parkus:
The problem I have is with Scania mirrors, because they don’t stick out far enough. This results in having to set the mirror pointing inwards so far in order to see down the length of the mirror, that half of said mirror is taken up by the side of the unit. Also not helped by the air kit sticking out an inch or so further than the trailer width.
Assuming it’s a full width cab ? the mirrors can’t be anything other than ‘far enough out’.However assuming a narrow cab that’s the argument which is taking place between myself and Juddian.In which he suggests that narrow cabs always have longer mirror arms to compensate.Which really is only a question the manufacturers can answer.
Juddian:
Bloody Hell CF where have you been living the last 30 years in a shed?
For years, since the F90’s at least and probably before, MAN’s have had wide and narrow cabs, in every case the narrower cabs have had longer mirror arms so the mirrors themselves are in the same position relative to the body.
I don’t recall having any vision issues with CF DAF’s, indeed as i recall its one of the better ones for less driver’s side around mirror vision at junctions due to the mirrors still being separate items.
I can only go by my own memory which applied in the case of most/all narrow cabs in the front corners of the truck/trailer body hiding an uninterrupted view along the sides including the rear/trailer wheels and rear corners.Admittedly some being worse than others in that regard.But in general the better view in the mirrors being a big advantage of the full width cabs like the DAF 2800 and 95 v 2500 and 85 for example in that regard.
cav551:
Going from the information the poster has supplied, of the quoted fatalities 5/6 out of the 9 incidents have more to do with the individual being a thoroughly bad driver than anything to do with extra mirrors, sideguards or special windows in doors. These men were going to kill someone on the roads sooner or later anyway.
You can only reduce the blind spots so much and you can only do so much behind the wheel to try and stop unnecessary accidents but all it takes is one clown to try his luck and then you’ve had it. Today I was driving down Chelsea Embankment and it was like the Charge of the Lycra Bridage… Coming from both sides, you need about 18 eyes in different directions to account for everyone. Its high time that cyclists need training on how to perverse their own and their cycling brethens lives. You get the ones that are all cladded up to the nines they look like an alien but they aren’t the ones getting squashed, its Joe from the office who decided to cycle to work because its a nice day. He sees the Lycra loonie so he thinks he can do it…
Its all well and good saying the driver needs to know where the cyclist is but when you have to account not only for the cyclist who may or may not be where you last spotted them, you’ve have to watch your tail swing, your cut in, the other traffic, your road position, if cyclists or bikers in front of you. Driving in a busy urban environment you need your eyes on storks and your head on a swivel.
Photo from the annual fors report ,funny how those promoting saftey are causing blind spots with thier adverts ,the fors licence disc holders should be banned .
Radar19:
You can only reduce the blind spots so much and you can only do so much behind the wheel to try and stop unnecessary accidents but all it takes is one clown to try his luck and then you’ve had it. Today I was driving down Chelsea Embankment and it was like the Charge of the Lycra Bridage… Coming from both sides, you need about 18 eyes in different directions to account for everyone. Its high time that cyclists need training on how to perverse their own and their cycling brethens lives. You get the ones that are all cladded up to the nines they look like an alien but they aren’t the ones getting squashed, its Joe from the office who decided to cycle to work because its a nice day. He sees the Lycra loonie so he thinks he can do it…
.
That did make me smile
Half a league, half a league, half a league onward,
Trucks to right of them,
Trucks to left of them,
Trucks in front of them
Boldly they rode Into the jaws of the city,
Into the mouth of Hell
Theirs not to reason why,
Theirs but to do and die:
nakes me want to invest in some lycra and the obligatory ‘fixie’
LOL
Radar19:
You can only reduce the blind spots so much and you can only do so much behind the wheel to try and stop unnecessary accidents but all it takes is one clown to try his luck and then you’ve had it. Today I was driving down Chelsea Embankment and it was like the Charge of the Lycra Bridage… Coming from both sides, you need about 18 eyes in different directions to account for everyone. Its high time that cyclists need training on how to perverse their own and their cycling brethens lives. You get the ones that are all cladded up to the nines they look like an alien but they aren’t the ones getting squashed, its Joe from the office who decided to cycle to work because its a nice day. He sees the Lycra loonie so he thinks he can do it…
.
That did make me smile
Half a league, half a league, half a league onward,
Trucks to right of them,
Trucks to left of them,
Trucks in front of them
Boldly they rode Into the jaws of the city,
Into the mouth of Hell
Theirs not to reason why,
Theirs but to do and die:
nakes me want to invest in some lycra and the obligatory ‘fixie’
LOL
I know it’s no laughing matter, but you sir win the internet today, this is just what I needed on a 3am call out after a ■■■■■■ start to week
Seen now the second Time a Lorry which works for the Council with :" Stay Clear. Vehicle is turning left!"
Think you fit the Cable on the Minus from Indicator Switch to Relais. You need 2 of it,so one warns Cyclists when turning Left and the other for turning Right. (If you find it as good Idea) vtstore.co.uk/reversing-ala … om-message
Driving in a busy urban environment you need your eyes on storks and your head on a swivel.
Yes you do but the problem is a lot do not bother. Said it many times. Stand at a busy junction and watch and tell me I am wrong.
Both parties are as much to blame as each other.
Attitudes are the biggest problem though.
Mirrors are things of the past. Why put an obstruction the size of a dinner plate in your line of vision? More than once I have moved onto a roundabout when I thought there was a gap, only to have a frightened cyclist, previously obscured by the driver’s mirror, appear, coming round the roundabout. Cameras are cheap as chips now and can be small as buttons
albion1971:
Yes you do but the problem is a lot do not bother. Said it many times. Stand at a busy junction and watch and tell me I am wrong.
