Can any uk haulier tell me what they have actually been fines for candlestiens in the truck at our border by our government recently.
HAS TO BE FACTUALLY CORRECT, you might have to firm it up as this story has what I believe to be some distance to run and my go all the way to the were it should once I compile the information.
PLEASE KEEP IT AS MATER OF FACT AS POSSIBLE.
many thanks.
Is this a school project■■?
In my case, none.
No it’s not my daughters EU in out school project.
What I may be sitting on is the paperwork from Uk borders doing a deal from 22k for 11 immigrants to 4K.
He has been caught again yesterday with 7 and is hoping to do another deal to reduce the fine.
That is why I am asking for factual information that can be backed up.
It’s obvious where this could go. And frankly when I found out I was furious.
Top it of they are fridge trailers, the most secure unit to prevent candelstines entering uk.
In effect the going rate for the driver is less than the fine our government charges.
i don’t want to sound rude, but that doesn’t tell us much.
There’s a big difference beetween an O/D and someone running 50 trucks, the latter having two sets of illegals in is not much, the former, a lot.
We had 18 in, in a hard sider with side door, locked, sealed the full monty. How they got in, is a mystery to me, the drivers and the police who spent 4 hours wandering round. The guess is a locksmith - the traffickers have some pretty sophisticated equipment and able people working for them.
And I’d stake my life on it being nothing to do with my lads.
had I been fined, I would have been negotiating down as well; for it to succeed the first time, there must have been mitigating circumstances?
I know it doesn’t tell you everything it is a foreign haulier in UK with around 50 trucks.
The first fine I am not sure as when but I know the amount of immigrants and the fine paid. The secound is recent same haulier and he is hoping to do a deal.
Is it not a case of the fine being set and used as a prevention to stop this happening or am I missing something. Or as I suspect our government not disclosing what’s really happening to foreign hauliers compared to uk firms.
Is there a disparity between what fines are raised to domestic hauliers over international foreign trucks with regard to candelstines?
I am pretty sure I can have the information that proves there is should I need it.
Hence the request for factual information from any owner drivers or firms hauling though our ports that have been fined by UK Borders.
NicholasVonBaron2:
I know it doesn’t tell you everything it is a foreign haulier in UK with around 50 trucks.The first fine I am not sure as when but I know the amount of immigrants and the fine paid. The secound is recent same haulier and he is hoping to do a deal.
Is it not a case of the fine being set and used as a prevention to stop this happening or am I missing something. Or as I suspect our government not disclosing what’s really happening to foreign hauliers compared to uk firms.
Is there a disparity between what fines are raised to domestic hauliers over international foreign trucks with regard to candelstines?
I am pretty sure I can have the information that proves there is should I need it.
Hence the request for factual information from any owner drivers or firms hauling though our ports that have been fined by UK Borders.
OK, so the haulier is hoping to negotiate down - so would I,if I were fined. Scenarios are, either the haulier is complicit with the drivers in which case don’t reduce the fine and press for action to be taken in the country of origin ( I have no idea if that is feasible, but it’s what I’d like to see). Or the drivers are iffy and the haulier has nothing to do with it having supplied them with locks blah blah, in which case why should he get done? Or despite doing their best to stop them, like us, migrants managed to get in.
The ratio for fines is around 93% to foreign firms and therefore 7% to UK firms, which indicates either that we are doing well or not getting fined in equivalent circumstances to foreign firms. Wether there is any disparity in the level of those fines I don’t know and without knowing the specific circumstances surrounding each case, it’s difficult to arrive at a comparison.
As I say, we didn’t get fined and the police were very good with us.
In case any of your are interested the government have opened a review into migrant fines which is open to responses until the 18th April 2016
You can put your views across directly to them, it could also help with your daughters project as it sets out questions on how they think prices could differ etc…
The official review document is here… https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/505766/CLANDESTINE_CIVIL_PENALTY_CONDOC_March_2016_-Final_2.pdf
I completely understand the need for mitigating circumstances in relation to fines.
However with what I may be able to obtain is the uk paperwork for a foreign haulier whom operates regularly in uk that shows twice his fines from our border force have been lower than what uk hauliers are aware of and less than what a candelstine would pay to smuggle themselves into uk with the assistance of foreign drivers/hauliers.
Regardless of mitigating circumstances if there is a financial gain for driver or haulier to smuggle people into our country, Uk border force is not fit for purpose and the haulage industry and general public should be aware of what’s happening on the front line.
I see where you are coming from now.
Maybe someone else can help then, as I say we didn’t get fined for our 18 and it’s difficult to get lower than that 
I dont know what it is but its not enough ,I would like to see the truck sold for spares and the people sent back.
I don’t do cross channel haulage but on a lot of the videos I’ve seen many don’t even have padlocks on the back doors.
I know that isn’t the be all and end all but it shows your at least making an effort
We put padlocks but I wonder is it worth it when the first set get screwed and you’rd putting the second set on.
Return loads.
Thanks you for sending me the consultation, I would not have found that.
The information is out there, I wonder if our government would put the fines and numbers in the public domain?
