Not one word about them not been tax and insured to drive on a public road
The-Snowman:
Richard R:
I would like to see trucks going into primary schools as part of a cycling proficiency programme so kids can understand that lorry so can’t always see them, teach them young get the message throughThere was a guy on here a while ago (on another thread where roaduser66 was spouting off) and he said he had tried to do this but the council said no due to health and safety incase a child injured themselves on a sharp edge or fell from the cab etc.
It beggars belief this idea gets vetoed due the “danger of injury” yet its still deemed perfectly acceptable to have them negotiate a few cones then have them “pass” their cycle proficiency and tell them they are ok to cycle on the road!
With my previous employer (DHL) I got involved in their Trucks and Child Safety scheme and was, for a short time, one of the demonstrators. We would take an artic to the school (or, if no reasonable access, take it to a nearby car park etc and meet the kids there). Then we would demonstrate how easy it was to “hide” the whole class in various blind spots, and how it was impossible to hear even the loudest shouts and screams from behind the vehicle. According to DHL, our Pièce de Résistance was supposed to be to stand an old bicycle next to the nearside middle wheel and then execute a left turn over it. Of course with several demonstrations through the day, the bicycle soon became very sorry looking - so my mate had the even better idea of using a watermelon instead to represent the child’s head. I’m sure we traumatised a few of the kids - but I doubt many of them forgot that particular lesson for a while. Anyway, even the teachers and parents who were present all reckoned they got a hell of a better understanding of the issues.
Simple solution, cyclist registration, printed in reflective letters/numbers on the back of a mandatory hi viz. Make undertaking hgv’s illegal, with a £100 spot fine and 3 points on their licence, if no licence put it on if and when they pass. If they can’t come down the near side, they can’t get squashed 
OVLOV JAY:
Simple solution, cyclist registration, printed in reflective letters/numbers on the back of a mandatory hi viz. Make undertaking hgv’s illegal, with a £100 spot fine and 3 points on their licence, if no licence put it on if and when they pass. If they can’t come down the near side, they can’t get squashed
Good in theory. But we are where we are. Seems an obvious good idea from here, but its like outlawing cigarettes; ban them today to save lives and cash; impossible to do because theyve been around too long. Cancer and heart attacks are no deterrent to smokers. If cyclists are prepared to risk death, saving a few seconds on their trip, by squeezing past a truck, are the slim chances of a fine gonna put them off? Licences, reg numbers, insurance are not about to happen, no matter how sensible an idea they are. We all see illegal moves everyday that go unseen by the authorities, fines and laws are of little use if not enforced.
Roymondos post about education seems a more likely way forward; catch em young. Teach kids how to behave responsibly, eventually they will become safer cyclists and later better drivers too. Eventually the publics attitude to stupid cyclists will mirror that of drink-drivers. Itll take years to work but one day selfish, dangerous, cycling will become as socially unacceptable as drink-driving is today.
Franglais:
We all see illegal moves everyday that go unseen by the authorities, fines and laws are of little use if not enforced.
Yes but the point is, there are millions of drivers who will not just flount the law as the fear of getting caught stops them. Manys a time ive sat at a red light at 2/3 in the morning with no other traffic but I still dont just go through it.
At the moment, there is zero fear factor for cyclists to bother with the law or anything they dont like as they have no way of being traced or held accountable. Thats the biggest problem and what people like roaduser66 cant see is that the animosity towards cyclists by some motortists is the way they behave as if they are immune from road laws and do as they please as if they own the place. If they were held accountable then it would go a long way to making better relationships on the road.
I keep hearing from RU66 and the like of how absurd and unworkable cycle registration, cycling tests, tax etc are but whenever I ask WHY its unworkable, they never have a reason or an explanation.
The-Snowman:
Franglais:
We all see illegal moves everyday that go unseen by the authorities, fines and laws are of little use if not enforced.Yes but the point is, there are millions of drivers who will not just flount the law as the fear of getting caught stops them. Manys a time ive sat at a red light at 2/3 in the morning with no other traffic but I still dont just go through it.
At the moment, there is zero fear factor for cyclists to bother with the law or anything they dont like as they have no way of being traced or held accountable. Thats the biggest problem and what people like roaduser66 cant see is that the animosity towards cyclists by some motortists is the way they behave as if they are immune from road laws and do as they please as if they own the place. If they were held accountable then it would go a long way to making better relationships on the road.
I keep hearing from RU66 and the like of how absurd and unworkable cycle registration, cycling tests, tax etc are but whenever I ask WHY its unworkable, they never have a reason or an explanation.
