some of you may remember that I sent a letter to my MP asking what the conservatives intended to do to level the playing field for UK hauliers.
I recieved this response yesterday.
Before the we will be worse off than before brigade start, the annual maut will be the same as the current taxation bands. The fuel rebate will in fact lower the annual bill and at least go some of the way to tackling fuel costs.(yes I know its not the answer to the current global crisis but it is a response to the original question).
I am VERY surprised that if the Exchequer is loosing out, that something hasn’t been done already.
Unfortunately, this suggests that any road charging would be offset by offering a rebate on fuel - but, i assume, only if you have paid a road duty - which would really only apply to non UK vehicles.
I dont see how any of that is an improvement for the UK hauliers.
Sorry if it sounds thick, but how does taking with one hand and giving with the other help the UK industry??
of course the exchequer is loosing out, currently something is done. They make us foot the bill letting the Europe fuelled trucks off scot free.
It does not suggest that road charging would be offset by a rebate, it suggests that the scheme would encourage the refuelling in the UK by bonafide operators paying the maut. This brings back money currently missing in the UK economy through fuel taxation etc. due to firms fuelling abroad and paying nothing at all in the UK. The rebate will of course be an added benefit to UK hauliers who currently recieve no form of rebate at all.(I stress the point again that I have asked wether the maut will be set annually at the current road fund level)
Provided the Maut doesn’t screw UK hauliers of course its an improvement:-
NON-UK Hauliers will have to pay to use our roads to compete for UK work
NON-UK Hauliers will only get a rebate on fuel purchased (TAX for roads)
UK Hauliers will get a rebate on fuel currently not there.
I hope the above explainswhy its not giving with one hand etc. the current system allows them to take and take without giving anything.
I forgot to mention also that a Maut will also be a way to stop offenders (Hours/safety) from operating freely in the UK, a simple bar or flag system to Vosa/police at points of entry when purchasing the maut rather than random checks would ensure they have to clean up there acts. Currently its a slap on the wrist a change of driver and very little chance of getting stopped for several months. The bent operators know this that is why they take the risk.
The orginal idea for this came from David Begg in terms of road charging.
Unfortunatly the main parties picked up his ideas and basterdised them.
The orginal idea was to remove fuel duty completly from fuel and remove road tax, leaving just road charging.
On top of that road charging would differ in different areas. If a city had decent public transport and alternatives yet still lots of congestion the road charging would be exepensive. If it was as place with no decent public transport the road charge would be much lower until a time where decent public transport had been implemented.
To help rural areas where private transport is needed there would be very little road charging if any.
Most governents instead of taking his advice changed it to keep fuel duty and getting rid of VED instead and wanting to leavy large charges for using the road.
So i’d be very warey about supporting this unless they can come up firm rates. Whats the point if you end up with fuel slightly cheaper then end up paying 50pence or a £1 a mile to use every road in the UK. WIth the way the price of a barrel of oil is rising could end up paying similar to what you are paying just now with a heavy road charge on top.
Also when talking about the tories got to remember as well they are the new “green” party. They are not going to make trucking cheaper. Infact Cameron, Steven Norris and another high ranking Tory have stated publically Labour were wrong to ditch the fuel duty escalator and have said they would bring it back to increase fuel duty.
I was working on the statement made - “This would mean that in effect British diesel was cheaper than foriegn diesel, and in fact these foriegn trucks would fill up in Dover rather than Calais.”
It makes it sound that only if you have paid a charge would you be entitled to a rebate. I read it that the charge would be for NON UK vehicles. Re-reading it, it would apply to ALL goods vehicles.
I assume then, the point made about a charge being in line with current road fund pricing, would mean that all UK registered vehicles would have already paid by paying their road tax. (Or have I misunderstood??)
I agree with you no scheme should be supported fully without understanding the costs.
As for David Beggs scheme, basically taxation based upon road usage with geographic banding. The cost of implementing the system would have been astronomic if memory serves me correctly a device located in each vehicle would track and charge for road usage. A system using number plates or ANPR was also recommended but thrown out because of the predicted massive increase in number plate theft etc. Planners and the highways also predicted increased a A/B road traffic to avoid heavy tax roads (motorways etc.)
creating more jams and increasing accidents.
