Why do lorry drivers put up with low pay

UK PROFESSIONAL DRIVERS FORUMS THE UK PROFESSIONAL DRIVERS FORUM (INTERACTIVE)
101

Olog Hai:

newmercman:
Didn’t do the miners, steelworkers and printers much good did it :open_mouth:

No, but on the other hand it hasn’t done the train drivers, ticket collectors/guards and those who stand on the barriers at Underground stations doing absolutely nothing whatsoever any harm. Virgin Trains drivers are on well over £40k basic for a four-day week one of them told me!!

In this fantasy world where drivers all join a union and stick together what would be the result? Would it go the way of the miner or the way of the train driver? The former, quite obviously. I doubt there are many Poles, Romanians and so on who could come across here and drive a train, but there is a million and one of them who can quite easily jump behind the wheel of an RHD truck.

Its not obvious at all. You really do not know. However if drivers just wing about it and do nothing and that floats there boat then that will that.

102

So this thread is now turning into " you shouldn’t expect high wages because half of your day you are doing nothing by sitting at RDC’s etc".

Sorry guys and gals, if I’m at work then I’m at work and want paying for it. It’s not my fault the units have become more efficient, comfortable and easy to drive. It’s not my fault niche skills are dying out such as roping and sheeting and its not my fault supermarkets have taken over the planet and control everything.
My boss would get far more from me if I weren’t held up at silly RDC’s with booking times that are simply there to keep someone in a job because we all know they don’t actually apply.

At the end of the day the job is still the same as it has always been i.e. move goods from a to b and it needs a driver to do that so here I am. The only thing setting drivers apart nowadays is skill and knowledge levels and this is where you can take advantage. There are high wages to be earned but these still generally involve long hours. You will not get rich driving for a company that does not value you or your abilities. Profits are the ultimate goal and you are in the way of them. Cheap foreign labour is the solution to the profit problem so how to get rid of you lot?

We need to prevent the cheap labour flooding our markets and the only way to do this is to harass your MP but we all know that is about as much use as ■■■■■■■ in a wind tunnel. A strong union could be the way forward and whilst there are unions out there professing to represent drivers, they don’t actually do anything for drivers so we need something new and fresh.

103

Harry Monk:
There’s a simple reason why drivers’ wages are what they are, and that is that we live in a free market economy where wages are determined by the law of supply and demand.

So its simples then. Create the demand by cutting off the supply!:wink:

Look at yourself as a business - you start to lose money (wages stand still for too long and your worth becomes less) but your costs keep going up (utilities, food, clothing, housing, taxes as in council tax) etc. you would as a business raise your prices or negotiate a reduction in your bills which you obviously can’t do. So the only way to redress the balance is increase your worth by reducing your availability. Simply withdraw your services until the market improves :wink:

104

beacuse vecome to lorry drivers can in 5-7 training day.just need pay 2000-3000 pound.yes this job have minus- stress,Vosa,risk of accident and much more.but anyway at present TRUCK-EASY JOB,CLEAN JOB.if people want start work in bank or …,just education taked 5 years.

105

Andrejs:
beacuse vecome to lorry drivers can in 5-7 training day.just need pay 2000-3000 pound.yes this job have minus- stress,Vosa,risk of accident and much more.but anyway at present TRUCK-EASY JOB,CLEAN JOB.if people want start work in bank or …,just education taked 5 years.

Your job may very well be clean and easy but many others are not.

106

it is not Uk drivers problem-blame everyone.in any country drivers blame everyony,and think who drivers -first job in the world.not try.in this logistic as well much more depend from planners.somebody must found contract,count everythink,buy truck and do all from A to Z.A- FOUND COTRACT,LOAD ,Z- GET PROFIT,

107

DRIVERS MUST BE VERY HAPPY WHO INSURANCE company have this rulles-hold licence 2 years.for this reason to many people don t want taked training.yes not everyone can work for LGV drivers,but to many people who can be potentional drivers,don t try become to drivers.so if this rules will be scraped and transport company start check new drivers just by one simply reasons-good or bad,so there will be no vacances ,and wages will be more less,and company will be sacked drivers much more.

108

Truckbling:

Andrejs:
beacuse vecome to lorry drivers can in 5-7 training day.just need pay 2000-3000 pound.yes this job have minus- stress,Vosa,risk of accident and much more.but anyway at present TRUCK-EASY JOB,CLEAN JOB.if people want start work in bank or …,just education taked 5 years.

