motley:
how does it count with the vosa if you head east of poland and the important issue is a safe parking and not the hours that you do? Just asking as many a time never found a parking in my driving hours and just chapped on till got somewhere safe and im not talking just over my hours im talking maybe 3hrs or more! I understand the case against mr kydd and this is slightly off topic but would like opinions plse
Prepare thyself to be stoned at dawn you bounder,(with rocks I mean, not in a state of anebriation )
Oh its one rule for one another for the rest…a offense IS A offense REGARDLESS
Go and read up on the Valley Transport investigation and answer that scenario !!!
Sandy Kidd didnt cut rates to get work either. The drivers were paid well also.
As I said earlier plenty off knocking people when there down.
Rikki-UK:
Airfreight:
I will be looking out for every pretentious prick on this link who has said good riddance to this firm,looking for you not going over 40mph on single carraigeways,not running on down hill,not going at 56mph on dual carraigeways,not tipping off the card,it does not matter how big or small the breach of the rules is it is still a breach.He who lives in glass houses,never a truer word.
there is a big diference in this day and age between minor offences and deliberatly flouting the laws. wake up and welcome to 2009. This is not a case of making a mistake, miscounting hours, or forgetting to put a chart in, read the judgement , read the drivers own words, they deliberatly set out to to break the law, in full knowledge of what they were doing.
I was no angel when I was driving, and yes I bent a few laws on occassion, anyone who has driven for any length of time on long distance will have, But I never set out on a day intending to do it. circumstances of that day led to the transgressions, in this case these guys set out first thing in the morning knowing that they were going to take liberties.
Sympathy… I have none, I have sympathy for the guys who worked legally and got laid off as thier boss couldnt compete, I have sympathy for the bosses who worked their asses off to try to run a business legally when their compitor was rigging the the field.
Like the laws or not, you cant pick and choose which laws to deliberatly flout, these guys did thought they could get away with it, and paid the price, dont want to do the time, dont do the crime.
I have worked with VOSA on a company that was non-compliant with the law, That company despite extracting the urine on hours, once pulled by VOSA buckled down and implemented VOSA’s suggestions, took their advice and worked with them to bring the company in line with the law… they never got in front of the TC, VOSA worked with them to resolve the problems. the worst thing you can do when caught out is shut VOSA out… which is exactly what happened in this case,
there is only a few people to blame for this situation and every single one of them work for Sandy Kydd
bedgar047:
Oh its one rule for one another for the rest…a offense IS A offense REGARDLESS
Absolutely. The difference is that the report by VOSA on Sandy Kydd suggests that his drivers were committing about half a dozen offences per driver every single day! As others have said there’s a big difference between going over your 4.5h once a week and being over your driving hours, short of daily rest, and interfering with your tachograph on every single day that you work.
bedgar047:
The drivers were paid well also.
I should hope so! If I was working getting on for 100 hours a week I would expect a huge pay packet!
This is a truck drivers forum and you are the MODERATOR going around spouting off your assisting (or have done) VOSA…
Cake and eat it…god knows what else you say to them
Go and post on Thorburns thread as well you lot are quick enough to knock the Scottish firms
Rikki-UK:
Airfreight:
I will be looking out for every pretentious prick on this link who has said good riddance to this firm,looking for you not going over 40mph on single carraigeways,not running on down hill,not going at 56mph on dual carraigeways,not tipping off the card,it does not matter how big or small the breach of the rules is it is still a breach.He who lives in glass houses,never a truer word.
there is a big diference in this day and age between minor offences and deliberatly flouting the laws. wake up and welcome to 2009. This is not a case of making a mistake, miscounting hours, or forgetting to put a chart in, read the judgement , read the drivers own words, they deliberatly set out to to break the law, in full knowledge of what they were doing.
I was no angel when I was driving, and yes I bent a few laws on occassion, anyone who has driven for any length of time on long distance will have, But I never set out on a day intending to do it. circumstances of that day led to the transgressions, in this case these guys set out first thing in the morning knowing that they were going to take liberties.
Sympathy… I have none, I have sympathy for the guys who worked legally and got laid off as thier boss couldnt compete, I have sympathy for the bosses who worked their asses off to try to run a business legally when their compitor was rigging the the field.