As for the rising price of oil cancelling out the scheme meaning we would be paying the same as we are now with a road charge ontop. Surely even if the system is not changed we will still meet the rising cost of oil at the pumps so I don’t get that argument.
The system is not about revolutionising the entire UK road tax system but providing a method to ensure the UK transport industry can compete against cheaper foreign competition.
I agree David Beggs scheme wasn’t feasilble at the time but my main point was the governments since his scheme have been wanting to introduce it anyway but forgetting about getting rid of fuel duty and forgetting about different rates.
There was huge protests about Labours plans because there was talk about £1 per mile. Which would be a huge crippling cost espec if you only were to see somthing like 10pence off fuel duty which in the long term would creep back up.
In theory making the UK a level playing field is a good idea. But on the other hand if its not done right and just makes the cost of working in the UK a lot more expensive its a kinda own goal because the foreign operators have a choice or not working in the UK we don’t.
The foreign operators may think ok its not worth doing business in the UK so we won’t too expensive but the other side of that is it may become to expensive for small UK hauilers and O/D to do business in the UK as well. Just leaving large companies who have such large fleets they can afford to run for pennies.
I guess thats my main worry. Reading his letter he looks at introducing some type of charge for all HGV’s in the UK. Again it doesent say very much.
What would that be a system where you have a daily payment, what would that be tho £25, £50, £100 ? Would it be like the M6 Toll, the congestion charge starts out quite low then in a few years time massive hikes. Or would a system be being charged for the amount of miles you do in a day and again how much would that cost.
Maybe getting old and cynical but i am skeptical, Even tho i am impressed he bothered to respond and seems a lot more on the ball about issues facing UK hauilers.
I know i wasn,t top of the class at school but can somebody explain to me why the brit disc[a form of road tax?]did not comply with eu rules when every country in the eu and beyond charge taxes or tolls on their roads except gb.
Well done N2N,at least you have done something about it and written a letter.
And from it came a promising reply,maybe a load of ■■■■■■■■ spin,but nevertheless welcome,we shall have to wait and see what they do WHEN they get in!!!eh?
The reason other countries toll charges are Legal, and the brit disc isnt, is because other countries are not afraid to say sod you im doing it my way. And i dont believe for one minute that the chancellor will say goodbye to our present road tax system..uk trucks will still pay a vehicle tax, and a road tax on top..so how fair is that..and that letter should have been sent to a present member of parliament, and then we wouldnt get the response if we win the next election..but at least your trying to do something about this miserable state were in,
truckyboy:
The reason other countries toll charges are Legal, and the brit disc isnt, is because other countries are not afraid to say sod you im doing it my way. And i dont believe for one minute that the chancellor will say goodbye to our present road tax system..uk trucks will still pay a vehicle tax, and a road tax on top..so how fair is that..and that letter should have been sent to a present member of parliament, and then we wouldnt get the response if we win the next election..but at least your trying to do something about this miserable state were in,
I was thinking along those lines myself just needed someone to confirm it,many thanks for that mate.
foreign trucks should be made to tax the vehicle when it enters the country the de licence when leaving,this i know is a faff on but they will have shown their test cert and insurance and paid to use our roads for gain ,level playing field they always bleet about
dafdave:
I know i wasn,t top of the class at school but can somebody explain to me why the brit disc[a form of road tax?]did not comply with eu rules when every country in the eu and beyond charge taxes or tolls on their roads except gb.
Any tax has to apply to all trucks, not just those of other countries.
So if there is a brit disc we have to have one as well a foreign trucks, But this is not a problem.
Exempt UK trucks for VED and make them buy a Brit disc, if you buy brit disc by the day then add an admin fee, but most UK hauliers will want a years worth so buy it like the VED.
Even if UK hauliers have to pay the same as foreign trucks at least everybody is paying UK road tax and not just the UK hauliers.
