The WTD period for 26 weeks is 1248hrs. What happens if I reach this total before the end of the period??
Can the boss send me home on unpaid leave as I believe that is what he is looking into doing.
Caretaker:
The WTD period for 26 weeks is 1248hrs. What happens if I reach this total before the end of the period??
Can the boss send me home on unpaid leave as I believe that is what he is looking into doing.
Yes. No work until next working period
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Not for the driver to worry about
Company computers do that working out
Company, if bothered, will inform you if there is an issue
Authorities not bothered about WTD
Surely I have already worked those hours already so should be paid for them??
Caretaker:
Surely I have already worked those hours already so should be paid for them??
You have been paid for them. But if your company decide to be one of the few to adhere to the WTD and sit you at home for the remainder of the reference period there’s no right to pay for that.
I’ve hit mine for the past few weeks and apparently so have quite a few people in the company. Anyone with holidays left they are “encouraging” to take them, and giving people who are high (on WTD) shorter runs.
Most people in most non agency jobs seem to be on guaranteed min hours per week (unless salaried), so they’d have to pay that much regardless. If you’re not on agency / zero hours contract or salaried, they really can’t much but pay the min amount.
This is very different for agency drivers, although in theory those are the responsibility of the agency according to our lot.
^^^^ problem is Trev that a days holiday counts as 8 hours working time so taking holidays only makes a small dent in your WTD average. I think that 20 (?) days of your annual entitlement do anyway, the rest are “freebies” and count as zero hours. Ok at this time of year I suppose.
trevHCS:
I’ve hit mine for the past few weeks and apparently so have quite a few people in the company. Anyone with holidays left they are “encouraging” to take them, and giving people who are high (on WTD) shorter runs.
Taking holiday doesn’t reduce the weekly average. A weeks holiday is treated as 48hrs work for the purposes of the WTD precisely to prevent companies using holiday entitlement to get around it.
Dont think he’s saying they’re using holidays to lower WTD, they’re asking some to take holiday so that thise who are hugh on WTD can be given the shorter runs that presumably those encouraged onto holiday would have otherwise
If you take less than 5 days holiday then they only count as 8 hours per day. So, for example, 4 days would count as 32 hours and then you could work a short day to reduce your average weekly hours. If you have already taken 20 days holiday,and still have days to take, then they can be put through as zero hours.
In answer to the original question - for any sensible company if you are on guaranteed hours and not via agency, then thry’d be on extremely didgy ground trying to send you home without pay.
If not on guaranteed hours, then you’re kindof on zero hours and they might be able to, but I wouldn’t work for someone who did that. Obviously don’t value their workforce.
toonsy:
Dont think he’s saying they’re using holidays to lower WTD…
In our case, don’t tell them holdays don’t count to reduce it much or they’ll be having kittens. 
I’m on very high WTD apparently so they very much encouraged taking of unused holidays, but that will increase the hours for everyone else. The rest are either lower or agency so it won’t matter there.
The shorter runs were another tactic they were using but didn’t exactly work, but that’s nothing to do with the drivers.
The wtd is minefield of regulation. If you operate under eu driving regs and work 5 days a week, your statutory holiday entitlement is 28 days which can include bank holidays. This comes under regulation 13 of the European working time (Mobile workers) regulations, the regulation was amended by the uk govt in 2007 ( I think ) to give drivers an extra 1.6 weeks of holiday. The 28 days must be recorded as work, either 48 hrs for a full week or 8hrs a day for single days of holiday. Some unscrupulous companies will zero 2 days of a full week, meaning the whole week will only be counted as 24 hours and not 48. To work out your statutory entitlement multiply 5.6 by the number of days you are contracted to work I.e. 5.6 x 5 = 28. Any days over your statutory entitlement can be used to reduce your average. Sick days must also be recorded in the same way. You will need to read your contract of employment to see if you are entitled to any pay. My guess is, if you are hourly paid then you will already have been paid for the hours worked, if you are salaried to 48 hrs a week then you should be paid for time off to reduce your average.
20 days of you holiday count.
If you take a fixed week off, then it’s 48 hours, days off other than a full fixed week are 8 hours, so not taking a full fixed week off would help to bring your average down.
If I had a 40 hours per week contract, but no wtd hours left, I’d want paying 40 hours
Wtd isn’t enforced by any Government body, and as drivers are “key” workers I don’t think they would bother…
If a pointy shoe’d manger has mentioned it, he’s just trying to score bumlicking points,to impress Hazel in HR.
Just crack-on and earn.
Like a lot of things , it won’t matter until your involved in a pile up , then theyl go through the lot , and I doubt theyl just say , wtd , no we’re not bothered
dozy:
Like a lot of things , it won’t matter until your involved in a pile up
That was the only argument one of our office lot tried to make as to why it mattered one dot. But then they couldn’t point to a single case where WTD had been used by HSE in any case.
The trouble is, in this job there are often grey areas where POA or break could keep the WTD down, but they could also be seen as attempting to circumvent the EU driver hour regulations which could get people into a lot more trouble.
For example, at night I sometimes spend 2 hours before I can strap down a load. I could do the checks then out it on break or POA. Except I don’t have a pre set time for POA and may do other work for a couple of minutes, eg: pull curtains for an FLT or look at paperwork. I might not be near the truck to go switch it to other work, then back afterwards.
This is all on CCTV, so after this there’s a serious incident, they could look at footage. Now if VOSA want to be pedantic, they can say you worked while on break / POA, thus we’re going to prosecute for the more serious offence of failing to record activity on the tacho correctly.
Which would I rather breach - WTD everytime.
trevHCS:
dozy:
Like a lot of things , it won’t matter until your involved in a pile upThat was the only argument one of our office lot tried to make as to why it mattered one dot.
Wow. The biggest argument is the health and wellbeing of the worker. You work to live, not live to work and the WTD is designed to ensure that remains the case.
God knows why you lot are so hell bent on wanting to screw every minute you can out of the job. Do you not have a life outside of work, a husband/wife/boyfriend/girlfriend or kids/grandkids?
Conor:
trevHCS:
dozy:
Like a lot of things , it won’t matter until your involved in a pile upThat was the only argument one of our office lot tried to make as to why it mattered one dot.
Wow. The biggest argument is the health and wellbeing of the worker. You work to live, not live to work and the WTD is designed to ensure that remains the case.
God knows why you lot are so hell bent on wanting to screw every minute you can out of the job. Do you not have a life outside of work, a husband/wife/boyfriend/girlfriend or kids/grandkids?
Our place are now cracking down on WTD infringements, enough of them too soon over a few months and you can expect anything from a recorded discussion, to training to a disciplinary.
I rarely get any infringements to be fair and the only time I usually do is when I’ve managed to ■■■■ up a manual entry even though I know how to do them. So can’t say it really bother me one bit but it will make it harder for agency and full time staff with a don’t care attitude.