Newmercman have you been watching Zeitgeist ? Slavery still going strong 21st century Britain . This current version of capitalism is finished , debt has never been so high ,theres no more pages to turn, we are in the worse case scenario age . Personal greed is flourishing while the masses feed it. Now it looks as though we could potentially see a civil war on our doorstep with the Ukraine… But if you have a job your`e lucky(?)…
Rhythm Thief:
The main problem this country has is it seems to think it’s still 1850. We’re yesterday’s news and no longer a world power and if we could only accept that and come to terms with our new place in the world, we’d be a better and happier nation for it. However, try complaining to a Syrian refugee or a member of the Egyptian opposition about how terrible living here is and you’ll soon change your mind. For all that it’s not what it once was, Britain still isn’t bad.
You’re getting a little off track there I think. Being stuck in the past is not the issue. Walking into the future with eyes and ears closed is where many will come unstuck when the brown stuff meets the fan. Oligarchy is as you say a real threat here and in Egypt and Syria and Ukraine and everywhere else in the world where you can see people at each others throats. And that’s where they want us, not at their throats.
DrivingMissDaisy:
Rhythm Thief:
The main problem this country has is it seems to think it’s still 1850. We’re yesterday’s news and no longer a world power and if we could only accept that and come to terms with our new place in the world, we’d be a better and happier nation for it. However, try complaining to a Syrian refugee or a member of the Egyptian opposition about how terrible living here is and you’ll soon change your mind. For all that it’s not what it once was, Britain still isn’t bad.You’re getting a little off track there I think. Being stuck in the past is not the issue. Walking into the future with eyes and ears closed is where many will come unstuck when the brown stuff meets the fan. Oligarchy is as you say a real threat here and in Egypt and Syria and Ukraine and everywhere else in the world where you can see people at each others throats. And that’s where they want us, not at their throats.
Yep, divide and rule.
Hence a certain group will be todays enemy, tomorrow another one, usually equally blameless.
The unemployed and pensioners have been recent targets for govt sponsored guided venom from the easily led, indeed still are, who next?
We know full well it won’t ever be those responsible putting their hands up.
Juddian:
Yep, divide and rule.Hence a certain group will be todays enemy, tomorrow another one, usually equally blameless.
The unemployed and pensioners have been recent targets for govt sponsored guided venom from the easily led, indeed still are, who next?
We know full well it won’t ever be those responsible putting their hands up.
I’ve seen it so often recently
employed vs. unemployed
“native Brits” (whatever they are) vs. immigrants
public sector vs. private sector
It’s all part of the same tactic. Don’t let rich people tell you who your enemies are.
TommyTucker:
Newmercman have you been watching Zeitgeist ? Slavery still going strong 21st century Britain . This current version of capitalism is finished , debt has never been so high ,theres no more pages to turn, we are in the worse case scenario age . Personal greed is flourishing while the masses feed it. Now it looks as though we could potentially see a civil war on our doorstep with the Ukraine… But if you have a job your`e lucky(?)…
‘This’ version of Communist type ‘Capitalism’ is probably far from finished more like it’s just getting started.The issues in the Ukraine are just another symptom of the whole scam which,in this case,is all about an argument between the Russian ruling elite as opposed to the EU and US ruling elite for dominance in the global free market in cheap labour and influence in what Russia ( arguably rightly ) considers it’s turf.IE a bit like the turf war between Stalin and Hitler and the following cold war.
In which the EU and US ruling elite are using the carrot of EU membership to put yet more cheap labour supply into the EU labour market while the freeloading Ukrainians think that EU membership will make them much better off in the form of EU grants and access to the EU labour market. 
In this case the resulting argument has the potential to result in more than a ‘civil war’ assuming the ethnic Russian Ukrainian population is prepared to make a fight of it and ‘if’ Russia decides to support them and ‘if’ Obama and the EU ruling elite decide that they can’t afford to lose face by backing down and letting the Russians get on with it.In which case ironically it’s a similar type of stand off that existed at the start of WW1.The only difference is that whereas then it was us supposedly supporting the Russians and the French against the Germans it’s now us supporting the Germans and the French against the Russians.
