Just to open some highlights in case ■■■■■■■ did NOT decide to open a factory (Darlington) in the UK?
Please no political discussions on politics, employment and hidden things…just the UK-lorry-market.
Would AEC, Atkinson, Dennison, E.R.F., Foden, Leyland, Scammell, Seddon, and many other makes more
or less benefit from the “other” (UK-based or not) engine-manufacturers?
It all depends on the time/era and as an example…DAF had a sort of a marriage with P6 Perkins but at
the ‘end’ it all proceeds with the Leyland-vention…only an example gents.
On the continent…after WWII ■■■■■■■ started with the “fruits” of Army-Surplus-chassis in which ■■■■■■■
had a steady and significant role of first supplier…and in the mid fourties “Voortstuwingstechniek” and
Denonville (respectively Holland and Belgium) had their first success both in road- and watertransport as
Clessie ■■■■■■■ intended by 1919…please read “My days with the Diesel” not really cheap nor hard to find.
ERF-Continental:
Just to open some highlights in case ■■■■■■■ did NOT decide to open a factory (Darlington) in the UK?
Please no political discussions on politics, employment and hidden things…just the UK-lorry-market.
Would AEC, Atkinson, Dennison, E.R.F., Foden, Leyland, Scammell, Seddon, and many other makes more
or less benefit from the “other” (UK-based or not) engine-manufacturers?
It all depends on the time/era and as an example…DAF had a sort of a marriage with P6 Perkins but at
the ‘end’ it all proceeds with the Leyland-vention…only an example gents.
On the continent…after WWII ■■■■■■■ started with the “fruits” of Army-Surplus-chassis in which ■■■■■■■
had a steady and significant role of first supplier…and in the mid fourties “Voortstuwingstechniek” and
Denonville (respectively Holland and Belgium) had their first success both in road- and watertransport as
Clessie ■■■■■■■ intended by 1919…please read “My days with the Diesel” not really cheap nor hard to find.
Curious about your perceptions and feedback…
Here in West OZ I recall that ■■■■■■■ Engines that were assembled in the Uk and were identified by being painted black were the preferred engine.Apparently gave longer trouble free service.
Not my observation but mentioned to me when discussing the merits of different engines with other owner drivers around the early 90s.
In 1982 I was allocated this International T2670 new powered by 300 ■■■■■■■ … I was always quick to point out that it had a tag wired near the fuel pump "■■■■■■■ Made in Scotland "
from memory they were at Airdrie the Engine color was like a dull mustard … great motor
backsplice:
In 1982 I was allocated this International T2670 new powered by 300 ■■■■■■■ … I was always quick to point out that it had a tag wired near the fuel pump "■■■■■■■ Made in Scotland "
from memory they were at Airdrie the Engine color was like a dull mustard … great motor
“from memory they were at Airdrie”
Hi Robert, the factory was at Shotts.
Oily
backsplice:
In 1982 I was allocated this International T2670 new powered by 300 ■■■■■■■ … I was always quick to point out that it had a tag wired near the fuel pump "■■■■■■■ Made in Scotland "
from memory they were at Airdrie the Engine color was like a dull mustard … great motor
“from memory they were at Airdrie”
Hi Robert, the factory was at Shotts.
Oily
DIG:
Here in West OZ I recall that ■■■■■■■ Engines that were assembled in the Uk
From memory I think ■■■■■■■ UK was an engine manufacturing operation from forge to finished product ?.Which makes sense because what would have been the point of adding shipping costs of components from US just to be assembled here.
The downside seems to have been that ■■■■■■■ UK customers didn’t have access to the developments in engine technology and outputs that ■■■■■■■ US customers had.
Don’t think that ■■■■■■■ UK could supply the 320 - 400 big cam for example from the time when it was available from ■■■■■■■ US.
Do you think Leyland AEC and maybe Foden would have entered the loose engine market?
Meadows and Dorman engines may have developed more
I know AEC supplied Atkinson with engines at some point
Also without opening a can of worms from you know you dare I mention the Detroit word?
Would these engines have gained a better foothold in the loose engine market just a few thoughts
What could have been…still is predicting with hindsight but in fact Gardner, Rolls Royce, AEC, Thornycroft etc could
by all means feel some sort of comfort as their capacity was not large enough to serve ‘all’ customers?
Also a minor discussion as the marriage between KRUPP and ■■■■■■■ with the V6 and V8 did not last long…1963-1968…
…was that a sort of stratgeic decision to ‘ENTER’ the continental market or to jump into the gap Büssing, Hanomag-Henschel,
as well as Mercedes-Benz and M.A.N. created? Just a road to any destination…
ERF-Continental:
What could have been…still is predicting with hindsight but in fact Gardner, Rolls Royce, AEC, Thornycroft etc could
by all means feel some sort of comfort as their capacity was not large enough to serve ‘all’ customers?
Also, there were strands of development that continued after manufacturers had been taken over. For instance, you mention Thornycroft. When AEC took over Thornycroft they continued to develop the excellent Thornycroft gearbox very successfully, right to the end of AEC’s life.
Thats spot on Info, The Thorny 6 speed was a very good set up, I drove a Scammell with a 180 Gardner in along with the Thorny box, There was a big gap between 4th & 5th that IMO didnt perform as good as the Scammell with the 680pp Leyland engine in, But other than that it was a great bit of gear to drive and very good on fuel, Larry, The good old days, With very little red tape,
Well speaking from experience, I had a Foden S80 Tractor Unit with a 220 ■■■■■■■ engine in It was a total waste of time, It couldnt pull the skin off a good old rice pudding, It ended up having the very hot spanner treatment sadly to say, Larry.
I recall a discussion I had with Peter Foden in around 1979 and he told me that at that time ERF were producing about 3000 chassis annually and the engines they fitted were made up of 1500 ■■■■■■■■ 1000 Gardners and the balance of 500 were RR so he added that the biggest favour us hauliers could do ERF was to order chassis with ■■■■■■■ engines ! All the ERF’s I ordered from then on had 8LXB and 8LXC engines ! Bewick.
Via ■■■■■■■ Diesel & Sales Holland I have been told that ■■■■■■■ had a dedicated type for the “Continental” but UK-produced engines,
NTK where the K indicates United Kingdom and the first 6x4 ERF-chassis (1969) had a NTK310 under the hood…perhaps a genuine UK-start
together with ERF to expand towards the continent? Please no discussions again on tipper and/or tractor…it was the SAME chassis though.
Bewick.