Can anyone clarify if a company can plan in a reduced 9 hr rest period or if we have the right to say B*******ks.
The same goes for the extended 10 hr drives.
I can not find anything in the legistation thats says one way or the other.
would prefer not to have opinions as anwsers but whats the law says.
thanks in advance
Here you go …
Last one on this page …
HTH
you can be planned for 10 hour drives and/or reduced rest…
…
awaits “health and safety” blah blah quotes.
personally i refuse unless it is for my benefit
As Andy says, it’s been discussed to death, the planners are responsible for the scheduling, if that requires a reduced rest etc, then they can plan it.
However, it’s the drivers responsibility to make sure they’re fit to work, not tired, and have the right to refuse.
Don’t forget, a reduced rest period is when you’ve gone over 13hrs duty period or had less than 11hrs off, I’ve always been happy to do a 15hr day = reduced rest, but if at home, I WILL NOT only have 9hrs off 99% of the time. However, as said in the other thread, let’s say I’ve got a 1hr drive then a 4hr tip where I get to sleep, then I don’t mind going in tired.
lebush:
Can anyone clarify if a company can plan in a reduced 9 hr rest period or if we have the right to say B*******ks.
The same goes for the extended 10 hr drives.
I can not find anything in the legistation thats says one way or the other.
The general rule with the regulations is that if it doesn’t say it isn’t allowed, then it is allowed.
Nowhere does it say they’re not allowed to plan 10h drives or reduced daily rests, therefore (unless there is something in your contract of employment that says otherwise) they can plan anything they like as long as it is within the rules.
Your only grounds for refusal is that you feel you would not get sufficient rest and therefore not be safe on the road, but if you do that more than once or twice then they could quite legitimately sack you for not being up to the job.
Paul
Where I work it is for the driver to decide, we wouldn’t plan for a driver to drive 10 hrs without asking if it was ok with them first the only time we would EXPECT them to drive 10hrs is if for one reason or another they were out longer than expected ie traffic and they could get back to base in that 1 hr we would EXPECT them to drive back and if they didn’t the TM wouldn’t be too happy but couldn’t do anything apart from turn a few holiday requests down give ■■■■ runs etc etc.
As for the 9hrs rest again up to the driver we wouldn’t plan for it, but would hope if it was needed the driver would do it.
NewLad:
Where I work it is for the driver to decide, we wouldn’t plan for a driver to drive 10 hrs without asking if it was ok with them first the only time we would EXPECT them to drive 10hrs is if for one reason or another they were out longer than expected ie traffic and they could get back to base in that 1 hr we would EXPECT them to drive back and if they didn’t the TM wouldn’t be too happy but couldn’t do anything apart from turn a few holiday requests down give [zb] runs etc etc.As for the 9hrs rest again up to the driver we wouldn’t plan for it, but would hope if it was needed the driver would do it.
The general rule with the regulations is that if it doesn’t say it isn’t allowed, then it is allowed.
Nowhere does it say they’re not allowed to plan 10h drives or reduced daily rests, therefore (unless there is something in your contract of employment that says otherwise) they can plan anything they like as long as it is within the rules.
Your only grounds for refusal is that you feel you would not get sufficient rest and therefore not be safe on the road, but if you do that more than once or twice then they could quite legitimately sack you for not being up to the job.
Paul
Like all other things, needs of the business, reasonable management request, how much is it worth blah,blah,blah outweigh every sensible reason for maybe declining or performing the invitation/request to reduce or increase rest and/or drive time. 
Wouldn’t it be good to go ‘back’ (?) to being generally helpful to each other and agree that occasionally this might need to happen? But no, employers say ‘you’ve done it before or so and so has’ or the employee says ‘not unless you’re going to pay me ‘x’ amount more’ for me to even consider it’!
Unfortunately the monster is out of the bag and everything is abused or exploited beyond what is common courtesy by both sides! o
So in answer to the OP’s original question - yes, they can plan what they like so long as it is within the legal framework. As with all things though, so long as you have a ‘reasonable’ excuse for if and when the plan fails I would suggest that common sense should always prevail! 
some firms actually plan a drivers hours for him? 
what the [zb] is it coming to?
but what makes it worse, some drivers think this is normal.
if i drive for 9 hours on day one, but know i need two tens to get to my destination, then i’ll be an hour short, so i’ve failed and i’m no good at my job.
but why would i need someone in the office to tell me that?
limeyphil:
some firms actually plan a drivers hours for him?
what the [zb] is it coming to?
but what makes it worse, some drivers think this is normal.if i drive for 9 hours on day one, but know i need two tens to get to my destination, then i’ll be an hour short, so i’ve failed and i’m no good at my job.
but why would i need someone in the office to tell me that?