I happen to be a truck park operator and I have seen some startling incidents with regard to how drivers/ hauliers have been treated.
Three times I have had trucks escorted into my park of the motorway to be delt with by either the police or imigration services. Each time it has been a dozen or so, not once was the truck impounded or the driver arrested and not been able to drive of in his truck some hours later.
The last occasion Bulgarian registered fridge, waved in of motorway with ten or so contaminating the fresh produce. Driver was let go within half hour, 5 police cars, bus for candelstines and no explanation from officers why they let the driver carry on to deliver his load.
I doubt the customer whose produce was ruined was even informed.
What I need to know from a haulier is what happened to you either at our boarder or once within the uk by our police force and ultimately our government.
The most recent information has driven me to post on this forum and get to the bottom of what is going on.
Drivers (double-manned) parked up about 75 mile south of Calais.
The trailer was a schmitz folding wall, only on its second run from brand new, all locked. Locks intact in the morning, drivers looked in the trailer. We were coming back empty.
Ran up through the tunnel, got over to the UK side, pulled off the motorway in kent just before M20/25 split for a butty, heard a load of banging. Panicked. Rang me. I panicked. In lieu of anything else to do and briefly flirting with the idea of going somewhere quiet and letting them out, told them to go to Clacket lane services, on the grounds that sometimes there’s a police lodge on a services. Rang the police, there isn’t a lodge, but they said park there out of the way at the far end of the services, if they get out, don’t try and stop them, just count and see which way they headed.
Got to Clackett, police arrived about 5 minutes later. Police checked round the trailer, scratched their heads at the lack of damage, everything sealed, no holes in the trailer roof or floor. Unlocked the doors and 18 appeared. Duly taken away. Police kept my drivers about 4 hours, questioned them, went through the paperwork, all the checklist stuff and basically told the drivers that they had done everything they could and they didn’t think it would go any further. 7 months later I’ve not heard anything. I presume telling the authorities added on the plus side.
We think, they may have got in at Pidou, that was the only stop before the tunnel. We think they probably had a locksmith, it’s the only answer.
There’s an argument that they should have opened the trailer at Pidou, but that is the only thing that we feel we could be pulled up on.
Speaking with the sale rep at Eurotunnel a few weeks later, he though probably a locksmith, according to him, the traffickers have some very good equipment and fast workers.
If they had been a bit quieter, I’d willingly have paid the tunnel costs and drivers to run back into France, preferably Marseille, and leave them there.
I’m a 100% that it wasn’t with the collusion of the drivers.
Thank you very much Albion, your circumstances are the same as what I have experience, however as a park operator I don’t get any paperwork.
However the 3 instances I have experienced, 1 the driver was most definitely in collusion, we was busy and I advised the police that they needed either sort this out in a quite corner of my yard or wrap it up quick before the rest of the drivers become agrieved and cause unrest. I ended up taking his badge number and reading him the police riot act to get him to act before a problem arose.
Any more inncidents would be appreciated.
Can I add I do not believe a uk haulier would even entertain bringing candelstines into uk for financial gain, I am of the opinion Bulgarian/Romainian and possible Lithuanian/Estonian are bring them with the knowledge they can reduce the fine thus making it financial worth while.
Many thanks
Some drivers make money from this illegal .if he will stopped at first atemp that this is big penalty.But if he ready bring 10-20 people and earn some 20k or more that he east pay all penalty if police found just couple people.
Did anyone see “24 hours in police custody” I think it was called recently from Luton. A load of Iraqi’s in the back of a Heritage fridge pulling into Toddington running at 2 degrees pulled by a Romanian truck. The driver looked and I believe with all information, totally innocent and for a Romanian he fought his defence in English. Rear seals were intact but door locking gear tampered with then reseated to look normal. What beats me is the lorry driver was banged up and interrogated for 24 hours whilst “ILLEGAL immigrants” …their words were mostly instructed to be picked up and dropped straight to “the hotel”. World’s gone mad. The load of yoghurts looked badly damaged, urinated and pooped on, walked and slept all over. Illegals had interpreters to assist them. Why are they not charged with criminal damage to vehicles and load, breaking and entering a vehicle and breaking into the UK let alone the sub contractor and trailer operators down time?. Everyone wants to blame the haulier / driver and cash in.
The lorry driver was a family man and was mortified when he had 15 people inside a sealed fridge running just above zero especially when he saw the small children. The Iraqi women confessed at the end they had paid people smugglers all they had in Calais to get them into the Port area inside a people carrier with blacked out windows, who noisily damaged the trailer for them to be put inside and they admitted the driver was not aware or involved in any way. Their case of staying in the UK was pending but I feel they probably will stay here at tax payers expenses to boot.
Very similar to us Ade, illegals whisked away in an hour, my lads interviewed for four hours - I do stress my drivers said the Police were really good not being a pain.
At one point whilst the illegals were waiting for their minibus, the lads heard one of them say that 2 men helped them get in and they thought they were being stitched up, but the illegals later said, no two different men in France.
i really would have paid the tunnel and wages to take them back france side if they hadn’t been making such a racket by then. 