can anyone tell me if this is legal as regards to weekly rest
i will be having 4 days of at the start of this example so treat it that i will have paid back all my previous reduced breaks,
15 dec off
16 dec off
17 dec off
18 dec off 96 hrs weekly rest
19 dec on
20 dec on
21 dec on
22 dec on
23 dec on
24 dec on
25 dec off 45 hrs weekly rest (finish early on 24th & start late on 26th)
26 dec on
27 dec on
28 dec on
29 dec on
30 dec on
31 dec on
1 jan off 36 hrs weekly rest
2 jan on
3 jan on
4 jan on
5 jan on
6 jan off 36 hrs weekly rest
7 jan on
8 jan on
9 jan on
10 jan on
11 jan on
12 jan on
13 jan off 45 hrs weekly (rest as above)
Based only on the information given it looks legal to me.
Week 1 - Full rest period before commencing work on 19th Dec.
Week 2 - Full rest period 24th - 26th Dec.
Week 3 - Reduced rest period - over 1st Jan. and reduced rest period over 6th Jan
Week 4 - Full rest period commencing 13th Jan.
At no time will you have you worked more than 6 shifts between weekly rest periods. In consecutive weeks you will have had at least 2 full rest periods or 1 full and 1 reduced and in no consecutive weeks will you have taken 2 reduced rest periods, which since the rule change of April 11th is no longer allowed
Denis F:
not legal, you need a 45 hr rest on Jan 6th
Both the reduced rests fall in the same week Denis, he doesn’t need a full rest until the following week.
Denis F:
and at some time you’ll have to pay back 11 hours for the reduced rest on Jan 1st
9 hours and that doesn’t need to be paid back until before the end of the week ending 27th Jan.
Denis F:
and “normal” 45,36,45,36, etc could cause problems as there’s no payback there either
Could do but I took that to mean reduced, full rather than precisely those hours with it being a 5 shift, 6 shift a week pattern. The break between the 5 and 6 shift weeks would most likely be around 60 hours so payback no problem. He also mentions that prior to this all payback has been accounted for so the company seem to be aware of the need.
scania245:
daily rest of 15 hours contributes to weekly rest denis
Not when you’ve had a 9 hour weekly rest reduction it doesn’t. At best a 15 hour daily rest will be a payback of between 4 - 6 hours so cannot be used against a 9 hour weekly rest reduction.
BTW Chris, I said based on the info given it is legal but what you did before the 15th and when they fell and how long your previous weekly rest periods where it could change the answer.
Denis F:
not legal, you need a 45 hr rest on Jan 6th
Both the reduced rests fall in the same week Denis, he doesn’t need a full rest until the following week.
I’m still not totally convinced by that one - surely it could be argued that by taking a weekly rest you are starting another week - It depends on the legal definition of a week !
Denis F:
and at some time you’ll have to pay back 11 hours for the reduced rest on Jan 1st
9 hours and that doesn’t need to be paid back until before the end of the week ending 27th Jan.
it’s been a long week !
Denis F:
and “normal” 45,36,45,36, etc could cause problems as there’s no payback there either
Could do but I took that to mean reduced, full rather than precisely those hours with it being a 5 shift, 6 shift a week pattern. The break between the 5 and 6 shift weeks would most likely be around 60 hours so payback no problem. He also mentions that prior to this all payback has been accounted for so the company seem to be aware of the need.
scania245:
daily rest of 15 hours contributes to weekly rest denis
Not when you’ve had a 9 hour weekly rest reduction it doesn’t. At best a 15 hour daily rest will be a payback of between 4 - 6 hours so cannot be used against a 9 hour weekly rest reduction.
a daily rest in multpules of 3 over a 11 hour rest goes to your weekly (slange)
Denis F:
not legal, you need a 45 hr rest on Jan 6th
Both the reduced rests fall in the same week Denis, he doesn’t need a full rest until the following week.
I’m still not totally convinced by that one - surely it could be argued that by taking a weekly rest you are starting another week - It depends on the legal definition of a week !
