Hi all,
Just wondering if anyone is working for ADR Network as self employed ? And what’s the pro’s and con’s ?
I dont really know a lot about self employment but was asked today about it, working Culina out of Rotherham from what i can tell ?
Any info will be greatfully received 
They wanted me to pay them money to find me work pmsl they are a joke imo
Grundril:
Hi all,Just wondering if anyone is working for ADR Network as self employed ? And what’s the pro’s and con’s ?
I dont really know a lot about self employment but was asked today about it, working Culina out of Rotherham from what i can tell ?
Any info will be greatfully received
Pros, not a lot.
Cons:
No employment rights
No holiday pay
You’ll get an extra quid an hour which doesn’t even cover the holiday pay and employers NI you’ll pay
You get to pay £20 odd a week admin fee whether you work an hour or 84.
Cheers folks,
May well be telling them to leave me as PAYE tomorrow then !
Grundril:
Cheers folks,May well be telling them to leave me as PAYE tomorrow then !
or sling theyre hook pmsl
I’m PAYE with the agency I’m on for, they’ve spent ages trying to get me to go self employed, they keep telling me about all the extra money I’m missing out on 
£1 an hour extra??Thanks but no thanks
I tried this a few years back.
Pros of self employment
You will pay less tax than PAYE. You can claim for things like laundering your work wear, replacement of work-wear, travel to and from work, any extras you have to by (sat nav, maps). Best to talk to an accountant about the full range of things that can be claimed. Any legitimate claims will be offset against the final tax you pay.
Register at 3/4 different agencies, that way you have more chance of picking up work.
You have the choice of as much or as little work as you want, although some agencies don’t like the word “no” very often.
The freedom to have holidays when you want them.
Cons of self employment.
The hassle of hiring an accountant and keeping your books and paperwork in order.
No holiday or bank holiday pay.
If work drys up it’s a hell of a job to claim benefits.
Make sure you have adequate sickness and injury insurance.
i think every haulage company would love to have each driver self employed. No sick pay, holiday pay to worry about and they could pick up and drop drivers when they please. There is a lot to be said for steady employment.
steve6900:
I tried this a few years back.Pros of self employment
You will pay less tax than PAYE. You can claim for things like laundering your work wear, replacement of work-wear, travel to and from work, any extras you have to by (sat nav, maps). Best to talk to an accountant about the full range of things that can be claimed. Any legitimate claims will be offset against the final tax you pay.Register at 3/4 different agencies, that way you have more chance of picking up work.
You have the choice of as much or as little work as you want, although some agencies don’t like the word “no” very often.
The freedom to have holidays when you want them.
Cons of self employment.
The hassle of hiring an accountant and keeping your books and paperwork in order.No holiday or bank holiday pay.
If work drys up it’s a hell of a job to claim benefits.
Make sure you have adequate sickness and injury insurance.
i think every haulage company would love to have each driver self employed. No sick pay, holiday pay to worry about and they could pick up and drop drivers when they please. There is a lot to be said for steady employment.
All of which you can claim as a PAYE employee of the agency, the only difference is you have to do it yourself and at the end of the tax year.
As has been said you only get an extra £1/hr, and have to pay them around £20/week for the priviledge of them doing the working out and paying you the allowance early.
As for ADR, the last time I questioned them, they said I could be PAYE, but after 13 weeks would have to go umbrella/ltd as that was the new rules under the AWR.
Grundril:
Hi all,Just wondering if anyone is working for ADR Network as self employed ?
I dont have experience of ADR network but the question you need to ask yourself is, How long do you think youll be working for that company (ADR), or any other agency?
IMO doing the S/E thing isnt suitable for the short term, so you need to ask yourself, if I went S/E next week, will I be doing it in 12-24 months time or is it just to fill a gap between full time employment. Because if its the latter, then S/E isnt for you
Grundril:
what’s the pro’s and con’s ?
As previously stated by the previous posters the basic info has been beaten to death on TNUK many times
And as Henrys Cat has pointed out, a large chunk of allowances (for mileage, laundry, PPE) can be claimed back from HMRC via tax form P87 at the end of the tax year IF you are PAYE
Though IMO the cost of mobile phone, internet, office space etc can only be claimed if your fully S/E
Grundril:
I dont really know a lot about self employment
Doing your homework is the key to understanding it all, which doesnt nessesarily mean asking here as youll get a wide swathing bunch of contradicting views which will only confuse you even more.
Grundril:
but was asked today about it
By whom?
As it initially sounds like (as with others who have been given this idea) that the agency have pointed you down this road
Grundril:
Cheers folks,May well be telling them to leave me as PAYE tomorrow then !
