Tonights parliamentary vote result ! your thoughts

bigdave789:

tommy t:
I am most certainly not, no, I will NEVER vote for Any of what is known as the EU/establishment controlled Traitor class lib/lab/con brands (All are the same beast IMO) None of them will change anything for the better if the past 50 years doesn’t prove this then nothing will

So if you have no interest in voting or you are determined to “spoil your ballot paper”
then that’s your democratic choice and that’s fine.
So why spout the kind of bile normally reserved for a rabid Tory? If you’ve no faith in
mainstream politics and the political process then why repeat this garbage?

Which part of Nationalist can mean left and Socialists don’t have the monopoly on representing the working class don’t you understand.

On that note what was the big difference between Callaghan’s and Blair’s policies v Thatcher’s and don’t see Corbyn calling for the reopening of the mines and reversal of Thatcher’s anti union laws effectively removing the right to strike and the right of assocation.While Starmer is obviously just another Blairite willing to sell out Brit jobs to foreign workers.So tell us why would so called anti Blairite Corbyn want Blairite Starmer instead of Hoey in the job of shadow Brexit minister ?.

Only thing I’d say is this is how parliament has always been.
People are acting like the politicans have let the proverbal ■■■■ hit the fan and it’s all falling to pieces, I don’t think so.
Go back 300 years and you will see the most petty squabbles and stupid things happening.
It’s always how our government has operated during non-wartime and it seems to work for the most part.
Heck the only relatively new thing for us is running referendums.

Will the world end with a hard brexit? Nope. Will there be any immediate conqsences? Probably very little if any.
Will the world end if we delay brexit? Nope.

Heck the biggest loses of anything other then a continuation of this fudging eastenders-esqe marathon is the 24/7 news. They couldn’t string it out anymore if they tried. I’m starting to think they might run of a ‘guest analysts’ to give their BS take on it.

So I think we should just let this pig die. Even remainers I know just want it done and over with now because there are more important issues in the world occurring. (OH HI SYRIA hows it going?)

Just on Corbyn though he is not the devil everyone makes him out to be but I suspect I wont get anywhere on this so I’ll just leave that there.
Dianne Abbott is a complete and utter fool though.

toonsy:
Follow the money.

As mentioned above the pond has gained and that’s a big indication of investors confidence - in this case they’re either more confident as the prospect of a no deal or, more likely, more confident of the prospect of no deal.

As for me wake me up when it’s all over.

Look closely at the pound/Euro rate: when the vote happened there was a sharp dip. Followed shortly afterwards by a strong rally. Looks like the market doesn’t want a No Deal, but is OK with a change of Government?
But who knows for sure? It’s ALL guesswork.

It is sure that those who trade in such things have the chance to make serious money in volatile markets.
“Follow the money”? Yes, look at who is gaining here…investment traders and bankers, hedge-fund dealers. They are profiting from the turmoil their cronies are creating.

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Brexiteers don’t realise that they already have the unicorn in the stable (rebate, veto, seat at the table, blue/black passports for the asking, residency controls if we could be arsed to apply them).

The problem is that they keep looking up the wrong end to find the horn.

The Govt gave the people the vote. They never imagine for one moment it would go the way it did. Hence headless chicken syndrome.

EU too frightened to give us any good deal in case it starts a race for the door. Their stance of no concessions is arrogant in the extreme.

Truth is there has been no negotiation. It’s been take this or leave it.

It’s shows the contempt they hold us in. Personally I think it’s time to call their bluff. I would like to see a leader of our country actually growing a pair. For every threat the EU states we should counter. Tariffs etc. We all need each other. I want to be part of the EU I don’t want to be ruled by the EU.

And lastly and most importantly we should pull out of Eurovision

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P Stoff:
The Govt gave the people the vote. They never imagine for one moment it would go the way it did. Hence headless chicken syndrome.

EU too frightened to give us any good deal in case it starts a race for the door. Their stance of no concessions is arrogant in the extreme.

Truth is there has been no negotiation. It’s been take this or leave it.

