ERF-NGC-European:
Good point : yes, it would seem then that the NGC supplied to Eyckmanns and converted to 13-sp RTO from 9-sp RT by the Belgian importer before delivery to the new customer would have had a complete replacement gearbox. But bear in mind that this would have been a customer decision, not an ERF policy one.
That was my point Robert.It’s not just the advantage of the extra ratios.But at face value we’ve got a factory design which over compromised on overall gearing seemingly based on some strange worries about prop speeds ? and some other comments that direct drive top would have been acceptable at Continental max road speeds.
As opposed to an obvious contradiction in a Continental customer order conditional on upping the gearing,obviously in line with my thoughts and against those of ERF,before delivery.In direct contradiction to both previous premises.Yet again the Brits seem to have shot themselves in the foot to who’s gain,on the basis that plenty of other potential customers would probably have ruled out a pre delivery modification on a new vehicle.Also bearing in mind the fuel critical nature of the big ■■■■■■■ when taken outside of it’s engine speed sweet spot let’s say well under 2,000 rpm at least.
ERF-NGC-European:
Good point : yes, it would seem then that the NGC supplied to Eyckmanns and converted to 13-sp RTO from 9-sp RT by the Belgian importer before delivery to the new customer would have had a complete replacement gearbox. But bear in mind that this would have been a customer decision, not an ERF policy one.
That was my point Robert.It’s not just the advantage of the extra ratios.But at face value we’ve got a factory design which over compromised on overall gearing seemingly based on some strange worries about prop speeds ? and some other comments that direct drive top would have been acceptable at Continental max road speeds.
As opposed to an obvious contradiction in a Continental customer order conditional on upping the gearing,obviously in line with my thoughts and against those of ERF,before delivery.In direct contradiction to both previous premises.Yet again the Brits seem to have shot themselves in the foot to who’s gain,on the basis that plenty of other potential customers would probably have ruled out a pre delivery modification on a new vehicle.Also bearing in mind the fuel critical nature of the big ■■■■■■■ when taken outside of it’s engine speed sweet spot let’s say well under 2,000 rpm at least.
ERF-NGC-European:
There’s a chapter on this in Lorries of Arabia 3
Hopefully it goes along the lines of an ex fire truck test driver raised issues outside of these pages concerning ERF’s choice of gearing in the form of direct drive Fuller v over drive version.That seemingly being based on erroneous worries concerning prop shaft speed when the prop would obviously have been turning at the same speed at the equivalent road speed but the engine speed would just have been less.In addition to the closer spread of ratios in hilly terrain using the 13 speed not 9.
The above seemingly confirmed by at least one customer having called for the replacement of the gearbox of a new vehicle prior to delivery exactly in line with that claim.
ERF-NGC-European:
There’s a chapter on this in Lorries of Arabia 3
Hopefully it goes along the lines of an ex fire truck test driver raised issues outside of these pages concerning ERF’s choice of gearing in the form of direct drive Fuller v over drive version.That seemingly being based on erroneous worries concerning prop shaft speed when the prop would obviously have been turning at the same speed at the equivalent road speed but the engine speed would…
Where does it say that makers fitted low gears to keep propshaft speeds down?
ERF-NGC-European:
There’s a chapter on this in Lorries of Arabia 3
Hopefully it goes along the lines of an ex fire truck test driver raised issues outside of these pages concerning ERF’s choice of gearing in the form of direct drive Fuller v over drive version.That seemingly being based on erroneous worries concerning prop shaft speed when the prop would obviously have been turning at the same speed at the equivalent road speed but the engine speed would…
Where does it say that makers fitted low gears to keep propshaft speeds down?
Its in his book of does and don’ts, he has one for everything. Les.
ERF-NGC-European:
There’s a chapter on this in Lorries of Arabia 3
Hopefully it goes along the lines of an ex fire truck test driver raised issues outside of these pages concerning ERF’s choice of gearing in the form of direct drive Fuller v over drive version.That seemingly being based on erroneous worries concerning prop shaft speed when the prop would obviously have been turning at the same speed at the equivalent road speed but the engine speed would…
Where does it say that makers fitted low gears to keep propshaft speeds down?
Robert explained it as the reasoning behind it quoted by its designer/s some time ago on the topic ?.
