Containers. *Warning contains Brexit*

OUT OF HOURS BULLY'S TRUCKSTOP BAR (INTERACTIVE)
41

Carryfast:

GasGas:
Indeed…now we are out of the EU we will have no veto on cabotage within the EU…and the eastern nations in the EU may well demand that the UK opens its borders to their trucks in return to the UK having continued access to the single market for its financial services

But you also know that if we were really ‘out of the EU’ we wouldn’t need to use a VETO at all at all because it obviously gives us the same opt out as being in a Confederal Europe with the right to say no would.In which case they could demand whatever they want but they won’t get it.Because in either case with national sovereignty being supreme we don’t have to submit to their demands.

Let’s call it what it is Federalist remainers having hijacked the Brexit process to keep us shackled to the EU Federation but now just in a way that removes any of the useless ineffective opposition to commissioner dictat and foreign majority vote that we had in the form of UKIP MEP’s.Which was obviously Cameron’s and Juncker’s plan from the start.

In reality, trade agreements are reached by trading one sector off against another. For instance, the money the UK makes from having access to the EU for its financial services, insurance etc far exceeds any money lost to the UK by giving EU nations access to our fishing grounds or transport market.

As a sovereign nation member of the EU, the UK could exercise considerable powers over the EU. Outside the EU, every concession we gain will have to be more than compensated for by concessions made elsewhere.

44 - 49 per cent of our exports go to the EU. Only 8 – 18 per cent of the EU’s exports come here.

We need access to the EU more than the EU needs access to the UK market.

And that’s the reality.

And you can bet that if we want a favourable independent trading deal with a large emergent economy such as India, then the trade off is going to be us taking more immigrants from said country.

42

GORDON 50:
May summed it up on the news this morning, her deal…no deal…or no brexit. Sounds like her way of saying that brexit is stoppable and all the remainers will latch onto that and keep pushing and pushing till they get what they’ve wanted all along.
Don’t forget that May herself was/ is a remainer, so how the hell can you have a remainer in charge?

Because none of the leading Brexiters had the courage to apply for the job…Bo Jo, Gove, Reees-Mogg, where were they?

43

Carryfast:
Anything else was a mixture of wishful thinking and the delusion that a non binding referendum and the equally unenforcable and therefore not worth the paper they were written on promises that the Leave campaign was based on,was ever going to be deliverable outside of a UKIP majority in parliament…

"wishful thinking…delusion…Not worth the paper they were written on…promises of Leave campaign…

.Edit to add:not deliverable outside of a UKIP majority? True.
Not deliverable with a UKIP majority either, I’d say.

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44

Winseer:

Harry Monk:

GasGas:
for instance there is free movement of labour in the EU

Wrong, and that’s the whole point, there is not free movement of labour in the UK transport industry, this is why Waberers and Willi Betz cannot take over every contract which Stobart has.

It is the stated aim of the eu to ultimately remove cabotage restrictions, only pressure from trades unions and the road transport lobby in France, Holland and Belgium has prevented this happening yet, but if it ever did happen, nobody would pay you or me £2000 a month to run loads from Northampton to Southampton when Bogdan will do it for £500 a month.

There’s no freedom of movement for UK truckers wanting a job in say, Holland either - is there?

Working in Britain - seems to be a one-way-street INTO the UK, but what blue collar jobs are available to ex-pats?

If you hang out in a pub or cafe in Kent you’ll meet people who have come into the UK.
If you were to go to a pub or cafe in another country your meet Brits who work abroad.
Where do you spend your time?
I’ve met Brits, as already said by GasGas working as drivers abroad. And refinery workers, warehouseman, agricultural workers, crane drivers, office workers…no Scottish Gendarmes yet tho!

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45

GasGas:
I know Brits who have worked or are working as truck drivers for foreign-national companies in Spain, Holland and France. In the 1970s and 80s I knew Brits working on building sites in Germany and for fencing contractors in the Netherlands.

The barrier to Brits taking blue-collar jobs abroad is languages…like me, most Brits only speak a few words of languages other than English.