Your job may very well be clean and easy but many others are not.

may be ,but my present job not very clean,not best.but drivers blame… but warehouse operatives as well must have reponsibility .factory staff,and and…every job have plus and minus

109

miketaurus:

Euro:
… because drivers won’t join a union
… because drivers won’t join a union
… because drivers won’t join a union

Euro the demographics have changed. Certainly in the private sector people now have no idea how a union can help in restoring their “RIGHT” to a healthy living wage. It is not just a “PRIVILAGE” ultimately it is a persons individual choice.

in my own personal experience, having come from a strong union family and personal dealings with unions, i would not waste any of my money or my time and i would,nt even waste my ■■■ throwing it at em anymore…

110

Harry Monk:

DrivingMissDaisy:

Harry Monk:
There’s a simple reason why drivers’ wages are what they are, and that is that we live in a free market economy where wages are determined by the law of supply and demand.

There’s no denying there’s an element of truth in that Harry but when workers are being manipulated by moving large scale populations of workers from countries that have been operating at a much lower cost base than,for example, UK PLC, then transferring them here under the banner “free movement” is nothing less than greedy and dishonest. The unacceptable face of capitalism will bring little but bad news to working people all over the world in years to come.

I couldn’t agree more, and the worst thing is that people have been brainwashed into viewing a person as “racist” if they oppose immigration policy in any way, shape or form, when all immigration policy has done is to enrich the already rich at the expense of the working class, by driving down wages and driving up the cost of housing.

Harry you are spot on with the above, I oppose the current imigration policy ect and have been called racist! even by those that know me, and know that I come from a part of the black country and my best man and several other friends are asian or afro caribean… In fact my best man (asian lad) will and does speak out against other asians who have come to this country for a better life ect but seem to want to bring the bad things they are escaping from with them… he also opposes the current imigration policy but its funny no one ever calls him racist… and he can say the exact thing as me but will get treated completely different… think its called positive racism… lol

111

Truckbling:
So this thread is now turning into " you shouldn’t expect high wages because half of your day you are doing nothing by sitting at RDC’s etc".

Sorry guys and gals, if I’m at work then I’m at work and want paying for it.

And that is what you are getting, you are paid as an unskilled labourer, yes you may have a licence to drive a lorry but it is hardly a skill is it?

There are far fewer train drivers or pilots than lorry drivers, that is because its a skilled job that need academic qualifications and far more strenuous training, we spend 4 days with an instructor who has probably become disillusioned with being away from home all week, and has probably also become grumpy after 30 years up and down the road. My friend is training to be a doctor, she will be still training in 4 years time. I hope she gets a little more than the minimum wage, as she is in hock for thousands to pay for her 6 years at University.

Supply and Demand, that is all. Stick together all you like, but while you are doing that, someone will be driving that lorry because we all want our bread with jam on it.

112

Just wait until September when the country falls to its knees because most drivers wont have a CPC !!..i wont be getting out of bed for under £35 an hour !! :stuck_out_tongue:

113

Tooz:
Just wait until September when the country falls to its knees because most drivers wont have a CPC !!..i wont be getting out of bed for under £35 an hour !! :stuck_out_tongue:

I reckon you won’t be getting out of bed much then :unamused:

114

newmercman:

Euro:
… because drivers won’t join a union
… because drivers won’t join a union
… because drivers won’t join a union

]

Didn’t do the miners, steelworkers and printers much good did it :open_mouth:

If we (westerners) did strike, we’d all get [zb]ed off and replaced by cheap imported labour, if we joined forces with the cheaper at the moment EEs, they’d [zb] them off too and go to third world countries to import labour :cry:

I don’t think that there is any inclination to strike. A well supported union is in a good position to negotiate on our behalf for better, safer, more remunerative and more attractive working conditions.

115

Wheel Nut:

Truckbling:
So this thread is now turning into " you shouldn’t expect high wages because half of your day you are doing nothing by sitting at RDC’s etc".

Sorry guys and gals, if I’m at work then I’m at work and want paying for it.

And that is what you are getting, you are paid as an unskilled labourer, yes you may have a licence to drive a lorry but it is hardly a skill is it?

There are far fewer train drivers or pilots than lorry drivers, that is because its a skilled job that need academic qualifications and far more strenuous training, we spend 4 days with an instructor who has probably become disillusioned with being away from home all week, and has probably also become grumpy after 30 years up and down the road. My friend is training to be a doctor, she will be still training in 4 years time. I hope she gets a little more than the minimum wage, as she is in hock for thousands to pay for her 6 years at University.

Supply and Demand, that is all. Stick together all you like, but while you are doing that, someone will be driving that lorry because we all want our bread with jam on it.

That’s elitist bs.Even pilots have their own unions and it’s not unknown for those unions to sometimes be involved in disputes with employers just like any other union.While although a doctor might have to go to university it’s obviously what they’re born to do just like a driver or a miner or a factory worker etc and it’s no good doctors expecting to be paid loads more than anyone else when their wage is dependent on what everyone else is earning to pay for their services.Which is why the NHS is doomed to failure,in a system whereby one group of workers,in the form of doctors,expect to be paid an elitist type wage while their patients don’t earn enough to cover it.Therefore you can bring in the cheap labour east euro etc strike breakers,to maintain the low age economy status quo,but who’s going to be covering the costs of the NHS,let alone private health care.In addition to all the other social costs involved in running ( what should be ) a modern civilised industrial economy.

