Anyone think this would be a good idea? I know they can be a pain in the arse for some, but the reason for them is clear. A lot of cabbies I know get 4 hours sleep here, 3 there, and then 10 cups of coffee a day will see them right. Certainly can’t be healthy, or safe. I know with the price of fuel now, many don’t earn what they did a decade ago, and many are working more hours to keep their income up, but surely you need a bit of fair competition?
A simplified tacho maybe. I don’t think it’s necessary to go all ■■■■ like the EU driving regs. I have massive misgivings about the wisdom (lack of) with the LGV driving regs anyway, a pile of steaming dung that’s not fit for purpose. In fact don’t get me started on LGV driving regs. I’ve been involved in working fatigue studies on rostering at a non driving transport company and the EU regs leave me speechless for their ineptitude. A classic case of a bunch of now out of date studies from very bright minds in the 70s being collated together by a group of analysts and administered by a team of civil servants and enforced by a diluted generation of more civil servants. An antiquated set of rules based off 30-40 year old research that haven’t been changed just added to bit by bit, so we now have an entirely separate set of incompatible (WTD) rules laced into the cocktail, that are equally useless on top of a highly modified jury-rigged set of 30 odd year old ideology: terribly, really terribly thought out.
Anyway before I start on one!!! I think a simple tacho that records start time, finish and makes sure they have a 1 hour break in the middle without movement would do for taxis. ■■■■ it up and go complicated and you lose your audience. It’s not like they’d be rope and sheeting off card, more like talking bull with fellow drivers/ playing the slots/ having food. That’s their choice.
The meter already records total time
paid time
unpaid time
total miles
paid miles
unpaid miles
total jobs etc
Why burden another industry with more regulation taxi drivers are lucky if they even drive for half their shifts
In my experience the 1s doing mega
hr s were the 1s who do it as a second job firemen prison officers council bin men etc were there isn’t overtime or not enough of it as a lot of councils deregulated taxis making it easy for these guys to just come out when they want leaving the full timers struggling hence more hrs the second job guys would never break the tacho hrs limits as they wouldn’t declare the full time job like they don’t at present
Freight Dog:
A simplified tacho maybe. I don’t think it’s necessary to go all ■■■■ like the EU driving regs. I have massive misgivings about the wisdom (lack of) with the LGV driving regs anyway, a pile of steaming dung that’s not fit for purpose. In fact don’t get me started on LGV driving regs. I’ve been involved in working fatigue studies on rostering at a non driving transport company and the EU regs leave me speechless for their ineptitude. A classic case of a bunch of now out of date studies from very bright minds in the 70s being collated together by a group of analysts and administered by a team of civil servants and enforced by a diluted generation of more civil servants. An antiquated set of rules based off 30-40 year old research that haven’t been changed just added to bit by bit, so we now have an entirely separate set of incompatible (WTD) rules laced into the cocktail, that are equally useless on top of a highly modified jury-rigged set of 30 odd year old ideology: terribly, really terribly thought out.Anyway before I start on one!!! I think a simple tacho that records start time, finish and makes sure they have a 1 hour break in the middle without movement would do for taxis. ■■■■ it up and go complicated and you lose your audience. It’s not like they’d be rope and sheeting off card, more like talking bull with fellow drivers/ playing the slots/ having food. That’s their choice.
Do u think the American H O S (tacho rules) are better
10 (daily driving limit)
14 (daily duty limit)
70 (weekly hrs limit)
Non of this weekly rules fortnightly rules etc
LostSomeWhere:
Do u think the American H O S (tacho rules) are better
10 (daily driving limit)
14 (daily duty limit)
70 (weekly hrs limit)Non of this weekly rules fortnightly rules etc
Its 11hrs drive limit and 70 hours of driving/on duty limit in 8 days and after the 8th day you automatically gain back the hours from day one so you never actually have to stop if you stay under that. If you come to the 70hr limit earlier, which you generally do, you can take a 34hr break and reset the clock back to zero and crack on again.
