I’ve recently transferred to Tesco / Stobart at Middlewich (ditch) in Cheshire having previously worked out of James Irlam Logistics at Stoke on Trent. (the depot by J15 of the M6)
I’ve found myself doing considerably less hours than at Irlams (we practically ran bent tbh!) yet I’m told by my “planner” that my working average is currently circa 53hours. I find this a little odd as despite the absurd hours at JIL I never had an issue with my working time and I am well aware of the rules & regs and use POA as much as I can (as & where applicable) to keep the average down.
Trouble is, I can’t for love nor money get anybody to give me a proper breakdown of my hours from my digi rather than from what Stobart call “GTS” which is the computer system thats linked to the Isotrak that monitors our hours, POA, breaks etc.
I’m wondering if the “GTS” system is recording my time incorrectly or, given that Crimbo is fast approaching, could Stobart be pulling a fast one by making me think that my hours are high, reducing my shifts (I’ve been struggling to get a 10 hour shift over the past few weeks) which will obviously bring my average right down ready for the inevitable Christmas rush?
Surely you keep a diary to record your hours.If you don’t then you should.It would also be wise to record registration numbers of everything you drive.
i dont use i-sotrack thank god, we still use time-books, but even so surely you know you start time, finish time, cant you just check at end of shift on digi-display how much break youve had[i dont use p.o.a].
i.e
start 1.00 a.m- finish 4.00 p.m = 15 hrs
less 8 hrs break [check on display on digi at end of shift]
15-8 = 7 hrs w.t.d
do it every day and youve got your hrs for week,
mine this week is 40hrs 45 duty hours, 26 hrs 30 w.t.d,in 4 days.
to be honest even when i was doing 70/80 hrs p.w i was still below 48 hrs for the week,mine only gets near the 48 hrs when im on multi drop, when im on 1 hit +collection i struggle to get 5 hrs w.t.d in each day.
as for trying to keep hours down, so im told our rosta done to keep you at 50 hrs so they dont pay you o/t ,but also dont pay you 50 hrs for 30 hrs work, the trouble is you never get the job on the rosta so it very rarely works[this week they arnt far away],other weeks ive done 80hrs,other 40 ish.
the other question is do you do like some ,the minute it hits 46 mins its back onto other work,that can put your hours up, know a lot that soon as digi hits 31/46 its on other work so even though there fast asleep in bunk there on other work for 3/4/5 hrs,then they cant understand why there w.t.d,s so high
I used to simply write in a diary or even on my cmr, start place/time, finish place/time ferries, and daily mileage, then from the digi check the display for the driving hours, we also got photocopies of our work sheets back with our wages at the end of the month.
I fail to see how you can say you “practically ran bent” with Irlam if you didn’t keep a diary or a record either
TruckingHell:
I’ve found myself doing considerably less hours than at Irlams (we practically ran bent tbh!) yet I’m told by my “planner” that my working average is currently circa 53hours. I find this a little odd as despite the absurd hours at JIL I never had an issue with my working time and I am well aware of the rules & regs and use POA as much as I can (as & where applicable) to keep the average down.
Stobarts are probably right.
Lets give an example.
Your average working week is calculated over 26 weeks. In that 26 weeks you can record work of 1248hrs
Taking advantages of all breaks and PoAs, you record 60hrs a week at Irlams for 10 weeks. That’s 600hrs used. You then move over to Stobarts. For the remaining 16 weeks of the WTD period, you would have to record 40.5hrs OR LESS in order to average 48hrs over the 26 week period.
The longer into the 26 week period you were averaging high hours, the far fewer you’d need to do over the remaining weeks. If you record the maximum 60hrs a week every week, you’d actually have to stop working altogether for the last 5 weeks of the 26 week reference period.
Stobarts aren’t trying to screw you over. At Xmas and on the run up, its all hands on deck and the last thing they need is you sat at home.