Like the laws or not, you cant pick and choose which laws to deliberatly flout, these guys did thought they could get away with it, and paid the price, dont want to do the time, dont do the crime.
I have worked with VOSA on a company that was non-compliant with the law, That company despite extracting the urine on hours, once pulled by VOSA buckled down and implemented VOSA’s suggestions, took their advice and worked with them to bring the company in line with the law… they never got in front of the TC, VOSA worked with them to resolve the problems. the worst thing you can do when caught out is shut VOSA out… which is exactly what happened in this case,
there is only a few people to blame for this situation and every single one of them work for Sandy Kydd
Oh blimey!! I do hope Rikki hasnt told them about my escapades , back in the good old days.I have had a severe enough kicking from MacVosa, Hammer, Greek, and others, without Geordie Vosa kicking me front door in.Looking for log books and tacho cards from the 1960,s and 70,s. This is certainly a thread which has stirred up some bad feeling amongst the Brothers of the Trucking fraternity. Not that it is a hard thing to do. Just an after-thought. I,d better get me tin hat on .
bedgar047:
Go and post on Thorburns thread as well you lot are quick enough to knock the Scottish firms
I’ve posted on Thorburns thread !!!
It makes no difference which country the cowboys are from they are best out of the game if they have to rely on illegal practices to stay in the game.
I’ve seen plenty of Sandy Kydds “Nice” motors on the road over the past few years, I never thought he was relying on his drivers deliberately breaking the law to stay in business to pay for those motors.
Also for your information, theres a slight difference regarding Thorburns going out of business, the “MAJOR” point being the fact that the directors “Deliberately” misled the Commissioner by failing to disclose that they were banned from being directors.
Either way, it comes down to cowboy activities, and whether they are English, Welsh, Scotch or Irish etc etc etc there are laws to adhere to, I suggest you get your finger out of your backside and search through the forums and see just how many companies have been criticised in the past for illegal activities, and rather strangely you’ll be surprised to see they all aint scotch so dont bother trying to play the “Scotch are being victimised” card
If anyone can play the victimisation card it should be the Irish
bedgar047:
Go and post on Thorburns thread as well you lot are quick enough to knock the Scottish firms
I’ve posted on Thorburns thread !!!
It makes no difference which country the cowboys are from they are best out of the game if they have to rely on illegal practices to stay in the game.
I’ve seen plenty of Sandy Kydds “Nice” motors on the road over the past few years, I never thought he was relying on his drivers deliberately breaking the law to stay in business to pay for those motors.
Also for your information, theres a slight difference regarding Thorburns going out of business, the “MAJOR” point being the fact that the directors “Deliberately” misled the Commissioner by failing to disclose that they were banned from being directors.
Either way, it comes down to cowboy activities, and whether they are English, Welsh, Scotch or Irish etc etc etc there are laws to adhere to, I suggest you get your finger out of your backside and search through the forums and see just how many companies have been criticised in the past for illegal activities, and rather strangely you’ll be surprised to see they all aint scotch so dont bother trying to play the “Scotch are being victimised” card
If anyone can play the victimisation card it should be the Irish
Its you armchair drivers on here who are quick to knock Kidd’s and whoever else, you would think every driver / company on here is squeaky clean. Might like to think that
Have a look in your mirror tomorrow and see who is flying past or got a crap motor, then report it to our resident VOSA man or our mod he will pass the info on
I’m not playing a VICTIMISATION card…SO GET A LIFE
Everyone makes mistakes.
The drivers involved as well as Mr Kydd knew what they were doing, their choice, they knew if caught what would happen and it has. So the End for the company & drivers.
Davey driver. I did the National Service Plus 3 more years.between 1953 and 1958. All bar the first 8 months spent in Malaya.You are quite correct. There are quite a few on this site who would benefit from being seperated from Mummy for a year or two.It might stop them moaning on about ,The boss- the waggon- the wages- and Eddie Stobart. Insofar as the Public Flogging is concerned. You,ll get that soon enough, when the Muslims take over.Maybe even Public Beheadings if you are caught running bent. I,ve got a picture in me mind of Mr.Macdoog with his chopper in his hands .and me kneeling there looking sorry for meself. With Hammer holding the basket for me head to drop into.
