Can someone post a link to what is the fine for an unstrapped load on a curtainsider.
Mmtm told me last night that he was told by a woman in a position of authourity at a Palletnetwork hub that the Scottish drivers heading back north on the M6 had all been pulled and were fined £10 per pallet which wasn’t strapped.
I thought it was a fixed £100 penalty, whether it was 1 pallet or 24.
You seem to be correct at £100, it’s fixed penalty. As soon as you hear somebody fined on the roadside for anything other than a standard fixed penalty fee, then you can assume what you are being told is BS, and it might be worth assuming anything else they say from that point is also ■■■■■■■■. 
http://brookwoodsolutions.co.uk/Brookwood/index.php/legislation/safe-loading-legislation
I think the DVSA use the following load matrix to decide whether to fine and prohibit the vehicle or just offer advice.
http://trailerassess.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderfiles/enforcementmatrixv6.pdf
theres no such thing as a fine for “an unstrapped load”
Its
A fine for a load that’s “Insecure”.
I think the rumour is £10 per outside curtain strap not being secure
nick2008:
theres no such thing as a fine for “an unstrapped load”
Its
A fine for a load that’s “Insecure”.
I think the rumour is £10 per outside curtain strap not being secure
Those palletliners have really flimsy straps that would struggle to hold anything.
If the fine were for “insecure load” rather than “missing/not applied straps” then surely EVERYONE would get pulled in or outgoing from the pallet hub?
Whatever happened to “Load bearing curtain” btw?
Would the police & VOSA not be better off applying the law to incidents where an actual incident has occured first?
“Fell of the back of a lorry”? - BOSH - Here’s a PCN with any random 3-figure number on it as ‘penalty’ my son.
Winseer:
nick2008:
theres no such thing as a fine for “an unstrapped load”
Its
A fine for a load that’s “Insecure”.
I think the rumour is £10 per outside curtain strap not being secureThose palletliners have really flimsy straps that would struggle to hold anything.
If the fine were for “insecure load” rather than “missing/not applied straps” then surely EVERYONE would get pulled in or outgoing from the pallet hub?
Whatever happened to “Load bearing curtain” btw?
There are load bearing curtains, must be to EN12642 XL, (I believe the whole trailer has to fit this standard, not just the curtains.) However VOSA, DVSA didn’t accept that they would hold a load, so you still had to use straps, but earlier this year they changed their policy on this and accepted that a load could be carried on a trailer rated to EN12642XL without straps provided it was a positive fit, which might not be much help those trucking to pallet hubs.
Winseer:
Would the police & VOSA not be better off applying the law to incidents where an actual incident has occured first?“Fell of the back of a lorry”? - BOSH - Here’s a PCN with any random 3-figure number on it as ‘penalty’ my son.
Isn’t that a bit like shutting the door after the horse has bolted?
muckles:
There are load bearing curtains, must be to EN12642 XL, (I believe the whole trailer has to fit this standard, not just the curtains.) However VOSA, DVSA didn’t accept that they would hold a load, so you still had to use straps, but earlier this year they changed their policy on this and accepted that a load could be carried on a trailer rated to EN12642XL without straps provided it was a positive fit, which might not be much help those trucking to pallet hubs.
Going on the definition of positive fit given they pretty much do as there’s no gap from the headboard and the pallets are all butted up unless the goods on the pallet are wider than the pallet in which case the goods make up the space. In fact given how some of mine are loaded when I do the odd night for a local one they take it to an extreme. The only part of my load that didn’t meet the positive fit was a JCB shovel at the back of the bottom deck as it was about 5ft wide so in the middle and more than 80mm from the curtain on one side but a ratchet strap over that would sort that out. When you stick 60+ pallets on a trailer there isn’t a lot of slack space.
Starting to see a lot of them like these though with a net for the top deck.
Winseer:
Those palletliners have really flimsy straps that would struggle to hold anything.
Tonight a strap saved my life. 
:lol:
Opened a bulging curtain with caution to find a pallet of upright heavy slabs which had another of orange juice on top straining against one poor strap. They’d wiggled left and right and that one little fella was the only thing preventing the whole lot collapsing and going over the side.
Looooo:
Opened a bulging curtain with caution
Didn’t think that opening the other side first to have a look would be a good idea ?
Nah, just stood under it and hoped for the best. I could do with a good compo claim and a few months with my feet up in a hospital bed.
muckles:
There are load bearing curtains, must be to EN12642 XL, (I believe the whole trailer has to fit this standard, not just the curtains.) However VOSA, DVSA didn’t accept that they would hold a load, so you still had to use straps, but earlier this year they changed their policy on this and accepted that a load could be carried on a trailer rated to EN12642XL without straps provided it was a positive fit, which might not be much help those trucking to pallet hubs.
Source please? Only last month it was still only in consultation phase and I’ve not seen anything in the new pages about it since.
Left hand down!:
muckles:
There are load bearing curtains, must be to EN12642 XL, (I believe the whole trailer has to fit this standard, not just the curtains.) However VOSA, DVSA didn’t accept that they would hold a load, so you still had to use straps, but earlier this year they changed their policy on this and accepted that a load could be carried on a trailer rated to EN12642XL without straps provided it was a positive fit, which might not be much help those trucking to pallet hubs.Source please? Only last month it was still only in consultation phase and I’ve not seen anything in the new pages about it since.
shep532:
Left hand down!:
muckles:
There are load bearing curtains, must be to EN12642 XL, (I believe the whole trailer has to fit this standard, not just the curtains.) However VOSA, DVSA didn’t accept that they would hold a load, so you still had to use straps, but earlier this year they changed their policy on this and accepted that a load could be carried on a trailer rated to EN12642XL without straps provided it was a positive fit, which might not be much help those trucking to pallet hubs.Source please? Only last month it was still only in consultation phase and I’ve not seen anything in the new pages about it since.