In which case no doubt the doctors like your friend will be looking for a job in the remaining and ever reducing civilised parts of the world where workers in general are still paid enough to afford the real terms costs of health care. :unamused:

116

Euro:

newmercman:

Euro:
… because drivers won’t join a union
… because drivers won’t join a union
… because drivers won’t join a union

]

Didn’t do the miners, steelworkers and printers much good did it :open_mouth:

If we (westerners) did strike, we’d all get [zb]ed off and replaced by cheap imported labour, if we joined forces with the cheaper at the moment EEs, they’d [zb] them off too and go to third world countries to import labour :cry:

I don’t think that there is any inclination to strike. A well supported union is in a good position to negotiate on our behalf for better, safer, more remunerative and more attractive working conditions.

History shows that’s an impossible contradiction.It’s only by the real threat of united indefinite strike action that unions can do what you’ve described.

117

fredthered:

Harry Monk:
There’s a simple reason why drivers’ wages are what they are, and that is that we live in a free market economy where wages are determined by the law of supply and demand.

So its simples then. Create the demand by cutting off the supply!:wink:

Look at yourself as a business - you start to lose money (wages stand still for too long and your worth becomes less) but your costs keep going up (utilities, food, clothing, housing, taxes as in council tax) etc. you would as a business raise your prices or negotiate a reduction in your bills which you obviously can’t do. So the only way to redress the balance is increase your worth by reducing your availability. Simply withdraw your services until the market improves :wink:

The problem in this case being that it’s a labour market that’s rigged in favour of the employers not the workers.Your idea would only work in a closed labour market that’s insulated from the supply of cheap foreign labour in addition to workers who are prepared to fight to improve their conditions as opposed to acting like a defeated rabble.

118

dle1uk:

Harry Monk:

DrivingMissDaisy:

Harry Monk:
There’s a simple reason why drivers’ wages are what they are, and that is that we live in a free market economy where wages are determined by the law of supply and demand.

There’s no denying there’s an element of truth in that Harry but when workers are being manipulated by moving large scale populations of workers from countries that have been operating at a much lower cost base than,for example, UK PLC, then transferring them here under the banner “free movement” is nothing less than greedy and dishonest. The unacceptable face of capitalism will bring little but bad news to working people all over the world in years to come.

I couldn’t agree more, and the worst thing is that people have been brainwashed into viewing a person as “racist” if they oppose immigration policy in any way, shape or form, when all immigration policy has done is to enrich the already rich at the expense of the working class, by driving down wages and driving up the cost of housing.

Harry you are spot on with the above, I oppose the current imigration policy ect and have been called racist! even by those that know me, and know that I come from a part of the black country and my best man and several other friends are asian or afro caribean… In fact my best man (asian lad) will and does speak out against other asians who have come to this country for a better life ect but seem to want to bring the bad things they are escaping from with them… he also opposes the current imigration policy but its funny no one ever calls him racist… and he can say the exact thing as me but will get treated completely different… think its called positive racism… lol

I actually managed to write (& get published) a magazine article about the negative effects of immigration in the transport industry and I’m a white man :open_mouth:

I had to move to Canada to do it and be an immigrant myself though. It is a very touchy subject and it is very difficult to put your point across without appearing racist and the thing that causes that is skin colour or ethnicity. Our brains will naturally label things, so we tend to focus on the easiest identifier which is skin colour or accent.

As soon as we do that we’re branded racists, however it isn’t the colour of the skin and it doesn’t matter where somebody comes from, if their behaviour is very different from ours then we find it offensive. The current anti muslim feeling being a prime example of that, their behavior is offensive (in some cases) but object and you’re a racist :unamused:

Should we be offended by people coming from other countries and pricing us out of a job? [zb]ing right we should…on the surface…but what is another country apart from a line on a map that has been drawn by a king or emperor type figure in the past and is maintained by the current equivalent (a banker or business) they decide where the money is distributed and how much goes where.

Look at us (westerners) with our houses, multiple family cars, electronic gadgets, shops full of food, holidays etc etc, then compare the life of an African, our country produces SFA, yet in Africa there are diamonds, oil and all kinds of sought after minerals, yet the population live in poverty while a few mega rich cream all the money off the top.

The same applied to Russia and the former Warsaw Pact countries, look at the Abramovich’s of this world as perfect examples. They have so much money that they pay millions for a painting or piece of art, now it may well be a nice vase, but it’s only a vase ffs, yet they’ll pay millions for it and where does that money come from? From us, the working man and one vase ain’t enough for them, they want them all.