TruckingHell:
I’ve found myself doing considerably less hours than at Irlams (we practically ran bent tbh!) yet I’m told by my “planner” that my working average is currently circa 53hours. I find this a little odd as despite the absurd hours at JIL I never had an issue with my working time and I am well aware of the rules & regs and use POA as much as I can (as & where applicable) to keep the average down.
Stobarts are probably right.
Lets give an example.
Your average working week is calculated over 26 weeks. In that 26 weeks you can record work of 1248hrs
Taking advantages of all breaks and PoAs, you record 60hrs a week at Irlams for 10 weeks. That’s 600hrs used. You then move over to Stobarts. For the remaining 16 weeks of the WTD period, you would have to record 40.5hrs OR LESS in order to average 48hrs over the 26 week period.
The longer into the 26 week period you were averaging high hours, the far fewer you’d need to do over the remaining weeks. If you record the maximum 60hrs a week every week, you’d actually have to stop working altogether for the last 5 weeks of the 26 week reference period.
Stobarts aren’t trying to screw you over. At Xmas and on the run up, its all hands on deck and the last thing they need is you sat at home.
dont know if screw you over is the right word,BUT,they do try to control your hours,they dont want driver A doing 80 hrs so paying him 30 ish hrs o/t ,then driver B doing 40,driver c doing 40,driver d doing 40,they want all 4 drivers doing 50 hrs ,so there not paying drivers o/t and some 10hrs for doing nothing,not saying it works,but i know at ours its the idea
Wheel Nut:
I used to simply write in a diary or even on my cmr, start place/time, finish place/time ferries, and daily mileage, then from the digi check the display for the driving hours, we also got photocopies of our work sheets back with our wages at the end of the month.
I fail to see how you can say you “practically ran bent” with Irlam if you didn’t keep a diary or a record either
why do you need a diary ,on the fridges you get a run sheet which you put start time,begin mileage,finish time ,finish mileage,your names on it,reg no,tri no,arr times,dept times
youve got a time book,you put start time ,finish time,breaks,w.t.d.
you dont need anything else,the infos there ,never mind us going on stobarts[iso-■■■■] system,by the sounds of it theyd be better off on our,tried and trusted system,that actually works
when i was on at asda albeit on the agency i found it the quietest time, what i mean be that is the job was snowed under… queuing at stores ect… but hours wise i was lucky to get 8hours in as the they used to kick you out of the cab and somebody else jumped in. the lorries were kept running 24 hours a day but by 3 shifts. i found i made more money in january than december.
Wheel Nut:
I used to simply write in a diary or even on my cmr, start place/time, finish place/time ferries, and daily mileage, then from the digi check the display for the driving hours, we also got photocopies of our work sheets back with our wages at the end of the month.
I fail to see how you can say you “practically ran bent” with Irlam if you didn’t keep a diary or a record either
why do you need a diary ,on the fridges you get a run sheet which you put start time,begin mileage,finish time ,finish mileage,your names on it,reg no,tri no,arr times,dept times
youve got a time book,you put start time ,finish time,breaks,w.t.d.
you dont need anything else,the infos there ,never mind us going on stobarts[iso-[zb]] system,by the sounds of it theyd be better off on our,tried and trusted system,that actually works
Because with a diary, if someone said you hit a car, damaged a trailer, failed to report a defect, went over your time or slotted a fork lift driver, you could either argue the point or prove otherwise. Can you do that with isotrak or run sheets?
Deathstar:
Surely you keep a diary to record your hours.If you don’t then you should.It would also be wise to record registration numbers of everything you drive.
That’s what we were doing in the 1970’s they were called log books and most places in the civilised world except the EU still use them instead of tachos.
Wheel Nut:
I used to simply write in a diary or even on my cmr, start place/time, finish place/time ferries, and daily mileage, then from the digi check the display for the driving hours, we also got photocopies of our work sheets back with our wages at the end of the month.
