[Updated] Overweight, summons Issued, Advice please

[wildgoose]

Right, not a great day.

Was pulled over earlier by a traffic car coming off a roundabout, as in his words “I looked a bit heavy”.

Unfortunately, he had two guys from West Berks trading standards in the car with him, and he said he would have to take me to a weighbridge.

They weighed the gross, and both axles, was found to be 780kg overweight on the gross, and 740kg on the rear axle. In a 7.5t.

Was interviewed under caution in the back of the cop car at the weighbridge, much to the interest of a line of Hanson franchisee’s, the truck was prohibited then subsequently released again when they decided it best to ■■■■■■ me back to the yard as it was close, rather than clog up Hansons weighbridge area waiting for another truck.

Did the drive of shame at 30mph back down the road to the yard, was given a form and told I would hear from them after report has been submitted, and those on high make a decision as regards how to proceed, and off they went.

Unfortunately can’t complain about how I was treated, as apart from a condecending lecture about which way leaf springs bend laden and unladen(he was talking ■■■■■■■■, and I corrected his statement, but never mind) they were quite polite overall, I have definately come across a lot worse.

The traffic cop didn’t say a great deal for most of the time, he took an interest in in a blown brake light, but once he saw I actually did the defect report and had everything defected that needed to be, he laid off a bit. Nothing to see here.

So anyway, any advice please on the best and worst I could expect.

Am I looking at a large fine, if so, what region?
Points? How many?
Court summons…
Ban…
Execution…

etc

Why would we possibly want to do this for a living.

Save the lectures about how I should know exactly how much weight im carrying for another day, when I feel up to defending myself. I have no excuses, but with what I carry, its definately not as cut and dried as the trading standards guys would like to make out, nor is it realistic to take 2 hours out of everyday to drive to the nearest public weighbridge.

Thanks folks.

[mike-c]

I don’t know where you where or where you where going to, is there any chance you could say you where on your way to [insert name of public weighbridge] ? It might be a way out for you, depends upon if you made a statement or what you told them? If you’re found guilty i imagine you and the people who loaded you up would get a couple hundred quid fine each.

[wildgoose]

Unfortunately one of the questions in the interview was “were you on your way to a weighbridge” I said no, because i’ve only been working there for a few weeks, and hadn’t the first clue where the nearest one was.

He did subsequently show me the list, there was on in Thatcham apparently, but I was travelling the opposite direction on the A4 when was tugged. The list of delivery notes was in my windscreen.

I’m guessing the weighbridge did a reasonable job of finding me guilty.

[wildgoose]

Also, any idea how long it will be before I hear something, weeks? Months?

[mike-c]

You’ll hear in a few weeks, no points,no ban just a fine.

Recommended fine according
to Magistrates Association
Weight limits and overloading HGV Driver - £360
HGV Owner - £750

For overloading, add £30 for each 1% of overload (ignoring the first 10%) but always have regard for commercial gain and damage to roads.

[big_bear]

From your description they weighed you on a one piece plate bridge which is fine for your gross weight.But for accurate axle weights you should have been weighed on a dynamic (axle) weigher i think.You need to get some proper legal advice.Also you can ask to see the calibration certificate for that weighbridge.It would not be the first time I,ve seen an expired one in that case
good night case.

[wildfire]

did you have weights on your delivery notes for each drop? if you did they might hammer you harder as it is your responsibility to check them as much as your employer, who should of know the weight of the product he was loading on to you before it left the yard. sorry but they are starting to tighten right up on weights now, with the price of fuel going up they know people are going to cut corners, and try to save a journey by putting on that one extra drop!!!

[deepinvet]

Speak to a brief, I do know of a Hanson weighbridge that is a long way out!!!
Get a good one and they will rip them to bits.

[dieseldave]

Hi WildGoose, By my dodgy maths, you were approx 10.4% overloaded on your gross weight.
Can’t give you the figure for the rear axle overload without knowing the info from the plate in the cab.

Back in my day, that was often treated as two separate offences, but I’m not sure whether they still take that view.

IMHO, Deepinvet has a great point, and I’d also suggest that you see a transport ‘savvy’ solicitor asap.

As you said, “not a great day.”

[wheel_nut]

dieseldave:
Hi WildGoose, By my dodgy maths, you were approx 10.4% overloaded on your gross weight.
Can’t give you the figure for the rear axle overload without knowing the info from the plate in the cab.

Back in my day, that was often treated as two separate offences, but I’m not sure whether they still take that view.

IMHO, Deepinvet has a great point, and I’d also suggest that you see a transport ‘savvy’ solicitor asap.

As you said, “not a great day.”

I reckoned the same Dave, so the brain cells must be just as tired. But you have said it might be two offences. I also think that is the case, and where we may have got away scott free with the gross overload, it is the axle weight where they will hang him .

From my experience many years ago, trading standards just will not let something go. I will be interested in the outcome of this case…

[rikki-uk]

Unforuantly over loaded is almost undefendable, it is an absolute offence… you are over weight therefore you are guilty

You have lost your only get out in that you were not heading for you nearest weighbridge.

You could try to defend the axle weight charge as a plate bridge wil not give accurate axle weights, also you could try to get the bridge calibration certs , if they cant produce them then the weights are invalid.

But to be honest thats clutching at straws.

I hate to say it mate but on what you have said here you are looking at a hefty fine

[hitch]

also a bit worrying
was the fact you took no notice of the way the leaf springs where

Mr Plod mentioned this and you said he was talking zb
dunno what he said
but on little trucks the giveaway is the way the springs are sitting

so if you knew about the reaction of springs why did you not notice a
problem

as been said if you shell out for brief he may find a loophole
but overweight is overweight

dont be suprised if you now get points

[albion]

Since I don’t know the circumstances of your load, this may or may not be relevant.