Which just leaves the question this time would the British and American working classes be sensible enough to tell the respective German/British/American etc ruling elite to zb off.Instead of yet again joining in with the scam and getting involved with an argument,between the Germans and the Slavs as to who controls what,where and who.So far the propaganda seems to be in full swing in trying to get us all behind the cause of the ‘poor downtrodden Ukrainians’ against their corrupt Russian masters.When the fact is the EU and US ruling alliance is just as corrupt if not moreso. 
Rhythm Thief:
Juddian:
Yep, divide and rule.Hence a certain group will be todays enemy, tomorrow another one, usually equally blameless.
The unemployed and pensioners have been recent targets for govt sponsored guided venom from the easily led, indeed still are, who next?
We know full well it won’t ever be those responsible putting their hands up.
I’ve seen it so often recently
employed vs. unemployed
“native Brits” (whatever they are) vs. immigrants
public sector vs. private sectorIt’s all part of the same tactic. Don’t let rich people tell you who your enemies are.
They’re quite good at this too, they throw out a few ‘facts’ and let us make our minds up about who to hate 
Look at the anti Muslim propaganda, I know there’s the odd bit of trouble around Bradford etc with the more extreme Muslims, but most British cities have a similar problem with hoodies, chavs, yobbos and scroats in general, the Muslims are no worse than them in reality, except that the powers that be have decided to use the Muslims as a method of deflecting attention from what’s really happening in the world, to further their goal, they let Muslims march and protest and all the other stuff they do that ensures they get on our ■■■■ and we focus on hating them, this way we will not stand together and fight the real enemy 
newmercman:
Rhythm Thief:
Juddian:
Yep, divide and rule.Hence a certain group will be todays enemy, tomorrow another one, usually equally blameless.
The unemployed and pensioners have been recent targets for govt sponsored guided venom from the easily led, indeed still are, who next?
We know full well it won’t ever be those responsible putting their hands up.
I’ve seen it so often recently
employed vs. unemployed
“native Brits” (whatever they are) vs. immigrants
public sector vs. private sectorIt’s all part of the same tactic. Don’t let rich people tell you who your enemies are.
They’re quite good at this too, they throw out a few ‘facts’ and let us make our minds up about who to hate
Look at the anti Muslim propaganda, I know there’s the odd bit of trouble around Bradford etc with the more extreme Muslims, but most British cities have a similar problem with hoodies, chavs, yobbos and scroats in general, the Muslims are no worse than them in reality, except that the powers that be have decided to use the Muslims as a method of deflecting attention from what’s really happening in the world, to further their goal, they let Muslims march and protest and all the other stuff they do that ensures they get on our ■■■■ and we focus on hating them, this way we will not stand together and fight the real enemy
To be fair the Muslim cause and sharia law isn’t exactly the type of regime that I’d want to be involved with.IE sometimes even the raving ruling elite controlled media gets it right.The really scary thing is that Putin seems to be making more sense than Obama at present.
None of us want to be involved in a society governed by Sharia law. Even I, as a raving loony lefty (apparently), don’t. But not all - not even most - UK muslims want this, either. Most of them just want to get on with their lives. It’s only a minority that will plant bombs in pubs and blow up innocent women and - oh, no hang on … I’m thinking of catholics.
Anyway, so that’s why lorry drivers put up with low pay.
Rhythm Thief:
None of us want to be involved in a society governed by Sharia law. Even I, as a raving loony lefty (apparently), don’t. But not all - not even most - UK muslims want this, either. Most of them just want to get on with their lives. It’s only a minority that will plant bombs in pubs and blow up innocent women and - oh, no hang on … I’m thinking of catholics.
If you were to remove extreme sharia type laws and rules from the Muslim societies around the world you wouldn’t be left with many Muslim countries.
