Just joined the forum as i’m after some advice. I work full time in the fire service, and am also driving wagons from time to time on my days off (for some additional income, and because I am a classic boy who likes toys kind of guy!). I’ve recently been going through CPC renewal training where it was talking about the need to do manual entries on tachographs to account for entire working weeks. I work a 4 on, 4 off shift pattern in the fire service, so only drive trucks a few days a month. I only drive for one company and it’s the same company every time I accept work.
Can someone give me some advice on what to do here, as a manual entry for my working week would take me about 2 hours to enter, sometimes depending on my full time job, I may not drive a lorry for several week at a time (drive fire engines but obviously, they don’t need tacho’s). Am I am able to keep a written log of my working week instead and use the tachograph in the lorry on days I work for the company driving a lorry?
Appreciate any help you can offer, tachograph rules blow my mind, I find it all so unnecessarily complicated!
You usedto be able to do manual entries on a tachograogh envelope but they dud away with that now.You have to do it on the machine now next time you drive a truck
DO not become greedy ,one job is enough ,you will get a good pension in a government job, driving trucks doubtful that always was the trouble with the transport industry too many part timers who do not need the money and work for less what does your union say about it…
If I were you I’d probably just do a manual entry saying I’d been on rest in between the days I was using a vehicle to drive in scope.
You could do manual entries inputting which days you had been working but it would be a real PITA because you’d have to make sure you inputted breaks during the working days to conform to working time regs and it would end up taking ages, as you say.
Strictly speaking you should do manual entries to account for your fire service work. In the real world, in the unlikely event that you do get stopped by DVSA, I don’t imagine they would get too bent out of shape if you didn’t, but kept a manual log instead. They might “offer advice” but I can’t imagine them prosecuting over it.
Here’s the government take on the legislation gov.uk/guidance/drivers-hou … raph-rules
It states, amongst lots of other stuff, “There is however no requirement to make a manual record on a driver card where all the activity has already been captured on an analogue record sheet.” So depending on your interpretation of wtf an analogue record sheet is■■? Presumably a diary or any piece of paper? I think just keep records, no manual entries required.
Here’s the last time there was a discussion on here (as long as you ignore my argumentative rubbish at the start and go on to see Eagledrives example at the end) r.tapatalk.com/shareLink/topic? … source=app
As above, you can legally write manual entries for none HGV driving days work on printouts or charts, then the next time you put your card into a tachograph record the time from the end of the last shift when you used a tachograph with the ? symbol.
Never try to put manual entries for several none driving work days into the tachograph, it’s time consuming and you’re likely to make mistakes, apart from that it’s not legally required.
To be “belt and braces” you could input the time between you last shift on your racho and your next shift on tacho as a ? Mark.
A ? is unknown but assumed rest, this would then allow you to fill in the time with manual records without saying you’ve spent it all on rest (which however unlikely could be viewed as a false declaration)
I had a second driving job for a while. My driving boss used to give me a letter on company headed paper stating “no driving work in the previous 12 days (or whatever was)”. Just carried that with me whenever I was at the wheel.
Cheers
Paul
Buy a box of tacho discs (analogue records) (£5-50 for box of 100 / 15 quid for a year)
When you work, but dont have access to a tacho, (when on Fire Service duty) write your work times on the back of the disc. If you do this daily you will not forget anything, be 100% legal, and itll take about one or two minutes per day.
Wheel Holder:
If I were you I’d probably just do a manual entry saying I’d been on rest in between the days I was using a vehicle to drive in scope.
Yikes, that’s straight forward fraudulent records and a trip to the TC.
One of the main reasons for the manual records, is exactly for the likes of the OP…… those who are working full time and wanting to add some driving time.
Untrue records may get past the casual roadside check, BUT if or when it goes wrong, either during hgv or work at the fire service, that’s when it makes a real difference. Do it wrong and suddenly it’s the potential of losing HGV entitlement and your full time job.
We assume you are declaring the driving for tax purposes and notified employer if it’s a term in employment contract.
If I’m a trade plate car driver, I can drive literally as many hours as I want, work another job as a pot washer over the weekend and declare/record none of it.
So, I believe, ignore my previous reference to diary or paper. It does need to be on printout paper. But you could retrospectively create your last 28 days records only once you know you are going to drive. (Assuming you can remember, or have records of what you’ve done).
toonsy:
To be “belt and braces” you could input the time between you last shift on your racho and your next shift on tacho as a ? Mark.
A ? is unknown but assumed rest, this would then allow you to fill in the time with manual records without saying you’ve spent it all on rest (which however unlikely could be viewed as a false declaration)
I thought it’s not belt and braces, but just what the tacho does, if you refuse its question of entering a manual entry or rest until now.
I was told to use ? for the time between tacho exit and entry and keep a manual dusty of non driving work.
A recent cpc course told me diary not acceptable now it has to be written on a tacho printout sheet!! So perhaps as Rob said buy a pack of discs.
toonsy:
To be “belt and braces” you could input the time between you last shift on your racho and your next shift on tacho as a ? Mark.
A ? is unknown but assumed rest, this would then allow you to fill in the time with manual records without saying you’ve spent it all on rest (which however unlikely could be viewed as a false declaration)
I thought it’s not belt and braces, but just what the tacho does, if you refuse its question of entering a manual entry or rest until now.
Theoretically yes, although there’s likely to be a small manual entry required for finishing the last shift (booking off time/throwing the keys back time etc) so by actively selecting ? you can add that bit in, then specify the duration of the ? before adding your manual entry for the start of the shift about to be undertaken (ie the bit before you get to the truck)
Wheel Holder:
If I were you I’d probably just do a manual entry saying I’d been on rest in between the days I was using a vehicle to drive in scope.
You could do manual entries inputting which days you had been working but it would be a real PITA because you’d have to make sure you inputted breaks during the working days to conform to working time regs and it would end up taking ages, as you say.