Ironically, the more senior the job you take in Europe, the more likely you are to be able to get away with only speaking English. English being the ‘company language’ in Volvo Group for instance.

I hear you - but surely in northern Europe, everyone speaks English right down to the kids there - so we’d all be surely able to get by doing mining and tipping work in Tromso, or Container Work around the Baltic - without having to speak Swedish, Lithuanian, etc…?

Speaking some German as I do, I tried to get a job in Northern Switzerland once - but got knocked back NOT because my German wasn’t up to scratch, but rather because the wages for the job I was applying for on their own - were not enough to sustain me without state assistance. In other words, you’ve got to be well-heeled as a Brit if you want to emmigrate on a blue collar ticket. Bit of a contratiction perhaps, but then again - we surely all know a few old mates who’ve made just such an emmigration trip as a trucker - because they’ve sold their properties they’ve already paid their mortgages off on - at the top of the market, say, about 12 years back… “Canada” seemed to be the destination of choice for those truckers that I knew…

46

Franglais:

Winseer:

Harry Monk:

GasGas:
for instance there is free movement of labour in the EU

Wrong, and that’s the whole point, there is not free movement of labour in the UK transport industry, this is why Waberers and Willi Betz cannot take over every contract which Stobart has.

It is the stated aim of the eu to ultimately remove cabotage restrictions, only pressure from trades unions and the road transport lobby in France, Holland and Belgium has prevented this happening yet, but if it ever did happen, nobody would pay you or me £2000 a month to run loads from Northampton to Southampton when Bogdan will do it for £500 a month.

There’s no freedom of movement for UK truckers wanting a job in say, Holland either - is there?

Working in Britain - seems to be a one-way-street INTO the UK, but what blue collar jobs are available to ex-pats?

If you hang out in a pub or cafe in Kent you’ll meet people who have come into the UK.
If you were to go to a pub or cafe in another country your meet Brits who work abroad.
Where do you spend your time?
I’ve met Brits, as already said by GasGas working as drivers abroad. And refinery workers, warehouseman, agricultural workers, crane drivers, office workers…no Scottish Gendarmes yet tho!

Sent from my SM-G361F using Tapatalk

I’ve lived for days up to months in 13 different countries over the past four decades.
In all that time - the only Brits I ever met abroad were either Tourists, or on a trip originating from Blighty, rather than working locally in the foreign land in question.

The closest I got to “meeting a local working Brit” was when I got talking to an English guy from Brum who’d been sacked that day, and was drowning his sorrows in a bar I happened to frequent. (I wasn’t working, but on a sabbatical) I pointed him in the name of a local van driver who was driving from there (Denia, Alicante district) to Eindhoven the following day, allowing him to have at least a good shot at getting home without running out of the meagre funds he had left to his name at that point. :neutral_face:

Dunno how he got on of course, as I saw neither the departing van driver (only a local Spanish acquaintance) nor this Brit guy ever again after that day in February 1985. It was bloody cold in Spain that year as well, if I recall…

47

GasGas:

Carryfast:

GasGas:
Indeed…now we are out of the EU we will have no veto on cabotage within the EU…and the eastern nations in the EU may well demand that the UK opens its borders to their trucks in return to the UK having continued access to the single market for its financial services

But you also know that if we were really ‘out of the EU’ we wouldn’t need to use a VETO at all at all because it obviously gives us the same opt out as being in a Confederal Europe with the right to say no would.In which case they could demand whatever they want but they won’t get it.Because in either case with national sovereignty being supreme we don’t have to submit to their demands.

Let’s call it what it is Federalist remainers having hijacked the Brexit process to keep us shackled to the EU Federation but now just in a way that removes any of the useless ineffective opposition to commissioner dictat and foreign majority vote that we had in the form of UKIP MEP’s.Which was obviously Cameron’s and Juncker’s plan from the start.

In reality, trade agreements are reached by trading one sector off against another. For instance, the money the UK makes from having access to the EU for its financial services, insurance etc far exceeds any money lost to the UK by giving EU nations access to our fishing grounds or transport market.

