Bewick:
This is a roping and sheeting thread not a talking shop about all and sundry ! Cheers Bewick.
Need to get some ropes over that fly sheet be flapping in the wind before you reach forton services…! 
Punchy Dan:
Tidy looking 400 Larry ,shame it’s not got a proper back axle .
Hi Dan, We did have a lot of oil seal problems with the Group Axle, But once we fitted Stemcos it was no more bother,It was a nice motor to drive Uprated 290 RR, And the Fuller nine speed box Did us well I may add, Regards Larry.
Retired Old ■■■■:
I’ll bet he does. Especially with those ropes over the fly!
There is no way I would level any criticism at my Pal Larry , he’s only put the odd rope over the fly sheet so no harm done eh! and it was his trailer and gear, not mine 
Cheers Dennis.
Lawrence Dunbar:
Punchy Dan:
Tidy looking 400 Larry ,shame it’s not got a proper back axle .Hi Dan, We did have a lot of oil seal problems with the Group Axle, But once we fitted Stemcos it was no more bother,It was a nice motor to drive Uprated 290 RR, And the Fuller nine speed box Did us well I may add, Regards Larry.
Excuse my ignorance Larry- what are, or were, Stemcos?
Sounds like something you take when you’ve got piles!
As I was sitting on the cold garage floor repairing my 600 Norton, my grandmother would say ‘I’ve brought you some cardboard to sit on, if you sit on the concrete you’ll get piles when you’re older.’
‘Yeah, thanks Nanny!’ Shove cardboard to one side.
When you’re seventeen, you’re never going to be old are you!
John.
John, STEMCO seals are a leather seal in a metal ‘cage’ that replaced the rubber lip ones in the hub, also a thin steel wearing ring was fitted over the original rubbing ring on the axle and they were very good and worked well. Fodens own axles were a nightmare with hub seal failure but Stemco’s cured the problem as long as the hub nut was tightened up properly. stemco.com/
Pete.
windrush:
John, STEMCO seals are a leather seal in a metal ‘cage’ that replaced the rubber lip ones in the hub, also a thin steel wearing ring was fitted over the original rubbing ring on the axle and they were very good and worked well. Fodens own axles were a nightmare with hub seal failure but Stemco’s cured the problem as long as the hub nut was tightened up properly. stemco.com/Pete.
Thanks for explaining Windrush, We had the proper tool for fitting them as there was very little margin for error, We also fitted them onto the Bedford we had IIRC We used to warm them up a little bit which made them go in easy, Regards Larry.
Now you come to mention the word Stemco lads I recall that we used them in the workshop on the poxy Group axles behind the 8LXB Sed/Atks although the Group axles behind the 6LXB 32/4’s were no trouble IIRC. Cheers Dennis.
Thanks for the explanations.
If the Stemcos worked on group axles on the 8lxb and the 6lxbs were no problem, why were they poxy Dennis? Did they give you other problems?
John
John West:
Thanks for the explanations.If the Stemcos worked on group axles on the 8lxb and the 6lxbs were no problem, why were they poxy Dennis? Did they give you other problems?
John
Right “John Boy” listen up Seriously now, and this is only my experience of running Seddon Group Axles, I believe that the Seddon axle was totally over rated as how could it be rated as a 13 ton axle on Continental Europe when it wasn’t fit to be operated at 10 ton in the UK ? IMO the Torque/Power that was transmitted from the 8LXB and to a lesser extent the ■■■■■■■ 220 was in excess of what the axle could cope with. Whereas the 180LXB was well matched and consequently gave little or no problems. I can tell you from first hand experience that our double shifted 8LXB Sed/Atks were lucky to achieve 70,000 miles before the hub reductions were worn out and ■■■■■■■ oil out. which is where the Stemco seals were used in an effort to extend the down time and loss of availability of the motor. The most reliable axles we ran on our British motors were the Eaton ,the Kirkstall BDR and D85 and latterly the Rockwell in the later Sed/Atks. I hope this go’s some way explaining the shortcomings of the Group axle but no doubt some other members will be able to throw more light on the problem as I wasn’t a fitter but I was interested in reliable operation and had to pay the “bills” so I did have an input into any mechanical problems that arose but I can say that the Scania, Volvo, Mercedes and Renault drive axles gave no problem whatsoever. Cheers Dennis.
