Would you recommend HGV Driving as a career to young 'uns?

I am a full-time teacher/part-time driver. Some of my students have got wind of the fact that I drive (copies of T&D lying around, etc…) and some have mentioned to me that they want to pursue it as a career.
Now, much as I love driving, I have only ever done it for a few extra quid, apart from my first year of HGV work when I was ‘between jobs’ (IE unemployed). I suspect that few of my current students are going to walk into a well-paid driving job from day one, although there is plenty of driving work around in my area.
The students in question are unlikely to succeed in traditional academia, but they have plenty of common sense, and I can see them doing well in driving, but I worry that they will pursue it, spend thousands on the courses and testing and then find themselves in a job wilderness for years.

Thoughts?
Recommendations?

So your asking if HGV driving is a good place to send the thicko’s■■?

Yes probably.

Aren’t the teaching profession always beating their chest with pride about the vast number of kids who leave school with a dozen A* and then going to Uni for a degree in waffle making.

Curiously all the kids that leave school with excellent results are down to the brilliance of the teaching staff, yet all the kids that leave with sod all are down to the kids being thick.

Easy answer to this question No. I left driving 2 years ago to work on the railway and when you see how other jobs treat there staff compared to transport no way would I ever go back.

Shandy123:
Thoughts?

Are you delusional ?

Shandy123:
Recommendations?

Recommend they stay well clear of driving, if they’re so thick point them in the direction of the armed forces careers offices.

Shandy123:
The students in question are unlikely to succeed in traditional academia, but they have plenty of common sense,

I’d take common sense and lack of academic qualifications over super intelligent and no common sense.

It’s a tough one, unless they’ve grown up knowing someone in the industry, it’s difficult to explain what the job is like on a day to day basis. If you get on for a good firm, then it’s a good job - if you end up for a rubbish firm, it’s a miserable existance, but as a newbie you end up generally having to do the carp jobs and they need to be prepared for that.

I still love my industry, though I don’t drive any more. Often wish I did, deskwork is not really my cup of tea.

Although my history with the teaching profession is more ■■■■■■ than educational (different times), it’s always going to be a constant that there are ‘the unteachables’ in any classroom.

It’s good that a teacher spots these and cares enough to point them in a direction they may be successful at.

Now your average unteachable is easily spotted as they are one of the cool kids, popular, self sufficient and capable of a particular style of daring doo that shoves 2 fingers up at established rules and socially acceptable politically correct compliance.

These stars are the truckers of tomorrow (although technology may make them redundant), they should be shown the beauties of a life on the open road and left to make their own choices.

Many an older trucker like me will happily take them under their wing and show them the ropes, straps and maybe even the golden rivet.

So in conclusion, show them the road and it’s up to them if they want to drive it, not gender specific either so if there’s any 17 year old young ladies who may be better suited to driving be sure to nurture them accordingly.

The irony is by becoming a trucker you automatically become an expert on everything.

There’s no way I would recommend wagon driving to my worst enemy!
Learning a trade is the way to go for young people that are not bright enough to do anything else.

My friends who have a trade laugh at me for the amount of hours I have to work Just to earn in 5 days what they easily earn in 2/3 days. In fact they cannot believe that I am legally allowed to work the hours that we do. In ‘normal’ jobs you would only be expected to work 3 days per week doing 12/13 hour shifts!

No, never.
I have experienced a few different vocations in my life, some up to senior management level.
I decided to drive because it was something I had always wanted to do and my father drove for a living, so a bit of emotional attachment in there as well.

I have never been treated so badly in all my life, by the delivery point, not employers, consequently I am banned from several places, mainly for questioning the over zealous rules and regs.
Other drivers are usually incapable of stringing together a coherent sentence, let alone a paragraph.

There is no infrastructure to support what is one of the most important industries this country has and it is regulated by a Govt. that is only interested in revenue and how to procure it.

Safety design of the vehicles is non-existent and I doubt very much any of the LGV`s on the road would satisfy a rigorous H&S risk assessment in context of driver safety in event of a full frontal impact. Those who live in their vehicles on a weekly basis (tramping) are doing so with a vehicle not fit for purpose and with scant facilities on the road, it is criminal and inhuman.

Conditions of the roads in every aspect is not fit for purpose, design, planning and road furniture is often at eye level, blocking your view and therefore negating any subsequent planning the driver has undertook approaching the junction.

