
Sorry to crap on about this but I still think a good driver with a constant-mesh gearbox can do it better. It might not be fuel-economically better but it won’t be far off. I just hate these auto boxes in all their forms. I read now that drivers have new ‘skill-sets’ so we have to move with the times. If they had the old skills they would feel like proper professional drivers who could really control a lorry instead of the lorry controlling them. You don’t notice it on the motorway but as soon as you drive in the mountains your very being screams out for a Fuller Roadranger instead of the frustrating nonsense now sold to us as ‘gearboxes’ at huge expense. Robert
Famine
My comments on reading the handbook refer to the times ( quite a few ) where a. Driver has been in a bit of bother, can,t get suffient traction for exàmple and has been asked did you dump the air on the second steer or did you put the difflock in and be asked how do you do that,whichever action is required. Reading the handbook just gives you extra knowledge of the vehicle but it still takes a driver to drive it.
If the scenario,s you describe refer to a DAF auto then I can,t compare because I,ve no experience with a DAF auto but I have performed many such manoeuvres with Volvo,s and MAN,s with powder tanks on. In and out of quarries reversing on loose surfaces upto silo,s tight yards the full gamut and whilst not getting there first time every time the auto did it,s job. Yes, sometimes I used manual cos that is what was required.
But having read the book I knew how to work all the bits the truck had, and saying that does not beliitle me and no intention was meant for any other driver.
I still think that a professional will, one way or another ,want to get the best out of his truck and the handbook is just another little tool to help him do that.
I will agree that not all truck types are suited for all jobs, maybe the bulk of your work would be done better with a manual,but generally suits in offices buy trucks, not the men who have to work them…
Cheers Bassman
Ramone
I apologise for my heading being Famine,instead of Ramone, God only knows why it came out like that. Maybe my thick fingers and lack of checking had something to do with it.
Bassman
robert1952:
Sorry to crap on about this but I still think a good driver with a constant-mesh gearbox can do it better.
Robert1952
I am in complete agreement that a good driver should be able to do it better than an auto box,after all he has eyes and (mostly) a brain to see and assess what is in front of him and act accordingly.
Without wishing to get into a long drawn out debate on the why,s and wherefores of different gearbox’s I think there is a place for a system, ie autoboxes, to make life a bit easier…
I Am not an out and out advocate of autoboxes,I too used to enjoy having a good Fuller box to use but as the years wore on and traffic and it,s problems increased I also appreciated autoboxes. I do think they have there place
A good driver with any gearbox will still be a good driver.
Cheers. Bassman
Well i`ve driven the Volvo i shift which is streets ahead of anything automatic but my preference is the Scania auto with the clutch pedal so you are in total control of the vehicle when reversing , incidentally the zf auto which is fitted to the Dafs , Mans and Ivecos are a manual costant mesh box with the gearchanging being controlled by the computer the only good thing i can say about the zf is the computer is far superior to me at changing gear it never ever catches one
I drive Merc 2540 on trunk with DD T/rs and I have found the auto box more or less perfect, using the retarder on long down hill sections of road with the odd touch on the brakes, but today with the A43 closed I had to use the A361 from Banbury to Crick and with the now 50mph limit on this route I found, trying to keep above 45mph with 44ton Decker near impossible using auto, as soon as lifting my foot off the accelerator, it would change up, I resorted to using the manual override, to hold the correct gear.
as for normal manual boxes, you can keep them as I said I do trunk work, I used to run in to the centre of London, in the '70’s with precast concrete sections, doing upwards of 100 gear changes, from the end of the M1 to Knightsbridge, that was with an ERF 210 & ERF 220 ■■■■■■■ with a Fuller & Lipe Clutch
Daventry:
I drive Merc 2540 on trunk with DD T/rs and I have found the auto box more or less perfect, using the retarder on long down hill sections of road with the odd touch on the brakes, but today with the A43 closed I had to use the A361 from Banbury to Crick and with the now 50mph limit on this route I found, trying to keep above 45mph with 44ton Decker near impossible using auto, as soon as lifting my foot off the accelerator, it would change up, I resorted to using the manual override, to hold the correct gear.
as for normal manual boxes, you can keep them as I said I do trunk work, I used to run in to the centre of London, in the '70’s with precast concrete sections, doing upwards of 100 gear changes, from the end of the M1 to Knightsbridge, that was with an ERF 210 & ERF 220 ■■■■■■■ with a Fuller & Lipe Clutch
Well Merc were probably first with auto boxes as we now know them , i had no problem with the old EPS because it had the vital clutch pedal and i have driven the newer ones ,we have a 56 plate Merc double drive and in the last 12 months its been off the road more than on with the box being out on several occasions , its out again now and off to a specialist , the work you are doing is imho what they were designed for just trunking not general haulage or off site work
ramone:
Well Merc were probably first with auto boxes as we now know them
No, Eaton was first with their semi-automatic, later fully automatic.
Just ordered a new R450 Scania, had to pay 600€ extra for stick and clutchpedal.