As for the issue of ‘Catholics’ in the cases which you seem to be describing as far as I know the Catholic church made it’s position clear on that subject during the Irish civil war.While non catholics are made more welcome in places like Italy and Spain than Jewish people would be in Iran or Saudi Arabia or Hindus in Pakistan and the London bus and tube bombers didn’t give any coded warnings before they went out with the intention of actually doing what you’ve described.
when I first started driving class 1 in 1990 all the old guys kept saying that there’s going to be a drivers shortage in a Cpl of years… well 24 yrs later I’m still waiting!
There will never be a shortage of drivers and it will always be a low paid job were drivers have to work 60-70hrs per week and be away from your family all week to make good money.
My advice to any young drivers would be,dont get into driving,shelf stackers at Tesco’s will soon be on more money per hr than you!
But Islamic leaders have also - for the most part - strongly condemned the more extreme sharia law nutters. Sure, there’s the odd one who doesn’t, but then I’m tolerably certain there were catholic leaders preaching hatred against the proddies back in the day. Probably still are. You can believe otherwise, but you’re just falling for the oldest trick in the book … muslims are today’s bogeymen, just as catholics (and, by extension, the Irish generally) were in the 1970s and 1980s.
Being warned beforehand is little consolation for being blown to bits, by the way. Remember the Birmingham pub bombings? Or Omagh? Just as cowardly and despicable as the London tube bombings, and about as representative of the religion as a whole.
TTX boy:
when I first started driving class 1 in 1990 all the old guys kept saying that there’s going to be a drivers shortage in a Cpl of years… well 24 yrs later I’m still waiting!
There will never be a shortage of drivers and it will always be a low paid job were drivers have to work 60-70hrs per week and be away from your family all week to make good money.
My advice to any young drivers would be,dont get into driving,shelf stackers at Tesco’s will soon be on more money per hr than you!
i sadly agree on this ive certainly seen pay rates drop and what was once a skill/trade to have not many people want it nowadays agencys umbrella schemes etc etc i dont regret taking mine but wouldnt recomend it
[quote="itsybitsy i sadly agree on this ive certainly seen pay rates drop and what was once a skill/trade to have not many people want it nowadays agencys umbrella schemes etc etc
i dont regret taking mine but wouldnt recomend it
[/quote]
Drivers have always said this though. I remember people saying it to me 15 or 16 years ago. 
Roverman:
This is a serious question, why do we put up with such low wages? I am working for £8.26 an hour (not through choice!)
The answer is in the question, 8 pages later !!! 
TTX boy:
when I first started driving class 1 in 1990 all the old guys kept saying that there’s going to be a drivers shortage in a Cpl of years… well 24 yrs later I’m still waiting!
There will never be a shortage of drivers and it will always be a low paid job were drivers have to work 60-70hrs per week and be away from your family all week to make good money.
My advice to any young drivers would be,dont get into driving,shelf stackers at Tesco’s will soon be on more money per hr than you!
There are two seperate issues which need to be factored into that idea.Firstly there’s the one of if someone is cut out to be a driver then doing the job is more of a priority than the actual wage.Trust me,as I’ve said previously,putting a ‘driver’ to work ‘inside’ on a warehouse or factory type job is effectively like being made to do double the amount of hours if not more.IE working ‘inside’ might be less hours for similar money but in reality time drags to the point where the hours actually worked are irrelevant.
Then there’s the second issue of wage levels in general,throughout the economy,relative to prices,and it’s ‘those’ figures which are the relevant factor in the actual amount which ‘all’ workers,including drivers,can realistically earn and what sets living standards throughout the economy.Therefore the answer to the OP’s question is the former issue.However the relevant question is why are ‘workers in general’ having to put up with low pay and the answer to that is a historical and political one which is the subject of many of the discussions on the topic so far. 
