Sacked for making a h&s suggestion

Sorry,

Who gives a hell if your rospa, ADI, congrasts you managed to pass a test, wow big deal, I worked at M&S RDC’s I used to use Hazard lights but then they had a one way system in only shunter used to go wrong way in his unit … I think you airt on the Geek I know it all your wrong type …

ERRRRRRRRRRRRRR I have an issue, the mph is 5mph I noticed your driver was doing 5.00000000000001 mph, i need to advise you that i am a ADI car which has no relevance to driving a truck oh and I am a member of ROSPA, I think we need to talk about this H&S in your company … I would tell you to foxtrot Oscar as you are there to drive, good job the likes of you dont go back you F it up for decent drivers.

EastAnglianTrucker:

Gogan:

Harry Monk:
Yes, this is true, nearly all H&S is about the mitigation of litigation. If there is an accident, a company can defend a claim if it can prove that it has taken all reasonable measures to minimise the risk of accidents, even if the measures do not actually make anything safer. Simply the fact that some stuffed shirt was paid to dream these rules up is a good defence.

In our case, it’s not the fear of litigation that provides the incentive to take H+S seriously, but rather the fear of prosecution!

Like most companies, we have extensive insurance policies covering both Public and Employer liabilities. To be honest, these insurance policies cost pennies in the great scheme of things (our public liability insurance costs less each year than the vending contract for the coca-cola dispenser in the canteen!) but would pick up the majority of the legal and compensation bill for any litigation claim resulting from an accident, regardless of whether we could have prevented it.

Unfortunately the insurance policy won’t prevent myself, or the other directors or accountable managers from being prosecuted by the HSE, and very possibly imprisoned for failing to take reasonable steps to prevent an accident occuring.

Financial loss I can deal with, losing my liberty however is not worth the risk regardless of how pointless some of the rules and procedures seem, and for the record I think a vast majority of them are pointless!

You do make a very valid point Gogan, and not for the first time on this thread I might add.

However, I do wonder what the response will be when everyone wears their PPE, and observes even the most banal of H&S directives to the letter, as the logical result is diminished productivity and eventual commercial standstill, for fear that someone will do something, anything, that might harm another person, in the context of commercial operations. And I might add, contractors will only enter commercial premises once they have been indemnified and insured against potential prosecution.

We laugh at the example of wearing a hard hat in a field, but blind observance of the “rules” doesn’t necessarily result a totally accident free work place. The law of diminishing returns is bound to kick in when everyone wears luminous workwear, making them actually blend into their surroundings, rather than stand out.

You could argue that the objective is to minimise the risk, but that will not ultimately stop you from being prosecuted by an increasingly draconian H&S executive.

Taken to its logical conclusion, an HGV driver for example, will no doubt soon be able to sue his employers, should he be injured in an accident involving him driving into a tree, or a ditch at the side of the road. (Or any other potential hazard for that matter.) After all, given his employers duty of care to their workforce, they should risk assess every ditch and tree on their driver’s routes, and either take action to remove the obstruction or minimise the risk of an accident… possibly by instructing their driver to travel past said hazards at 5mph or below. And even at that speed, as we read about in the papers these days, whiplash can still be the cause a massive claim for compensation.

In the final analysis, there’s only so much you can do to cover your backside.

Great post this. ^^^

For example:

If you are laid down in a field full of bright yellow flowers in all yellow hiviz, how easy would you be to spot from the air?

If you were laid in the same field in a black jacket and trousers, how easy would you be to spot?

A silly example yes. But illustrates beautifully that, when all are wearing the same stuff, everyone blends into the background and ‘disappears’

Most H&S is an unnecessary waste of time. One day the above will occur to the powers that be and we’ll all have to wear different colour hiviz. There will be a roaring trade, some will go for Nike, some Adidas, some M&S!!!

I was once pulled up in a B&Q RDC for ‘not having my hazards on’ I apologised and asked why. I was told it was ‘company policy’. ‘Ok,’ says I, ‘why is it company policy?’ Erm, ahem, erm, and the driver had no idea. He eventually said ‘so you can be seen’. Ah, said I, ‘so how is it you were able to walk over to my lorry and address me about it just now if I can’t be seen without my hazards on? Surely if you can’t see a Scania with a 40ft Maersk box on it you shouldn’t be working here?’ And, ‘I’ve just driven here from Fxto (180m) without them on and no-one has run into me. Are all the staff here blind or stupid?’