I certainly like it much better. I’m on paper log books so don’t panic and clock watch and fret over a few minutes violation here and there, even the odd 30 minutes here or there is nothing. I do more hours and longer stints behind the wheel but actually feel much less stressed and tired because I concentrate mainly on the driving, whereas in the UK/Europe you have to concentrate mainly on making sure you’re always 100% compliant with numerous different regulations with absolutely no leeway for error and after all that, you might get a bit of driving done as a secondary activity.
A friend of mine did jus under a grand on xmas day he did wrk pretty much non stop for most of the double fare time tho.
andy12:
A friend of mine did jus under a grand on xmas day he did wrk pretty much non stop for most of the double fare time tho.
No double fare in Glasgow taxis
robinhood_1984:
LostSomeWhere:
Do u think the American H O S (tacho rules) are better
10 (daily driving limit)
14 (daily duty limit)
70 (weekly hrs limit)Non of this weekly rules fortnightly rules etc
Its 11hrs drive limit and 70 hours of driving/on duty limit in 8 days and after the 8th day you automatically gain back the hours from day one so you never actually have to stop if you stay under that. If you come to the 70hr limit earlier, which you generally do, you can take a 34hr break and reset the clock back to zero and crack on again.
I certainly like it much better. I’m on paper log books so don’t panic and clock watch and fret over a few minutes violation here and there, even the odd 30 minutes here or there is nothing. I do more hours and longer stints behind the wheel but actually feel much less stressed and tired because I concentrate mainly on the driving, whereas in the UK/Europe you have to concentrate mainly on making sure you’re always 100% compliant with numerous different regulations with absolutely no leeway for error and after all that, you might get a bit of driving done as a secondary activity.
I came back to change the 10 hrs driving to daily rest but u beat me to it
It sure as hell seems a lot simpler
don’t drive more than 11 hrs
Don’t work more than 14 hrs
no extending the daily driving or reducing the daily rest
Just keep it simple
Now next I believe Canada is slightly different better ?
LostSomeWhere:
I came back to change the 10 hrs driving to daily rest but u beat me to it
It sure as hell seems a lot simpler
don’t drive more than 11 hrs
Don’t work more than 14 hrs
no extending the daily driving or reducing the daily rest
Just keep it simpleNow next I believe Canada is slightly different better ?
In the US you can for example have two hours off during your working day as a uninterrupted block and then have a daily rest period of 8 hours instead of 10, so long as you start another uninterrupted two hour block no more than 24 hours from the start of the one the previous day. For example if you start at 6am, drive until 12 noon and then have two hours off and start again at 2pm and drive until 7pm and book off, you can then start again at 3am but you must stop at or before 12 noon again for the two to make up the requirement for 10 hours off in any 24 hour period. This is something I seldomly do unless I’ve just happened to have more than two hours off getting tipped or loaded and I’m parking early, starting super early and can make it back to Canada before needing to take the two hours off as Canadian rules are different and a 2+8 hr break resets the clock without the requirement for another 2 the next shift. But to keep things simple and what I do 99.9% of the time is just as you say, 11 hrs drive, 14hr spread over and 10 hours off every night.
You do have to have a 30 minute break in the US now before 8hrs of driving/on-duty time so if I’m doing a long trip with just driving for example, I’ll log on, show 15 minutes for my pre-trip, do 5-6 hours driving, have 30 minutes off at least, though I usually take an hour off, sometimes a bit more and then do the remaining 5-6 hours to make up my 11hr drive.
In Canada it can be a bit more complicated.
13 hrs drive per day.
14hrs duty time. You can extend that duty time up to 16hrs if you have two hours off during the day so long as each break is at least 30 minutes long. So two 30 minute breaks and an hour break gives you two extra hours on your duty time and takes off the equivalent time from your daily rest so you can then only have 8 hours off.
