I’ve read your reply several times, I hope you don’t take this the wrong way, but I just can’t see what you’re saying.
Mike P,
Thank you.
I’ve been left a while now, so I’ll not be asking for the new sheets.
Those sheets were/still are old well used ones that tended to be used on loads that didn’t need to be kept dry, and/or loads where there was a good chance something may go through it. I know, shouldn’t let that happen. As I said, that load didn’t need sheeting, so they were good enough to throw over it.
Mr Bewick.
I, like a good many others, was a lad going with Dad in the wagon in the days “when S&R was king”, so we’ve not had the chance to do this day in day out, much as we’d like to.
I like to take pride in roping & sheeting because of the shunters and drivers you speak of, it’s their work I saw as a young 'un, and that to me is how the job should be done. When I throw a sheet over a load, I see it as my “duty” to make a good job of it, I don’t want to sound over dramatic here, but I want to “honour” the men that took this in their stride day after day come wind, rain, shine, snow or anything else. What they did at work every day is something to be proud of, and I’m very pleased to see other “latter day” drivers appear to see things the same way. Yourself and Mr D are of course included in “they”.
Totally agree with you there my good friend
if we all took pics of every load weve sheeted we would need a 45 ft flat loaded with boxes of pics fly sheeted of course ; )
the job has changed dramatically over the last ten years with elf and safety at the extreme
climbing on trailers nowadays is almost forbidden without airbags safety harness etc etc never mind climbing on top of a load to roll sheets out
shame really, but theres not many lads that want to sheet loads nowadays twice a day anyway
as you know its a regular sight in our yard but nothing like the sights you were used too
Mike Ponsonby
Bewick transport
Lichfield
Staffs
[
quote=“Bewick”]What I am about to say will probably go down like a “lead balloon” in many quarters but it is just my opinion and in no way casts aspersions on the “one off” sheeting and roping jobs that appear on the thread now and are first class efforts make no mistake.However,they are just that, “one offs” which will have taken time and slow careful effort in order to produce a near perfect example of what is now a dying craft.IMHO the real skill in S&R unfortunately died a lingering death as Curtainsiders took hold in the late '70’s and into the 80’s.The real skill lay with the many Shunters(and Drivers) that loaded flat trailers,and rigids,in the big works and busy warehouses,I am thinking here of the likes of the big Glass works,Metal Box factories,Food manufactures and quite a few Paper mills,some of which we operated from.When a Shunter had sometimes upwards of 10 + trailers a day to load,sheet and rope singlehanded he didn’t have time to stop and admire his work or photograph his work(mores the pity) as he had to get another empty onto the bay PDQ.I’ve witnessed many a time what I’ve just described at many places and the the quality of the R&S in most cases was comparable to any shot on this thread in fact it was wonderous to behold as to how some of these Shunters got through their days work but still managed to turn out immaculate loads but had no time to stand back and admire their sterling efforts.I know I may draw some Flak but those were the days when S&R was King and those are the shots which should be featuring on the thread but alas it never can be as we all well know Anyway I will await the “onslaught” with interest although I hope no one has “taken a powder” with my coments. Cheers Bewick.
[/quote]
Leyland600:
102Here is a fine example of roping and sheeting by a pal of mine when he drove for a mutual friend of Bewick and myself.
Leyland 600.
Now that is a “fly sheet and a half” L600,it must be 16ft wide or so ! What would the load have been,outward from W.■■■■■■■ or inward ? They certainly won’t taking any chances on it getting wet eh! Cheers Bewick.
MIKE P:
Totally agree with you there my good friend
if we all took pics of every load weve sheeted we would need a 45 ft flat loaded with boxes of pics fly sheeted of course ; )
the job has changed dramatically over the last ten years with elf and safety at the extreme
climbing on trailers nowadays is almost forbidden without airbags safety harness etc etc never mind climbing on top of a load to roll sheets out
shame really, but theres not many lads that want to sheet loads nowadays twice a day anyway
as you know its a regular sight in our yard but nothing like the sights you were used too
Mike Ponsonby
Bewick transport
Lichfield
Staffs
[
You crawl arse Now that would have been an idea 30/35 years ago a depot at Tamworth maybe but where would I have got the traffic from around there ? We did a lot into Birmingham and we used to reload Thermolite blocks from Coventry back to Worsely IIRC.And we had driver who lived in W.Brom and he tipped a trunk trailer every day at a paper merchants in Hinkley.We’d have probably struggled to get any decent drivers around Lichfield and Tamworth Cheers Dennis.
