Just reading a thread about technology in cabs then saw this on news Daimler lorry drives itself on German motorway
bbc.co.uk/news/technology-34449213
Still many, MANY years away from any real possibility of commercial implementation. As ive said before, id love to see how it copes with the maniacal lane-hoppers on the M25 from 4pm onwards. Also, whats the bloody point of the presumably hugely expensive "robot" system if a human has to be present and constantly vigilant to override if necessary? Wishful thinking on their part, im afraid - just another heavily flawed design folly that no countrys infrastructures (or car drivers) are prepared for. No automated system has yet been devised that can be fully trusted, and i really dont think it ever will be.
■■■■■■■:
Still many, MANY years away from any real possibility of commercial implementation. As ive said before, id love to see how it copes with the maniacal lane-hoppers on the M25 from 4pm onwards. Also, whats the bloody point of the presumably hugely expensive "robot" system if a human has to be present and constantly vigilant to override if necessary? Wishful thinking on their part, im afraid - just another heavily flawed design folly that no countrys infrastructures (or car drivers) are prepared for. No automated system has yet been devised that can be fully trusted, and i really dont think it ever will be.
That’s great news,alarm set for 3.00am,happy days
■■■■■■■:
No HUMAN has yet been devised that can be fully trusted, and i really don`t think it ever will be.
Fixed that for you
I think this kind of advanced cruise control that we are talking about will have less use in the UK than elsewhere in Europe but will have its uses and I am quite sure will happen and fairly soon.
■■■■■■■:
Still many, MANY years away from any real possibility of commercial implementation. As ive said before, id love to see how it copes with the maniacal lane-hoppers on the M25 from 4pm onwards. Also, whats the bloody point of the presumably hugely expensive "robot" system if a human has to be present and constantly vigilant to override if necessary? Wishful thinking on their part, im afraid - just another heavily flawed design folly that no countrys infrastructures (or car drivers) are prepared for. No automated system has yet been devised that can be fully trusted, and i really dont think it ever will be.
It will happen and it is probably a lot closer than some think. From next year there will be driverless cars on British roads.
They should make RDCs hands free. They’re the places knackered up by “human” (I use the term loosely) interference
I don’t get how this is better. I’m sure they will succeed in fully autonomous trucks that can reverse onto the tightest docs without issue and have driverless cars and vans, but when it happens what are the government going to do with the thousands of drivers unemployed because of it. We are talking all truck drivers, bus drivers, van drivers, taxi drivers etc. They may save lives and companies a fortune, but companies wouldn’t exist if no one is able to buy the goods because they have no jobs. I believe the government is already concerned enough to set up a commission to look into how increasing automation will effect the economy.
The only way this would ever work on roads as crowded as in the UK is on purpose made track type lanes…sort of like railways tracks but presumably without the £50k salary for a 35 hour week.
Very few here will be affected by it in their driving lives, its one thing having a silly looking googley bubble car pottering round with some geek pretending to read a newspaper inside, its another thing entirely trusting a bunch of computers not to suddenly display error 404 and default drive a 44 tonner up a tree taking 14 cars stuffed full of kittens nuns and little cheeldren with it.
What the eggheads would like and what will work in the real world are two different things…but not to worry it sells media space and time and keeps said eggheads in non jobs.
albion1971:
■■■■■■■:
Still many, MANY years away from any real possibility of commercial implementation. As ive said before, id love to see how it copes with the maniacal lane-hoppers on the M25 from 4pm onwards. Also, whats the bloody point of the presumably hugely expensive "robot" system if a human has to be present and constantly vigilant to override if necessary? Wishful thinking on their part, im afraid - just another heavily flawed design folly that no countrys infrastructures (or car drivers) are prepared for. No automated system has yet been devised that can be fully trusted, and i really dont think it ever will be.It will happen and it is probably a lot closer than some think. From next year there will be driverless cars on British roads.
We’re getting them in Milton Keynes, between the Station & Shopping Centre, gonna have some great fun when I’m up the town on a Wobbly ‘Pub Crawl’ Bike Ride round all the ‘Spoons’ we’ve got 4 at the last count, so should be able to get nicely Merry before checking them out for an Emergency Stop.