No, that could not be argued as the definition of a week is clearly stated in the tacho rules - 00:00 Monday - 24:00 Sunday - and hasn’t changed at all with the changes of April 11th. When you actually take a weekly rest makes no difference to the definition of a week. This was one of the reasons why some drivers used to fall foul of taking too many reduced daily rests in a week, they had taken three then took a weekly rest then took further reduced daily rests. They thought that because they had taken a weekly rest it reset the amount of reductions they were allowed. It didn’t and because the reductions all fell in the same fixed week they had taken more than three. This no longer applies as from the 11th April the rules are 3 x reductions between weekly rest periods, so after a weekly rest this is reset. The ten hour driving day is still limited to twice a week and taking a weekly rest does not reset this, it is only reset at midnight Sunday into Monday.
scania245:
daily rest of 15 hours contributes to weekly rest denis
Not when you’ve had a 9 hour weekly rest reduction it doesn’t. At best a 15 hour daily rest will be a payback of between 4 - 6 hours so cannot be used against a 9 hour weekly rest reduction.
a daily rest in multpules of 3 over a 11 hour rest goes to your weekly (slange)
No it doesn’t. Does it hurt when you pull these ‘facts’ out your arse? Compensation for reduced weekly rest must be taken in one block and added to another rest period of at least 9 hours, To compensate for a reduction to the weekly rest of 9 hours would require a daily rest period of at least 18 hours
Basically i wanted 2 know whether my 36 hr breaks would be illegal in the way i’ve laid them out.
Where i have shown reduced breaks these will usually be ‘paid back’ in the week following the reducement if that’s a word!, it’s not uncommon to have 20 hr daily rest periods
So from what coffee said it is legal, both my driver trainers have said so
fuse:
you are having two 36 hour breaks in a three week period you are now only allowed one you are illegal
Rubbish, it’s not a 3 week period. In any 2 consecutive weeks you must have two full rest periods or one full and one reduced.
This means in a 3 week period it is possible and legal to have 2 reduced rest periods.
Week 1 Reduced rest
Week 2 Full rest
Week 3 reduced rest
Week 4 Full rest
Legal and two reduced rest periods in the 3 week period.
In the scenario which started this thread the 2 reduced periods fell in the same week and with the weeks either side of that week having full rest periods the regulations were complied with.
rules april 11 07 in any two consecutive weeks a driver must take at least two regular weekly rest periods( of 45 hours each) or one regularweeklyrest period andone reduced weekly rest period of atleast 24 hours. this means you can not work regular six day weeks two reduced weekly rests is not allowed
dont let me see you before me in court
fuse:
rules april 11 07 in any two consecutive weeks a driver must take at least two regular weekly rest periods( of 45 hours each) or one regularweeklyrest period andone reduced weekly rest period of atleast 24 hours.
You really need to carefully read and understand the section of the regulations you are quoting. If you do that you will see it says “Two consecutive weeks” and it does not say consecutive weekly rests. Every time the word week is used in the tacho rules it means the period between 00:00 Monday and 24:00 Sunday so in any two consecutive periods of 00:00 Monday to 24:00 Sunday there must be two full or one full and one reduced rest period.
fuse:
jan 1 and jan 6 he is haveing two reduced weekly rests not allowed
Nowhere in the regulations does it say consecutive weekly rests are not allowed. Consecutive weekly rests and two consecutive weeks are not the same thing.
There is nothing in the regulations to prevent a driver taking more than one weekly rest period in a fixed week, 00:00 Monday to 24:00 Sunday, and January 1st and January 6th fall in the same fixed week. In the week before and the week after the week containing January 1st and 6th, full weekly rest periods are taken so there are no two consecutive weeks with reduced weekly rest periods, which is exactly what is required by the regulations. The reason there are two reduced rest periods in the fixed week containing January 1st and 6th is simply to prevent the driver working more than 6 daily periods without a weekly rest
it’s been a long week !