As a sovereign nation member of the EU, the UK could exercise considerable powers over the EU. Outside the EU, every concession we gain will have to be more than compensated for by concessions made elsewhere.

44 - 49 per cent of our exports go to the EU. Only 8 – 18 per cent of the EU’s exports come here.

We need access to the EU more than the EU needs access to the UK market.

And that’s the reality.

And you can bet that if we want a favourable independent trading deal with a large emergent economy such as India, then the trade off is going to be us taking more immigrants from said country.

No the reality is that our EU exports are a liability to us when set against the import bill.Our massive trade deficit figure with the EU obviously by definition includes all of your bs ‘offsets’. On that note we could more than afford to ditch all of our trade with the EU offset by the reduction in the resulting massive import bill.It’s obvious that your argument is based on clerical workers trying to protect their jobs at the expense of the economy overall.IE pen pushers in unproductive jobs buying German manufactured goods and putting us all in debt to do it.

Confirmed by that bastion of the Leave propaganda machine The Guardian.

theguardian.com/business/201 … d-widening

While what does any of that have to do with non EU imports transitting the UK and what difference would us leaving the EU make to that traffic.

48

Edit

theguardian.com/business/201 … d-widening

49

GasGas:

GORDON 50:
May summed it up on the news this morning, her deal…no deal…or no brexit. Sounds like her way of saying that brexit is stoppable and all the remainers will latch onto that and keep pushing and pushing till they get what they’ve wanted all along.
Don’t forget that May herself was/ is a remainer, so how the hell can you have a remainer in charge?

Because none of the leading Brexiters had the courage to apply for the job…Bo Jo, Gove, Reees-Mogg, where were they?

When even Farage stupidly said trust May to deliver why would supposed Brexiteer Con MP’s want to go against their own leadership.Bearing in mind that any true Brexiteer wouldn’t make the same Party which took us into the EU and which chucked out Powell their choice of membership.We really need to get rid of this stinking lying excuse for a political Party and let’s have the GE we need based on Starmer and Cable v Batten then we all know where we stand.

50

Franglais:

Carryfast:
Anything else was a mixture of wishful thinking and the delusion that a non binding referendum and the equally unenforcable and therefore not worth the paper they were written on promises that the Leave campaign was based on,was ever going to be deliverable outside of a UKIP majority in parliament…

"wishful thinking…delusion…Not worth the paper they were written on…promises of Leave campaign…

.Edit to add:not deliverable outside of a UKIP majority? True.
Not deliverable with a UKIP majority either, I’d say.

Firstly I meant not worth the paper they were written on because the referendum was deliberately drawn up by remainers Cameron and Hammond to be non binding on the government.At which point Farage should have said this isn’t the referendum we were promised rather than whingeing about this isn’t the Brexit we were promised having trusted remainer May and Hammond to deliver it.

Why wouldn’t an elected majority UKIP not be able to deliver Brexit ?.Make no mistake this could all turn to our advantage if the Cons implode from the results of shafting more than 17 million voters and we then end up with Batten in the driving seat instead of remainer stooge May.It will then be the remain bulldozer would then be staring over the edge of the cliff of an election between Starmer/Cable v Batten instead of the Leave vote being derailed by the stinking Tories and their Remain leadership trying to sabotage and subvert the process at every turn while pretending to deliver it.

51

Winseer said:

"
I hear you - but surely in northern Europe, everyone speaks English right down to the kids there - so we’d all be surely able to get by doing mining and tipping work in Tromso, or Container Work around the Baltic - without having to speak Swedish, Lithuanian, etc…? "J

And there we have it. English arrogance/ignorance at its finest.

(You beter learn some basic Mandarin. You’ll find that the Chinese will be a lot less willing to speak English once there’s nothing left to sell…)

52

wing-nut:
48 letters won’t be a problem, it’s the 158 votes needed to win a no confidence motion that will be difficult.