I wonder if a Driverless Ambulance will convey me to Hospital ?
pepsifarr:
I don’t get how this is better. I’m sure they will succeed in fully autonomous trucks that can reverse onto the tightest docs without issue and have driverless cars and vans, but when it happens what are the government going to do with the thousands of drivers unemployed because of it. We are talking all truck drivers, bus drivers, van drivers, taxi drivers etc. They may save lives and companies a fortune, but companies wouldn’t exist if no one is able to buy the goods because they have no jobs. I believe the government is already concerned enough to set up a commission to look into how increasing automation will effect the economy.
I wonder too, I can see many drivers losing their jobs, this technology is designed to replace not to assist, who are they kidding.
pepsifarr:
I don’t get how this is better. I’m sure they will succeed in fully autonomous trucks that can reverse onto the tightest docs without issue and have driverless cars and vans, but when it happens what are the government going to do with the thousands of drivers unemployed because of it. We are talking all truck drivers, bus drivers, van drivers, taxi drivers etc. They may save lives and companies a fortune, but companies wouldn’t exist if no one is able to buy the goods because they have no jobs. I believe the government is already concerned enough to set up a commission to look into how increasing automation will effect the economy.
This has been mentioned and talked about. Drivers will still be employed but their job will not be as it is now. They will still have a role to play which but the main part of the job will not be driving. Maybe in future the will be called driver assistants. Who knows but apparently they will be on the roads in less than 10 years according to those that know. The technology is already there. They just need to sort out the roads!
I just can’t buy into the notion that this embryonic technology is going to become a widespread reality anytime soon. Much like Juddian, I’m of the opinion that a LOT of undeclared safety work would have to be done to our little, overcrowded island to make this even remotely viable, and even then would only be workable on carefully selected routes or, more believably, within large, out-of-scope environments, depots, rdcs etc.
All truck manufacturers would have to fully embrace the technology required at the design and build stage (probably with the proviso of considerable government cash incentives), and the litigation resulting from the inevitable life-changing injuries/fatalities when things go breasts northwards can only be imagined. There’s a whole lot more to the successful introduction of these machines onto the public highways than has been divulged, and I’m pretty sure that our jobs are not in any present danger of becoming obsolete.
albion - “they JUST need to sort out the roads”…YEARS and BILLIONS are two words that readily spring to mind. Look how long it takes our industrious road crews to complete even the most basic of improvements. 
we struggle to repair the roads as it is now, yet alone build thousands of mile of suitable infrastructure for these type of vehicles. plus as others have said 1 major accident and the outcry will put the tech back about 20 years.
I don’t think any time soon there will be completely driverless anything. The roads are too screwed up. I think the vehicles will be able to drive themselves on certain allowed roads such as motorways provided they’re monitored. Suppose the idea being safety and efficiency.
I don’t buy into this idea that automation doesn’t buy goods in shops and spend money therefore that will stop progress of automation.
Automation has been going on years and that argument hasn’t stopped companies if they think it’s more efficient or cheaper. Started with the Luddites and mills. Factories became more automated, people were forced out of work. Computer aided design has allowed drawing offices to be replaced by one man and a computer station.
A friend of mine worked as an engineer on large ships. The ship was originally built to crew 38. But when he was on this thing there were only 15 crew including 4 engineers. Overnight the engine room was run unmanned. Any alarms and he was woken up. So not replaced completely but still cut down the amount of manpower needed.
Originally docks employed thousands of steevadores and loaders. The move onto containers with robotic cranes happened ages ago. Compare the reduction in staffing to the 1970s.
I still don’t believe that lorries will be completely unmanned any lifetime soon. As said the roads here confuse even the fastest computer on the planet. The brain!
Freight Dog…next year…read my earlier link.
Yes Albion but it doesn’t state whether it is actually driverless cars or cars that can drive themselves whilst monitored. I suspect the term “driverless” is being used for sensationalism. I can’t see a car without a single human being inside being allowed onto the roads next year.