So how do they go about it? Simple, they get the people to earn it for them by manipulating economic policies, aided and abetted by their banker friends and their puppets in government.

We don’t need to get all our colleagues onside for a lorry driver strike for a couple of quid an hour, we need to get our fellow men onside, be they white, black, yellow or whatever and stand together to knock the head off the monster that is threatening to devour us all in its quest for money and power :open_mouth:

119

newmercman:

dle1uk:

Harry Monk:

DrivingMissDaisy:

Harry Monk:
There’s a simple reason why drivers’ wages are what they are, and that is that we live in a free market economy where wages are determined by the law of supply and demand.

There’s no denying there’s an element of truth in that Harry but when workers are being manipulated by moving large scale populations of workers from countries that have been operating at a much lower cost base than,for example, UK PLC, then transferring them here under the banner “free movement” is nothing less than greedy and dishonest. The unacceptable face of capitalism will bring little but bad news to working people all over the world in years to come.

I couldn’t agree more, and the worst thing is that people have been brainwashed into viewing a person as “racist” if they oppose immigration policy in any way, shape or form, when all immigration policy has done is to enrich the already rich at the expense of the working class, by driving down wages and driving up the cost of housing.

Harry you are spot on with the above, I oppose the current imigration policy ect and have been called racist! even by those that know me, and know that I come from a part of the black country and my best man and several other friends are asian or afro caribean… In fact my best man (asian lad) will and does speak out against other asians who have come to this country for a better life ect but seem to want to bring the bad things they are escaping from with them… he also opposes the current imigration policy but its funny no one ever calls him racist… and he can say the exact thing as me but will get treated completely different… think its called positive racism… lol

I actually managed to write (& get published) a magazine article about the negative effects of immigration in the transport industry and I’m a white man :open_mouth:

I had to move to Canada to do it and be an immigrant myself though. It is a very touchy subject and it is very difficult to put your point across without appearing racist and the thing that causes that is skin colour or ethnicity. Our brains will naturally label things, so we tend to focus on the easiest identifier which is skin colour or accent.

As soon as we do that we’re branded racists, however it isn’t the colour of the skin and it doesn’t matter where somebody comes from, if their behaviour is very different from ours then we find it offensive. The current anti muslim feeling being a prime example of that, their behavior is offensive (in some cases) but object and you’re a racist :unamused:

Should we be offended by people coming from other countries and pricing us out of a job? [zb]ing right we should…on the surface…but what is another country apart from a line on a map that has been drawn by a king or emperor type figure in the past and is maintained by the current equivalent (a banker or business) they decide where the money is distributed and how much goes where.

Look at us (westerners) with our houses, multiple family cars, electronic gadgets, shops full of food, holidays etc etc, then compare the life of an African, our country produces SFA, yet in Africa there are diamonds, oil and all kinds of sought after minerals, yet the population live in poverty while a few mega rich cream all the money off the top.

The same applied to Russia and the former Warsaw Pact countries, look at the Abramovich’s of this world as perfect examples. They have so much money that they pay millions for a painting or piece of art, now it may well be a nice vase, but it’s only a vase ffs, yet they’ll pay millions for it and where does that money come from? From us, the working man and one vase ain’t enough for them, they want them all.

So how do they go about it? Simple, they get the people to earn it for them by manipulating economic policies, aided and abetted by their banker friends and their puppets in government.

We don’t need to get all our colleagues onside for a lorry driver strike for a couple of quid an hour, we need to get our fellow men onside, be they white, black, yellow or whatever and stand together to knock the head off the monster that is threatening to devour us all in its quest for money and power :open_mouth:

:open_mouth:

That could have been written by any idealistic socialist union leader or misguided Labour Party member of the type which wrecked the Labour Party and led the unions into the mistake of following socialism.Forget all about the idea of workers of the world unite.Countries and borders and different ethnicities are there for a reason and it’s up to the seperate nations’ workers to look after themselves on a national basis.However that doesn’t mean the same thing as national socialism.As in all cases it all goes pear shaped when ‘socialism’ gets into the act regardless of what type of socialism it happens to be.

Ironically the thing that’s threatening to devour us in it’s quest for money and power is the logical conclusion of the wrong type of Capitalism joining forces with what the idea of workers of the world unite actually always inevitably leads to in the form of socialism. :bulb:

120

TBH, lorry driving has got easier over the years, very little handball, very little roping and sheeting, sitting in RDC’s not having to unload yourself, auto lorries, mainly new’ish lorries, night heaters/air con.
Sadly, the market sets the wages.
We all want stuff cheaper, and the biggest cost of most stuff is transport, so the wages get driven down
If we were all in a union would it make any difference?, I think not.