Article:
XL-rated vehiclesHowever, vehicles and trailers built to the European Standard EN 12642 XL are the exception to this rule. New European guidance (still in draft) states that vehicles built to the XL standard will meet the 50% of load securing to the side, as per the DfT Code of Practice.
Winseer:
Would the police & VOSA not be better off applying the law to incidents where an actual incident has occured first?
Very good point but … Unfortunately this is how we have been doing it in the UK for years which has left us way behind mainland Europe when it comes to actual safety. In most of mainland Europe heavy fines are handed out for a load that isn’t secured to a recognised standard - this then makes the industry try to get it right BEFORE the accidents happen - hence avoiding such fines and ultimately avoiding the incidents in the first place.
When we talk of secure loads it isn’t just whether they fall off on the road. What about incidents (such as the close call above - save by a strap) during loading or unloading where load shift during transport causes an accident? There are thousands of such incidents every year. Some make the news and court, more don’t because they are covered up or nobody reports it.
What about the driver forced to brake or swerve due to some young persons crap driving - their load shifts - they stop at the side of the road to try and sort it and get wiped out by some half asleep dozy pillock drifting off the road. That death was a result of load shift. It doesn’t matter who’s fault it was - a guy is dead - and all because of load shift.
If loads were secured properly, carried in the right vehicle for the job, drivers actually given the time and equipment to work safely etc it would prevent a lot of issues and make the industry safer and a better place to be.
There are an average of 4000 successful prosecutions for dangerous loads each year. A prosecution normally only takes place when a serious incident occurs so this doesn’t include all the £100 fixed penalties and prohibitions. Mile for mile covered by HGVs I suppose this isn’t a lot … but how many resulted in a death, disability or just pain and discomfort for someone.
In my job I meet a lot of drivers. I have met many with missing fingers, scars, limping, back injuries etc etc etc all caused by load shift incidents. I’ve met a few have served prison sentences for death by dangerous driving as well.
The British way seems to be - let’s have an accident then blame somebody. Why don’t we step back, look at the issues and prevent the accidents? It’s all about education …
Left hand down!:
shep532:
Left hand down!:
muckles:
There are load bearing curtains, must be to EN12642 XL, (I believe the whole trailer has to fit this standard, not just the curtains.) However VOSA, DVSA didn’t accept that they would hold a load, so you still had to use straps, but earlier this year they changed their policy on this and accepted that a load could be carried on a trailer rated to EN12642XL without straps provided it was a positive fit, which might not be much help those trucking to pallet hubs.Source please? Only last month it was still only in consultation phase and I’ve not seen anything in the new pages about it since.
https://movingon.blog.gov.uk/load-security-for-xl-rated-vehicles/ Any good?
Article:
XL-rated vehiclesHowever, vehicles and trailers built to the European Standard EN 12642 XL are the exception to this rule. New European guidance (still in draft) states that vehicles built to the XL standard will meet the 50% of load securing to the side, as per the DfT Code of Practice.
I read it as saying the EUROPEAN GUIDANCE is still in draft but DVSA have already adopted/accepted said guidance and right now in the UK it’s what the DVSA say/do that matters and they say
“We are accepting new standards on load security provided by XL-rated vehicles. Previously we accepted that vehicles built to the EN 12642 XL standards would provide 40% of security to the side. After consultation with industry stakeholders we now accept these vehicles as providing 50% of load security to the side — as long as the load is a positive fit.”
The one piece of information missing from the DVSA report is COEFFICIENT of FRICTION. I think you will find the finalised European Guidance will require a coefficient of friction of at least 0.5 maybe 0.6 and most loads don’t reach that sort of level. An average wooden pallet manages 0.3 so friction enhancing material would be required and most UK hauliers don’t even know what that is.
so as its going to be written inn law, that internal straps are not safe enough, and we must use outside straps, then why doesn’t the authoritys make it law that all outside straps must be on a system to the European one, and that is to fit strap and ratchet holders along the length of the trailers, where you have to use a metal bar to pull them down tight, just a thought, but I thought they were a good idea.
truckyboy:
so as its going to be written inn law, that internal straps are not safe enough, and we must use outside straps, then why doesn’t the authoritys make it law that all outside straps must be on a system to the European one, and that is to fit strap and ratchet holders along the length of the trailers, where you have to use a metal bar to pull them down tight, just a thought, but I thought they were a good idea.
Good idea, makes sense, but of course not that simple. Not all loads require them and may need something completely different. It is sufficient to simply say in law “The load must be secure” and leave it to the user to decide what is needed to achieve secure.
Law just cannot be ‘that’ prescriptive or detailed with an industry as diverse as haulage.
Even in Europe hauliers don’t have to have the ‘XL’ standard and can simply opt for EN 12642 which is a more basic standard.
The straps you refer to aren’t actually all that good either … pretty low standard tension force (STF) meaning not all that effective