Also its 70 in 7 days in Canada and you gain back the hours from day 1 at the end of day 7 or at any point you can have a 36hr rest period which resets the clock back to zero. As its 36 hours in Canada and 34 hours in the US, Canadian trucks always take 36 off regardless of where we are as there is no sense in resetting in the US and not in Canada for the sake of two extra hours.
There are other things you can do in Canada but there is no point in over complicating things.
The biggest difference is the lack of stress with going over my time. I never set out to exceed my driving time and plan everything to the T but crap happens and trucks get stuck in traffic, its a fact of life and unlike the UK where truck drivers must have some of the highest blood pressure in the western world purely because of clock watching and worrying about the consequences of exceeding their legal driving time for two or three minutes, basically as long as it takes a kettle to boil! over here its a non-issue. We log in 15 minute increments anyway so minor violations would simply be rounded down and bigger ones disappear somehow. This of course does lead to abuses but by and large I’ll take the North American model over the European one for the lack of stress and enjoyment of the job.
Yes I read somewhere about cycle 1 and cycle 2 and above 60th parallel oilfield exemptions etc as u say complicated
Another question
During a recent episode of ice road truckers Art got his log book checked and got $450 fine and stood down / parked up for 4 days and something about the company getting points ?
LostSomeWhere:
Yes I read somewhere about cycle 1 and cycle 2 and above 60th parallel oilfield exemptions etc as u say complicatedAnother question
During a recent episode of ice road truckers Art got his log book checked and got $450 fine and stood down / parked up for 4 days and something about the company getting points ?
No idea mate, I’ve never really seen the program. I don’t know why he should be parked up for four days unless he had missing logs and couldn’t show that he hadn’t exceeded his 70/7 or 8 (dont know if it was Canada or Alaska?) but four days seems excessive and wouldn’t be for something minor. The most I’ve ever known anyone put out of service for was 36 hours.
I’ve only been put out of service once for log book violations and that was only for two hours as I’d messed up with the 2+8 rule for the US and a sudden last minute job going just over the border was thrown my way and for lack of any parking on the Canadian side I headed to the border totally forgetting I would be in violation for that country and intended to park at a truckstop about 2 miles in to the US. The DOT were at the border and inspected me and alerted me to the error of my ways and parked me for two hours to bring my log book to where it needed to be. I got no fine though.
Over here its all about weights, its not unusual to be weighed several times a day by the DOT as you enter and sometimes leave each state you drive through.
I did several shifts in my taxi days where I’d start Friday morn, couple of power 20min naps and finish Sunday night/mon morn, only 1every 3months or so but every weekend was 4hrs kip a night, no more.couldnt do it now tho
Done taxi’s myself previously, 60 hour working weekends were commonplace for a cash blast, add that on your week and you got silly money for silly hours, but inbetween that you can be sat about napping waiting for work, it is very rare to nigh on impossible you would do a 6 hour shift and never get a rest of at least 20 mins inbetween jobs, In my experience anyway.
But then you put a tacho in a taxi, where do you stop? Put a taxi in a sqaddies motor, does his Friday work then drives 4+ hours home from base?
Your average person, works Friday then jumps in the car for a weekend away somewhere?
robinhood_1984:
LostSomeWhere:
Yes I read somewhere about cycle 1 and cycle 2 and above 60th parallel oilfield exemptions etc as u say complicatedAnother question
During a recent episode of ice road truckers Art got his log book checked and got $450 fine and stood down / parked up for 4 days and something about the company getting points ?No idea mate, I’ve never really seen the program. I don’t know why he should be parked up for four days unless he had missing logs and couldn’t show that he hadn’t exceeded his 70/7 or 8 (dont know if it was Canada or Alaska?) but four days seems excessive and wouldn’t be for something minor. The most I’ve ever known anyone put out of service for was 36 hours.
I’ve only been put out of service once for log book violations and that was only for two hours as I’d messed up with the 2+8 rule for the US and a sudden last minute job going just over the border was thrown my way and for lack of any parking on the Canadian side I headed to the border totally forgetting I would be in violation for that country and intended to park at a truckstop about 2 miles in to the US. The DOT were at the border and inspected me and alerted me to the error of my ways and parked me for two hours to bring my log book to where it needed to be. I got no fine though.