Cant say I have noticed an anti scottish theme on this site so I think the anti Scottish firms statement is chucking the toys out the pram because he is upset.
If I was running bent a bit never mind a lot I would wonder about getting caught every time I did it, so its a certainty these drivers knew what would happen.
They did it they got caught now they will do their punishment.
In the good old days as people keep harping on about the working man was marching and fighting for all these H&S laws to stop employers exploiting and in some cases killing or injuring their employees.
bedgar047:
This is a truck drivers forum and you are the MODERATOR going around spouting off your assisting (or have done) VOSA…
Cake and eat it…god knows what else you say to them
Go and post on Thorburns thread as well you lot are quick enough to knock the Scottish firms
I suggest you read the post again, I didnt say which side of the table I was sitting on I said I worked with VOSA, which is true, VOSA will happily sit down with drivers and operators and help them sort out the problems, if the drivers and operators dont shut them out. As it happened in my case VOSA asked to talk to me regarding a few charts that had infringements on them, as part of an investigation into the whole company, I agreed and was interviewed, I explained the charts I could remember and put my hands up for those times I simply couldnt remember why I had run over. The two guys ran through how they like to see manual entries on the back of the charts to explain the odd overrun on hours, also talked me through what they feel is reasonable when exceeding hours to get to safe and secure parking.
For the company as a whole they gave advice on setting up a better checking system, tying in timesheets with tacho’s , also gave advice on keeping the maintanence records.
Once VOSA came in and everyone was straght with them, they could see that what on first glance was a company that was flouting the law, was in fact one that simply didnt have the right system of checks and records in place and a lack of training for both the drivers and management, If the compnay had blocked VOSA’s attempts to investigate I have no doubt they would have eventually been bought up before the TC. They didnt we worked with VOSA to sort out the problems and the issues were resolved.
VOSA dont actually want to shut anyone down, its far more paperwork and hassle for them, Want they want, and are tasked to do is ensure that drivers and operators are compliant with the law, and they will , if the drivers and operators let them, help non-compiiant companies get back on track.
bedgar047:
Go and post on Thorburns thread as well you lot are quick enough to knock the Scottish firms
I’ve posted on Thorburns thread !!!
It makes no difference which country the cowboys are from they are best out of the game if they have to rely on illegal practices to stay in the game.
I’ve seen plenty of Sandy Kydds “Nice” motors on the road over the past few years, I never thought he was relying on his drivers deliberately breaking the law to stay in business to pay for those motors.
Also for your information, theres a slight difference regarding Thorburns going out of business, the “MAJOR” point being the fact that the directors “Deliberately” misled the Commissioner by failing to disclose that they were banned from being directors.
Either way, it comes down to cowboy activities, and whether they are English, Welsh, Scotch or Irish etc etc etc there are laws to adhere to, I suggest you get your finger out of your backside and search through the forums and see just how many companies have been criticised in the past for illegal activities, and rather strangely you’ll be surprised to see they all aint scotch so dont bother trying to play the “Scotch are being victimised” card
If anyone can play the victimisation card it should be the Irish
can i speak up for our fellow celtic victims davey ? i think i am right that scotch is a drink but people from scotland are ok with the term scots. could be like calling people from england after a drink ,like bitter maybe.
Rikki-UK:
VOSA dont actually want to shut anyone down, its far more paperwork and hassle for them, Want they want, and are tasked to do is ensure that drivers and operators are compliant with the law, and they will , if the drivers and operators let them, help non-compiiant companies get back on track.
I’m with Rikki on this one, the original pull by the police was on the 21st March, now either the driver didn’t mention he’d been pulled with no fuse, or Sandy Kydd didn’t really care, but when VOSA went in they asked for the tachos between 1st May - 30th June, a period that started 6 weeks after the police stop.