Both parties are as much to blame as each other.
Attitudes are the biggest problem though.
I would have thought modern lorries are well enough designed for good careful and fully alert drivers never to have blind spot problems.
The argument for bigger better more mirrors would be akin to demanding bigger clearer windscreens to help idiots avoid low bridges. The problem lies with the driver rather than the truck.
the only change directly regarding mirrors that I would suggest is some sort of roadside test / enforcement to ensure mirrors are optimality adjusted for the driver.
The other area I would look at is to whether there is any correlation between these so called ‘blind-spot’ accidents and how the driver is employed, how he is paid and his workload. 8 to 10 hrs driving is fine when most is done on the open road, but 8 hrs would be an epic shift in central London. May be driving in built-up areas should account for double on the tacho, and drivers should, by law, be paid double when in such an environment. This to me would ensure a number of positives, shorter hours should result in drivers being more switched on, the better pay and shorter working week would attract more experienced drivers, and those in the job would be more compelled to drive better so as to keep their job.
If I am sat stationary at a set of traffic lights, providing I am not distracted I will notice a cyclist come down my nearside in my standard nearside mirrors & will be aware of them. I firmly believe that the field of vision you have on modern trucks is good enough. The problem is likely to get created if the cyclist starts making there way down my nearside after I have started the left turn manoeuvre thinking there is no cyclist there. This is because at some point on a busy London street during the course of the manoeuvre I am going to take my eye off the nearside to check the offside for idiots & people encroaching on my space. There is a lot of information to take in. Us drivers aren’t superhuman, we are driving a large vehicle through a busy environment with limited space and can’t look in every direction all of the time.
Road safety in all instances is a two way street & it’s no different with cyclists. Truck drivers need to be alert & off their phones with clean & well adjusted mirrors, cyclists need to stop riding up the nearside of moving HGV’s near junctions & take more responsibility for their own safety.
It is interesting though that so many of these incidents in London seem to involve tipper trucks. Has it got anything to do with the way these guys are working? A driver in a rush won’t pay as much attention to detail as one taking their time.
Apart from the obvious reason, I’ll suggest that a large proportion of the accidents involve 8w tippers is because of the wide turning circle. You cannot hug the kerb in one, thus moving out to give a wide turn you end up giving undertaking room to a cyclist not paying attention. Using 6 instead of 8wheel tippers may help but then payload is reduced, putting more tipper trucks into crowded environments.
How about someone trialling a tridem 8wheeler in London, with all the other FORS and CLOCs stuff fitted?
albion1971: Driving in a busy urban environment you need your eyes on storks and your head on a swivel.
Yes you do but the problem is a lot do not bother. Said it many times. Stand at a busy junction and watch and tell me I am wrong.
Both parties are as much to blame as each other.
Attitudes are the biggest problem though.
Spot on. I’ve been on a number of fors courses and 90% of the drivers are anti bike.
Look at the cyclist forums or comments on news articles or the clown on here and there attitude is as bad
Immigrant:
fine every Cyclist who does not use a Cycle Way
That’s the trouble, if people cycle in those stupid cycle lanes they get blamed for “under-taking”, but you want to fine people who ignore that useless piece of garbage. Can’t win.
rob22888:
The problem is likely to get created if the cyclist starts making there way down my nearside after I have started the left turn manoeuvre thinking there is no cyclist there. This is because at some point on a busy London street during the course of the manoeuvre I am going to take my eye off the nearside to check the offside for idiots & people encroaching on my space.
On balance it’s more likely that cyclists or pedestrians or sometimes even cars will try to undertake or get into conflict with the nearside of a left turning truck than for the offside or ahead to be compromised.Also bearing in mind that it’s best to stop to let anyone waiting to cross a road you’re turning into cross first before making the turn.Which is why I generally found it safer to concentrate attention more on the nearside mirrors through a turn.In which case large rear tail sweeps obviously don’t help in that regard.While if it’s an artic you won’t see anything much on the offside anyway after starting the turn so there’s no reason to treat rigids a lot differently in that regard.
Immigrant:
fine every Cyclist who does not use a Cycle Way
That’s the trouble, if people cycle in those stupid cycle lanes they get blamed for “under-taking”, but you want to fine people who ignore that useless piece of garbage. Can’t win.
So stop and wait behind the truck until it’s cleared the junction etc regardless just as I would in the case of the car let alone bicycle if it’s two lanes.What’s the problem.IE cycle lanes aren’t there to facilitate dangerous undertaking manouvres.
albion1971:
Yes you do but the problem is a lot do not bother. Said it many times. Stand at a busy junction and watch and tell me I am wrong.
Both parties are as much to blame as each other.
Attitudes are the biggest problem though.
I would have thought modern lorries are well enough designed for good careful and fully alert drivers never to have blind spot problems.
The argument for bigger better more mirrors would be akin to demanding bigger clearer windscreens to help idiots avoid low bridges. The problem lies with the driver rather than the truck.
the only change directly regarding mirrors that I would suggest is some sort of roadside test / enforcement to ensure mirrors are optimality adjusted for the driver.
The other area I would look at is to whether there is any correlation between these so called ‘blind-spot’ accidents and how the driver is employed, how he is paid and his workload. 8 to 10 hrs driving is fine when most is done on the open road, but 8 hrs would be an epic shift in central London. May be driving in built-up areas should account for double on the tacho, and drivers should, by law, be paid double when in such an environment. This to me would ensure a number of positives, shorter hours should result in drivers being more switched on, the better pay and shorter working week would attract more experienced drivers, and those in the job would be more compelled to drive better so as to keep their job.
Have you replied to the wrong person?
I totally agree there are no problems with the trucks.
It’s the drivers that are the problem most of the time.
with a dummy 
