A flat bed wagon and drag passed me in Kilmarnock today with the prime mover completely empty but the drag fully loaded with bales of hay. In my head, I’m thinking that truck can’t drive very well with all that weight at the back and surely can’t be very stable. It didn’t look like the way I would like to have my truck loaded. I once had a trailer that had too much weight at the arse end and it was horrible to drive and I certainly wouldn’t do it again. Never driven a wagon and drag so just wondering if what I seen was a bit daft, or is it me just being a dafty? [emoji1]
No, I don’t think you are being daft, too much weight on the drag and the tail starts wagging the dog ! Not fun and I have done it all the way from Italy to Lincolnshire 
Ive never seen that before but what I have seen a lot of is car transporters with the bottom row empty and the top with cars on it. Ive always felt that would be dicey with all the weight on the top and the bottom empty. One wrong judged speed at a corner and its ta ta safe delivery bonus
funny you’ve made this thread. This morning on the way into work I saw something similar with bales of hay stacked high on the drag and one single bale on the prime mover 
maga:
funny you’ve made this thread. This morning on the way into work I saw something similar with bales of hay stacked high on the drag and one single bale on the prime mover
Was it a blue Volvo FM?
damoq:
maga:
funny you’ve made this thread. This morning on the way into work I saw something similar with bales of hay stacked high on the drag and one single bale on the prime moverWas it a blue Volvo FM?
white Scania, looked like one of stobarts old wag and drags converted to flats.
The-Snowman:
Ive never seen that before but what I have seen a lot of is car transporters with the bottom row empty and the top with cars on it. Ive always felt that would be dicey with all the weight on the top and the bottom empty. One wrong judged speed at a corner and its ta ta safe delivery bonus
That’s always got me thinking too. I’d never take a decker out with the top deck full and bottom empty. 5 cars must weigh roughly 8 or 9 ton. Surely that weight up top makes it very unstable.[emoji15]
raymundo:
No, I don’t think you are being daft, too much weight on the drag and the tail starts wagging the dog ! Not fun and I have done it all the way from Italy to Lincolnshire
That’s what I thought might happen, plus it must jump around like a kangaroo when braking.
100% loaded incorrectly.
Car transporters you can in almost every case lower the decks to a sensible height, except for the vehicle over the cab obviously, very few non van carrier artics-with-peak running around now where the top deck had to be more or less level if loaded.
Yes and no. Ideally it’s nice to have the prime mover weighing more than the trailer but not a necessity.
As you say where you get into trouble is when there is too much weight on the arse end of the trailer which really translates to the drawbar being too light. If the trailer is loaded uniformly, or even a bit heavy on the drawbar, is ok where the prime mover has air suspension but not as stable as the prime mover being loaded.
A lot of 3.5t trailers are pulled by 4x4s that weigh not much more than 2t and it’s not too bad at all really if loaded correctly. Also with a lorry wag and drag the hitch is often quite recessed below the rear of the chassis and the closer it gets to the back axle the more stable the outfit is and also the longer the prime mover the more stable the outfit is (ie both scenarios make it harder for the tail to wag the dog through the lever principle)
Gone on a bit but, in summary, I would not plan to end up like that but if something changed with the drops or a delivery refused I would be fairly happy to drive like that.
I wouldn’t be happy to drive empty except two 1t pallets sat at the very back of the trailer same with an artic, possibly even more so. Where Moffetts are fitted weights are fitted in the trailer headboard to stop you getting a close up view of the side of the trailer at every wet roundabout. It’s not just trailers though a rigid with a chunky overhang and a load of weight on the arse can get unpleasantly choppy in motorway tramlines the same.
damoq:
raymundo:
No, I don’t think you are being daft, too much weight on the drag and the tail starts wagging the dog ! Not fun and I have done it all the way from Italy to LincolnshireThat’s what I thought might happen, plus it must jump around like a kangaroo when braking.
Once a trailer has got into a bit of a sway it’s the panic braking of an inexperienced driver that causes the total catastrophe. As the brakes go on the prime mover lurches forward and sinks on the front axle whilst raising the rear - effectively taking more weight off the rear axle - at which point the tyres lose grip and the trailer starts pushing the prime mover round.
With a 4x4 or a car with a caravan though it’s all much worse than a lorry as it only has overrun brakes that work by shoving into the back of the tow vehicle where as the lorry trailer has load sensed air brakes that if the prime mover is empty, if the load sensing is working, should apply the trailer brakes more fiercely helping to ‘snap’ the outfit back into line. Also on a lorry compared with a car or 4x4 the drive axle is relatively much heavier and harder for a trailer to lift.
Saw one last week on a14 heading out of Felixstowe, wagon had no container on it but the drag did.
Seemed illogical to me but I don’t drive artic so no clue on weight and balance but thought if they had to brake sharply on the limiter it’d be game over??
I run like this quite often but I’m slightly different from your man with the hay in that my prime mover has a fair bit of weight even when empty, and the trailer with an empty box doesn’t weigh that much.
When I took the trailer for test last month it was fully freighted (18 ton) and although the handling characteristics were a wee bit different it was in no way unstable or dangerous but then again the empty prime mover was still a wee bit heavier.
As long as the trailer is loaded and balanced properly and also driven properly then I don’t see a problems.
When I look at your outfit alfa man, it doesn’t look like it would be as unstable as the hay truck I seen today. Not sure if its cos of the low ride trailer and your prime mover being a heavy looking 8 wheeler. The hay truck just didn’t look right at all.[emoji53]
The-Snowman:
Ive never seen that before but what I have seen a lot of is car transporters with the bottom row empty and the top with cars on it. Ive always felt that would be dicey with all the weight on the top and the bottom empty. One wrong judged speed at a corner and its ta ta safe delivery bonus
do it the other way and its ta ta trip money,i use a mob over here to lift vans for me who are on trip dosh and it saves loading the cars 10 times for the 1 full load
I used to see a 4 or 6 legger rigid with hay on around Horncastle. It was going on a weighbridge at a scrap yard (Riddels?? at a guess). 
That used to sway like a swing. Passed it regularly in centre and to this day I don’t know how it didn’t go over 
One occasion at main traffic lights I was on red waiting to turn right, he came from my right turning left 
OH!!! he’s coming over me (awaits perverted digs 
). How he managed to crack on I don’t know, obviously done it before but christ - bum twitch moment or what 
Loaded drag at one farm, drive to next a few miles up road, drop trailer and in with rigid to load at another farm. Ideal when second farm can’t accommodate artics and w+d. That old stobart lorry is up and down there all the time, I’m sure he knows what he’s doing