quote=“Bewick”]What I am about to say will probably go down like a “lead balloon” in many quarters but it is just my opinion and in no way casts aspersions on the “one off” sheeting and roping jobs that appear on the thread now and are first class efforts make no mistake.However,they are just that, “one offs” which will have taken time and slow careful effort in order to produce a near perfect example of what is now a dying craft.IMHO the real skill in S&R unfortunately died a lingering death as Curtainsiders took hold in the late '70’s and into the 80’s.The real skill lay with the many Shunters(and Drivers) that loaded flat trailers,and rigids,in the big works and busy warehouses,I am thinking here of the likes of the big Glass works,Metal Box factories,Food manufactures and quite a few Paper mills,some of which we operated from.When a Shunter had sometimes upwards of 10 + trailers a day to load,sheet and rope singlehanded he didn’t have time to stop and admire his work or photograph his work(mores the pity) as he had to get another empty onto the bay PDQ.I’ve witnessed many a time what I’ve just described at many places and the the quality of the R&S in most cases was comparable to any shot on this thread in fact it was wonderous to behold as to how some of these Shunters got through their days work but still managed to turn out immaculate loads but had no time to stand back and admire their sterling efforts.I know I may draw some Flak but those were the days when S&R was King and those are the shots which should be featuring on the thread but alas it never can be as we all well know Anyway I will await the “onslaught” with interest although I hope no one has “taken a powder” with my coments. Cheers Bewick.
Dennis I agree with every word you said when you were doing it day in and day out it came naturally to you. I never took to curtainsiders as I felt you could never secure the load as well as on a flat. That possibly was due to our ones all being second hand and hence missing most of the internal straps. We had one that was a new build body on a used trailer by KURTRANZ of TELFORD I was happily tightening down the internals when I hears a pinging noise followed by the strap falling!!! they were fixed to the roof with POP RIVITS nae wonder Tam thought it was fairly cheap. Eddie.
Dennis
Like you I can admire a well sheeted load and I agree that in days of yore— your’s and mine—it was a common place sight and more often than not done with canvas or oil cloth sheets which weighed a ton not like the nylon or plastic based ones which became the norm a couple of decades ago.
Having ,to some extent “,been there and done that” I thought I’d post a picture of my favourite load and you will see that it looks a treat and not a flapping rope or corner in sight
robert1952:
Great pics of the loads of hop pokes and pockets, Paul. Someone on the Kent Transport thread was crying out for any Colin Ashby pics a while ago… Robert
That was me Robert, don’t you remember? your getting old Robert
Bewick:
What I am about to say will probably go down like a “lead balloon” in many quarters but it is just my opinion and in no way casts aspersions on the “one off” sheeting and roping jobs that appear on the thread now and are first class efforts make no mistake.However,they are just that, “one offs” which will have taken time and slow careful effort in order to produce a near perfect example of what is now a dying craft.IMHO the real skill in S&R unfortunately died a lingering death as Curtainsiders took hold in the late '70’s and into the 80’s.The real skill lay with the many Shunters(and Drivers) that loaded flat trailers,and rigids,in the big works and busy warehouses,I am thinking here of the likes of the big Glass works,Metal Box factories,Food manufactures and quite a few Paper mills,some of which we operated from.When a Shunter had sometimes upwards of 10 + trailers a day to load,sheet and rope singlehanded he didn’t have time to stop and admire his work or photograph his work(mores the pity) as he had to get another empty onto the bay PDQ.I’ve witnessed many a time what I’ve just described at many places and the the quality of the R&S in most cases was comparable to any shot on this thread in fact it was wonderous to behold as to how some of these Shunters got through their days work but still managed to turn out immaculate loads but had no time to stand back and admire their sterling efforts.I know I may draw some Flak but those were the days when S&R was King and those are the shots which should be featuring on the thread but alas it never can be as we all well know Anyway I will await the “onslaught” with interest although I hope no one has “taken a powder” with my coments. Cheers Bewick.
Sadly, & I do mean sadly Dennis, I can’t argue with a word of what you say , not because I want a row, but because it is another example of how the Industry we live & work in is basically going (or has gone) down the crapper, so to speak! Yes the H&S rules & reg’s that we constantly get kicked down our throats almost daily now, with site induction videos & on-site safety sheets etc etc etc that you have to watch/read nearly everywhere you try to deliver/collect from nowadays , despite the fact that you could have been going to some of these places for 20-30 yrs, all of a sudden none of us are considered intelligent enough to recognise any dangers or to know what we are doing ! Tautliners have taken over & rule the roost, yes they are easier & faster, it’s all about speed nowadays, strange how the safety side is ignored when it suits though isn’t it , but many a time I have used ropes inside a Tautliner to secure something using the rings in the floor, because I just couldn’t get the straps from the rails in the roof to secure something properly, they may stop stuff going sideways/back or forth, but you actually try pinning something to the deck with them, yes you can use straps but I always felt I had a better feel of the tension with ropes! Here in lies the problem there today, a interesting survey would be "How many wagon drivers today know how to tie a Dolly?, I bet the answer to that would be quite depressing too . Regards Chris
deckboypeggy:
Imust say it is good to read that most of the comments on roping and sheeting have all come from men who have done it,no [zb],just as the job was,all the young men who want to learn to drive should be put through a weeks course of hand ball, .
