A few of the drivers at my place including myself have fell out with management after a heated discussion yesterday, apparently we need to be working more hours (day work), we are contracted to 45 paid hours per week in which we all are averaging between 45 and 50 per week over the 17 weeks for WTD as none of us have chosen to opt out, management are frustrated because deliveries are being brought back because we have all stuck together now to adhere to our contracted hours but they are saying we need to do more hours. Myself and another driver have made the point yesterday that as we are not being paid overtime we will not work extra hours to then be told we should find ourselves another job, safe to say I have said I’m having the rest of the week off whilst I find other work, are we right in standing our ground against management?
Sounds like all they have to do is create a decent overtime rate on the proviso all drivers opt out.
Or just give revised contracts to the new drivers being brought in to replace the work shy buggers. 
Seriously though more info needed like is the job any good, is the rate decent.
Classic case of talking it through with management to find a mutually beneficial resolution.
Tuckert92:
we are contracted to 45 paid hours per week in which we all are averaging between 45 and 50 per week over the 17 weeks for WTD as none of us have chosen to opt out,
Truck drivers CAN NOT opt out of the 48hr average limit the RTD sets. They can only opt-out of the 10hr maximum night shift. Management can be as frustrated as they want but IT IS ILLEGAL for you to average more than 48hrs over the reference period and 60hrs in any week. It might be worth pointing this out as it seems to me that they seem to think you are governed by the same Working Time Directive they are. You’re not. You are covered by the Road Transport Directive (Mobile Workers) which has no opt out for the 48hr average and because you’ve not opted out you can only do 10hrs (excl breaks and PoA) on nights and you are classed as a night worker if you work even a minute between 00:00 and 04:00.
Myself and another driver have made the point yesterday that as we are not being paid overtime we will not work extra hours to then be told we should find ourselves another job, safe to say I have said I’m having the rest of the week off whilst I find other work, are we right in standing our ground against management?
Absolutely. Say you’re paid weekly. If the unpaid overtime means you are averaging below the NMW for the hours you work that is illegal. If you’re paid monthly then that has to average over the month. If they offer time off in lieu that has to be taken at some point so they’d be without drivers. Then as I said, if your weekly average for the reference period is going to be over 48hrs (PoA and breaks excluded) then that is illegal also.
I would point out to them that what they’re doing is the same as Ryanair has done with its pilots and that if they’re not careful they’ll end up in the same boat as Ryanair as the drivers have maxed out their legal working hours for the 26 week reference period several weeks before that is up meaning they cannot work.
Dipper_Dave:
Sounds like all they have to do is create a decent overtime rate on the proviso all drivers opt out.
.
Truck drivers cannot opt out of the 48hr average.
Thought he meant the night time opt out thing.
Conor:
Dipper_Dave:
Sounds like all they have to do is create a decent overtime rate on the proviso all drivers opt out.
.Truck drivers cannot opt out of the 48hr average.
I think he means opting out of the average 45 hr contract he’s on over the reference period .
Multi drop class 2 work, 300 to 400 mile per day with 10-15 drops, pay is average for the area, take home 1300 per month, dealing with management who think they know the laws BUT when you provide them with facts they soon go quiet, good example is that they asked us this week not to put our cards in until the second we leave as the time spent doing vehicle checks, checking the load and strapping down and also filling in all paperwork such as vehicle checksheets and sorting our runs in an order that’s doable is time that doesn’t need to be recorded on tacho so it gives more time to do deliveries. And also getting back after a 10 hour drive and being asked to just nip out to somewhere like Liverpool in a van because they forgot to send something out. That’s the kind of firm it is lol great for a new pass to get experience until they grow wise to what else is out there.
Ahhhh the pictures getting clearer now, bloody hell your working your arse off as it is.
Tuckert92:
Myself and another driver have made the point yesterday that as we are not being paid overtime we will not work extra hours to then be told we should find ourselves another job, safe to say I have said I’m having the rest of the week off whilst I find other work, are we right in standing our ground against management?
I hope that’s holiday you’re taking because, IMHO, you are leaving yourself wide open to disciplinary charges of gross misconduct by walking off the job.
Nothing wrong with standing your ground, but suggest its time for a cool headed bit of lateral thinking here.
As Dipper mentioned you have to stand back and do some calculations, before you do anything divide your top line by the hours actually worked (not including statutory breaks) to give a mean hourly rate, comparing one job with another is meaningless without this figure…adjusted sensibly for any night/weekend/etc hours worked.
When you have that figure you will have an idea how good or badly you are being treated, if the figure is well above the average then it might be worth doing some in depth consultation with the management to see if you can reach an agreement of some sort, jaw jaw being better than war war every time.
There are busy and not so busy times in every job, i get really easy weeks and some weeks i seem to be doing loads of hours, but again get that calculator out do the maths and then compare with what is on offer elsewhere (with a large pinch of salt taken when they tell you the hours and wages you ‘can’ earn), if i asked for my hourly rate elsewhere they’d laugh me out of the office.
Sounds like you could do with a union and choosing the right shop steward you can trust.
edit.