I fail to see how you can say you “practically ran bent” with Irlam if you didn’t keep a diary or a record either
why do you need a diary ,on the fridges you get a run sheet which you put start time,begin mileage,finish time ,finish mileage,your names on it,reg no,tri no,arr times,dept times
youve got a time book,you put start time ,finish time,breaks,w.t.d.
you dont need anything else,the infos there ,never mind us going on stobarts[iso-[zb]] system,by the sounds of it theyd be better off on our,tried and trusted system,that actually works
Because with a diary, if someone said you hit a car, damaged a trailer, failed to report a defect, went over your time or slotted a fork lift driver, you could either argue the point or prove otherwise. Can you do that with isotrak or run sheets?
run sheet-top right hand corner,box for writing any notes
time book-right on back of your copy of time sheet any incidents
to be honest i think if i hitting cars,smashing up trailers,missing defects,flattening forkies id probally pack up driving rather than buy a diary,but you keep writing it down in your diary if you think it helps
when i was at stobs that was the main talking/organising getting all drivers to do the same hours, it was also mentioned of no tramping! trailer depot to depot ect till it gets to its destination so as no or very little o/t would be paid and no night out money ect and no trucks parked up not being used as they said a parked truck is,nt earning!!
I’ve always kept a diary ever since i started driving,its got me out of the mire a few times as well,as when i was at Blakes chilled,a customer took me and the company to court over him refusing to pay for goods and a delivery.
Diary was used as evidence in court and the customer was done…
I always write down my hours,poa,breaks and working time in my diary and my planner rings me up every morning to take my hours,poa etc and enters it into GTS so they always tally.My Working time at the moment is running at 43hrs so i’m ok.
I think a lot of it boils down to your indivdual planner,make him/her take your details down every morning so you and their information always tallys.
Christmas rush??..i’ll wait and see if this is the calm before the storm as the work is very quiet at the moment.
ady1:
dont know if screw you over is the right word,BUT,they do try to control your hours,they dont want driver A doing 80 hrs so paying him 30 ish hrs o/t ,then driver B doing 40,driver c doing 40,driver d doing 40,they want all 4 drivers doing 50 hrs ,so there not paying drivers o/t and some 10hrs for doing nothing,not saying it works,but i know at ours its the idea
THey have to control your hours BY LAW. BY LAW you are not allowed to work more than 60 hours in any one week (PoA/breaks excluded) and what they don’t want is as I said, the last 5 weeks of a 26 week reference period spent paying agencies bucket loads of money because all their own drivers have run out of hours and are sat at home on pay. Of course they want all 4 drivers doing 50hrs FFS. By averaging it to 50hrs a week, they make sure the drivers are not exceeding the 48hr average.
I`m with wheelnut keep a diary then when bods say you done this or that you have something to arque with.
I can go back yrs what trailer i had how many miles where I tipped & loaded & now driving time & working time then you can check it yourself no need for teckno just pen & diary
stvme2519:
when your on holiday 8 hours per day count to you 48 hour average example
Only if it is part of your normal holidays, for extra holidays you don’t count 8 hours for those days.
stvme2519:
so if you exceed your hours nad your laid off you cant be paid
Course you can be paid, just because you are being paid doesn’t mean you are working. Most drivers get paid for breaks and POA but that doesn’t mean you then count those times as work instead. There is nothing legally to stop a company telling you to stay at home because you have reached your limits for the WTD and paying you for that day, well nothing other than the fact they are trying to avoid paying you.
Conor:
run out of hours and are sat at home on pay.
As that is not holiday does that time count for anything under the RT(WTD)R
Coffeeholic:
Course you can be paid, just because you are being paid doesn’t mean you are working. Most drivers get paid for breaks and POA but that doesn’t mean you then count those times as work instead. There is nothing legally to stop a company telling you to stay at home because you have reached your limits for the WTD and paying you for that day, well nothing other than the fact they are trying to avoid paying you.