Before today’s shennanigans I would have agreed with you. A great deal more Conservative MP’s will now realise that she cannot carry this Agreement through the Commons. She has nailed her colours to this Agreement and she lives or dies by it.

Six resignations at various levels already with more to come over the weekend. Her own MP’s openly accusing her of lying, no secrecy around letters of no confidence. She has to win the first round of a No Confidence vote with ease, anything less won’t silence the wolves.

53

Stanley Knife:

wing-nut:
48 letters won’t be a problem, it’s the 158 votes needed to win a no confidence motion that will be difficult.

Before today’s shennanigans I would have agreed with you. A great deal more Conservative MP’s will now realise that she cannot carry this Agreement through the Commons. She has nailed her colours to this Agreement and she lives or dies by it.

Six resignations at various levels already with more to come over the weekend. Her own MP’s openly accusing her of lying, no secrecy around letters of no confidence. She has to win the first round of a No Confidence vote with ease, anything less won’t silence the wolves.

But who is there to stand up against her?
Who wants to wrest the honour of being Prime Minister during the biggest cockup for decades away from her and Cameron?

And whether you’re for/against/couldn’t give a toss, you’ll surely agree this is a fiasco no one would want to preside over?

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54

Stanley Knife:

wing-nut:
48 letters won’t be a problem, it’s the 158 votes needed to win a no confidence motion that will be difficult.

Before today’s shennanigans I would have agreed with you. A great deal more Conservative MP’s will now realise that she cannot carry this Agreement through the Commons. She has nailed her colours to this Agreement and she lives or dies by it.

Six resignations at various levels already with more to come over the weekend. Her own MP’s openly accusing her of lying, no secrecy around letters of no confidence. She has to win the first round of a No Confidence vote with ease, anything less won’t silence the wolves.

The idea that the Cons would suddenly ditch the leader that they’ve confirmed their loyalty to is as deluded as Farage’s idea that Cameron’s sham non binding referendum would settle an ideological Federalist v anti Federalist argument.Or that the Cons as a Party have changed their line on that since ditching Powell and Thatcher campaigning for a yes vote and signing us up to all the following treaties from the Single European Act to Lisbon.On that note suggest you read Raab’s ‘resignation’ statement.

The whole thing is a pre planned stitch up which ties us to the EU just as a remain vote would have done while also removing the UKIP thorn in the side from the EU parliament.No wonder the remain orientated media like the BBC are obviously in celebratory mood about their stooge May and the Cons in typical style delivering for them.

55

Seems like a general election is incoming.

If Corbyn gets elected nothing will get done due to him trying to appease his backbenchers who openly hate him.
If Any tory gets elected nothing will get done due to the party being so self destructive.

I think we broke our political system. :grimacing:
There is no common good anymore it’s all about personal legacy and self interest and it’s fudged our country right up.

What I think needs to be done:
What we need is a big ballys leader who will pull us out of the EU then commit on building a big fudging bridge over the channel as a sign of a continued relationship on trade with the EU
Ye it’s silly but there is nothing like a overly ambitious project to get people to work together. :grimacing:

56

Franglais:

Stanley Knife:

wing-nut:
48 letters won’t be a problem, it’s the 158 votes needed to win a no confidence motion that will be difficult.

Before today’s shennanigans I would have agreed with you. A great deal more Conservative MP’s will now realise that she cannot carry this Agreement through the Commons. She has nailed her colours to this Agreement and she lives or dies by it.

Six resignations at various levels already with more to come over the weekend. Her own MP’s openly accusing her of lying, no secrecy around letters of no confidence. She has to win the first round of a No Confidence vote with ease, anything less won’t silence the wolves.

But who is there to stand up against her?
Who wants to wrest the honour of being Prime Minister during the biggest cockup for decades away from her and Cameron?

And whether you’re for/against/couldn’t give a toss, you’ll surely agree this is a fiasco no one would want to preside over?