I tried that, having turned my nose up at all the other umbrella bull, and got sent on one assessment the trainer didn’t turn up for, and then no work whatsoever after that - about a year ago.
I was offered a 12 hour contract which I was fine with, as I was trying to sign up for weekends and nights. That wasn’t in the contract however, so I’m guessing I’d just be getting 2 x 6 hour shifts tuesday & wednesday at morrisons for £8.33ph umbrella which means I would have been “paying pit owner to employ uz.” I didn’t sign this one, and just went on the PAYE casual contract instead, which of course keeps you get kept in the “do not use” pile. 
I turned up in the first place because the ad said “£14ph morrisions plenty of work every week” - just not for the hours THEY’D have you working at this agency!
I’m not prepared to lickcock to get work. Agencies make money out of me working for them, so it’s for them to come up to my fussy high standards, and not the other way around. 
They renounced the right to have fussy high standards themselves when the application said “6 points OK” of course! 
I’m also tired of doing odd shifts at great inconcenience to me “as a favour” as the favours don’t seem to ever go the other way (ie I pick up a plum job over the other bod senior in pecking order to me!)
At this time of the year, I’m quite happy to pick up 5x12 hour shifts all the way to the end of the year, but frown on singleton <8 hour shifts that still have me setting aside a whole day to do, but pay so much less, without the proper breaks you don’t seem to get on them etc.
(“minimalist break”=45 mins taken, nothing to eat, nowhere warm to go and “proper break” means hot food, warm place to be, toilets available, not expected to unload on your break etc etc) 
I would have been quite happy with PAYE saturdays & sundays at rates from 12-14ph but alas, they couldn’t do what they said on the tin, so I got no work.
I’ve had a decent amount of work elsewhere this past year at minimum £10ph, so I’ve got no complaints regarding my current circumstances, apart from the current worry that the “Christmas Buildup” still has NOT started around here with less than 3 weeks to go! 
Of course £1 an hour covers holiday pay.
If you only did 40hrs a week thats £40. Say, 40 weeks a year is £1600. 50 wks is £2000! How much holiday pay do you want?
N.I. is £12.50 per month.
The umbrella charges 4% of gross pay for invoicing and transferring money to you. Not £20 a week. Although they charge more if you require them to do all your tax and other paperwork.
A belt and braces approach to s/e is to work for more than one agency, (they understand this). It keeps things legal in terms of the definition of s/e.
The down side is you must be disciplined in your affairs and be able to keep basic records. Its probably not worth it for the short term as has been said, and if you cant or dont want to the bookwork then its maybe not cost effective to pay them or anyone else to do it. (unless you do megga hours)!
I`m also VAT registered on the flat rate which means I charge VAT at 20% and pay HMRC 12% of that, so thats another bonus.
Its horses for courses. If yourre in an area of high demand and wages are great its easy to get sniffy about agencies and going s/e. But if you live in the north where wages are generally low and jobs scarce, getting an extra bit is important. Ive got my rate to £9.80 P/H which while maybe not much for the home counties is pretty ok up here.
"i think every haulage company would love to have each driver self employed. No sick pay, holiday pay to worry about and they could pick up and drop drivers when they please. There is a lot to be said for steady employment.
[/quote]
All of which you can claim as a PAYE employee of the agency, the only difference is you have to do it yourself and at the end of the tax year.
As has been said you only get an extra £1/hr, and have to pay them around £20/week for the priviledge of them doing the working out and paying you the allowance early.
As for ADR, the last time I questioned them, they said I could be PAYE, but after 13 weeks would have to go umbrella/ltd as that was the new rules under the AWR.
[/quote]
AWR rules do not state that “all employess must go on umbrella after 13 weeks” - ADR are implying it’s the AWR rule rather than a bent deal made up by themselves here.
What should be kept in mind is that this so-called rule is the same as saying “It is imperative we’ve fiddled all staff out of their 13 week rights UNDER AWR rules BY getting them to go on umbrella/SE before that point is reached. Our clients don’t want to comply with AWR, and as we lickcock so much, we’re quite happy to rip off the drivers to keep the clients happy”.
Anyone says “Compulsory umbrella” to me, and I’m “compulsory walking out the door”. I just wish they’d admit this bent side of the business BEFORE I’ve wasted a day filling out the forms, turning up, doing assessments, and that stupid test that’s only there so they can slip the endorsement crowd through the net. 
steve6900:
All of which you can claim as a PAYE employee of the agency, the only difference is you have to do it yourself and at the end of the tax year.
I don’t think this is quite right, I’me with an agency on PAYE being paid by a seperate payroll company and I send a expences claim form direct to the payroll company each week and all my expences are offset against any tax I pay.