Bewick:
John West:
Thanks for the explanations.If the Stemcos worked on group axles on the 8lxb and the 6lxbs were no problem, why were they poxy Dennis? Did they give you other problems?
John
Right “John Boy” listen up
I have to agree with you Dennis about the group axle. I was a HGV mechanic and the firm i worked for had four sed/atki tractor units with rr265/ fuller box and group axles fitted. The units were on tipper work and the hub reduction units used to fail on a regular basis, the needle rollers in the planetary gears used to collapse they were not man enough for the job. They were so unreliable that a pair of overhauled hubs were kept in he stores. Oil seal failure was also an issue and stemco oil seals were used to extend the life. Cheers Mick
A pal of mine who ran a couple of S/As with group axle (some folks never learn!) used to warm his new Stemcos in hot engine oil before fitting them. The fact that he was prepared to suffer those damned axles for years says something for either his temerity or stupidity!
The Group axle, -
The thing was just not up to the job full stop.
from new the first lot had the shallow nut how many came loose woooobbbbblllleeeeyyyy hub 
mod from sed/atk a deeper nut yes it made it easy to nip up but the reply from s/a your not torquing it up enough.
This sort of p–t GOD off(Ian) a bit so a nice big nut/tube spanner was made at British Engines down on the quayside as smiles enginering couldnt make
the spanner (monster), No more nut problems after this was made 
- .
As said the three pins and needle roller bearings made of plastic ,
The oil seal would give up at the first chance it got if you was lucky the little dribble out the little tube gave you a chance if
spotted early to save the brake shoes.
Then you had the diff pinion shims that used to 
fail/disolve giving lift play then the oil seal failure would follow, we had a set of hubs refurbed ready to fit
and a parts department with more stock than sed/atk for this axle.
I can remember the parts guy Ted i think coming and asking for bits for other operators as Sed/Atk had run short of parts. - .
This oil rep came and said got some great oil,MAKES OIL SEALS AND REPAIRS WORN GEARS ETC came in a green 5 gal drum thin silky grey in colour quite expensive at the time so it was agreed to try it 
put it in a couple of back axles and gearboxs.
Merc-axle-gearbox 100% ok
Fuller-gearbox 100% ok
David Brown 8-speed oil all over the place 
Sed/Atk group axle no better than the normal oil still hub and diff seals
so no fancy oil made any diffrence tried lower oil levels in the axle/hubs no change the axle breather was checked on a 2-week grease level check as was the gearbox and axles so they had the best
attention they could have had and still gave problems which was
This axle was a horror story from start to finish nothing you did made any diffrence oh yes 
buy Mercedes -
just a little bit of info about the great Seddon/Atkinson group axle. -
The Front axle had wheel stud problems 4 studs snaping off ONLY SIX - This was a regular
thing on a few motors makes you think quality control -
8LXBV8BRIAN:
The Group axle,
The thing was just not up to the job full stop.
from new the first lot had the shallow nut how many came loose woooobbbbblllleeeeyyyy hub
mod from sed/atk a deeper nut yes it made it easy to nip up but the reply from s/a your not torquing it up enough.
This sort of p–t GOD off(Ian) a bit so a nice big nut/tube spanner was made at British Engines down on the quayside as smiles enginering couldnt make
the spanner (monster), No more nut problems after this was made
As said the three pins and needle roller bearings made of plastic
The oil seal would give up at the first chance it got if you was lucky the little dribble out the little tube gave you a chance if
spotted early to save the brake shoes.
Then you had the diff pinion shims that used to
and a parts department with more stock than sed/atk for this axle.
I can remember the parts guy Ted
This oil rep came and said got some great oil,MAKES OIL SEALS AND REPAIRS WORN GEARS ETC came in a green 5 gal drum thin silky grey in colour quite expensive at the time so it was agreed to try it
put it in a couple of back axles and gearboxs.