It’s shows the contempt they hold us in. Personally I think it’s time to call their bluff. I would like to see a leader of our country actually growing a pair. For every threat the EU states we should counter. Tariffs etc. We all need each other. I want to be part of the EU I don’t want to be ruled by the EU.

And lastly and most importantly we should pull out of Eurovision

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Eurovision is now Russian controlled any way

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commonrail:
Take away democracy…what’s left?

Is there really democracy?

Why do we have a House of Commons ? - make rules for us commoners.

Why do we have a House of Lords? - different rules/ laws for the elite.

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It is a farce ,The Eu was a trading club that has now gotten to big for its own boots .
Roll on April .

The eu are making it very difficult to leave because we are a cash cow and they would like to carry on milking please

eurotrans:
The eu are making it very difficult to leave because we are a cash cow and they would like to carry on milking please

This cash cows udders are getting very very sore and drying up

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It’s also taking us from behind whilst milking us it seems.

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I reckon Brexit can only be rescued at this point - by the Conservative Brexiteers scuttling their own party for the greater good.

May is expected to survive this motion of no confidence being tabled by Corbyn.
Presumably, there is room for Starmer to make a move on Corbyn if the motion fails to produce either a second referendum, halt Brexit officially, or precipitate a general election.

Where it would be far more interesting - is if the Tory Brexiteers vote WITH Corbyn’s motion, ending May’s premiership. The election would not be held before the March 29th deadline, but more likely the first week of April, just a week later… Higher turnout, which favours the incumbent government. Graham Brady would likely step in as “Interim PM” up until the time the election is due.
Graham Brady could then de-select all Remainers in Brexit voting wards, making it likely that a shiny new conservative candidate - picks up the seat with an increased majority.
Remainers in Remain voting wards - would be left alone.

If a suitable new candidate cannot be found - the Tories could even step aside, and let UKIP win the seat.

The likely outcome of the election would be the Tories losing x amount of seats, which all go to UKIP. Labour might also lose a handful of seats - to both the Libdems and UKIP.

Corbyn would be under pressure to resign, as “Labour seats have been lost”.
Graham Brady, who wasn’t intending to stick around, steps aside, and who becomes leader of the party depends upon just how many seat tally UKIP end up with.

Firstly, if UKIP+CON >326 then Andrea Leadsom is most likely to become PM in my mind - Coalition with UKIP.
If UKIP>CON>326 - then Rees-Mogg would become leader, and he’d give way to Gerard Batten becoming PM as Mogg “doesn’t want to be PM”.
Corbyn loses votes - because he sat on the fence. He’d win an outright majority if he became the new master of Brexit - but his party won’t let him do or be that.
The Libdems - would only likely take seats off Labour.
The other minor parties - stay exactly the same.

Those calling for this snap election - would cite that “Brexit is being cancelled, unless UKIP show a lot more strongly than they have in the past”. So be it, then!
UKIP voters swung to Cameron in 2015 to get his promised referendum in the first place. Cameron, broke his promise to stay, and did everything in his bias to knobble the entire Leave campaign to boot.
UKIP voters swung to Labour in 2017, perhaps as a bit of a joke?

I reckon UKIP need about 8.5m votes to make a serious difference in our parliament.

If this doesn’t happen, then people will be effectively voting for Corbyn who is noncommittal on Brexit, and will likely drop it after moving into number 10 - either on the Parliamentary Labour Party’s request and/or The EU’s!!

OssieD:
We cant just have another referendum because if remain won that referendum that would make it a draw, because leave won the first referendum, so we would have to have a third referendum but then if leave won that…hold on hold on I’m getting a headache…
Ossie

why so glumy?
Remainers won’t win a second referendum, because they lost the first one, surely. Why would they?
The more time passes, the more time regular people have to think about the consequences of leaving the EU, so brexiters will win second referendum too.
Are you all implying that people have changed their minds since they voted 2 years ago?
Doesn’t make any sense.
I knew what I was voting for the first time, I understood the implications of possible leave vote and I voted knowing what I was doing and the last 2 years only confirmed I was right with my first vote.