Now if VOSA were really being picky they could have asked for tachos from a period before the original stop, which would have truly put them in the ■■■■, gagged, cuffed, zipped up and weighed down, as they wouldn’t of been able to do much about, but instead they had a period of grace in which to put things back on track which they couldn’t be arsed to do, as they seemed to have carried on regardless, which is the bit I can’t get my head round.
i dont have sympathy for kydd or his drivers because his drivers knew the risks they were taking, and im sure if they refused to go over their hours like they did and by the looks of it they had been there for a while so im sure that would go under unfair dismissal if they refuse to go over what they can legally do?
he did run a nice fleet and the motors looked great but it just looks like he abused what he had and his drivers, who also agreed to risk their licence.
i dont risk my licence for nobody, i paid for it ill decide bout running over and i wont do it, mayby 20 mins to find safe parking but thats about it.
every one who trys to beat the system knows,
that when caught, they will be puinished if
you do not want this to happen ,then drive
as the rules require you to,As some one posted
early on; yes once or twice a month a small mistake
but not daily, week in and week out, that is plain stupidity
and greed,If the rules are enforced like this then we
will see a reduction in companys that BREAK SUCH
rules, also those that are caught and closed down, will
help bring better rates all round, AND no, I was no angel
but have learnt my lesson like many of us here,How is it
many firms can adjust but some,are so stuck in their ways
that they end up ruining their good name ,and that of
the drivers who work for them, plus these driver may have
problems getting a new job without a driveing licence,
Yes these firms had nice looking lorrys but, sorry that
does not,make them above the LAW;which is what our
grandfathers and fathers fought for to ensure better
and safer working conditions,
Its no wonder our job is totally [zb]'ed. Some folks don’t seem to realise that while cowboys like Kydd cheat the rules and can afford as a result to run cheaper, then that’s what industry will expect - these reduced rates for haulage. So, with rates reduced, our pay is kept low because there is no money on the industry. Jesus Christ! Wake up and smell the coffee. You might be a better driver than me, know more about trucks, right down to torque figures for individual trucks and what Scania comes with a friggin vanity light etc, but if you cannot see the basic business of this argument, then you are a clown and it is you and your likes who are [zb]ing this industry for all of us.
“Back in the day we used to do this…” - Aye, magic. Very proud of you. Thanks for building the foundations of an industry wracked by over legislation and ■■■■ poor rates/wages.
Napoleon88:
Its no wonder our job is totally [zb]'ed. Some folks don’t seem to realise that while cowboys like Kydd cheat the rules and can afford as a result to run cheaper, then that’s what industry will expect - these reduced rates for haulage. So, with rates reduced, our pay is kept low because there is no money on the industry. Jesus Christ! Wake up and smell the coffee. You might be a better driver than me, know more about trucks, right down to torque figures for individual trucks and what Scania comes with a friggin vanity light etc, but if you cannot see the basic business of this argument, then you are a clown and it is you and your likes who are [zb]ing this industry for all of us.
“Back in the day we used to do this…” - Aye, magic. Very proud of you. Thanks for building the foundations of an industry wracked by over legislation and ■■■■ poor rates/wages.
Ayup,well said Napoleon Ive had jobs spoilt by Drivers who bend too many rules,and before any of the oldtime heroes start calling me names,this was in the 70s and again in the 90s.Im not squeeky clean,but there is a limit in my opinion,after which the job is ucked up.Im glad to be out of it now and enjoying my bus pass
Napoleon88:
Its no wonder our job is totally [zb]'ed. Some folks don’t seem to realise that while cowboys like Kydd cheat the rules and can afford as a result to run cheaper, then that’s what industry will expect - these reduced rates for haulage. So, with rates reduced, our pay is kept low because there is no money on the industry. Jesus Christ! Wake up and smell the coffee. You might be a better driver than me, know more about trucks, right down to torque figures for individual trucks and what Scania comes with a friggin vanity light etc, but if you cannot see the basic business of this argument, then you are a clown and it is you and your likes who are [zb]ing this industry for all of us.
“Back in the day we used to do this…” - Aye, magic. Very proud of you. Thanks for building the foundations of an industry wracked by over legislation and ■■■■ poor rates/wages.
well said, i try to run legal and to the best of my knowledge do, never had any infringement notices etc so i seem fine. im nto perfect though.
)