Other driver standards are declining and the law is immediately against you in most instances when a death is involved on the road if you are part of it (or is that just media reporting bias?)

In conclusion I would never influence anyone to go into haulage, it is an industry that requires modernisation in attitude, equipment, environment and expectation.

Sad, but that is my view at this moment.

I was one of those, who because I was academically capable, the teachers and my parents hammered it into me that University was the only way to go. I’ve only just finished, and I hated everything about it. The culture, the course, the people, everything! The grafting your arse off, only for when you finish, every graduate job in the area has 25,000 applicants, and the only realistic jobs out there are low-skill, low-pay office jobs, or in a call centre, where every other bugger there went straight from school! I regret going to Uni, big time, and wish I would have either got a trade, or just worked my arse off for five years, to pay for some meaningful qualifications, like for the oil rigs or something like that. Put my supposedly above average intelligence into becoming a cracking plumber, or starting a business, something like that.

If you do something meaningful at Uni, like medicine, law, languages, stuff you NEED a degree for, and there are always demands for, then you’re laughing, but in my opinion it’s a waste of time doing “Logistics management”, media, film, that sort of thing, there just aren’t jobs for it. You may as well get a trade than do a crap degree, or just work hard from school and maybe be in a managerial position by the time your mates are graduating from Uni.

A sensible thing to do with the kids would be to outline the pros and cons of the job, like anything else. They will soon come to their own conclusions. I can see the being on your own, lone wolf, feet-up in a lay-by watching a DVD being quite an attraction for kids, especially when they’re at the “hate mum and dad”, Kevin and Perry stage. The goths would love it! :smiley:

It’s true that there are jobs out there that you can get the same wage as driving for, but only doing three day’s work, but it’s no reason to ignore the possibility of a driving career. You never know, the kids might love it.

Shandy123:
I am a full-time teacher/part-time driver. Some of my students have got wind of the fact that I drive (copies of T&D lying around, etc…) and some have mentioned to me that they want to pursue it as a career.
Now, much as I love driving, I have only ever done it for a few extra quid, apart from my first year of HGV work when I was ‘between jobs’ (IE unemployed). I suspect that few of my current students are going to walk into a well-paid driving job from day one, although there is plenty of driving work around in my area.
The students in question are unlikely to succeed in traditional academia, but they have plenty of common sense, and I can see them doing well in driving, but I worry that they will pursue it, spend thousands on the courses and testing and then find themselves in a job wilderness for years.

Thoughts?
Recommendations?

Steering a child towards trucking is really something you want to do to the pupils you dislike (if any), not to those to whom you want to give a helping hand.

There’s plenty of driving work around because basically the industry has guys doing the job at say £10 an hour, and are then advertising all the same work again at £9. If nobody bites, they claim there’s half a million unfilled vacancies, and if a cheaper driver does bite, then a driver at the current going rate gets thrown back into the water (to be told there’s half a million vacancies for him, now at £8 an hour).

It’s a crazy game for a new driver to drop five grand on. Become a taxi driver instead, or an FLT for a local warehouse. The only exception is if you get an offer to drive for a firm in a niche market whose operation you already know and you know you’d fit in (perhaps because you’re an existing employee in a different role, or because of family connections) - and then, if that firm is not paying for your training, then you need to look at what they’re offering you which makes it worth spending your money on it (it almost certainly won’t be worthwhile).

And remember, if you do get such an offer, it’s the very best offer you’ll ever get in the current market - don’t think you’ll take advantage of the training and experience, and then move on to something better in a few years. It won’t get any better, because an offer of training and employment is the best you can expect from the industry and it means the firm who’ve offered you it are already desperate for a driver to the point of squealing, and the wages they offer you post-training to retain you will be already at the high water mark of the market.

Rottweiler22:
I was one of those, who because I was academically capable, the teachers and my parents hammered it into me that University was the only way to go. I’ve only just finished, and I hated everything about it. The culture, the course, the people, everything! The grafting your arse off, only for when you finish, every graduate job in the area has 25,000 applicants, and the only realistic jobs out there are low-skill, low-pay office jobs, or in a call centre, where every other bugger there went straight from school! I regret going to Uni, big time, and wish I would have either got a trade, or just worked my arse off for five years, to pay for some meaningful qualifications, like for the oil rigs or something like that. Put my supposedly above average intelligence into becoming a cracking plumber, or starting a business, something like that.