No one had an answer that made any sense at all…company policy is to pay some chinless wonder 40K a year to sit in an office playing at silly buggers… :laughing:

H&S :unamused: I remember as a youngster working for Ilford Films in the pitch dark our only H$S was you had to keep shouting “Mind me” whilst trundling through the corridors, bloody hilarious. :grimacing:

alot of the site rules are a knee jerk reaction in reponse to an incident or near miss, as the managment have to be seen to do something otherwise they can leave themselves wide open to being sued if the same happens again, stupid i know but its this sue for everything culture we live in…

jessicas dad:

Gogan:
I think the basic answer is that the gaffer decided you were going to be trouble, and that is something he can do without!

i couldnt agree more, your an agency driver go in get the job done and go home again. its not your place to question the site rules.

when i go to a place of work i try to keep a lower profile the better, i dont contact or engage conversation with the office in question unless im really forced to, i like the out of sight out of mind way of working.

as an agency driver ive been to companies and seen other agency workers carrying on at office staff or trying to join the conversations like they actually work there… they normally come a cropper like you.

I sub-contract direct to several companies, and never question their H&S rules & regs, even if i disagree with them, and I hold IOSH certificates. It’s their yard, it’s their rules, some of the yards I work in insist on hazards at all times, some don’t - personally I mostly only use them when reversing but as I keep my head down and get on no-one says anything. Easiest thing is to play the game their way, keep your head down, drive the truck and go home.

Herongate:

jessicas dad:

Gogan:
I think the basic answer is that the gaffer decided you were going to be trouble, and that is something he can do without!

i couldnt agree more, your an agency driver go in get the job done and go home again. its not your place to question the site rules.

when i go to a place of work i try to keep a lower profile the better, i dont contact or engage conversation with the office in question unless im really forced to, i like the out of sight out of mind way of working.

as an agency driver ive been to companies and seen other agency workers carrying on at office staff or trying to join the conversations like they actually work there… they normally come a cropper like you.

I sub-contract direct to several companies, and never question their H&S rules & regs, even if i disagree with them, and I hold IOSH certificates. It’s their yard, it’s their rules, some of the yards I work in insist on hazards at all times, some don’t - personally I mostly only use them when reversing but as I keep my head down and get on no-one says anything. Easiest thing is to play the game their way, keep your head down, drive the truck and go home.

Although I disagree with much H&S ■■■■■■■■■, the above post is spot on.

Get on, do the job as well as you can, get out and ■■■■ 'em and their stupid rules! :sunglasses:

I bet there are many people on here that have worked for the same company for several years, accepting the rules whatever they maybe, only for the newest member of staff to come along with “suggestions” and all of a sudden they’re the self appointed drivers’ spokesman (or woman as some of us have experienced) :wink:

So,

Sir SteveRospa. You are clearly, a very educated, wise, experienced man, with a lot of qualifications, and massive experience, in road safety, on Motorcycles, Cars and Trucks.

So How did you benefit, from questioning the H&S policy ?

Has this made your agency realise how valuable you are ?

i wonder how many times per day the op informs people that he`s rospa,iam and adi…possibly whilst using a ken livingstone type accent

Semi Cdn:
So,

Sir SteveRospa. You are clearly, a very educated, wise, experienced man, with a lot of qualifications, and massive experience, in road safety, on Motorcycles, Cars and Trucks.

So How did you benefit, from questioning the H&S policy ?

Has this made your agency realise how valuable you are ?

Questionable. Have you tried to read his ran…, sorry posts? :wink: :stuck_out_tongue: :stuck_out_tongue:

Semi Cdn:
So,

Sir SteveRospa. You are clearly, a very educated, wise, experienced man, with a lot of qualifications, and massive experience, in road safety, on Motorcycles, Cars and Trucks.

So How did you benefit, from questioning the H&S policy ?

Has this made your agency realise how valuable you are ?

Yes is probably has unfortunately!!! :laughing: :laughing:

Sir Steve, ROSPA, ADI, VC, UNEMPLOYED

steverospa:
I was working for a big pallet company near coalville in Leicestershire, (SILVER UNITS AND TRAILERS) most of you will know by now who im on about.
What i asked was there a suggestion box as most or some big professional outfits have them.
What my suggestion was is why do you have to drive round the yard with you hazards lights on.
I was told to be seen, i then told this chap that hazards lights should only be used really when stationery as stated in the highway code.
I also pointed out that when you are following around the yard you can not see what the truck in front is going to do, a valid point as i thought as im Rospa (gold) bike and car trainer, and a fully qualified ADI driving instructor.
NOT SO BECAUSE IM A AGENCY WORKER IT WAS NICE AND BIG OF THEM TO SAY TO MY AGENCY NOT TO SEND ME THERE AGAIN, AND BAND ME FROM SITE… :imp: :imp: :imp: :imp:
A VALID POINT OR NOT…

best post was the last but i love rospa [ gold ] bike and car trainer and a fully qualified adi driving instructor so that gives you the right to tell a company how to run, i dont want another warning so i leave with i used to have an amex platinum charge card, yes i had airport lounge access but that was all