Rhythm Thief:
But Islamic leaders have also - for the most part - strongly condemned the more extreme sharia law nutters. Sure, there’s the odd one who doesn’t, but then I’m tolerably certain there were catholic leaders preaching hatred against the proddies back in the day. Probably still are. You can believe otherwise, but you’re just falling for the oldest trick in the book … muslims are today’s bogeymen, just as catholics (and, by extension, the Irish generally) were in the 1970s and 1980s.
Being warned beforehand is little consolation for being blown to bits, by the way. Remember the Birmingham pub bombings? Or Omagh? Just as cowardly and despicable as the London tube bombings, and about as representative of the religion as a whole.
The Catholic community is basically governed,at least in it’s moral thinking,by what the Vatican says and which is reflected in the countries with majority catholic populations like Italy and Spain etc.Whereas the Muslim community admittedly has different sub cultures and sects but it’s fair to say that,with the exception of places like Bosnia,it’s basically governed in it’s moral thinking by it’s leadership and example in places like Saudi Arabia,Iran,and Pakistan,none of which are exactly shining examples of tolerance and civilised morals and it’s the latter of those examples where the uk muslim population mostly takes it’s leadership from.IE comparing those who take their leadership from what the Vatican says as opposed to what the leadership of Saudi,Iran,and Pakistan says is like comparing chalk and cheese.
newmercman:
In an ideal world yes, but this is far from that and there would be military or paramilitary force used to break any strike or blockade and then we would be worse off than before, living under the threat of arrest or whatever.Just as we are finding out more and more about the corruption that controls our every waking moment, through alternative news sources, the 1% and their agents are using those same sources to monitor us and worse.
Anybody with factual evidence of the wrongdoings is likely to have an accident, KR79 mentioned the WMD bloke, there are also high’ish level bankers hanging themselves and leaping out of windows. Were they about to reveal something?
In the not too distant future people like myself posting about it will likely get a visit and be dragged off to a gulag or similar, never to be seen again.
It sounds pretty far fetched, but look at it from a neutral standpoint, we’re indoctrinated to remember a version of history that we’re told to believe, intelligence is measured by our ability to memorise the stuff we are ‘taught’, creativity is frowned upon, even excelling at sports is a no no, everyone must be a winner, a few corporations dictate what we eat and they’re helped along by the government and its tax policies, a few more corporations decide what is news and what isn’t etc etc etc. Sounds a lot like communism to me…
Well we shall not bother quoting Eric Blair here; I do agree with your points…however nothing ever happens without some form of stand point on such issues. The Dockers strikes in the 1910’s for example…near revolution if I may utter the word. Communism and fair pay are a long way away from my idea of that ideology.
PS I’m watching you.
Nothing to see here
As I said, in the past yes, but now the ‘forces of evil’ have learned from their ‘mistakes’ a strike such as the one in 1910 will never happen again.
For starters no industry has enough power to bring the country to its knees, even ours, we would just be replaced by imported drivers or vehicles with drivers.
As you’ve seen by my posts, I know all about ‘the big bad wolf’ and I’m also aware enough to know that there’s SFA I can do about it, even as part of a group, so I’ll just play the system and try to enjoy life as much as possible, I’m never going to be rich, but that’s not my dream anyway, so being a subject to the rich and powerful doesn’t really bother me at all.
That possibly makes me a perfect ‘victim’ of the ruling elite, but that’s my choice, not theirs, so I have a small victory of sorts.
And the important thing is, I like driving lorries and the whole trucking industry, it’s also my hobby, so I don’t class it as work anyway, so that’s another victory for me and also for ‘them’ as I don’t mind being a chain free slave to the system 
Mums the word.
However, with all due respect you have a short sighted view on the issue…yes it’s a win win for you. If YOU are living the dream great, I am happy for you and that is not said with one once of cynicism truly not. Those that aren’t however it remains a different matter, generally the main number of guys on here are paying/working away to provide a living and house over theirs and families heads.
Tell me this…if your son or daughter drove over here for a living would you wish the same pay/conditions for them…future?