Also signing up for 3 or 4 agencys when self employed may not be benaficial if they charge for working out your tax ect because if you get one day a week from each agency you’ll pay 3 or 4 lots of charges
steve6900:
I tried this a few years back.Pros of self employment
You will pay less tax than PAYE. You can claim for things like laundering your work wear, replacement of work-wear, travel to and from work, any extras you have to by (sat nav, maps).
But you can do that on PAYE if you don’t have one fixed place of work or go to the same place for less than 2 years and the Satnav is solely for work simply by completing a P87 Expenses in Employment form. You can only claim for laundering your work wear if it is a uniform provided by your employer.
Remember that on PAYE your agency as your employer is responsible for providing your PPE so should be supplying you gloves, hi-viz vests and steel toecapped boots if they’re required. Certainly the Driver Hire branch I used to be at in Hull did.
Henrys cat:
As for ADR, the last time I questioned them, they said I could be PAYE, but after 13 weeks would have to go umbrella/ltd as that was the new rules under the AWR.
They were lying.
Midnight Rambler:
I don’t think this is quite right, I’me with an agency on PAYE being paid by a seperate payroll company and I send a expences claim form direct to the payroll company each week and all my expences are offset against any tax I pay.Also signing up for 3 or 4 agencys when self employed may not be benaficial if they charge for working out your tax ect because if you get one day a week from each agency you’ll pay 3 or 4 lots of charges
Sorry but it is perfectly correct.
Unfortunately for you, your agency are conning you. You are effectively working for the agency the same as agencies who have drivers self employed via umbrella companies are. You are on the agency through an umbrella company - that is what the separate payroll company is. Legally your employer is actually the umbrella company, the payroll company that is paying you, and not the agency.
Don’t believe me? Go look up a few umbrella companies and see what they say about how it works and then have a long hard think about how you’re getting paid and claim expenses.
These arses are stitching drivers up left, right and center.
Also signing up for 3 or 4 agencys when self employed may not be benaficial if they charge for working out your tax ect because if you get one day a week from each agency you’ll pay 3 or 4 lots of charges
Why would they be charging anything? If you’re self employed they have no reason to be working out your tax at all unless you’re in the construction industry which operate a specific way as required by HMRC. You send them an invoice and they pay it. Working out and deducting the tax is for you to do, not them.
I like how you tell someone something isn’t quite right whilst displaying an ignorance about tax which is beyond belief.
cheekymonkey:
Of course £1 an hour covers holiday pay.
If you’re a blithering idiot who can’t do maths.
If you only did 40hrs a week thats £40. Say, 40 weeks a year is £1600. 50 wks is £2000! How much holiday pay do you want?
N.I. is £12.50 per month.
The umbrella charges 4% of gross pay for invoicing and transferring money to you. Not £20 a week. Although they charge more if you require them to do all your tax and other paperwork.
NOVA have a flat weekly charge so you’d pay say £20 if you worked one hour or 80.
As for holiday pay, one employer I worked at in 2003, Geopost, would have paid me £3,360. At the last agency I drove for, my holiday pay would have been £2,240.
How much holiday pay do I want? The amount I would be legally entitled to as an employee. But if you’re happy being screwed over and getting less because you think you’re getting paid more then that is up to you.
£1/hr is not enough to cover your admin/umbrella fees and the holiday pay you do not get. It isn’t enough to cover the SSP you won’t get. It isn’t enough to cover the cost of the PPE you have to buy which the agency is legally required to provide if you’re on PAYE.
cheekymonkey:
N.I. is £12.50 per month.
thats IF you pay it 
cheekymonkey:
The umbrella charges 4% of gross pay for invoicing and transferring money to you. Not £20 a week.
That depends upon the umbrella Co, some charge a percentage of income. Others charge a flat fee + VAT
not that I use them but, it pays to shop around
Also remember most umbrella payroll Cos will automatically sign you up for the VAT flat rate scheme, not that youll see any of the extra 10% (of the 20% VAT) they charge the agency on your behalf
Conor:
Remember that on PAYE your agency as your employer is responsible for providing your PPE so should be supplying you gloves, hi-viz vests and steel toecapped boots if they’re required. Certainly the Driver Hire branch I used to be at in Hull did.
its not unusual for the agency to charge the driver for supplying these items, though many years ago I did get a free DH Hi-viz and pen after completing a fixed number of assignments
Conor:
Midnight Rambler:
I like how you tell someone something isn’t quite right whilst displaying an ignorance about tax which is beyond belief.
Correct me if i’me wrong Buster but did I not write “I don’t think” which is different to “this is not right”, just saying how it works for me
You dont have to get so arsy, were not all tax experts, unlike yourself, or I would’nt be driving a ■■■■■■ truck for a living
£20 a week admin LOL. They make money out of the driver every time he or she goes out on a job. One word PARASITES