If you do something meaningful at Uni, like medicine, law, languages, stuff you NEED a degree for, and there are always demands for, then you’re laughing, but in my opinion it’s a waste of time doing “Logistics management”, media, film, that sort of thing, there just aren’t jobs for it. You may as well get a trade than do a crap degree, or just work hard from school and maybe be in a managerial position by the time your mates are graduating from Uni.

Or just shut yourself in a cupboard for 5 years. University is just a way of disguising the real rates of youth unemployment and the dearth of real opportunities, getting youths to pay for this warehousing on their own credit, and then at the end of it putting you in roles that brighter primary school leavers could fill.

You might get into a managerial position without a degree, but that is because those managerial positions never did require a degree, and they’re being paid at a fraction of a proper standard of living anyway (never mind a proper wage for a managerial position) which was the whole reason people were going to university (to avoid ending up as, say, a retail store manager on just £16k a year).

I’ve met team leaders and managers in other occupations who are on minimum wage. They told me about how their salary improved at promotion - but they didn’t seem to realise, as I did immediately, that the increase only paid for their routine overtime (effectively leaving them no additional remuneration to cover their increased responsibilities and pressures).

Generally speaking, you’ll only have a chance of a reasonable income these days if you’re smart but also of loose morals - a sharp salesman, for example, or a manager who can shrewdly and relentlessly cut the wage bill without causing uproar (or crack the whip and wring out more from people for the same pay), or a tradesman who can cut corners with cheaper materials (say, by using cheap inflammable materials where the law requires something fire-proof).

If you’re an essentially decent salesman, you’ll struggle to find work; if you’re a decent manager who wants to take care of people, you’ll miss your targets or resign in distaste at the moral compromises your budget demands; if you’re a competent tradesman working properly, you’ll earn less than minimum wage for your time. This is what market competition really is: forcing moral people to compete with the immoral, forcing decent firms to compete with the indecent, forcing those who internalise their costs to compete with those who externalise them.

A sensible thing to do with the kids would be to outline the pros and cons of the job, like anything else. They will soon come to their own conclusions. I can see the being on your own, lone wolf, feet-up in a lay-by watching a DVD being quite an attraction for kids, especially when they’re at the “hate mum and dad”, Kevin and Perry stage. The goths would love it! :smiley:

It’s true that there are jobs out there that you can get the same wage as driving for, but only doing three day’s work, but it’s no reason to ignore the possibility of a driving career. You never know, the kids might love it.

Well, if the kids start at 18, I’d say the first thing they’ll notice is that everyone else is at least 20 years older, but look closer to 40 years older, and very quickly they’ll learn the reasons for it. They’ll learn why drivers rooms are dank, grimy, and with more security than the post office counter - prison cells are cleaner, quieter, and comfier. They’ll learn the joys of starting work in the summer before the sun comes up, and finishing after it has gone down. Oh yes, they just might love it!

mac12:
Easy answer to this question No. I left driving 2 years ago to work on the railway and when you see how other jobs treat there staff compared to transport no way would I ever go back.

Depends on the job. Where I am we’re treated very well, even the agency. My son has just started on the path to getting his HGV license. I’ve done it longer than he has been alive so he’s been aware of the hours it involves and how crap it can be and he has been out with me a lot so he is under no illusion of what the job is like. He is doing it because he says its far more challenging than what he does and he’ll not be stuck in a windowless room working on machinery 12hrs a day.

As for the comments about the wages, for an 18-21 or even 25 year old the wages that they can get driving a truck are a lot better than they’re looking at in most other jobs at that age, even the skilled ones. Hell where I am working currently at Howdens Joinery you’ll struggle to find many professional jobs in the area paying the same wage. There are a lot of people in the East Yorkshire area with degrees in jobs which require degrees working for a lot less money than truck drivers get.

I will however make this final point. Unlike us its not going to be a job that will see them through to retirement. I reckon automated trucks will be along in 20 years and it’ll be a very niche few things that actually require a person at the wheel.