Why there is so much panic amongst brexiters when it comes to the second referendum.?
Second referendum will only confirm what the first one achieved, a win for the leave campaign, surely, but this time with a wider margin, as people have learned much more over the last two years.
The more time people have to think about the consequences of their vote, the better decissions they can make.
I wouldn’t buy a house next day, week, just from looking at a picture in an agency shop window.
I wouldn’t marry the next day, week, or month, a pretty girl I met on a holiday or in a club.

Two years is plenty of time to consider all the options, to make a reasonably informed decission when it comes to Brexit, as we can’t drag it on forever.

It looks to me like brexiters know they have managed to con less informed into believing that Brexit is a golden panacea for all their worries, bad fortunes and as soon as they reach Nirvana in a form of leaving the EU, the country will come back to be a land of plenty, again, and now the more time passes, the more common people realise they’ve been taken for a ride by the Brexit used car salesmen.

Be brave, you might be lucky and pull it off again

Here’s a lot of reasons to stay in the EU, because obviously (NOT) they have our best interests at heart. But all you remainers keep believing the blag they keep feeding you. Thanks Micky Hennessy for the article brilliant and factual not the blag that they try so hard to feed us…

Cadbury moved factory to Poland 2011 with EU grant.
Ford Transit moved to Turkey 2013 with EU grant.
Jaguar Land Rover has recently agreed to build a new plant in Slovakia with EU grant, owned by Tata, the same company who have trashed our steel works and emptied the workers pension funds.
Peugeot closed its Ryton (was Rootes Group) plant and moved production to Slovakia with EU grant.
British Army’s new Ajax fighting vehicles to be built in SPAIN using SWEDISH steel at the request of the EU to support jobs in Spain with EU grant, rather than Wales.
Dyson gone to Malaysia, with an EU loan.
Crown Closures, Bournemouth (Was METAL BOX), gone to Poland with EU grant, once employed 1,200.
M&S manufacturing gone to far east with EU loan.
Hornby models gone. In fact all toys and models now gone from UK along with the patents all with with EU grants.
Gillette gone to eastern Europe with EU grant.
Texas Instruments Greenock gone to Germany with EU grant.
Indesit at Bodelwyddan Wales gone with EU grant.
Sekisui Alveo said production at its Merthyr Tydfil Industrial Park foam plant will relocate production to Roermond in the Netherlands, with EU funding.
Hoover Merthyr factory moved out of UK to Czech Republic and the Far East by Italian company Candy with EU backing.
ICI integration into Holland’s AkzoNobel with EU bank loan and within days of the merger, several factories in the UK, were closed, eliminating 3,500 jobs
Boots sold to Italians Stefano Pessina who have based their HQ in Switzerland to avoid tax to the tune of £80 million a year, using an EU loan for the purchase.
JDS Uniphase run by two Dutch men, bought up companies in the UK with £20 million in EU ‘regeneration’ grants, created a pollution nightmare and just closed it all down leaving 1,200 out of work and an environmental clean-up paid for by the UK tax-payer. They also raided the pension fund and drained it dry.
UK airports are owned by a Spanish company.
Scottish Power is owned by a Spanish company.
Most London buses are run by Spanish and German companies.
The Hinkley Point C nuclear power station to be built by French company EDF, part owned by the French government, using cheap Chinese steel that has catastrophically failed in other nuclear installations. Now EDF say the costs will be double or more and it will be very late even if it does come online.
Swindon was once our producer of rail locomotives and rolling stock. Not any more, it’s Bombardier in Derby and due to their losses in the aviation market, that could see the end of the British railways manufacturing altogether even though Bombardier had EU grants to keep Derby going which they diverted to their loss-making aviation side in Canada.
39% of British invention patents have been passed to foreign companies, many of them in the EU
The Mini cars that Cameron stood in front of as an example of British engineering, are built by BMW mostly in Holland and Austria. His campaign bus was made in Germany even though we have Plaxton, Optare, Bluebird, Dennis etc., in the UK. The bicycle for the Greens was made in the far east, not by Raleigh UK but then they are probably going to move to the Netherlands too as they have said recently.