I think the point being missed is that the first versions we will get are nothing more than a glorified cruise control. This is level 3 automaton - a driver is still there to drive when the situation doesn’t allow the vehicle to drive. Level 3 can maintain a speed set by the driver, reduce speed and accelerate, brake, maintain its place within the lane (when road markings are sufficient), maintain a set distance from the vehicle in front. Level 4 is where no driver is required and legally we are years and years from that on normal roads.
The current system used by Mercedes (who seem to be leading the race to getting it out there) will not allow the driver to engage the highway pilot unless it is happy. This means the amount of traffic on the road, the state of the road and road markings, the weather etc etc. If everything is right it will tell the driver he can engage it if he wishes to.
If the situation and surroundings aren’t right - it won’t activate. This means here in the UK we might perhaps be able to activate highway pilot maybe - at a guess - perhaps - 30% of our driving day and the rest of the time it’d be useless. (Although there are ‘city driving’ versions that below certain speeds can take a vehicle through a city centre without any interaction from the driver - including obeying traffic lights!)
We already have adaptive cruise in a lot of trucks that uses GPS and 3D mapping to adjust it’s speed up or down within a tolerance and maintain a distance from the vehicle in front. Some even select a gear based on GPS data (i.e there’s a hill coming or perhaps a bend) meaning the gearbox can be more pro-active and therefore quicker. The only thing the Mercedes highway pilot adds is that it takes over the steering.
Don’t forget some of this technology is to be made a legal requirement from next month across Europe - it is here already. This means autonomous braking systems which require radar and can slow the vehicle or even stop it probably more efficiently than a human, automatic stability control which allows the truck to manage the braking distribution, suspension and potentially steering input and lane departure warnings that already have the capability to resist a driver changing lanes without indicating (some Volvo cars do this where the steering becomes weighted if you haven’t indicated and it resists your input but can be overruled by the driver). The Volvo adaptive steering already returns the steering to straight at slow speeds (even when reversing) if the driver lets go of the wheel. It also absorbs small road wheel movements without transmitting them to the steering wheel and can monitor the steering over 2000 times per minute (or is it second?). Most of the technology required for the highway pilot type systems are pretty much well tried and tested and relatively cheap.
Because the technology is relatively cheap and most trucks are made for a mass market it means trucks arriving in the UK will have the system installed once it is legally allowed - we just probably won’t get to use it much because of the state of our roads. Compared with the rest of Europe we are a tiny little island that is way over crowded. As we have seen Mercedes are already driving them in controlled circumstances on the public road - it is gonna happen relatively soon.
I suppose its like ABS - we’ve pretty much all got it but we tend not to use it until its needed. Highway pilot type systems will be the same - once in a while the little light will come on saying you can engage it. You switch it on and for the next 10 minutes get to relax a little … maybe longer.
Check out Volvo’s youtube channel - they have a prototype truck that can potentially warn the driver of a pedestrians/cyclists actions up to 5 seconds before it happens … WOW!
As for level 4 autonomous (driverless) vehicles? Maybe not on the M60 but certainly in certain places
Adaptive cruise is already here but its going to be increasingly invasive, and far too many of our brethren need it to stop them travelling stupidly close to the vehicle in front.
Again perimitter warnings of objects is because those same non drivers haven’t the foggiest idea whats going on around them, let alone the wit to drive accordingly.
All needed due to the race to the bottom and lowest common denominator ethos prevalent in much of the industry.
Yar dee year dee yar, just so much pie in the sky. Raymond Baxter reliably informed me that by the year 2000 I’d be wearing a silver suit and holiday inn on Mars.
I do quite like my silver suit though.
the maoster:
Yar dee year dee yar, just so much pie in the sky. Raymond Baxter reliably informed me that by the year 2000 I’d be wearing a silver suit and holiday inn on Mars.I do quite like my silver suit though.
Maybe that’s what pilots said in 1914 or so when the first auto pilots were devised. 
It’ll never happen 