Driving trucks isn’t something that you need to recommend to anyone.Generally those who want to do the job know it from an early point and then concentrate on that goal to the exclusion of all else.The question is then more one of them telling teachers and parents etc trying to direct them into other types of jobs,to do one. :bulb:

This is an interesting debate. As a ‘young n’ (35) I have only just started out in the industry. My father had been a hgv driver for years and he told me to not be a driver. Many students/teenagers do not listen to parents/teachers advice and I to decided to ignore this warning.

The industry is changing - arguably for the better and I’m glad I have started in the industry albeit late in life. I have learned that decisions that I make have pitfalls and I may fall on my sword and wait for the ‘I told you so’! I have not regretted -so far, self funding the licence and quitting the banking industry. If you enjoy the job and lifestyle then that is the most self fulfilling choice somebody can make. One is still learning and that is not limited to just work activities. But, obstacles I come across daily is the negativity that some drivers promote including rubbish wages; job stealing; long hours etc… On the plus side of this, if a new entrant into the industry can ignore this white noise and challenge the social norms then these issues can be character building and add personal value, furthermore, if the ‘new entrant/new starter’ decides to change career direction or industry, these valuable lessons and skills learned can be transferred.

Now before somebody says ‘you’ve worked in a bank so you must have had a silver spoon, university upbringing’ then I would like to put that to bed. I left school and became a mechanic. My point is drivers can be very intelligent and drivers can be thick. However thick drivers can become less thick. To tarnish an industry because of archaic views such as if you’ve achieved poor grades then choose the forces or become a driver, simply does not stand. I say this all in good nature but as I have mentioned before- if a driver complains about job stealing and puts off new starters then paradoxically you will give rise to either more youngsters joining that won’t listen to what you say and take advantage of opportunities that other long term drivers do not want–or the ‘immigrant’ who can’t understand what you’re saying.

I would recommend this industry because if anything there must be at least one thing that is good about it but it may be for the student to discover for him/herself.

YES why not, compared with the sort of jobs these youngsters will wind up in, driving is not a bad option. I think Conor has it about right, though I think it will take a lot more than twenty years before most trucks are driverless.
I wish I’d started driving a lot younger than I did as the job I have now is a lot better than most of the jobs I’ve had over the years and that means pay as well as conditions.

Carryfast:
Driving trucks isn’t something that you need to recommend to anyone.Generally those who want to do the job know it from an early point and then concentrate on that goal to the exclusion of all else.The question is then more one of them telling teachers and parents etc trying to direct them into other types of jobs,to do one. :bulb:

Another generalisation, know people who wanted to drive trucks from school, but I didn’t aim to be driving trucks, only took my test as a bit of a challenge, then circumstances changed and I needed a new job so started driving and enjoyed it. I know other who started after they left the forces, and one who started driving trucks after many years in the police.

xichrisxi:
So your asking if HGV driving is a good place to send the thicko’s■■?

Yes probably.

This is the problem with our education system, totally geared towards academia to make the school look good in the league tables, and writing off those who aren’t academic, instead of helping them forfill their potential.

Now to the question, I don’t think you can seriously sell HGV driving as a career, but there are good jobs out there, but judging from written here plenty of crap jobs as well.

Personally for me getting an HGV licence has been a good thing, I’ve been to some interesting places, met loads of interesting people, been treated very well, and been and get paid well. But the downside is that I spend many days away from home, not a problem me, but doesn’t suit everybody’s lifestyle.

So I couldn’t really give a blanket don’t do it, but I think the best you can do, if give them an honest opinion of life as a truck driver, and of course if you have a few pupils who aren’t very good at geography, maths, have poor communication skills then you could always suggest they should look into becoming a traffic planner. :laughing:

Conor:
As for the comments about the wages, for an 18-21 or even 25 year old the wages that they can get driving a truck are a lot better than they’re looking at in most other jobs at that age, even the skilled ones. Hell where I am working currently at Howdens Joinery you’ll struggle to find many professional jobs in the area paying the same wage. There are a lot of people in the East Yorkshire area with degrees in jobs which require degrees working for a lot less money than truck drivers get.

I will however make this final point. Unlike us its not going to be a job that will see them through to retirement. I reckon automated trucks will be along in 20 years and it’ll be a very niche few things that actually require a person at the wheel.

Yep, my two youngsters that started before their 25th birthdays are earning more than their mates. They aren’t academics, left school soon as they could, but they aren’t thick by any means. No way round it hours are going to be long with Euro work, but nowhere else would they earn late 30k to early 40k (+ expenses ).