You’re just nit picking on the wording there though. If someone has given you a drop that is 20h driving away and the only way to get it there on time is to do 2 10h drives then they have effectively planned you two 10h drives, however you choose to word it.
Paul
Every driver will try to save a reduced rest for Friday night to get him into the football, swimming baths or pub on Saturday lunchtime, the planners will try to use up your reduced rests in the week to assist the customer, it becomes a meeting of minds 
At the end of the day though, the legislation does say; “The driver may choose.”
I have always said if you choose to refuse too often, especially if you blame tiredness, the company may question your ability, and your workmates may shun you as the bloke who wont pull his finger out!
Is this honestly how some people behave, refusing to do this and that? Im honestly lost for words!
limeyphil:
some firms actually plan a drivers hours for him?
what the [zb] is it coming to?
but what makes it worse, some drivers think this is normal.if i drive for 9 hours on day one, but know i need two tens to get to my destination, then i’ll be an hour short, so i’ve failed and i’m no good at my job.
but why would i need someone in the office to tell me that?
What he said.
Maybe this defines the difference between ‘drivers’ and ‘steering wheel attendants’…
Saaamon:
Is this honestly how some people behave, refusing to do this and that? Im honestly lost for words!
I reckon its true, some people do behave like this and effectivley say…i won’t just do anything you ask of me, anytime. I actually want some semblance of a work routine. Wierd i know, but they’re out there !!
Your paid to drive it ■■■ king drive it or get a job in a sweetie shop!
bigtruck:
Your paid to drive it [zb] drive it or get a job in a sweetie shop!
sweetie shops often have opening hours from 7am to 10 pm. I realise hard descisions like who can make you reduce, why should you, do you have to can be tough calls, and i like your take on it…just shut up and do what you’re asked effectivley. Although its a non answer to me.
Mike-C:
Saaamon:
Is this honestly how some people behave, refusing to do this and that? Im honestly lost for words!I reckon its true, some people do behave like this and effectivley say…i won’t just do anything you ask of me, anytime. I actually want some semblance of a work routine. Wierd i know, but they’re out there !!
The job doesnt work like that though, why are you gonna get up a 0700 if your boats’ not in till 1000? What good are you if you’ve got a 19:00 tip and you knock off at 18:00.
The worst I have had was a 5am start, 5 hour shift , 9 hours rest , back in for a 14 hour shift, I didn’t feel that was very safe, it’s not easy getting some sleep when you have only been up for 6 or 7 hours
Mike-C:
I reckon its true, some people do behave like this and effectivley say…i won’t just do anything you ask of me, anytime. I actually want some semblance of a work routine. Wierd i know, but they’re out there !!
If you want some kind of a routine then lorry driving is probably not the job for you, it’s one of the least predictable jobs there is as far as working hours are concerned.
Paul
The answer to your question could be found in your employment contract, as most employers have, although reduced rest periods may not be specifically mentioned, a subject to ‘operational needs’ clause.
Which basically means that you may of already agreed, subject to Tacho & WTD rules, to work shifts to meet the ongoing needs of the business.
Failure to comply with their request (without showing just cause), could be classed as breech of contract and how far they decide to take it is really up to them.
Saaamon:
Mike-C:
Saaamon:
Is this honestly how some people behave, refusing to do this and that? Im honestly lost for words!I reckon its true, some people do behave like this and effectivley say…i won’t just do anything you ask of me, anytime. I actually want some semblance of a work routine. Wierd i know, but they’re out there !!
The job doesnt work like that though, why are you gonna get up a 0700 if your boats’ not in till 1000? What good are you if you’ve got a 19:00 tip and you knock off at 18:00.
Depends on what your job is and your ‘usual’ hours are i suppose. As you point out its not good tramping and getting boats if you aint prepared to do what comes along. At the same time if your on local tipper work, or deliveries normally starting at 7am and finishing at 3.30/4 pm and can understand a driver doing that not wanting to start work at 4am when asked to do so.