Why would any real Brexit supporter view it as a fiasco as opposed to a remainer orchestrated stitch up.Why is the job of PM limited to the choice of Corbyn ( Starmer ) or another no hoper Conservative muppet.When it’s still possible that it could actually turn into the Starmer v Batten show down it would take to give us the Brexit we voted for.Given the tall order of turning the 17 + million Brexit referendum vote into UKIP seats.Which Cameron and the treacherous Cons were obviously betting against when they called the referendum.But no make no mistake May’s predictable sell out is conspiracy not ■■■■ up/fiasco.With remainers in upbeat if not celebratory mood to prove it.

57

Batten will not be PM lol.
UKIP have zero seats
UKIP have pretty much been dead politcally to the public since Farage left and they won brexit refrendum
The general public don’t really know who Gerald Batten is.
Also I still don’t think UKIP have gotten past the Henry Bolton affair yet.
I’m still surprised UKIP are a party.

I personally don’t think May sold out though she went into negotiations with a minority government and no plan at the start for a no-deal bexit and got dominated.

58

the nodding donkey:
And there we have it. English arrogance/ignorance at its finest.

(You beter learn some basic Mandarin. You’ll find that the Chinese will be a lot less willing to speak English once there’s nothing left to sell…)

I think we can see where all this is going.One unelected control freak despot meets and greets another.

2duerighe.com/wp-content/upl … 50x300.jpg

59

So here we are… Opportunity to bring down may - missed.

The pound has given back all it’s gains against the Euro from earlier in the week, when there was much optimism…

And we’re now facing a deal so bad - that Remainers and Brexiteers are finding themselves ironically united over their joint disgust at it.

"UK MEPS to be disbanded, Money still to be paid, MORE money to be paid, less influence in the future, and nothing but a “Treaty of Versailles” ruinous reparation stitch-up that could only be inflicted upon the British people IF we can be scared into voting “Establishment” parties.

UKIP are nowhere, Labour cannot get over the line unless they at least keep the 2015 UKIP voters that came their way last year, and the Tories? - "Had every chance to make a difference, and suddenly Boris, Mogg, and Gove - go on bended knee, and act to protect their position, rather than their country, party, or even constituents. :angry:

The future doesn’t belong to either May or Corbyn as it happens - they are both running on borrowed time already.

So who’s coming up through the ranks that we’ve not seen yet?

Imagine the grip on the country that a “new” political leader with a background in transport could gain right now?

They would need to be a millionaire, thus not needing to “be in it for the money”.
They would need to ride to power on a Labour or Tory ticket - or even SNP if this mystery person comes up with the bright idea of “funding SNP candidates SOUTH of the border”…
They would need to be politically incorrect. We’ve yet to see a more “RIght” leaning leader for the SNP - haven’t we? Come to that, a more “Nationalist” leader of the Scottish “Nationalist” Party!!!

It can’t be UKIP, because if Aaron Banks cannot make it work with his millions - then he is falling flat for the same reason Trump fell flat years ago running as an independent, and then a Democrat, a party that didn’t need his money and influence.

60

adam277:
Batten will not be PM lol.
UKIP have zero seats
UKIP have pretty much been dead politcally to the public since Farage left and they won brexit refrendum
The general public don’t really know who Gerald Batten is.
Also I still don’t think UKIP have gotten past the Henry Bolton affair yet.
I’m still surprised UKIP are a party.

I personally don’t think May sold out though she went into negotiations with a minority government and no plan at the start for a no-deal bexit and got dominated.

Perhaps UKIP can gain a handful of seats from those Ex-Tory voters disgusted at the Tory Brexiteers missing their opportunity of a lifetime this week?

All they had to do was "Remove May, and put Boris up for leader - on the basis "It is either get behind Boris - or we’ll have an election where all you idiots who can’t countenence Boris - will be the FIRST to lose their seats, he says looking at Rudd and Soubry in particular…

Then bugger me - what do we see? Boris, Mogg, - AWOL again, and Gove seems to be using May’s ■■■■■■■■ for a toothbrush… :unamused: :unamused: :unamused: :unamused:

… If only we had some Trump-like local Labour candidates around here!