I joined up in 1987
Contrary to what you read on here I didn’t do two laps of the parade ground for my license.
Before you could go on the HGV course you had to pass “load and restraint”
Thetr was a hanger full of trailers, ropes, sheets and straps.
You had to demeonstrate how to restrain a load using each or a combination if them.
We learned hook and ring dollies.
It stood me in good stead ansd was great learning for a 17 year old.
My first unit still had Leyland Bison dropsides/ flats so we roped and sheeted every load.
My first civvie job was roping and sheeting.
I found if you were doing it every day it was a doddle.
I tell you a tale that I put on another bit of here a while back.
I had broke down (the truck not me things weren’t that bad)
The lad who towed me in took me back to the factory and I found my car had been broke into.
Called my boss (by know about 22:00) and we agreed not to come in next day.
I came in to find the sheet laying in the yard with forklifts running over it.
My ropes were short litle lengths with the knots still in.
One of the forlift drivers had tried to undo the ropes.
A driver who was collecting (with a taut) advised him to get a rope wrench.
Having explained to them what it was he showed then how to saw through the ropes.
When they tried to unsheet it (so the boss told me)
One lad had an asthma attack.
One lad hurt his back.
One felt faint.
Funny enough after this (when I got new ropes) nobody thought I was swinging the lead or being a wimp asking the forklift driver to lift the sheet onto the load for me.
Hi Dennis, I dont know what the load was but RWB was always geared up with the correct sheets for the job. Can you imagine what he would have said if Ken had got the load wet. At the LDOY national championships in 1970 RW attended as a spectator but after watching some attempts to sheet trailers decided to have a go just for a laugh, resulting in him winning outright and again the following year. Here he is in action.
Cheers Leyland 600
Hi adr, Aye elf n safety have a lot to answer for, I remember a particularly windy day circa 1969 unloading concrete stairwell panels at St Andrews House at the north end of the Tyne Bridge, a tower crane was doing the lifting clicking each panel up rapidly after setting the slings and the aenamomiter bell ringing on the crane like mad when the wind speed reached 40mph, nevertheless I got tipped quickly and 5 minutes run over the Swing Bridge to Rank’s Baltic Mill (now “The Baltic Arts Centre”) where I loaded 14 tons of bulky wheatfeed bags for Carrs Flour Mills at Silloth. After pulling off the loading chute into the high open ended mill yard I lifted my 36ft x 24ft plastic sheet off the cab roof onto the top of the load and proceeded to open it out fore and aft then down each side this sheet being for such loads on my Mickey Mouse Foden 8 legger. I had just got the sheet nicely spread and was letting myself decend back to ground level holding the sheet strings when a huge gust of wind lifted the sheet and me completely off the load and down into the yard, I had visions of parachuting into the River Tyne. Unhurt I it took 3 lads and myself to fold the sheet again the forklift driver lifted back on top for me, I then backed into the sheltered loading alley and managed to spread the sheet again quickly tying the corners to stop it blowing off again before setting to work to secure it tidily and properly. With episodes like this I dont know how I managed to survive for 50 years without killing myself accordind to H&S rules.
Cheers, Leyland 600.
I’ve read your reply several times, I hope you don’t take this the wrong way, but I just can’t see what you’re saying.
Mike P,
Thank you.
I’ve been left a while now, so I’ll not be asking for the new sheets.
Those sheets were/still are old well used ones that tended to be used on loads that didn’t need to be kept dry, and/or loads where there was a good chance something may go through it. I know, shouldn’t let that happen. As I said, that load didn’t need sheeting, so they were good enough to throw over it.
Mr Bewick.
I, like a good many others, was a lad going with Dad in the wagon in the days “when S&R was king”, so we’ve not had the chance to do this day in day out, much as we’d like to.
I like to take pride in roping & sheeting because of the shunters and drivers you speak of, it’s their work I saw as a young 'un, and that to me is how the job should be done. When I throw a sheet over a load, I see it as my “duty” to make a good job of it, I don’t want to sound over dramatic here, but I want to “honour” the men that took this in their stride day after day come wind, rain, shine, snow or anything else. What they did at work every day is something to be proud of, and I’m very pleased to see other “latter day” drivers appear to see things the same way. Yourself and Mr D are of course included in “they”.