Anyone who thinks the EU is good for British industry or any other business simply hasn’t paid attention to what has been systematically asset-stripped from the UK. Name me one major technology company still running in the UK, I used to contract out to many, then the work just dried up as they were sold off to companies from France, Germany, Holland, Belgium, etc., and now we don’t even teach electronic technology for technicians any more, due to EU regulations.

I haven’t detailed our non-existent fishing industry the EU paid to destroy, nor the farmers being paid NOT to produce food they could sell for more than they get paid to do nothing, don’t even go there.
I haven’t mentioned what it costs us to be asset-stripped like this, nor have I mentioned immigration, nor the risk to our security if control of our armed forces is passed to Brussels or Germany.

Find something that’s gone the other way, I’ve looked and I just can’t. If you think the EU is a good idea,

1/ You haven’t read the party manifesto of The European Peoples’ Party.

2/ You haven’t had to deal with EU petty bureaucracy tearing your business down.

3/ You don’t think it matters.

OUT OF EUROPE we need to be out of it

tommy t:

commonrail:
Take away democracy…what’s left?

exactly if they won’t respect our votes then violence is all that is left, look at France 9 weeks the yellow vests have been protesting against micron and his globalist politics , the police have been abusing their powers beating people using flashball weapons inflicting serious life changing injuries on un armed people they are out of control, germany is going to go in to recession yet we have morons who think remaining in the failing EUSSR is beneficial to us■■? :open_mouth: :open_mouth: :open_mouth: :unamused: :unamused:[/qu

I remember the miners strike and the use of brutal police force against men trying to protect their jobs.
But hey we are British with short bias memories.

Seems to me the Australians have got better ideas than our lot

google.com/url?sa=t&source= … Ka2uV9_Lk0

Beetlejuice:
Here’s a lot of reasons to stay in the EU, because obviously (NOT) they have our best interests at heart. But all you remainers keep believing the blag they keep feeding you. Thanks Micky Hennessy for the article brilliant and factual not the blag that they try so hard to feed us…

Cadbury moved factory to Poland 2011 with EU grant.
Ford Transit moved to Turkey 2013 with EU grant.
Jaguar Land Rover has recently agreed to build a new plant in Slovakia with EU grant, owned by Tata, the same company who have trashed our steel works and emptied the workers pension funds.
Peugeot closed its Ryton (was Rootes Group) plant and moved production to Slovakia with EU grant.
British Army’s new Ajax fighting vehicles to be built in SPAIN using SWEDISH steel at the request of the EU to support jobs in Spain with EU grant, rather than Wales.
Dyson gone to Malaysia, with an EU loan.
Crown Closures, Bournemouth (Was METAL BOX), gone to Poland with EU grant, once employed 1,200.
M&S manufacturing gone to far east with EU loan.
Hornby models gone. In fact all toys and models now gone from UK along with the patents all with with EU grants.
Gillette gone to eastern Europe with EU grant.
Texas Instruments Greenock gone to Germany with EU grant.
Indesit at Bodelwyddan Wales gone with EU grant.
Sekisui Alveo said production at its Merthyr Tydfil Industrial Park foam plant will relocate production to Roermond in the Netherlands, with EU funding.
Hoover Merthyr factory moved out of UK to Czech Republic and the Far East by Italian company Candy with EU backing.
ICI integration into Holland’s AkzoNobel with EU bank loan and within days of the merger, several factories in the UK, were closed, eliminating 3,500 jobs
Boots sold to Italians Stefano Pessina who have based their HQ in Switzerland to avoid tax to the tune of £80 million a year, using an EU loan for the purchase.
JDS Uniphase run by two Dutch men, bought up companies in the UK with £20 million in EU ‘regeneration’ grants, created a pollution nightmare and just closed it all down leaving 1,200 out of work and an environmental clean-up paid for by the UK tax-payer. They also raided the pension fund and drained it dry.
UK airports are owned by a Spanish company.
Scottish Power is owned by a Spanish company.
Most London buses are run by Spanish and German companies.
The Hinkley Point C nuclear power station to be built by French company EDF, part owned by the French government, using cheap Chinese steel that has catastrophically failed in other nuclear installations. Now EDF say the costs will be double or more and it will be very late even if it does come online.
Swindon was once our producer of rail locomotives and rolling stock. Not any more, it’s Bombardier in Derby and due to their losses in the aviation market, that could see the end of the British railways manufacturing altogether even though Bombardier had EU grants to keep Derby going which they diverted to their loss-making aviation side in Canada.
39% of British invention patents have been passed to foreign companies, many of them in the EU
The Mini cars that Cameron stood in front of as an example of British engineering, are built by BMW mostly in Holland and Austria. His campaign bus was made in Germany even though we have Plaxton, Optare, Bluebird, Dennis etc., in the UK. The bicycle for the Greens was made in the far east, not by Raleigh UK but then they are probably going to move to the Netherlands too as they have said recently.