If we had a clean sheet thatd work fine, but seems to me that we are, where we are, and cycle reg, no matter how sensible, how necessary, aint gonna happen. The inertia from such a long time of dereg, with so many cyclists, won`t be overcome.
Rikki-UK:
Don’t agree with me Carryfast, my reputation on these forums is shot as it isOne passing comment Roaduser, I can feel you have a lot of compassion for cyclists and their families that have been tragically killed on the streets of London.
I have gone back through all your posts and read every thread you have posted in. in all drivers here have spoken about how cyclists deaths are tragic, some quite emotively and passionately.
I have read how drivers here genuinely want to make a difference and help make the roads safer for all.
I have not seen one word of compassion or understanding from you for the anguish and lifelong pain a truck driver will feel if by doing his work and by no fault of his own a cyclist dies. not one word of understanding of the lengths drivers go to to keep everyone safe to the best of their ability. Not one word about the 10’000s of truck drivers who guide their trucks through Londons streets every day safely.
NOT one word. I will tell you what the word is to all those truck drivers on here who try their very best in the most difficult of circumstances to keep everyone safe the word you should use…
Is THANKYOUBecause if these guys didn’t care and the companies didn’t care there would be 1000x more ghost bikes chained to railings around London.
I am surprised and proud that the guys here have let you rage at them as much as you have, they normally are not so restrained on here.the guys who drive these (YOUR WORDS) “killer trucks” are human beings not automations, they have lives and families too. Not one goes out every day to earn money whatever the cost .
Some folks on here will know who I am about to talk about, but I wont name him . a driver , just left the yard and a young girl aged 16 walked right under his truck- suicide by truck- quite deliberate- the driver never managed to cope with what happened, he never drove again , it destroyed his family life and in the end he took his own life- that’s a killer truck driver for you,. Someone you feel to label and denigrate, maybe not deliberately but by your postings and their tone that’s what you are doing.I think you have to go away and realise that from this side of the fence we feel that if the cycling community are serious about this, and not just laying the blame/responsibility out, they have to step up as well… you have been asked time and time again what is your community doing to add to all the measures the haulage industry can show they are taking, and you haven’t/cannot reply - there will come a natural point where folks will start asking well if you as a cycling community are really not that arsed about this that you wont do anything, why should we continue to be the whipping boys- you claim you find this serious and important if you do stand up as a community and put your money where your mouth is and join in training for all road users. If you don’t then you lose all your own credibility. and become part of the problem not the solution.
But we know, you wont come back and answer the difficult questions, you wont come back with any positive meaningful suggestions, you wont come back and look at how we can make a change together. you will come back with meaningless statistics, excuses why you cant do anything, and avoid actually engaging with us in any positive way. I agree that at one time the biggest problem in London re: trucks and cyclists was my own industry, today the biggest problem is the cyclists and their refusal to understand they are part of the problem and have to activate to become part of the solution… we are doing our share where the hell are you?
have to say,very well said
truckman020:
Rikki-UK:
Don’t agree with me Carryfast, my reputation on these forums is shot as it isOne passing comment Roaduser, I can feel you have a lot of compassion for cyclists and their families that have been tragically killed on the streets of London.
I have gone back through all your posts and read every thread you have posted in. in all drivers here have spoken about how cyclists deaths are tragic, some quite emotively and passionately.
I have read how drivers here genuinely want to make a difference and help make the roads safer for all.
I have not seen one word of compassion or understanding from you for the anguish and lifelong pain a truck driver will feel if by doing his work and by no fault of his own a cyclist dies. not one word of understanding of the lengths drivers go to to keep everyone safe to the best of their ability. Not one word about the 10’000s of truck drivers who guide their trucks through Londons streets every day safely.
NOT one word. I will tell you what the word is to all those truck drivers on here who try their very best in the most difficult of circumstances to keep everyone safe the word you should use…
Is THANKYOUBecause if these guys didn’t care and the companies didn’t care there would be 1000x more ghost bikes chained to railings around London.
I am surprised and proud that the guys here have let you rage at them as much as you have, they normally are not so restrained on here.the guys who drive these (YOUR WORDS) “killer trucks” are human beings not automations, they have lives and families too. Not one goes out every day to earn money whatever the cost .