Bugger, after typing that lot out i’ve seen your later post so ignore all i said and sod off sharpish mate, them wanting card in as you leave the depot will see Vosa (or whatever they call themselves this week) having a field day, and you don’t need to be involved in that ■■■■■■■■.
Payday tomorrow as it’s monthly Pay, that will see the notice going in first thing in the morning, it also ensures they won’t withhold my wages like they have with others in the past, had a ring round a few places this morning and there is plenty of work out there but I have to be careful not to make I stupid decision of where next just because it’s there on a plate.
Tuckert92:
Multi drop class 2 work, 300 to 400 mile per day with 10-15 drops, pay is average for the area, take home 1300 per month, dealing with management who think they know the laws BUT when you provide them with facts they soon go quiet, good example is that they asked us this week not to put our cards in until the second we leave as the time spent doing vehicle checks, checking the load and strapping down and also filling in all paperwork such as vehicle checksheets and sorting our runs in an order that’s doable is time that doesn’t need to be recorded on tacho so it gives more time to do deliveries. And also getting back after a 10 hour drive and being asked to just nip out to somewhere like Liverpool in a van because they forgot to send something out. That’s the kind of firm it is lol great for a new pass to get experience until they grow wise to what else is out there.
I dont often reply to this type of thread, but, you need to look else where,
I’m “semi retired” now this My working .
Multi drop on a puddle jumper 7.5t , 150 ~ 250 km a day ,average 20 ~ 30 drops a day, bit of hand ball, bit of tail lift work. 40hrs at basic 10hours o/t guaranteed + other worked o/t + ADR allowance ,1 hour (paid ) for lunch ,Pension contributions 5% , holidays paid all PPE supplied , work by the book , and the set procedures laid down for each job.
The lad that works 4hours a day does 53 km on a single drop and return 5 days a week takes home more than £1300 a month !
Class 1 boys get a whole lot more, and we cant get enough drivers ( of any nationality ) .
And Its not the best of company’s around here 
thats why some of the drivers have been with us 25 ~ 30yrs
So you need to look else where, really
I did not think it could get worse
Take home 1300 a month how does one live on that
sounds like bullying in the workplace… stick together lads… and good luck with your future jobs elsewhere…
If you lot are sticking together, then I wouldn’t look for other work yet, make a stand, if you and the others leave, they’ll just find a load that will do it.
Get good employment advice, as the company will start looking for little issues to get rid of those they believe the ring leaders and to divide the rest of you.
I’m personally pro Union as I’ve seem them work for the benefit of their members, others here aren’t so, my opinion is that 30 years of media union bashing has done that, but it could be bad personal experiences with union representation or unrealistic expectations on what can be achieved.
You have way too many issues to deal with at this company for£1300 take home and you’re wasting your time and energy trying to drag these ■■■■■■■ dinosaurs into the 21st century. Get out now! And name and shame!
300-400 a day 10-15 drops thats 1500 -2000 miles a week in a 45-50hr week,week in week out,surprised they can get driver newbies or otherwise
MOVE ON
Tuckert92:
Multi drop class 2 work, 300 to 400 mile per day with 10-15 drops, pay is average for the area, take home 1300 per month, dealing with management who think they know the laws BUT when you provide them with facts they soon go quiet, good example is that they asked us this week not to put our cards in until the second we leave as the time spent doing vehicle checks, checking the load and strapping down and also filling in all paperwork such as vehicle checksheets and sorting our runs in an order that’s doable is time that doesn’t need to be recorded on tacho so it gives more time to do deliveries. And also getting back after a 10 hour drive and being asked to just nip out to somewhere like Liverpool in a van because they forgot to send something out. That’s the kind of firm it is lol great for a new pass to get experience until they grow wise to what else is out there.
Providing you’ve got duty time left (out of your 15/13 hours) and the van is out of scope for EU regs, then the fact that you have maxed your EU driving hours for the day is irrelevant!
DonutUK:
Tuckert92:
Multi drop class 2 work, 300 to 400 mile per day with 10-15 drops, pay is average for the area, take home 1300 per month, dealing with management who think they know the laws BUT when you provide them with facts they soon go quiet, good example is that they asked us this week not to put our cards in until the second we leave as the time spent doing vehicle checks, checking the load and strapping down and also filling in all paperwork such as vehicle checksheets and sorting our runs in an order that’s doable is time that doesn’t need to be recorded on tacho so it gives more time to do deliveries. And also getting back after a 10 hour drive and being asked to just nip out to somewhere like Liverpool in a van because they forgot to send something out. That’s the kind of firm it is lol great for a new pass to get experience until they grow wise to what else is out there.Providing you’ve got duty time left (out of your 15/13 hours) and the van is out of scope for EU regs, then the fact that you have maxed your EU driving hours for the day is irrelevant!
Doing it for nowt is very relevant though as seems to be the case here!
Just think of the bright side, Literally no driving job is worse than the one you have now working for this circus.
£1300 p/m… 
Christ almighty, has everyone there got Drink driving convictions on their licences or something? Who on earth would work for such a company and what company would expect this. My only conversation with the management would be to how quickly can they sort out my P45 for me. Bloody wind up it must be.