Anyone who thinks the EU is good for British industry or any other business simply hasn’t paid attention to what has been systematically asset-stripped from the UK. Name me one major technology company still running in the UK, I used to contract out to many, then the work just dried up as they were sold off to companies from France, Germany, Holland, Belgium, etc., and now we don’t even teach electronic technology for technicians any more, due to EU regulations.

I haven’t detailed our non-existent fishing industry the EU paid to destroy, nor the farmers being paid NOT to produce food they could sell for more than they get paid to do nothing, don’t even go there.
I haven’t mentioned what it costs us to be asset-stripped like this, nor have I mentioned immigration, nor the risk to our security if control of our armed forces is passed to Brussels or Germany.

Find something that’s gone the other way, I’ve looked and I just can’t. If you think the EU is a good idea,

1/ You haven’t read the party manifesto of The European Peoples’ Party.

2/ You haven’t had to deal with EU petty bureaucracy tearing your business down.

3/ You don’t think it matters.

OUT OF EUROPE we need to be out of it

The list of companies you cut and pasted is not true mate… this list has been doing the rounds for a while and the EU grants for moving can be found as untrue elsewhere

Darkside:

Beetlejuice:
Here’s a lot of reasons to stay in the EU, because obviously (NOT) they have our best interests at heart. But all you remainers keep believing the blag they keep feeding you. Thanks Micky Hennessy for the article brilliant and factual not the blag that they try so hard to feed us…

Cadbury moved factory to Poland 2011 with EU grant.
Ford Transit moved to Turkey 2013 with EU grant.
Jaguar Land Rover has recently agreed to build a new plant in Slovakia with EU grant, owned by Tata, the same company who have trashed our steel works and emptied the workers pension funds.
Peugeot closed its Ryton (was Rootes Group) plant and moved production to Slovakia with EU grant.
British Army’s new Ajax fighting vehicles to be built in SPAIN using SWEDISH steel at the request of the EU to support jobs in Spain with EU grant, rather than Wales.
Dyson gone to Malaysia, with an EU loan.
Crown Closures, Bournemouth (Was METAL BOX), gone to Poland with EU grant, once employed 1,200.
M&S manufacturing gone to far east with EU loan.
Hornby models gone. In fact all toys and models now gone from UK along with the patents all with with EU grants.
Gillette gone to eastern Europe with EU grant.
Texas Instruments Greenock gone to Germany with EU grant.
Indesit at Bodelwyddan Wales gone with EU grant.
Sekisui Alveo said production at its Merthyr Tydfil Industrial Park foam plant will relocate production to Roermond in the Netherlands, with EU funding.
Hoover Merthyr factory moved out of UK to Czech Republic and the Far East by Italian company Candy with EU backing.
ICI integration into Holland’s AkzoNobel with EU bank loan and within days of the merger, several factories in the UK, were closed, eliminating 3,500 jobs
Boots sold to Italians Stefano Pessina who have based their HQ in Switzerland to avoid tax to the tune of £80 million a year, using an EU loan for the purchase.
JDS Uniphase run by two Dutch men, bought up companies in the UK with £20 million in EU ‘regeneration’ grants, created a pollution nightmare and just closed it all down leaving 1,200 out of work and an environmental clean-up paid for by the UK tax-payer. They also raided the pension fund and drained it dry.
UK airports are owned by a Spanish company.
Scottish Power is owned by a Spanish company.
Most London buses are run by Spanish and German companies.
The Hinkley Point C nuclear power station to be built by French company EDF, part owned by the French government, using cheap Chinese steel that has catastrophically failed in other nuclear installations. Now EDF say the costs will be double or more and it will be very late even if it does come online.
Swindon was once our producer of rail locomotives and rolling stock. Not any more, it’s Bombardier in Derby and due to their losses in the aviation market, that could see the end of the British railways manufacturing altogether even though Bombardier had EU grants to keep Derby going which they diverted to their loss-making aviation side in Canada.
39% of British invention patents have been passed to foreign companies, many of them in the EU
The Mini cars that Cameron stood in front of as an example of British engineering, are built by BMW mostly in Holland and Austria. His campaign bus was made in Germany even though we have Plaxton, Optare, Bluebird, Dennis etc., in the UK. The bicycle for the Greens was made in the far east, not by Raleigh UK but then they are probably going to move to the Netherlands too as they have said recently.