Merc-axle-gearbox 100% ok
Fuller-gearbox 100% ok
David Brown 8-speed oil all over the place
Sed/Atk group axle no better than the normal oil still hub and diff seals
so no fancy oil made any diffrence tried lower oil levels in the axle/hubs no change the axle breather was checked on a 2-week grease level check as was the gearbox and axles so they had the best
attention they could have had and still gave problems which was
This axle was a horror story from start to finish nothing you did made any diffrence oh yes
just a little bit of info about the great Seddon/Atkinson group axle.
The Front axle had wheel stud problems 4 studs snaping off ONLY SIX
thing on a few motors makes you think quality control
Hi Bri, We had this problem with the front wheel studs breaking, We used to carry spare ones in the cab, I was at the testing station at Sandy Lane with this Sedaki, & was talking to Brian Gill one of the head men there at this time, He was very helpful & asked for any broken ones that we had,Which I did & took them for him to see, He sent them away for to be examined & informed me that the result was that they had been overtightened, Well I was very surprised at the result as we had a Torque Wrench which I took to him & showed that we had the gear for the job, & he told me to get onto our supplier & get them to sort the problem out, But of course we replaced this with a Leyland Roadtrain Unit, Regards Larry.
It’s interesting reading about the broken wheel studs on the Sed/Atks but I can’t recall experiencing the same problems on the many Sed/Atks we ran at Bewick Transport. Yes we had major problems with the hub reductions behind the 8LXB’s and the ■■■■■■■ 220’s but why not behind the 32/4’s ? Simple I think, the 180LXB was as far as the Seddon axle was spec’d to but Seddons being Seddons they pushed the boat out even further and came unstuck eh! Cheers Bewick.
Bewick:
I think, the 180LXB was as far as the Seddon axle was spec’d to but Seddons being Seddons they pushed the boat out even further and came unstuck eh! Cheers Bewick.
With some exceptions driveline technology has often been a weak point among Brit manufacturers.That applies in everything from cars to trucks.The realistic choices either being German such as ZF or US like Fuller/Allison/Dana/Rockwell in the case of increasing engine outputs.
Setting up a marquee hire business, and deciding to go with vans and flatbed trailers to start with to get around the O-licence crud. Worked for a company that still ropes and sheets their loads, and I’ve decided to do the same on my trailer. I find flatbeds are far more forgiving with mixed loads that include awkward things that project, and rope is far more versatile than straps IMO. One strap can only do one pass effectively, whereas one rope can go back and forth a few times quite happily and each lashing will be perfectly tight and safe if done right. Also the van trailer thing is that my ‘van’ is converted into a camper so can’t carry much at all but it’s great for jobs where I stay on site, which at some festivals I do.
FTBlunder:
Setting up a marquee hire business, and deciding to go with vans and flatbed trailers to start with to get around the O-licence crud. Worked for a company that still ropes and sheets their loads, and I’ve decided to do the same on my trailer. I find flatbeds are far more forgiving with mixed loads that include awkward things that project, and rope is far more versatile than straps IMO. One strap can only do one pass effectively, whereas one rope can go back and forth a few times quite happily and each lashing will be perfectly tight and safe if done right. Also the van trailer thing is that my ‘van’ is converted into a camper so can’t carry much at all but it’s great for jobs where I stay on site, which at some festivals I do.
If I was not ret. ide agree with you mate but I believe the h/s mob can put problems in your way regarding climbing on trls ect.is this correct.
regards dave.
Tbh the trailer is small enough that the vast majority of the work can be done on the ground. I could put a pointless harness on if they really want me to…
Sent from my SM-J500FN using Tapatalk
FTBlunder:
Tbh the trailer is small enough that the vast majority of the work can be done on the ground. I could put a pointless harness on if they really want me to…Sent from my SM-J500FN using Tapatalk
Ahh I was thinking in terms of normal trls sorry.
regards dave.