Last time we got done for an overload, (about 4 years back, 5.2% over), we had delivery notes with the weight on. Unfortunately the product we were carrying had been modified over the years, but no-one had had thought of how it would affect the weight and told our customers transport office. We still got done as a firm, about £500.00 if I remember right and the driver about £100.00. We paid the driver’s fine as it genuinely wasn’t his fault ( I saw the truck and it looked OK).

About the only mitigating circumstances are if the weight you have been given by the customer is incorrect. I always make sure the weight is on the notes or that when the order is placed, the weight is on the booking.

[big_bear]

You can be liable for points if the overloading is thought to make the vehicle dangerous to drive.What Rikki said is true you should not have said anything when interviwed under caution without taking legal advice first.

[mikejk]

WildGoose:
.

They weighed the gross, and both axles, was found to be 780kg overweight on the gross, and 740kg on the rear axle. In a 7.5t.

In my best John Mcenroe ‘you cannot be serious’ you mean to tell me that you had 122 stone, that’s your normal load plus an extra 12 10 stone people in you wagon and you were supprised when found to be overweight

[olog_hai]

i have been done for overloaded once in my less experienced, ‘doesn’t matter it will be ok’ days. 2.5 tonne over on an axle. Got the full interview by one of the vosa men under caution, and then the prohibition. i then asked him what was likely to happen then, and he explained that it would be a court job but the offence was non-endorsable, i.e. i would get no points.

Months and months later i got the letter of prosecution, but at this point my employers took over dealing with it and i pleaded guilty by post with a grovelling letter. The upshot was a £800 fine, although it didn’t bother me as my by now ex-emplyers paid it.

[wildgoose]

First off thanks for all the advice folks, its appreciated, I intend to pop into the Hanson weighbridge this week to ask about the calibration certificate.

In my best John Mcenroe ‘you cannot be serious’ you mean to tell me that you had 122 stone, that’s your normal load plus an extra 12 10 stone people in you wagon and you were supprised when found to be overweight

No idea , I am young enough to work in metric. Also don’t remember mentioning I was surprised, at any point in my original post, but thanks for the sarcasm

You can be liable for points if the overloading is thought to make the vehicle dangerous to drive.What Rikki said is true you should not have said anything when interviwed under caution without taking legal advice first.

Definately true, I wish I had neglected to give an interview now, but whats done is done.

also a bit worrying
was the fact you took no notice of the way the leaf springs where

Mr Plod mentioned this and you said he was talking zb
dunno what he said
but on little trucks the giveaway is the way the springs are sitting

It wasn’t Mr plod, it was the chap from trading standards. Plod said very little for the whole ordeal apart from checking my licence and defect report.

The guy was trying to tell me, that unladen, or safely laden, a trucks leaf springs will curve downwards, i.e. a smiley face type affair. Then when overloaded they will curve the opposite way, a dead giveaway in his words.

I happened to have studied such things in my previous job so was quite confident to point out to him that he was talking nonsense. Leaf springs vary in design, there are dozens of variables across manufacturer and vehicle, so a sweeping generalisation such as his, was due to be corrected, before he tried spouting it to the next unfortunate he came across.

If anyone can tell the difference in how a leaf spring looks when supporting 7.5t or 8.3t then you are a better man than I, clearly.

in my less experienced, ‘doesn’t matter it will be ok’ days

Yes, think i’ve just passed through that stage, nothing like being caught out to drag you swiftly back down to earth with a bump.

Ultimately, I took out the load that was allocated to me, it was all laid out on pallets in the yard I simply forklifted it on. The boss thought it was ok, so naturally so did I. Not a mistake I will be making again, but those of you who have been there will probably remember how easy it is to be blasé about weight.

I’ll try and update back here when I hear something.

[greg]

WildGoose:

also a bit worrying
was the fact you took no notice of the way the leaf springs where

Mr Plod mentioned this and you said he was talking zb
dunno what he said
but on little trucks the giveaway is the way the springs are sitting

It wasn’t Mr plod, it was the chap from trading standards. Plod said very little for the whole ordeal apart from checking my licence and defect report.

The guy was trying to tell me, that unladen, or safely laden, a trucks leaf springs will curve downwards, i.e. a smiley face type affair. Then when overloaded they will curve the opposite way, a dead giveaway in his words.

I happened to have studied such things in my previous job so was quite confident to point out to him that he was talking nonsense. Leaf springs vary in design, there are dozens of variables across manufacturer and vehicle, so a sweeping generalisation such as his, was due to be corrected, before he tried spouting it to the next unfortunate he came across.

If anyone can tell the difference in how a leaf spring looks when supporting 7.5t or 8.3t then you are a better man than I, clearly.

Granted there are many spring manufactuers however in past experience i have found that most 7.5 tonners do have springs as the trading standards bloke states, and he wasn’t wrong with his sweeping generalisation as you were overloaded by over 3/4 of a ton.

Surely you have driven it either at max weight or close too, you should therefore know how it looks when its fully loaded and also know what it drives like when fully freighted.

[ellies_dad]

I take it your Irish wildgoose?

[okey-didley-dokely]

Don’t worryt too much about it, first offence is usually a warning.

I got pulled at purfleet a couple of months ago heading for Dover, I was over wieght on my unit and drive axle, was given all the paperwork and interveiwed.

My gross was ok and was asked the question have I been to a weighbridge, I answered no and said that as most if not all weighbridges are not dynamic wieghbridges I sill wouldn’t have known that my axle weights or unit weight was over.

I still haven’t heard anytyhing back from them