Phil.
+1
Trouble is Phil some of these ole boys see it thru rose tinted glasses
Leyland600:
Hi adr, Aye elf n safety have a lot to answer for, I remember a particularly windy day circa 1969 unloading concrete stairwell panels at St Andrews House at the north end of the Tyne Bridge, a tower crane was doing the lifting clicking each panel up rapidly after setting the slings and the aenamomiter bell ringing on the crane like mad when the wind speed reached 40mph, nevertheless I got tipped quickly and 5 minutes run over the Swing Bridge to Rank’s Baltic Mill (now “The Baltic Arts Centre”) where I loaded 14 tons of bulky wheatfeed bags for Carrs Flour Mills at Silloth. After pulling off the loading chute into the high open ended mill yard I lifted my 36ft x 24ft plastic sheet off the cab roof onto the top of the load and proceeded to open it out fore and aft then down each side this sheet being for such loads on my Mickey Mouse Foden 8 legger. I had just got the sheet nicely spread and was letting myself decend back to ground level holding the sheet strings when a huge gust of wind lifted the sheet and me completely off the load and down into the yard, I had visions of parachuting into the River Tyne. Unhurt I it took 3 lads and myself to fold the sheet again the forklift driver lifted back on top for me, I then backed into the sheltered loading alley and managed to spread the sheet again quickly tying the corners to stop it blowing off again before setting to work to secure it tidily and properly. With episodes like this I dont know how I managed to survive for 50 years without killing myself accordind to H&S rules.
Cheers, Leyland 600.
Aye L600, I can remember Ranks Baltic Mill, It was a dump IMO, But nevertheless it was work that kept me in my job, Mind you it allways seemed to be windy there, I suppose being on the River Tyne could have something to do with it, All hand ball in those days, Spillers on the other side of the Tyne was the same, Plus some of the Tossers that went there to work as little as possible & make things very awkward for drivers, & get paid for doing it, & Then have a good laugh when you were trying to sheet up Etc, Never Mind Eh they were the good old days, Gone forever, Regards Larry.
Leyland600:
Hi adr, Aye elf n safety have a lot to answer for, I remember a particularly windy day circa 1969 unloading concrete stairwell panels at St Andrews House at the north end of the Tyne Bridge, a tower crane was doing the lifting clicking each panel up rapidly after setting the slings and the aenamomiter bell ringing on the crane like mad when the wind speed reached 40mph, nevertheless I got tipped quickly and 5 minutes run over the Swing Bridge to Rank’s Baltic Mill (now “The Baltic Arts Centre”) where I loaded 14 tons of bulky wheatfeed bags for Carrs Flour Mills at Silloth. After pulling off the loading chute into the high open ended mill yard I lifted my 36ft x 24ft plastic sheet off the cab roof onto the top of the load and proceeded to open it out fore and aft then down each side this sheet being for such loads on my Mickey Mouse Foden 8 legger. I had just got the sheet nicely spread and was letting myself decend back to ground level holding the sheet strings when a huge gust of wind lifted the sheet and me completely off the load and down into the yard, I had visions of parachuting into the River Tyne. Unhurt I it took 3 lads and myself to fold the sheet again the forklift driver lifted back on top for me, I then backed into the sheltered loading alley and managed to spread the sheet again quickly tying the corners to stop it blowing off again before setting to work to secure it tidily and properly. With episodes like this I dont know how I managed to survive for 50 years without killing myself accordind to H&S rules.
Cheers, Leyland 600.
Hi Leyland 600. What would be interesting at a lot of companies/factories/docks etc, would be to compare the on site accident/incident
books from 20-40 years ago, to the last 10-20 years when H & S has really gone mad, I bet you would find there isn’t much difference in the amount of reported incidents regards Chris
Anyway I will await the “onslaught” with interest although I hope no one has “taken a powder” with my coments. Cheers Bewick.
Cheers Dennis.
, despite the fact that you could have been going to some of these places for 20-30 yrs, all of a sudden none of us are considered intelligent enough to recognise any dangers or to know what we are doing 
! Tautliners have taken over & rule the roost, yes they are easier & faster, it’s all about speed nowadays, strange how the safety side is ignored when it suits though isn’t it 
, but many a time I have used ropes inside a Tautliner to secure something using the rings in the floor, because I just couldn’t get the straps from the rails in the roof to secure something properly, they may stop stuff going sideways/back or forth, but you actually try pinning something to the deck with them, yes you can use straps but I always felt I had a better feel of the tension with ropes! Here in lies the problem there today, a interesting survey would be "How many wagon drivers today know how to tie a Dolly?, I bet the answer to that would be quite depressing too 