Some folks on here will know who I am about to talk about, but I wont name him . a driver , just left the yard and a young girl aged 16 walked right under his truck- suicide by truck- quite deliberate- the driver never managed to cope with what happened, he never drove again , it destroyed his family life and in the end he took his own life- that’s a killer truck driver for you,. Someone you feel to label and denigrate, maybe not deliberately but by your postings and their tone that’s what you are doing.I think you have to go away and realise that from this side of the fence we feel that if the cycling community are serious about this, and not just laying the blame/responsibility out, they have to step up as well… you have been asked time and time again what is your community doing to add to all the measures the haulage industry can show they are taking, and you haven’t/cannot reply - there will come a natural point where folks will start asking well if you as a cycling community are really not that arsed about this that you wont do anything, why should we continue to be the whipping boys- you claim you find this serious and important if you do stand up as a community and put your money where your mouth is and join in training for all road users. If you don’t then you lose all your own credibility. and become part of the problem not the solution.
But we know, you wont come back and answer the difficult questions, you wont come back with any positive meaningful suggestions, you wont come back and look at how we can make a change together. you will come back with meaningless statistics, excuses why you cant do anything, and avoid actually engaging with us in any positive way. I agree that at one time the biggest problem in London re: trucks and cyclists was my own industry, today the biggest problem is the cyclists and their refusal to understand they are part of the problem and have to activate to become part of the solution… we are doing our share where the hell are you?
have to say,very well said
That’s why Rikki leads this forum! 
And to prove he’s not CF’s alter ego. 
i didnt realise it was illegal for a cyclist to pass on inside
Glenntran:
i didnt realise it was illegal for a cyclist to pass on inside
Its not illegal to take your toaster into the bathroom and make a couple of slices while having a bath either but its not exactly a wise decision.
Not illegal does not automatically mean perfectly safe
Glenntran:
i didnt realise it was illegal for a cyclist to pass on inside
Fault isn’t always determined by legality.It’s not illegal to overtake unless markings say otherwise.But it is a charge of dangerous driving to cause a head on crash because of being on the wrong side of the road when something is approaching.In just the same way that it’s probably a charge of dangerous driving to run over a turning cyclist while undertaking or overtaking them through a junction on the same basis that rule 167 of the highway code applies.No surprise the cyclist lobby seems to be selective in its view of the highway code.Like riding an unlit bike on the road at night based on the excuse that using the pavement isn’t allowed.
And so this London cyclist v truck debate rumbles on. Honestly chaps, it’s not worth arguing with the London cyclist lobby, just let them crack on and enforce whatever safety measures/bans they want.
The long term result will be goods being delivered to large hubs just outside the low emissions zone, saving many hauliers the expense of complying with standards not necessary everywhere else & Londoners being charged a fortune by opportunistic hauliers for consolidation then onward delivery in TFL compliant low cab rigids with every safety feature under the sun.
Then, inner city Londoners can pay ever more of a fortune for living in squalor.
.
roaduser66:
No you are the one that is saying all the drivers are wrong, and therefore only drivers have responsibility for what happens on the road
I have said nothing of the kind, once again you are lying about what I said. STFU if you are unable to post without lying.
Touchy little fellow, aren’t you?
The questions still stand: Do you wear lycra when you are on your bike, do you become very angry with pedestrians when you think that they are in ‘your’ way and do you try to beat your previous best times when making a journey on your bike?
cattle wagon man:
removed… not helpful and off topic, if you want to raise race issues in London go to a website that panders to that, we dont
Cheers , cattle wagon man .
Well done Rikki
Why not go back to having extra windows on the passenger doors, like the maggie 8 wheel tippers in the 80’s.
I’d be happy to never drive in London again. Accidents happen so often cause car drivers are in a bloody rush with no regards to safety. They justold pull out and cut in without any care in the world.
Of course it’s not just trucks ‘killing’ cyclists;
2016 so far - 2 HGV artics on straight roads, 2 cars, 1 bus, 1 flatbed transit, 1 cyclist just fell off on poor surface
2015; 7 HGVs, 1 car, 1 cyclist hit another cyclist
2014; 5 HGVs, 7 cars, 1 cyclist fell off
Has it been a fluke this year or generally speaking has message about safety filtered through to more road users in general?
The-Snowman:
Its not illegal to take your toaster into the bathroom and make a couple of slices while having a bath either but its not exactly a wise decision.
And the reason for that is because the steam makes the toast go all soggy otherwise perfectly OK, I knows cos I ride a bike … 
raymundo:
The-Snowman:
Its not illegal to take your toaster into the bathroom and make a couple of slices while having a bath either but its not exactly a wise decision.And the reason for that is because the steam makes the toast go all soggy
Exactly. Plus when your hands are wet its hard to hold the knife to butter the toast and it can slip in the water