Over here its all about weights, its not unusual to be weighed several times a day by the DOT as you enter and sometimes leave each state you drive through.
This series is based in Winnipeg iirc
In Glasgow Edinburgh etc a lot of the black cabs are double shifted and in Glasgow at least I know some of the single shifters may do 13-14-15 hr shift on say A Sat only but remember this a spread they go home for their dinner etc
I worked in taxis for years…had 60 drivers working for me also…they all work to suit themselves…some days,nights,some start on a fri and flatout till mon morn,some days nights…working at airports can mean sitting for 2 or 3 hours between jobs. the holding carparks have a burgerbar etc.some might work and do schoolruns in between having to take the misses to the shops etc…ideal job for fat lazy gits that like to spend the day in the bookies.just a job that takes allsorts that work all different ways.its not like long distance when your on a mission,its easy to just stop,and go home,. work at the weekend till you pickup some drunk trollop,and happy days for the rest of the night.everyone works different so I would think a taxitacho would be about as much good as a chocolate teapot,apart from the next thing would be linking the earnings to the meter for the taxman.
dieseldog999:
I worked in taxis for years…had 60 drivers working for me also…they all work to suit themselves…some days,nights,some start on a fri and flatout till mon morn,some days nights…working at airports can mean sitting for 2 or 3 hours between jobs. the holding carparks have a burgerbar etc.some might work and do schoolruns in between having to take the misses to the shops etc…ideal job for fat lazy gits that like to spend the day in the bookies.just a job that takes allsorts that work all different ways.its not like long distance when your on a mission,its easy to just stop,and go home,. work at the weekend till you pickup some drunk trollop,and happy days for the rest of the night.everyone works different so I would think a taxitacho would be about as much good as a chocolate teapot,apart from the next thing would be linking the earnings to the meter for the taxman.
As u well know DD its a non starter would the wife need a digicard to go to the shops or collect u from the pub and as for the taxman most jobs would turn into fixed price so no meter
What next van drivers
To many rules and regs as it is ffs
dieseldog999:
I worked in taxis for years…had 60 drivers working for me also…they all work to suit themselves…some days,nights,some start on a fri and flatout till mon morn,some days nights…working at airports can mean sitting for 2 or 3 hours between jobs. the holding carparks have a burgerbar etc.some might work and do schoolruns in between having to take the misses to the shops etc…ideal job for fat lazy gits that like to spend the day in the bookies.just a job that takes allsorts that work all different ways.its not like long distance when your on a mission,its easy to just stop,and go home,. work at the weekend till you pickup some drunk trollop,and happy days for the rest of the night.everyone works different so I would think a taxitacho would be about as much good as a chocolate teapot,apart from the next thing would be linking the earnings to the meter for the taxman.
Chocolate teapot you say?
LOL…yeah the IRT episode when Art got caught at the new scale…the $450 fine seems about right in MB,but parked up for 4days was pure TV BS,at the very most it should have been 36hrs to reset his log.
The show was on when I was round at a mates for cards/drink and we all are drivers and more than one o us screwed up a hand laughing at the show.,and as robinhood says its less pressure/stress on paper logs than tachos.
jimmy.
JIMBO47:
LOL…yeah the IRT episode when Art got caught at the new scale…the $450 fine seems about right in MB,but parked up for 4days was pure TV BS,at the very most it should have been 36hrs to reset his log.
The show was on when I was round at a mates for cards/drink and we all are drivers and more than one o us screwed up a hand laughing at the show.,and as robinhood says its less pressure/stress on paper logs than tachos.
jimmy.
If a Canadian truck was operating on the 120hr in 14 day cycle (I think thats what it is?) would they be put out of service for 3 days in theory as the reset for that cycle is 72hrs. I’ve never known anyone operate on that cycle and in the last couple of years the option to select it hasn’t even been printed on our logs.