Anyone who thinks the EU is good for British industry or any other business simply hasn’t paid attention to what has been systematically asset-stripped from the UK. Name me one major technology company still running in the UK, I used to contract out to many, then the work just dried up as they were sold off to companies from France, Germany, Holland, Belgium, etc., and now we don’t even teach electronic technology for technicians any more, due to EU regulations.

I haven’t detailed our non-existent fishing industry the EU paid to destroy, nor the farmers being paid NOT to produce food they could sell for more than they get paid to do nothing, don’t even go there.
I haven’t mentioned what it costs us to be asset-stripped like this, nor have I mentioned immigration, nor the risk to our security if control of our armed forces is passed to Brussels or Germany.

Find something that’s gone the other way, I’ve looked and I just can’t. If you think the EU is a good idea,

1/ You haven’t read the party manifesto of The European Peoples’ Party.

2/ You haven’t had to deal with EU petty bureaucracy tearing your business down.

3/ You don’t think it matters.

OUT OF EUROPE we need to be out of it

The list of companies you cut and pasted is not true mate… this list has been doing the rounds for a while and the EU grants for moving can be found as untrue elsewhere

Absolutely, the EU does not operate like that.

It does however allow one member state to offer money to a Company and in the case of Slovakia and JLR, the bung/sweetener was £110 million.

Slovakia recieved € 1.645 billion from the EU

Total Slovakian contribution to the EU budget: € 0.600 billion

So they have a billion or so sloshing around to spend on improving their country, so they can offer 110 million to help JLR set up and JLR get the added benefit of a cheaper workforce.

One of the reasons that Macron did unusually poorly in his hometown during the the race to become President was because Whirlpool announced during the race, that they were shifting production to Poland, so it isn’t just the UK that sees work move East, nor just haulage.

On a personal note, it doesn’t bother me, the East EUs can’t do my work and I just charge round trip money, but I can fully understand the frustration of someone for whom a portion of their tax money goes to the EU, the EU distribute it and then those tax pounds indirectly to help a Company move from the |UK to elsewhere. It happens globally, but it’s that bit more galling when it is your own money.

I’m not a strident Leaver BTW, I understand the principles behind it, but the notion that to get us all on equal footing could be achieved by bringing up the East EU nations to Western standards without Western living standards taking some sort of hit, was always flawed.

Perhaps some of it is fiction,However since we joined the Eu 45 odd years ago we have lost a lot of manufacturing encouraged through the EU out of the UK .That is fact .They are now putting in force an EU army ,Just a few months ago that was denied .They are getting out of hand and we are wise to leave on WTO rules until we can sort out the UK’s problems and forget funding our own decline .

Beetlejuice:
Perhaps some of it is fiction,However since we joined the Eu 45 odd years ago we have lost a lot of manufacturing encouraged through the EU out of the UK .That is fact .They are now putting in force an EU army ,Just a few months ago that was denied .They are getting out of hand and we are wise to leave on WTO rules until we can sort out the UK’s problems and forget funding our own decline .

Unlike most on here I will only comment on what I know is true.

The fishing industry comment is also an untruth.

80% of the UK fishing quota is owned by foreign companies and members of Rich List. 25% is owned by 4 families. Without the EU our fishermen will be in a far worse position.