From memory it went along the lines that the drivers would still run it up to the engine governor with the over drive box which therefore would obviously have spun the prop faster than they seem to have liked.Assuming tachos nothing that a warning or two from the boss wouldn’t have fixed.But obviously a financially suicidal way of speed limiting a truck before speed limiters were invented regardless.Both for the manufacturer and the operator.
Although having said that it was common knowledge that continental gearing did sometimes differ to provide better performance in the hills and with no need to gear for UK type motorway speeds.But ERF seems to have taken that to a silly extreme in this case especially in the case of the big ■■■■■■■■ need to lug to get the best fuel return.
ERF-Continental:
Another thing…how many kilometres had the Collin on the clock? Bear in mind that the total represents on- and off-road use, so a hard life anyway.
I’ve no idea, though I expect we will find out in due course. As you suggest, off-road use may give the overall mileage a low figure, whilst disguising the fact that much of that mileage may well have been in low gear on fairly gruelling terrain. On the other hand, a lot of managed woodland on flat landscape has good, firm surfaces - if unmetalled - and would not have over stressed the beast. It’ll be interesting to see if the lorry came with any historical photographs of it at work. That would tell us more!
ERF-Continental:
Another thing…how many kilometres had the Collin on the clock? Bear in mind that the total represents on- and off-road use, so a hard life anyway.
I’ve no idea, though I expect we will find out in due course. As you suggest, off-road use may give the overall mileage a low figure, whilst disguising the fact that much of that mileage may well have been in low gear on fairly gruelling terrain. On the other hand, a lot of managed woodland on flat landscape has good, firm surfaces - if unmetalled - and would not have over stressed the beast. It’ll be interesting to see if the lorry came with any historical photographs of it at work. That would tell us more!
Cheers, Robert
Well, this 4x2 tractor didn’t had a crane-fitted (just like the 6x4 Eyckmans had) so most probably it had a log-carrier or flat as a trailer.
One of my contacts in Holland has just sent me these pics of the R Collin unit, taken while it was still in France. He was sent them by someone else who found them on FB . Cheers, Robert
ERF-NGC-European:
One of my contacts in Holland has just sent me these pics of the R Collin unit, taken while it was still in France. He was sent them by someone else who found them on FB . Cheers, Robert
210
Looks great Robert, like its just emerged from a time capsule.
Must have had a good operator, to be so straight.
Hope it’s not a collector that locks things away, never to be seen again.
Would be very interesting to see the stages of the restoration posted on here.
Cheers. Colin.
TOP! And to my knowledge and as per some posts it was in ‘hands’ of a Dutchman then…but more important
Robert Collin and his son Bernard Collin are still in the forestry-business! To my French peers to proceed?
ERF-Continental:
TOP! And to my knowledge and as per some posts it was in ‘hands’ of a Dutchman then…but more important
Robert Collin and his son Bernard Collin are still in the forestry-business! To my French peers to proceed?
A-J
The mis-information that it was in the hands of a Dutchman almost certainly delayed its purchase by 3 or 4 years so it is therefore nothing to be proud of. There were people in UK who would have seriously considered buying it at the time the ‘Dutchman’ lie was peddled. How anyone who purports to care about NGC preservation can perpetrate such sabotage beggars belief. Robert
ERF-NGC-European:
One of my contacts in Holland has just sent me these pics of the R Collin unit, taken while it was still in France. He was sent them by someone else who found them on FB . Cheers, Robert
210
Nice pics Robert, looks like the interior has survived remarkably well. Is that a top sleeper bunk i can see ■■
ERF-NGC-European:
One of my contacts in Holland has just sent me these pics of the R Collin unit, taken while it was still in France. He was sent them by someone else who found them on FB . Cheers, Robert
210
Nice pics Robert, looks like the interior has survived remarkably well. Is that a top sleeper bunk i can see ■■
Yes Dean; they came with twin bunks as standard. Robert
: yes, it would seem then that the NGC supplied to Eyckmanns and converted to 13-sp RTO from 9-sp RT by the Belgian importer before delivery to the new customer would have had a complete replacement gearbox. But bear in mind that this would have been a customer decision, not an ERF policy one.
. Robert
